My question is how many times are they going to revise and rewrite the damned things?
UGH............#5 "Go forth as leaders and workers..........in the household."
The corps training/indoctrination is NO LONGER masked as a "Christian" endeavor, but an in-house and subservient role to the cult. When you realize that "the Word" is code for wierwille-doctrine..........there is not one thing in those 5 objectives that deem it has anything to do with Jesus Christ.
They are blinded by their own deceptive tactics and cannot see it.
#4 Simply cannot be made anything close to right. As way corps im supposed to practise believing to bring material abundance to me AND the ministry.
But "the ministry" offers little to no help of it's "material abundance" to help anyone that has need, especially the way corps. Just give to the ministry...give some more.....and more.
Something I find interesting about this is remembering what vpw himself said about this. There was a tape set "the Heart of the Way Corps." It was a compilation of 7 teachings addressing the WC from different perspectives. 2 were by vpw addressing them, In one of them, he said that he came up with the 5 principles "in about ten minutes" originally and that they hadn't been changed. Even when I was in, I thought that was an awfully short time to come up with something that fundamental to a program and then have it never change.
Furthermore, he also complained about the first principle: "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness." He claimed it really should say "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness OF THE WORD." He made fun of the idea that this "in-depth spiritual perception and awareness" would be applied to anything else, which I thought at the time was particularly odd. I thought the point was learning stuff to apply it all the time, not just when reading. So, when you encountered life, you'd understand more because you knew more.
This becomes particularly odd when you see that vpw said the complete opposite other times! In "vp and me", lcm documented that "Horse Sense is probably the greatest part of Corps Principal 1." Further, he gave supposed examples of this where vpw pointed out things that needed preventative maintenance and so on. That's completely the opposite of what vpw said elsewhere- he was claiming the importance of something he mocked at other times.
This would be confusing concerning the average person. Most people are fairly consistent- unless one is possibly comparing them after a span of time, time to change their positions on things. (In this case, the tape and the book covered the same span of a few years, twi after it's big boom began but before vpw was too sick to do stuff.) In the case of vpw, this makes sense because we know he went around and taught different things to different people at the same time. He could teach a CFS class and say that a man wasn't supposed to help himself to a woman and to only do stuff with your spouse (the meaning of "let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband") and turn around a few hours later and tell someone "who was spiritual enough to take it" that God Almighty was fine with sexual adultery and someone "meeting the needs" of some married minister sexually and keep it quiet (his "lockbox" doctrine, very private.) He told the pfal audience that he started over with his Bible as his sole source of information, but turned around and mentioned a few books here and there like Bullinger's Companion Bible (leaving out that his "sole source of information" claim was a complete lie because "his" class was an amalgam of Bullinger, Stiles, Leonard, Kenyon, and a handful of others with virtually NO original content.) So, the idea that vpw would make contradictory claims actually should be no surprise- he did it all the time if you kept track if who he told what. That's a bad sign for someone supposedly honest, but twi has been run like a political entity than a religious entity at the top for a long time.
What struck me about the revision was the subtle tightening of the leash in principle # 5 (I noted revision in bold red)
"Go forth as leaders and workers in areas of concern, interest, and needin the household"
That really narrows down your options or choices quite a bit.
Reminds me of a scene in The Jerk, where Steve Martin works at a carnival as The Guesser…a guy asks him “what do I win?” and Steve uses his hands, body language and words to direct the guy’s attention to one small section with dinky little prizes ..."anything in this general area right below the stereo and on this side of the bicentennial glasses."
== == == ==
recent Way corps graduate (originally from France):Geez all those principles have such promise – I can’t wait to get out in the world and do great things for God! Ya know principle # 5 has been on my heart a lot lately – I haven’t been back home since I moved to the US some three years ago. I am so concerned with all the changes going on there and terrorism that we’ve heard about on the news. I’d really like to go back there as a corps grad to move the word like crazy – it will be such a blessing to my family still living there ....and lets think big shall we - how about a blessing to all the citizens of France!
Way corps director: we’ve just started working on assignments so I can’t promise you anything right now… but I tell you what - the household could really use a fired-up leader like you – there’sbranch outside of Hebron , Kentucky that could really use your help – and you’ll even be close to an International Airport - so France is only some 8 hours away. What do you say to that?
Furthermore, he also complained about the first principle: "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness." He claimed it really should say "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness OF THE WORD."
When I was in rez, this is what CP1 was changed to. Apparently that had always been implied, but it needed to be made explicit. Nobody changed the sign in the woods, though, the outside the Corps Chalet.
As to newly-revised CP5 ... "in the household" !!!
CP2 "Doctrinally and practically" - goodness me, are they going to get some external teachers in to teach this aspect? Cuz there ain't not nobody there that could do that.
Something I find interesting about this is remembering what vpw himself said about this. There was a tape set "the Heart of the Way Corps." It was a compilation of 7 teachings addressing the WC from different perspectives. 2 were by vpw addressing them, In one of them, he said that he came up with the 5 principles "in about ten minutes" originally and that they hadn't been changed. Even when I was in, I thought that was an awfully short time to come up with something that fundamental to a program and then have it never change.
Furthermore, he also complained about the first principle: "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness." He claimed it really should say "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness OF THE WORD." He made fun of the idea that this "in-depth spiritual perception and awareness" would be applied to anything else, which I thought at the time was particularly odd. I thought the point was learning stuff to apply it all the time, not just when reading. So, when you encountered life, you'd understand more because you knew more.
This becomes particularly odd when you see that vpw said the complete opposite other times! In "vp and me", lcm documented that "Horse Sense is probably the greatest part of Corps Principal 1." Further, he gave supposed examples of this where vpw pointed out things that needed preventative maintenance and so on. That's completely the opposite of what vpw said elsewhere- he was claiming the importance of something he mocked at other times.
This would be confusing concerning the average person. Most people are fairly consistent- unless one is possibly comparing them after a span of time, time to change their positions on things. (In this case, the tape and the book covered the same span of a few years, twi after it's big boom began but before vpw was too sick to do stuff.) In the case of vpw, this makes sense because we know he went around and taught different things to different people at the same time. He could teach a CFS class and say that a man wasn't supposed to help himself to a woman and to only do stuff with your spouse (the meaning of "let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband") and turn around a few hours later and tell someone "who was spiritual enough to take it" that God Almighty was fine with sexual adultery and someone "meeting the needs" of some married minister sexually and keep it quiet (his "lockbox" doctrine, very private.) He told the pfal audience that he started over with his Bible as his sole source of information, but turned around and mentioned a few books here and there like Bullinger's Companion Bible (leaving out that his "sole source of information" claim was a complete lie because "his" class was an amalgam of Bullinger, Stiles, Leonard, Kenyon, and a handful of others with virtually NO original content.) So, the idea that vpw would make contradictory claims actually should be no surprise- he did it all the time if you kept track if who he told what. That's a bad sign for someone supposedly honest, but twi has been run like a political entity than a religious entity at the top for a long time.
WW, I was never in the WC, but I think VPW was a POS. He didn't know Jack about God, life, or people. So many wonderful, talented, and intelligent people were badly used, and abused by TWI. Some day God will judge all of us, and He will give us our just merits.
Just for the record, from my experience in the 2nd Corps, when VPW was trying to explain principle #1, he said, among other gobbled jargon, that it meant having common horse sense, so LCM parroted that.
Initially, I was confused as to what VP really meant by it. I think he was, too. Maybe he got the idea from someone else. Ultimately, I decided it meant listening to my intuition, which I thought came from God, like directions for my personal life, what we used to call "revelation." To me, that was spiritual perception and awareness. If you ask me, that is different from common sense. Who knows? Why do we care? I care insofar as I use examples like this to show people (college students in particular) how mixed up and manipulating VP was.
He usually gave conflicting and/or confusing messages, so no surprise here.
...This becomes particularly odd when you see that vpw said the complete opposite other times! In "vp and me", lcm documented that "Horse Sense is probably the greatest part of Corps Principal 1." Further, he gave supposed examples of this where vpw pointed out things that needed preventative maintenance and so on. That's completely the opposite of what vpw said elsewhere- he was claiming the importance of something he mocked at other times.
This would be confusing concerning the average person. Most people are fairly consistent- unless one is possibly comparing them after a span of time, time to change their positions on things. (In this case, the tape and the book covered the same span of a few years, twi after it's big boom began but before vpw was too sick to do stuff.) In the case of vpw, this makes sense because we know he went around and taught different things to different people at the same time. He could teach a CFS class and say that a man wasn't supposed to help himself to a woman and to only do stuff with your spouse (the meaning of "let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband") and turn around a few hours later and tell someone "who was spiritual enough to take it" that God Almighty was fine with sexual adultery and someone "meeting the needs" of some married minister sexually and keep it quiet (his "lockbox" doctrine, very private.) He told the pfal audience that he started over with his Bible as his sole source of information, but turned around and mentioned a few books here and there like Bullinger's Companion Bible (leaving out that his "sole source of information" claim was a complete lie because "his" class was an amalgam of Bullinger, Stiles, Leonard, Kenyon, and a handful of others with virtually NO original content.) So, the idea that vpw would make contradictory claims actually should be no surprise- he did it all the time if you kept track if who he told what. That's a bad sign for someone supposedly honest, but twi has been run like a political entity than a religious entity at the top for a long time.
2 hours ago, penworks said:
Just for the record, from my experience in the 2nd Corps, when VPW was trying to explain principle #1, he said, among other gobbled jargon, that it meant having common horse sense, so LCM parroted that.
Initially, I was confused as to what VP really meant by it. I think he was, too. Maybe he got the idea from someone else. Ultimately, I decided it meant listening to my intuition, which I thought came from God, like directions for my personal life, what we used to call "revelation." To me, that was spiritual perception and awareness. If you ask me, that is different from common sense. Who knows? Why do we care? I care insofar as I use examples like this to show people (college students in particular) how mixed up and manipulating VP was.
He usually gave conflicting and/or confusing messages, so no surprise here.
wierwille was truly a chameleon - a genius at adapting his deluded agenda to situations.
1) CP#5 changes to areas of concern interest and need in the household. I think this represents the cementing of doctrinal error into the leadership body. Practically they ignore the community and focus internally. There are marriages to be manipulated, budgets to control, people of weak and unstable mental habit patterns who need a controlling force to make all the major decisions in their life. This also cements the guiding principle in the doctrine of a cult. To get the attention of vp worshippers, "the Dead Sea is dead because it has only inlets, no outlets". Nice quote there from PFAL that applies to the current leadership body of the Way the Way Corps. I mean who cares about the community you live in? Except to instruct fellowship coordinators how to lie and say there isn't a business operating as a church in your residence in opposition to zoning laws. Use the community, manipulate people.
I absolutely believe the "household of God" teaching of the Way is false and erroneous doctrine from a false prophet. We are not a nation of Israel anymore since Christ, not one blood, one nation, one group. The body of Christ is all encompassing to those who call Christ Lord. He is the head of the church. Just because man judges and can't see the working parts doesn't mean they aren't there. All Christians are brothers, Catholic, Protestant, Apostolic, community church, Messianic Jews, and hundreds of others that are beyond my knowledge and grasp. The seperatist doctrine of the "household of God" is much more suited to a cult. Like Victor Barnard and the River Road group, a documented nightmare on Dateline. That is what seperatist cults produce. The New Knoxville cult is not that much different - just a different shade of veneer, a different coat of whitewash.
Also, hypocrites. I heard one of the things kicking up the Revival and Restoration group was Rosalie confronting all the field Corps towards the end of last year for not running enough classes. Their main tenet communicates circling wagons and focusing on household, but it's their fault for not "moving the Word' when your teachings are so dull on the services that nobody wants to dial in.
2) CP#1 - this was always in my opinion kept nebulous enough where people could accuse or excuse. Treated like a superstitious spider-sense of sorts. "Why did you get in that car accident?" "Your CP1 must not have been functioning". or "You must be dull and not operating CP1".
3) CP#2 - training doctrinally and practically in the whole Word - this to me sounds like a cover up for not having a certified teaching staff with PhDs. Or master's degrees for that matter. Doctrinally, by any measure other than a "withdraw from the body of Christ and make up your own measure" is deficient in training. Corps in-residence re-take the classes, and study them in-depth. They don't study the Bible. Training in the whole Word practically makes no sense. So you're going through the Levitical sacrifice processes? Or just the ones that have to do with gay bashing and tithing?
4) People like lists - it's true - research has proven that articles that consist of a list get more clicks than not. Constructing a list of this nature, even though he spent 10 minutes on it, is kind of genius. I mean how many people have dedicated their entire life to living that list? I knew plenty of people in the Way who were not happy unless they had a list. A calendar list of events, with teachers and topics, a list of outreach events, a list of annual events, a list of things they must do daily to be a "good" Christian. Many groups and organizations boil their list of beliefs down to a list. Many religions guide people towards a list of virtues. Other lists are just moral code tenets. For example, when i was a kid I took Tae Kwon Do, a Korean martial art. What are the "5 Tenets of Tae Kwon Do?"
Just for the record, from my experience in the 2nd Corps, when VPW was trying to explain principle #1, he said, among other gobbled jargon, that it meant having common horse sense, so LCM parroted that.
Initially, I was confused as to what VP really meant by it. I think he was, too. Maybe he got the idea from someone else. Ultimately, I decided it meant listening to my intuition, which I thought came from God, like directions for my personal life, what we used to call "revelation." To me, that was spiritual perception and awareness. If you ask me, that is different from common sense. Who knows? Why do we care? I care insofar as I use examples like this to show people (college students in particular) how mixed up and manipulating VP was.
He usually gave conflicting and/or confusing messages, so no surprise here.
Penworks, great post! Thanks for your "insider" information. He did often give confusing, or mixed messages IMO. I think he didn't know Jack about anything, but he thought he knew everything. Numb Nuts!
Also, the "family / household" distinction caused a major uproar in the research department in the 1980s. There is no substantiation in the Bible for how VPW taught it. This terrible uproar is described in my book.
Anyhow, "household" was VPW's divisive word to label faithful Wayfers who obeyed him and stuck with the program. His program.
"Material abundance to you and the ministry" - yeah, right, prosperity gospel.
I guess Paul when he was in prison wasn't enjoying prosperity gospel... he must have been so badly out of fellowship...just acquiring spiritual abundance, so that he could write "the prison epistles" with all that great revelation that TWI so reveres.
And so many of the OT prophets were out of fellowship.
And what of some OT kings, who had great abundance? Like Ahaz: rich? Yep. In fellowship? Nope. So bad that he wasn't buried in the kingly tomb.
Actually, I was thinking about this phrase "to the ministry." And yes, we can "believe for it."
It's just that we want to bring success to the MINISTRY OF JESUS CHRIST (which we, as the body of believers, have the privilege to do, to minister his blessing to others) - but NOT to bring success of any kind to the "ministry" of TWI. No way.
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Bolshevik
Telling lies is like fighting a hydra.I mean, we're always working to grow in our understanding of God's Word.Pentagon points down in this photo . . . *makes notes*
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skyrider
UGH............#5 "Go forth as leaders and workers..........in the household."
The corps training/indoctrination is NO LONGER masked as a "Christian" endeavor, but an in-house and subservient role to the cult. When you realize that "the Word" is code for wierwille-doctrine..........there is not one thing in those 5 objectives that deem it has anything to do with Jesus Christ.
They are blinded by their own deceptive tactics and cannot see it.
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OldSkool
#4 Simply cannot be made anything close to right. As way corps im supposed to practise believing to bring material abundance to me AND the ministry.
But "the ministry" offers little to no help of it's "material abundance" to help anyone that has need, especially the way corps. Just give to the ministry...give some more.....and more.
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Bolshevik
Principle #1
Induce and magnify egocentric cognitive dissonance into a full-blown psychoses.
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Bolshevik
Principle #2
Practically apply psychosis in the marketing skills of spin and propaganda.
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Bolshevik
Principle #3
Learn the principles of white-washed public image.
Edited by Bolshevikspelling, bad public image
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Bolshevik
Principle #4
Minimize self worth as an example to others.
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waysider
"Practice believing"...What's that old saying about a chain only being as strong as its weakest link?
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Bolshevik
Principle #5
Take sunk cost to new lows.
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WordWolf
Something I find interesting about this is remembering what vpw himself said about this. There was a tape set "the Heart of the Way Corps." It was a compilation of 7 teachings addressing the WC from different perspectives. 2 were by vpw addressing them, In one of them, he said that he came up with the 5 principles "in about ten minutes" originally and that they hadn't been changed. Even when I was in, I thought that was an awfully short time to come up with something that fundamental to a program and then have it never change.
Furthermore, he also complained about the first principle: "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness." He claimed it really should say "Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness OF THE WORD." He made fun of the idea that this "in-depth spiritual perception and awareness" would be applied to anything else, which I thought at the time was particularly odd. I thought the point was learning stuff to apply it all the time, not just when reading. So, when you encountered life, you'd understand more because you knew more.
This becomes particularly odd when you see that vpw said the complete opposite other times! In "vp and me", lcm documented that "Horse Sense is probably the greatest part of Corps Principal 1." Further, he gave supposed examples of this where vpw pointed out things that needed preventative maintenance and so on. That's completely the opposite of what vpw said elsewhere- he was claiming the importance of something he mocked at other times.
This would be confusing concerning the average person. Most people are fairly consistent- unless one is possibly comparing them after a span of time, time to change their positions on things. (In this case, the tape and the book covered the same span of a few years, twi after it's big boom began but before vpw was too sick to do stuff.) In the case of vpw, this makes sense because we know he went around and taught different things to different people at the same time. He could teach a CFS class and say that a man wasn't supposed to help himself to a woman and to only do stuff with your spouse (the meaning of "let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband") and turn around a few hours later and tell someone "who was spiritual enough to take it" that God Almighty was fine with sexual adultery and someone "meeting the needs" of some married minister sexually and keep it quiet (his "lockbox" doctrine, very private.) He told the pfal audience that he started over with his Bible as his sole source of information, but turned around and mentioned a few books here and there like Bullinger's Companion Bible (leaving out that his "sole source of information" claim was a complete lie because "his" class was an amalgam of Bullinger, Stiles, Leonard, Kenyon, and a handful of others with virtually NO original content.) So, the idea that vpw would make contradictory claims actually should be no surprise- he did it all the time if you kept track if who he told what. That's a bad sign for someone supposedly honest, but twi has been run like a political entity than a religious entity at the top for a long time.
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T-Bone
Thanks for posting that, OldSkool !
What struck me about the revision was the subtle tightening of the leash in principle # 5 (I noted revision in bold red)
"Go forth as leaders and workers in areas of concern, interest, and need in the household"
That really narrows down your options or choices quite a bit.
Reminds me of a scene in The Jerk, where Steve Martin works at a carnival as The Guesser…a guy asks him “what do I win?” and Steve uses his hands, body language and words to direct the guy’s attention to one small section with dinky little prizes ..."anything in this general area right below the stereo and on this side of the bicentennial glasses."
== == == ==
recent Way corps graduate (originally from France): Geez all those principles have such promise – I can’t wait to get out in the world and do great things for God! Ya know principle # 5 has been on my heart a lot lately – I haven’t been back home since I moved to the US some three years ago. I am so concerned with all the changes going on there and terrorism that we’ve heard about on the news. I’d really like to go back there as a corps grad to move the word like crazy – it will be such a blessing to my family still living there ....and lets think big shall we - how about a blessing to all the citizens of France!
Way corps director: we’ve just started working on assignments so I can’t promise you anything right now… but I tell you what - the household could really use a fired-up leader like you – there’s branch outside of Hebron , Kentucky that could really use your help – and you’ll even be close to an International Airport - so France is only some 8 hours away. What do you say to that?
Edited by T-Boneclarity
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Twinky
When I was in rez, this is what CP1 was changed to. Apparently that had always been implied, but it needed to be made explicit. Nobody changed the sign in the woods, though, the outside the Corps Chalet.
As to newly-revised CP5 ... "in the household" !!!
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Twinky
CP5: "Go forth as leaders and workers in areas of concern, interest and need..."
"...in the household."
Would be of concern, interest and need to this group of people? (Mt 10:36) And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
Can you imagine (ROFLMAO) that shower at TWI lovingly serving their enemies?
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Twinky
CP2 "Doctrinally and practically" - goodness me, are they going to get some external teachers in to teach this aspect? Cuz there ain't not nobody there that could do that.
... Gross! ...
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Grace Valerie Claire
WW, I was never in the WC, but I think VPW was a POS. He didn't know Jack about God, life, or people. So many wonderful, talented, and intelligent people were badly used, and abused by TWI. Some day God will judge all of us, and He will give us our just merits.
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penworks
Just for the record, from my experience in the 2nd Corps, when VPW was trying to explain principle #1, he said, among other gobbled jargon, that it meant having common horse sense, so LCM parroted that.
Initially, I was confused as to what VP really meant by it. I think he was, too. Maybe he got the idea from someone else. Ultimately, I decided it meant listening to my intuition, which I thought came from God, like directions for my personal life, what we used to call "revelation." To me, that was spiritual perception and awareness. If you ask me, that is different from common sense. Who knows? Why do we care? I care insofar as I use examples like this to show people (college students in particular) how mixed up and manipulating VP was.
He usually gave conflicting and/or confusing messages, so no surprise here.
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Bolshevik
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penworks
Yes, writing is hard! Who knew?
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T-Bone
wierwille was truly a chameleon - a genius at adapting his deluded agenda to situations.
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chockfull
Wow.
1) CP#5 changes to areas of concern interest and need in the household. I think this represents the cementing of doctrinal error into the leadership body. Practically they ignore the community and focus internally. There are marriages to be manipulated, budgets to control, people of weak and unstable mental habit patterns who need a controlling force to make all the major decisions in their life. This also cements the guiding principle in the doctrine of a cult. To get the attention of vp worshippers, "the Dead Sea is dead because it has only inlets, no outlets". Nice quote there from PFAL that applies to the current leadership body of the Way the Way Corps. I mean who cares about the community you live in? Except to instruct fellowship coordinators how to lie and say there isn't a business operating as a church in your residence in opposition to zoning laws. Use the community, manipulate people.
I absolutely believe the "household of God" teaching of the Way is false and erroneous doctrine from a false prophet. We are not a nation of Israel anymore since Christ, not one blood, one nation, one group. The body of Christ is all encompassing to those who call Christ Lord. He is the head of the church. Just because man judges and can't see the working parts doesn't mean they aren't there. All Christians are brothers, Catholic, Protestant, Apostolic, community church, Messianic Jews, and hundreds of others that are beyond my knowledge and grasp. The seperatist doctrine of the "household of God" is much more suited to a cult. Like Victor Barnard and the River Road group, a documented nightmare on Dateline. That is what seperatist cults produce. The New Knoxville cult is not that much different - just a different shade of veneer, a different coat of whitewash.
Also, hypocrites. I heard one of the things kicking up the Revival and Restoration group was Rosalie confronting all the field Corps towards the end of last year for not running enough classes. Their main tenet communicates circling wagons and focusing on household, but it's their fault for not "moving the Word' when your teachings are so dull on the services that nobody wants to dial in.
2) CP#1 - this was always in my opinion kept nebulous enough where people could accuse or excuse. Treated like a superstitious spider-sense of sorts. "Why did you get in that car accident?" "Your CP1 must not have been functioning". or "You must be dull and not operating CP1".
3) CP#2 - training doctrinally and practically in the whole Word - this to me sounds like a cover up for not having a certified teaching staff with PhDs. Or master's degrees for that matter. Doctrinally, by any measure other than a "withdraw from the body of Christ and make up your own measure" is deficient in training. Corps in-residence re-take the classes, and study them in-depth. They don't study the Bible. Training in the whole Word practically makes no sense. So you're going through the Levitical sacrifice processes? Or just the ones that have to do with gay bashing and tithing?
4) People like lists - it's true - research has proven that articles that consist of a list get more clicks than not. Constructing a list of this nature, even though he spent 10 minutes on it, is kind of genius. I mean how many people have dedicated their entire life to living that list? I knew plenty of people in the Way who were not happy unless they had a list. A calendar list of events, with teachers and topics, a list of outreach events, a list of annual events, a list of things they must do daily to be a "good" Christian. Many groups and organizations boil their list of beliefs down to a list. Many religions guide people towards a list of virtues. Other lists are just moral code tenets. For example, when i was a kid I took Tae Kwon Do, a Korean martial art. What are the "5 Tenets of Tae Kwon Do?"
Courtesy, Integrity, Perseverance, Self-Control, Indomitable Spirit,
Sir.
I would say that living those tenets probably catches God's attention more than the cult tenets, or "Corpse Principles"
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Grace Valerie Claire
Penworks, great post! Thanks for your "insider" information. He did often give confusing, or mixed messages IMO. I think he didn't know Jack about anything, but he thought he knew everything. Numb Nuts!
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penworks
Also, the "family / household" distinction caused a major uproar in the research department in the 1980s. There is no substantiation in the Bible for how VPW taught it. This terrible uproar is described in my book.
Anyhow, "household" was VPW's divisive word to label faithful Wayfers who obeyed him and stuck with the program. His program.
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Twinky
"Material abundance to you and the ministry" - yeah, right, prosperity gospel.
I guess Paul when he was in prison wasn't enjoying prosperity gospel... he must have been so badly out of fellowship...just acquiring spiritual abundance, so that he could write "the prison epistles" with all that great revelation that TWI so reveres.
And so many of the OT prophets were out of fellowship.
And what of some OT kings, who had great abundance? Like Ahaz: rich? Yep. In fellowship? Nope. So bad that he wasn't buried in the kingly tomb.
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Twinky
Actually, I was thinking about this phrase "to the ministry." And yes, we can "believe for it."
It's just that we want to bring success to the MINISTRY OF JESUS CHRIST (which we, as the body of believers, have the privilege to do, to minister his blessing to others) - but NOT to bring success of any kind to the "ministry" of TWI. No way.
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