I would agree, Sky, as one of the things I found shocking was one of the other members of my twig saying leadership said women should use men's wantimg to date them to get men to take the class.
However, some social cohesion was seriously lacking. For example, all of the WOWs (state and national) would come into the area, put in their year talking about how we're the family of God, leave, and, outside of seeing them at the Rock or at state functions, were never heard from again.
I would agree, Sky, as one of the things I found shocking was one of the other members of my twig saying leadership said women should use men's wantimg to date them to get men to take the class.
However, some social cohesion was seriously lacking. For example, all of the WOWs (state and national) would come into the area, put in their year talking about how we're the family of God, leave, and, outside of seeing them at the Rock or at state functions, were never heard from again.
Oh yeah.......many WOWs after rock of ages were never heard from again.
Same with some corps after graduation................gone.
I left 20 years ago......and STILL can't hardly believe that I stayed that long. It wasn't because of wierwille-mystique nor wierwille's writings, that's for sure. The social contract of helping others is noble......IF the organization has noble motives.
"By emphasizing shared symbolism, religious teachings and practices help promote social cohesion. An example is the Christian ritual of communion, which not only commemorates a historical event but also allows followers to participate in the unity ('continuum") of themselves with other believers (McGuire, 2002). All religions have some form of shared experience that rekindles the group's consciousness of its own unity. Religion has played an important part in helping members of subordinate groups develop a sense of social cohesion and belonging even when they are the objects of prejudice and discrimination by dominant group members..."
I would agree, Sky, as one of the things I found shocking was one of the other members of my twig saying leadership said women should use men's wantimg to date them to get men to take the class.
However, some social cohesion was seriously lacking. For example, all of the WOWs (state and national) would come into the area, put in their year talking about how we're the family of God, leave, and, outside of seeing them at the Rock or at state functions, were never heard from again.
No, the social cohesion was working fine. You were looking at the wrong target. The people at the location the wows went to were expendable and faceless. The wows who went there on their own dime and ran classes that raised a tidy profit for twi counted-especially once some of them started tithing. (Their money is welcome at twi.) The cohesion was between the wow vets, corps grads, etc, not with the peons on the field. They only count for the income they bring in.
No, the social cohesion was working fine. You were looking at the wrong target. The people at the location the wows went to were expendable and faceless. The wows who went there on their own dime and ran classes that raised a tidy profit for twi counted-especially once some of them started tithing. (Their money is welcome at twi.) The cohesion was between the wow vets, corps grads, etc, not with the peons on the field. They only count for the income they bring in.
I can see where I made the error, WW. I was thinking of cohesion as being like a close knit family (family of God, how much closer knit should that be) And members of a close knit family would never dream of losing contact with one another.
In reality, The Way was more like a poker tournament, where a core group was making the rules, but the players were interchangable and come and go.
social relations.......the longer you stay, the more "interconnected" you become
task relations..........the longer you stay, the more "valuable" you become
perceived unity.......the longer you stay, the more "invested" you become
emotions.................the longer you stay, the more "committed" you become
The intricacies of social cohesion are vast and wide........and, so often, are overlooked as a main component of the cult's infrastructure. I'm sure that there are others here at GSC that can convey this topic much better than I have.
In summary.........from all my years in twi, I believe that social cohesion was and is the underlying foundation of why people stay. There is NO laser-eyed focus on the Scriptures and following its precepts. While twi touts itself as a "Biblical Research, Teaching and Fellowship" ministry......there's no research department, only readings on sunday sermons, and very few even like hanging out with others in their branch (except at meetings). Oh Lordy, Lordy........what a tangled web they weave when first they practice to deceive..........
Indeed !!!!!
Skyrider, I think you always do a great job of revealing and articulating the subliminal factors of a cult’s control.
“...So often are overlooked...” you say - from my own experience and even from where I am now looking back - - I was not even aware or their reality or powerful influence...maybe like gravity...whether or not you’re aware of it - there’s so many degrees of effort you have to put forth to resist its pull on you: get up from a chair, climb several flights of stairs, make a jump shot, carry heavy suitcases into an airport.
I think it takes an enormous effort for anyone to escape the gravitational field of a cult.
I would agree, Sky, as one of the things I found shocking was one of the other members of my twig saying leadership said women should use men's wantimg to date them to get men to take the class.
However, some social cohesion was seriously lacking. For example, all of the WOWs (state and national) would come into the area, put in their year talking about how we're the family of God, leave, and, outside of seeing them at the Rock or at state functions, were never heard from again.
Yes shocking. Why they would never think of doing things like sending a group of 4 young hot women out together to "move the Word" now, would they?
When a thread like The Wierwille Legacy comes along and sucks up all the oxygen in the room, I believe that it is an extreme example of how followers viewed wierwille, his writings and/or twi. Not trying to be disrespectful to Mike in any way......I simply stated that "he was a cult of one."
In fact, I have many times stated that social cohesion, or group cohesiveness, was the underlying foundation that kept "followers" in this group for years and decades. The primary motive for staying, for most (not all), was social cohesion......i.e. access to others, activity, self-worth, a-cause-bigger-than-self, part of a movement, etc. While on staff 1981-1983 (at the height of wierwille's "glory years" of Ambassador One flights, Living Victoriously, High Country Caravan Filming, and Sound Out '84..........corps and staff were buzzing around with plenty of activity. Yet, on corps nights in the OSC lunchroom........dozens of corps who sat at the back of the room hardly took any notes. And, forgive my skepticism when I say........."who ever took the time to go back and study ANY of their corps notes?"
So......while its eye-opening to see someone come along and have this hyper-fixation to the "writings of wierwille"........it's beyond the pail of most everyone I ever was around in twi, except Chris Geer. And even then, I believe that Geer was a surgical-opportunist wanting to get into wierwille's inner-circle, and more.
To me........the pfal class was the nectar and social cohesion (activity) kept the bees a-buzzing. The more "involved"......the more one was "in the know." Climbing the pyramid......getting to the next level increased "perceived" spiritual stature. Headquarters was inundated with social activity.......not staffers who sat around with lexicons and concordances. One of the posters here, years ago, said that Rosalie told her that she didn't need to read the Bible, because she was constantly editing publications for the way magazine......i.e. reading "the word" every day at work.
Although cohesion is a multi-faceted process, it can be broken down into four main components: 1) social relations, 2) task relations, 3) perceived unity, and 4) emotions. No matter the task, staffers were led to believe that they were "helping to move the word over the world." If you were a carpenter, your work helped in that perceived goal. If you worked kitchen staff, then your preparation of the food that day helped nourish leaders and staffers to do their work.......every person interconnected and adding to the cohesion of the group. Of course, here at GSC we know that the cult took this cohesion and seduced it.........with buzzwords, incremental indoctrination, isolationism, unbridled adulation, etc.
People stay/stayed in twi........because of
social relations.......the longer you stay, the more "interconnected" you become
task relations..........the longer you stay, the more "valuable" you become
perceived unity.......the longer you stay, the more "invested" you become
emotions.................the longer you stay, the more "committed" you become
The intricacies of social cohesion are vast and wide........and, so often, are overlooked as a main component of the cult's infrastructure. I'm sure that there are others here at GSC that can convey this topic much better than I have.
In summary.........from all my years in twi, I believe that social cohesion was and is the underlying foundation of why people stay. There is NO laser-eyed focus on the Scriptures and following its precepts. While twi touts itself as a "Biblical Research, Teaching and Fellowship" ministry......there's no research department, only readings on sunday sermons, and very few even like hanging out with others in their branch (except at meetings). Oh Lordy, Lordy........what a tangled web they weave when first they practice to deceive..........
skyrider you've got something here. Definitely you can see evidence of the Way Headquarters kind of being like the North Korean regime. I'm sure there are a lot of long-time staffers there who justify staying because they have no other life or friends. They see things getting worse and worse. But they are too scared to leave. Maybe it won't affect them. Maybe they won't p1$$ off Rosie or DeLoser. Maybe they won't be like the ex-vice president in the Revival and Restoration video - who got booted for some never to be known reason due to an NDA. But when you see good-hearted happy go lucky people just decimated by those evil position climbers, it makes your average person respond. And the Way kind of rides the line right there.
And what reward is there for the position climber? Look at Rupp. All those years of smooching bootie - where did it get him? Second dog in charge. You saw how upset he got, posting up his resume on the internet. Lofty accomplishments - world outreach leader this, head honcho that. How many calls do you think he got from other Christian ministries? Even one? I mean I know of 3 churches in my local area that have done a nationwide search for a new pastor, all at a more comfortable wage than the Way pays. Do you think he even crossed their radar? The Way is an employer that once someone gets on their payroll for a number of years, they are more and more handcuffed. They know of no other way to bring in food other than act like a Way leader. And a Way leader is not a Christian pastor.
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So_crates
I would agree, Sky, as one of the things I found shocking was one of the other members of my twig saying leadership said women should use men's wantimg to date them to get men to take the class.
However, some social cohesion was seriously lacking. For example, all of the WOWs (state and national) would come into the area, put in their year talking about how we're the family of God, leave, and, outside of seeing them at the Rock or at state functions, were never heard from again.
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skyrider
Oh yeah.......many WOWs after rock of ages were never heard from again.
Same with some corps after graduation................gone.
I left 20 years ago......and STILL can't hardly believe that I stayed that long. It wasn't because of wierwille-mystique nor wierwille's writings, that's for sure. The social contract of helping others is noble......IF the organization has noble motives.
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Rocky
"By emphasizing shared symbolism, religious teachings and practices help promote social cohesion. An example is the Christian ritual of communion, which not only commemorates a historical event but also allows followers to participate in the unity ('continuum") of themselves with other believers (McGuire, 2002). All religions have some form of shared experience that rekindles the group's consciousness of its own unity. Religion has played an important part in helping members of subordinate groups develop a sense of social cohesion and belonging even when they are the objects of prejudice and discrimination by dominant group members..."
From sociologyassignments.com
It's pretty basic.
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WordWolf
No, the social cohesion was working fine. You were looking at the wrong target. The people at the location the wows went to were expendable and faceless. The wows who went there on their own dime and ran classes that raised a tidy profit for twi counted-especially once some of them started tithing. (Their money is welcome at twi.) The cohesion was between the wow vets, corps grads, etc, not with the peons on the field. They only count for the income they bring in.
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So_crates
I can see where I made the error, WW. I was thinking of cohesion as being like a close knit family (family of God, how much closer knit should that be) And members of a close knit family would never dream of losing contact with one another.
In reality, The Way was more like a poker tournament, where a core group was making the rules, but the players were interchangable and come and go.
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T-Bone
Indeed !!!!!
Skyrider, I think you always do a great job of revealing and articulating the subliminal factors of a cult’s control.
“...So often are overlooked...” you say - from my own experience and even from where I am now looking back - - I was not even aware or their reality or powerful influence...maybe like gravity...whether or not you’re aware of it - there’s so many degrees of effort you have to put forth to resist its pull on you: get up from a chair, climb several flights of stairs, make a jump shot, carry heavy suitcases into an airport.
I think it takes an enormous effort for anyone to escape the gravitational field of a cult.
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chockfull
Yes shocking. Why they would never think of doing things like sending a group of 4 young hot women out together to "move the Word" now, would they?
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chockfull
skyrider you've got something here. Definitely you can see evidence of the Way Headquarters kind of being like the North Korean regime. I'm sure there are a lot of long-time staffers there who justify staying because they have no other life or friends. They see things getting worse and worse. But they are too scared to leave. Maybe it won't affect them. Maybe they won't p1$$ off Rosie or DeLoser. Maybe they won't be like the ex-vice president in the Revival and Restoration video - who got booted for some never to be known reason due to an NDA. But when you see good-hearted happy go lucky people just decimated by those evil position climbers, it makes your average person respond. And the Way kind of rides the line right there.
And what reward is there for the position climber? Look at Rupp. All those years of smooching bootie - where did it get him? Second dog in charge. You saw how upset he got, posting up his resume on the internet. Lofty accomplishments - world outreach leader this, head honcho that. How many calls do you think he got from other Christian ministries? Even one? I mean I know of 3 churches in my local area that have done a nationwide search for a new pastor, all at a more comfortable wage than the Way pays. Do you think he even crossed their radar? The Way is an employer that once someone gets on their payroll for a number of years, they are more and more handcuffed. They know of no other way to bring in food other than act like a Way leader. And a Way leader is not a Christian pastor.
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Twinky
Oh, so true!
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