Grace, have a practice in the area at the bottom of the Home page, called Testing 1 2 3. You can try out whatever you might need to do, there, or perhaps even find out some answers to other potential problems.
Grace, have a practice in the area at the bottom of the Home page, called Testing 1 2 3. You can try out whatever you might need to do, there, or perhaps even find out some answers to other potential problems.
All right. That there is the original post/ and I've read purt near every response to it and about it in this entire thread. I might've missed one or two, but suffice it to say - - I have the "jist" of what this all talking about.
rrobs -- you're quoting scripture. Nothing wrong with that - - but then (imo) you add your own "commentary/ preaching/ etc." mandating that we (and supposedly all of human kind) have to think like you do. I could go to any Baptist/ Catholic/ Pentecostal/ Mormon/ Presbyterian/ JW congregation/ etc./ etc./ etc./ church and gotten the exact same message from "the pulpit" saying "GO THOU AND BELIEVE LIKE US ". In my job, I have to deal with a LOT OF detrimental things that happen, both physically and mentally. Some can be forgiven outright, and others have consequences that need to be dealt with forcefully. I Am of the opinion that you are failing to see the "forceful" side of forgiveness, such as is mandated by scripture.
Mandated? Really? What part did I make mandatory? To be clear, you don't have to believe one single word I say. Never asked you to believe anything. I think you are reading things into it that aren't really there. That's OK though. It's clearly the MO here at GSC when they feel threatened by the scriptures.
What do you mean by the forceful side of forgiveness? I've not seen it in the scriptures but I guess you see it somewhere in there. Is it something you mandate I should do? Sounds like it to me, but I want to make sure you're not doing something you condemn in me. That would be hypocritical, wouldn't it?
I am coming to the conclusion that rrobs may have Asperger's syndrome. Clearly intelligent, well able to function in a mechanical way (after all, he was a pilot) - but not able to comprehend the meaning behind the words. Asperger's people take things at face value; literally; black and white; that's it. Excellent at some tasks, logical, decisive. But lacking, as Rocky remarks, empathy and compassion. Asperger's people can learn a little of what goes on behind the words, but they don't comprehend it.
There's more to life than that. Words encapsulate what goes on in the heart. "Love" as such isn't literal, isn't quantifiable or measurable, and isn't mechanical. Nor is "forgiveness." If these are any of those "mechanical" things, it's not love and it's not forgiveness.
An alternative to rrobs having Asperger's is that he is simply a Waybot, the sort of person that spouts the scriptures but doesn't properly consider who he's talking to and what their needs might be, but simply talks right over them. These people are like records or tape machines. They aren't really interested in what the person they are talking to has actually said, don't pay attention to responses, and they don't "draw out" from whomever they are talking to what is really going on, what the problem really is. Sadly, Waybots don't even notice when responses cease. Rather, this seems to make them spout even more scripture of increasing irrelevance to the person they are addressing.
I don't know whether Waybot-ness is learned behaviour or whether it patterns onto something in the Waybot's own personality. Whatever... they still miss the point that they are dealing with people and people's issues. And thus, (despite probably being well-meaning) they fail to be good ministers of the gospel.
I prefer to think of rrobs as the former. The latter thought is too horrible to entertain.
Thanks for your well wishes, having Asperger's as opposed to waybotness. I guess having Asperger's is a lot better than being a waybot. I just hope you are right. But there is the fact you mentioned that I haven't noticed the responses have stopped (the have?) so, God forbid, maybe it is waybotness. Oh no! And to think I haven't even noticed that I keep using scripture, ever increasing scripture at that. Could that be because I don't? Check up on that and get back to me. Or not.
OK, I'm done with the sarcasm. Now onto something serious:
You guys are soooo way conditioned that it is impossible to carry on a decent conversation. If you can look with a clear mind, you will undoubtedly ascertain that probably 90% of the references to the way are from GSC. I seldom mention it in my posts or answers. GSC seems to think that if someone doesn't fall in line with GSC that it has to be because of the way. There are other reasons. Bitter coloured glasses comes to mind. I left the way (I was on staff) a long time before anybody here after the scandal and I've not been to one fellowship since. You guys say stuff about which you know nothing. That doesn't reflect well, but I guess you were hurt pretty bad after having put your faith in a man instead of God. I understand the damage is done, but it's not too late for you to change though.
In your opening post, you lay out the love is greater than faith and hope. Fine.
But then you go into disagreement over doctrine, and that we should love those who disagree with our personal doctrine. Fine.
Then you discuss forgiveness as part of love. Fine.
Finally, you go into being wronged.
How did you jump from disagreement over doctrine to being wronged and actions in the flesh? You go from almost specific to completely general in that post.
I'd like it if you could fill in some missing information there. There seems to be a call to action at the end of your post, but I have no idea what you mean.
Bullies? Give me a break. Would you rather I just pronounce a judgment that you can simply deny? Why would you care if I believed you or not? At least you could put it out there in your own words and let it speak for itself.
Would I rather you judged me? What a foolish question. I don't care. Do what you want. God has judged me and I'm good with that.
Have you not read even one of the many time I said I don't care if you believe me or not? If not, I'll tell you right now: I don't care if you believe me, God or the man in the moon. There, now we can put that to rest (except somebody will undoubtedly bring it up again).
Put what out there? I haven't put enough out there already? You guys should have plenty of ammo by now.
In your opening post, you lay out the love is greater than faith and hope. Fine.
But then you go into disagreement over doctrine, and that we should love those who disagree with our personal doctrine. Fine.
Then you discuss forgiveness as part of love. Fine.
Finally, you go into being wronged.
How did you jump from disagreement over doctrine to being wronged and actions in the flesh? You go from almost specific to completely general in that post.
I'd like it if you could fill in some missing information there. There seems to be a call to action at the end of your post, but I have no idea what you mean.
I can't answer your question because I don't know where I complained about being wronged in the original post. You are asking a completely irrelevant question.
Gee, what could be the call to action in a post about love and forgiveness? Oh, maybe I should love and forgive? Notice I said "I", and not you or anybody else. I don't want to start another s..t storm because I demand obedience from all.
I can't answer your question because I don't know where I complained about being wronged in the original post. You are asking a completely irrelevant question.
Gee, what could be the call to action in a post about love and forgiveness? Oh, maybe I should love and forgive? Notice I said "I", and not you or anybody else. I don't want to start another s..t storm because I demand obedience from all.
Have you, who have been wronged, never wrong somebody else? We all do the same things in the flesh (Rom 2:1). - Rrobs, opening post
I didn't say you complained.
You're saying to disagree with doctrine is to be wronged?
Have you, who have been wronged, never wrong somebody else? We all do the same things in the flesh (Rom 2:1). - Rrobs, opening post
I didn't say you complained.
You're saying to disagree with doctrine is to be wronged?
So as not to exacerbate my Asperger's I can no longer post here. Sorry to ruin your fun, but eventually somebody else will come along for GSC to beat up on. Bye all....
Would I rather you judged me? What a foolish question. I don't care. Do what you want. God has judged me and I'm good with that.
Have you not read even one of the many time I said I don't care if you believe me or not? If not, I'll tell you right now: I don't care if you believe me, God or the man in the moon. There, now we can put that to rest (except somebody will undoubtedly bring it up again).
Put what out there? I haven't put enough out there already? You guys should have plenty of ammo by now.
Have you not even read what you posted yesterday?
Why do you ask me to say something that you will not believe anyway? You want me to take (waste) the time to "expound" no less. You've not once agreed with anything I've said (maybe a tacit agreement or two, but not much). I say I didn't mean to hurt anybody and you don't believe that either. You're mind is made up about who I am and I doubt anything I say will change that.
If you don't care whether I believe you, why do you refuse to simply set forth the answers to the questions I posed? Your initial response to my invitation for you to spell it out in your own words strongly suggested you do care.
What do you mean by the forceful side of forgiveness? I've not seen it in the scriptures but I guess you see it somewhere in there. Is it something you mandate I should do? Sounds like it to me, but I want to make sure you're not doing something you condemn in me. That would be hypocritical, wouldn't it?
That would be "projecting." Which it appears you do quite unconsciously and perhaps frequently in your posts.
Btw, Stinky (...er, Twinky... sorry, Twinky, I got quite a chuckle out of Grace's faux pas) may have hit the nail on the head. Aspergers may be the kindest way to assess the fact that so many things we write seem to just go right over rrobs' head.
We aren't mental health professionals and certainly are not qualified to diagnose anyone. But for background to perhaps understand why Twinky suggested Asperger's as a possibility, this article might shed some light.
So as not to exacerbate my Asperger's I can no longer post here. Sorry to ruin your fun, but eventually somebody else will come along for GSC to beat up on. Bye all....
I don't know that you have Asperger's. My question for you was my own and not "GSC". Nor was my question for sport.
Your initial post starts of fairly logical but finishes in a confusing way. If you can see why you'll see why it rubs people the wrong way. You're free to restate your opening post for clarity.
I find it most interesting that rrobs posts something about being loving and getting on and loving the unlovable (paraphrase). I posted something very personal and directly on point; an initial post and a follow-up one. Other people have commented, and one kind poster has PM'd me.
I know rrobs has had the opportunity to see it, because he has posted a couple of things after that. What has he said, or done? Just plain IGNORED IT and thus IGNORED ME.
How very "loving" of him.
Ya know, perhaps there’s been some confusion due to different expectations...I was thinking this was a group discussion in the doctrinal forum...maybe the person who started this thread anticipated a conservative church sermon setting - i.e. no interrupting the preacher kind of thing.
Difficult to know, but I'm not falling for it again. This is the second thread (at least) where he's talked past me, won't engage. So I won't get involved in his threads again. If he posts again!
Ya know, perhaps there’s been some confusion due to different expectations...I was thinking this was a group discussion in the doctrinal forum...maybe the person who started this thread anticipated a conservative church sermon setting - i.e. no interrupting the preacher kind of thing.
T-Bone, good point!! Most of the posts are way over my head, but I think the give-and -take is fascinating.
Difficult to know, but I'm not falling for it again. This is the second thread (at least) where he's talked past me, won't engage. So I won't get involved in his threads again. If he posts again!
Well that’s a shame Twinky - I don’t think I’m alone when I say your input is always appreciated - so don’t let one person ignoring you put the kibosh on what you have to say!
and another thing we Grease Spotters might want to keep in mind - that we’re addressing a wider audience than just folks on a particular thread (i.e. lurkers, folks still in TWI , offshoots, etc. who may read your comments too....or stumble upon them years from now - if Grease Spot is still around...I hope so.)
Being ignored doesn’t keep me from enjoying the discussion with other folks. ...Heck, I tried a different approach on this thread in an effort to keep to the topic and not start a fight over anything:
I did not quote the person who started the thread - though my points were distinctly at variance with his first post.
I deliberately did not mention TWI or wierwille when referring to that know-it-all mindset I had in my younger days (when I was in TWI) I know how certain folks get all defensive or antagonistic and may even take it personal if you criticize something wierwille taught or did, or if you even just make yourself vulnerable by admitting how much influence he once had over your mind and lifestyle.
...but alas he ignored me too...maybe he hit the ignore button on me...I should be so lucky....to be honest , I think I need an ignore button for myself...sometimes I can really annoy the $hit out of myself....dang - I found the enema - and it is me!
Well that’s a shame Twinky - I don’t think I’m alone when I say your input is always appreciated - so don’t let one person ignoring you put the kibosh on what you have to say!
and another thing we Grease Spotters might want to keep in mind - that we’re addressing a wider audience than just folks on a particular thread (i.e. lurkers, folks still in TWI , offshoots, etc. who may read your comments too....or stumble upon them years from now - if Grease Spot is still around...I hope so.)
Being ignored doesn’t keep me from enjoying the discussion with other folks. ...Heck, I tried a different approach on this thread in an effort to keep to the topic and not start a fight over anything:
I did not quote the person who started the thread - though my points were distinctly at variance with his first post.
I deliberately did not mention TWI or wierwille when referring to that know-it-all mindset I had in my younger days (when I was in TWI) I know how certain folks get all defensive or antagonistic and may even take it personal if you criticize something wierwille taught or did, or if you even just make yourself vulnerable by admitting how much influence he once had over your mind and lifestyle.
...but alas he ignored me too...maybe he hit the ignore button on me...I should be so lucky....to be honest , I think I need an ignore button for myself...sometimes I can really annoy the $hit out of myself....dang - I found the enema - and it is me!
T-Bone, and Twinky, I think both of you usually have interesting posts. However, I do think some of the people who post, keep posting far to long, and they seem to enjoy ticking off other posters. But, it is not for me to tell others, when to post, and when not to post. I know I have had a few "discussions" with other posters, and they let me know when I am off the beam in my posts. Some people like my posts, others don't. However, this is an open forum, and people are free, within reason, to post their views. Personally, I have learned to skip certain posters, and they probably have learned to skip mine. But in my opinion, the great strength of the GSC, is that people are free to posts their thoughts, within certain boundaries, about their experiences with TWI. Some of us hate TWI, some of us love it, and some of us have mixed feelings about it.
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Twinky
It's much more deeply seated than that, Grace. Sis has some psychological problems, and I am the unwitting focus for these. It is absolutely nothing to do with me. She has some sort of anger
T-Bone
What a great movie and what a great scene! Thanks for that clip, Rocky ! I am ashamed to say it reminds me of my former life when I thought I had all the answers and would dole
Bolshevik
Twinky
"Stinky"????
Okay, I see you changed that in a later post. Do you know you can edit posts, Grace?
Edited by TwinkyLater post by GVC
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Grace Valerie Claire
Twinky, I tried that once, and boy did I make a mess of my post!!
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Twinky
Grace, have a practice in the area at the bottom of the Home page, called Testing 1 2 3. You can try out whatever you might need to do, there, or perhaps even find out some answers to other potential problems.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Twinky, thanks!!
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rrobs
Mandated? Really? What part did I make mandatory? To be clear, you don't have to believe one single word I say. Never asked you to believe anything. I think you are reading things into it that aren't really there. That's OK though. It's clearly the MO here at GSC when they feel threatened by the scriptures.
What do you mean by the forceful side of forgiveness? I've not seen it in the scriptures but I guess you see it somewhere in there. Is it something you mandate I should do? Sounds like it to me, but I want to make sure you're not doing something you condemn in me. That would be hypocritical, wouldn't it?
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rrobs
Thanks for your well wishes, having Asperger's as opposed to waybotness. I guess having Asperger's is a lot better than being a waybot. I just hope you are right. But there is the fact you mentioned that I haven't noticed the responses have stopped (the have?) so, God forbid, maybe it is waybotness. Oh no! And to think I haven't even noticed that I keep using scripture, ever increasing scripture at that. Could that be because I don't? Check up on that and get back to me. Or not.
OK, I'm done with the sarcasm. Now onto something serious:
You guys are soooo way conditioned that it is impossible to carry on a decent conversation. If you can look with a clear mind, you will undoubtedly ascertain that probably 90% of the references to the way are from GSC. I seldom mention it in my posts or answers. GSC seems to think that if someone doesn't fall in line with GSC that it has to be because of the way. There are other reasons. Bitter coloured glasses comes to mind. I left the way (I was on staff) a long time before anybody here after the scandal and I've not been to one fellowship since. You guys say stuff about which you know nothing. That doesn't reflect well, but I guess you were hurt pretty bad after having put your faith in a man instead of God. I understand the damage is done, but it's not too late for you to change though.
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Bolshevik
In your opening post, you lay out the love is greater than faith and hope. Fine.
But then you go into disagreement over doctrine, and that we should love those who disagree with our personal doctrine. Fine.
Then you discuss forgiveness as part of love. Fine.
Finally, you go into being wronged.
How did you jump from disagreement over doctrine to being wronged and actions in the flesh? You go from almost specific to completely general in that post.
I'd like it if you could fill in some missing information there. There seems to be a call to action at the end of your post, but I have no idea what you mean.
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rrobs
Would I rather you judged me? What a foolish question. I don't care. Do what you want. God has judged me and I'm good with that.
Have you not read even one of the many time I said I don't care if you believe me or not? If not, I'll tell you right now: I don't care if you believe me, God or the man in the moon. There, now we can put that to rest (except somebody will undoubtedly bring it up again).
Put what out there? I haven't put enough out there already? You guys should have plenty of ammo by now.
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rrobs
I can't answer your question because I don't know where I complained about being wronged in the original post. You are asking a completely irrelevant question.
Gee, what could be the call to action in a post about love and forgiveness? Oh, maybe I should love and forgive? Notice I said "I", and not you or anybody else. I don't want to start another s..t storm because I demand obedience from all.
Edited by rrobstypo
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Bolshevik
Have you, who have been wronged, never wrong somebody else? We all do the same things in the flesh (Rom 2:1). - Rrobs, opening post
I didn't say you complained.
You're saying to disagree with doctrine is to be wronged?
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rrobs
So as not to exacerbate my Asperger's I can no longer post here. Sorry to ruin your fun, but eventually somebody else will come along for GSC to beat up on. Bye all....
Edited by rrobstypo
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Rocky
Have you not even read what you posted yesterday?
If you don't care whether I believe you, why do you refuse to simply set forth the answers to the questions I posed? Your initial response to my invitation for you to spell it out in your own words strongly suggested you do care.
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Rocky
That would be "projecting." Which it appears you do quite unconsciously and perhaps frequently in your posts.
Edited by RockyBtw, Stinky (...er, Twinky... sorry, Twinky, I got quite a chuckle out of Grace's faux pas) may have hit the nail on the head. Aspergers may be the kindest way to assess the fact that so many things we write seem to just go right over rrobs' head.
We aren't mental health professionals and certainly are not qualified to diagnose anyone. But for background to perhaps understand why Twinky suggested Asperger's as a possibility, this article might shed some light.
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Bolshevik
I don't know that you have Asperger's. My question for you was my own and not "GSC". Nor was my question for sport.
Your initial post starts of fairly logical but finishes in a confusing way. If you can see why you'll see why it rubs people the wrong way. You're free to restate your opening post for clarity.
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DontWorryBeHappy
Thanks for no longer posting! What a relief! Here's a good scripture quote for ya on your way out.........."suffer not a fool". Bye-bye now.
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T-Bone
Ya know, perhaps there’s been some confusion due to different expectations...I was thinking this was a group discussion in the doctrinal forum...maybe the person who started this thread anticipated a conservative church sermon setting - i.e. no interrupting the preacher kind of thing.
Edited by T-BoneClarity
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Twinky
Difficult to know, but I'm not falling for it again. This is the second thread (at least) where he's talked past me, won't engage. So I won't get involved in his threads again. If he posts again!
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Grace Valerie Claire
T-Bone, good point!! Most of the posts are way over my head, but I think the give-and -take is fascinating.
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T-Bone
Well that’s a shame Twinky - I don’t think I’m alone when I say your input is always appreciated - so don’t let one person ignoring you put the kibosh on what you have to say!
and another thing we Grease Spotters might want to keep in mind - that we’re addressing a wider audience than just folks on a particular thread (i.e. lurkers, folks still in TWI , offshoots, etc. who may read your comments too....or stumble upon them years from now - if Grease Spot is still around...I hope so.)
Being ignored doesn’t keep me from enjoying the discussion with other folks. ...Heck, I tried a different approach on this thread in an effort to keep to the topic and not start a fight over anything:
I did not quote the person who started the thread - though my points were distinctly at variance with his first post.
I deliberately did not mention TWI or wierwille when referring to that know-it-all mindset I had in my younger days (when I was in TWI) I know how certain folks get all defensive or antagonistic and may even take it personal if you criticize something wierwille taught or did, or if you even just make yourself vulnerable by admitting how much influence he once had over your mind and lifestyle.
...but alas he ignored me too...maybe he hit the ignore button on me...I should be so lucky....to be honest , I think I need an ignore button for myself...sometimes I can really annoy the $hit out of myself....dang - I found the enema - and it is me!
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Grace Valerie Claire
T-Bone, and Twinky, I think both of you usually have interesting posts. However, I do think some of the people who post, keep posting far to long, and they seem to enjoy ticking off other posters. But, it is not for me to tell others, when to post, and when not to post. I know I have had a few "discussions" with other posters, and they let me know when I am off the beam in my posts. Some people like my posts, others don't. However, this is an open forum, and people are free, within reason, to post their views. Personally, I have learned to skip certain posters, and they probably have learned to skip mine. But in my opinion, the great strength of the GSC, is that people are free to posts their thoughts, within certain boundaries, about their experiences with TWI. Some of us hate TWI, some of us love it, and some of us have mixed feelings about it.
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Twinky
Ah, T-Bone, not going to give up posting here - just that I won't bother attempting to engage with rrobs.
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T-Bone
Alright Twinky and Grace,
Keep on with the keepin’ on
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