Thanks waysider...this reminded me of the many many teachers we had that put their hearts into their sharings..over the years...for a 20 + aged guy..these people were good examples to me at that time...just really loved how this man gave of what God inspired in him..
I’m not interested in viewing the teaching nor do I have fond memories of the way we were following a charismatic cult leader. Judging by a previous thread you started - you still seem rather intent on “proselytizing” to an unreceptive audience:
…and as suggested on that thread you might try starting a thread in the doctrinal forum – where you can discuss a system of teachings on a particular topic. That way you might have better luck engaging others in a thoughtful conversation…I don’t mean to be rude – just stating my take on your posts - but your repeated efforts of “testifying” or “witnessing” to the great impact that an assortment of “teachers” has had on your life, does nothing for me.
unlike you...I do have many fond memories of others besides VPW who really gave it the best they could for our sakes)from the teaching platform)...this just reminded me of those special times as I'm learning some special stuff via thse guys..sorry that your experience was so sour....BUT perhaps there are others who did have an uplifiting experience those many many moons ago..perhaps this is for them...perhaps this goes l80 degrees opposite of sharing "unfond memories " of TWI...thus I don't see it as a doctrinal forum subject..its more about what GOOD I'm seeing in other people besides TWIers that makes alot of sense..I am not any kind of member of JGLM ministries..BUT am learning & trying alot of what they freely are sharing on line....this may be a bonafied blessing to others besides you...Love & Peace as well..to you dear friend..
unlike you...I do have many fond memories of others besides VPW who really gave it the best they could for our sakes)from the teaching platform)...this just reminded me of those special times as I'm learning some special stuff via thse guys..sorry that your experience was so sour....BUT perhaps there are others who did have an uplifiting experience those many many moons ago..perhaps this is for them...perhaps this goes l80 degrees opposite of sharing "unfond memories " of TWI...thus I don't see it as a doctrinal forum subject..its more about what GOOD I'm seeing in other people besides TWIers that makes alot of sense..I am not any kind of member of JGLM ministries..BUT am learning & trying alot of what they freely are sharing on line....this may be a bonafied blessing to others besides you...Love & Peace as well..to you dear friend..
Somehow that makes you feel entitled to come to GSC, a place maintained (time and $) by others, to proselytize to an unreceptive audience?
Much of what I've read about JGL's personal background begs the question, why would I want to follow someone then or now that was dishonest about their education, ministry training, and business involvement?
I'm not saying the holy spirit wasn't involved in his life. I honestly don't know. It just makes it more difficult to get even a little bit excited about wanting to know more about men and women who seem to think he was something special somehow.
unlike you...I do have many fond memories of others besides VPW who really gave it the best they could for our sakes)from the teaching platform)...this just reminded me of those special times as I'm learning some special stuff via thse guys..sorry that your experience was so sour....BUT perhaps there are others who did have an uplifiting experience those many many moons ago..perhaps this is for them...perhaps this goes l80 degrees opposite of sharing "unfond memories " of TWI...thus I don't see it as a doctrinal forum subject..its more about what GOOD I'm seeing in other people besides TWIers that makes alot of sense..I am not any kind of member of JGLM ministries..BUT am learning & trying alot of what they freely are sharing on line....this may be a bonafied blessing to others besides you...Love & Peace as well..to you dear friend..
12 hours ago, JayDee said:
Much of what I've read about JGL's personal background begs the question, why would I want to follow someone then or now that was dishonest about their education, ministry training, and business involvement?
I'm not saying the holy spirit wasn't involved in his life. I honestly don't know. It just makes it more difficult to get even a little bit excited about wanting to know more about men and women who seem to think he was something special somehow.
Guess I’m old school…simple Christianity is simply Christ-centered - simple in that all it takes is what's already been provided for us by God:
2 Grace and peace be yours in abundance through the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord.3 His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness. II Peter 1: 2, 3 NIV
I wonder how many folks would be interested in Christianity if all it provided was Jesus Christ. In my humble opinion, it seems rather popular now to market Christianity like some get-rich-quick scheme...something that holds the shortcuts to success...supposedly ways to tap into the power of God. It seems the least common denominator in all of that is what can you get out of Christianity. Thanks to the Internet we have a glut of supposed teachers who connive folks into thinking they desperately need whatever feel-good Pablum is being offered.
Personally I don’t see the need for any supposed middleman - like any of the guys you've mentioned…and while we're talking about it - with your lack of details and scope - you come across like a salesman for a product or service that you know very little about. You’ve said it yourself - how you don’t know much about them and even mentioned things that are questionable.
If you’re not a member of any of these ministries and seem to be afraid to discuss doctrine then how can you be so confident that what they teach is sound doctrine?
And what investigative standards are you employing that qualifies you to say “its more about what GOOD I'm seeing in other people besides TWIers that makes alot of sense.”? Where are these “other people” and how many are there? Can you please be more specific. And besides filling us in on the basis for your sweeping statements - perhaps you could share your fond memories of experiences you’ve had – again, please be specific. On your other thread you talked about miracles / healings - are you talking about miracles you've seen on You Tube? Are you talking about specific miracles you have done - please be specific in the details.
Many folks at Grease Spot endured enough of the feel-good Pablum teachings-and-false hopes-and-wishful thinking rigmarole to realize it’s really just all about supporting those who run the Mickey Mouse operation. The longer one stayed in TWI, getting ever more involved - the more one saw its twofold nature. Pleasant on the outside with its veneer of Christianity and yet inwardly such an abusive and exploitative system from the machinations of top leadership. typically in cults there's a support system in place (committed followers on staff and in leadership training programs) - the labor force that keeps the general populace of the cult interested in the charismatic leader and ensures their money keeps rolling in. That is the parasitic nature of a cult - the exploitative organization needs and feeds off the contribution of time/efforts, resources (money, possessions, etc.), and talents of its followers – yet contributes NOTHING in return. I venture to say you were in the general public of TWI - and not on staff or in the way corps - or you would know what I'm talking about.
Maybe you should have more of a concern for doctrine. Doctrine is inextricably linked to practice. Because what you believe directs what you do...Matthew 7 and the books of Timothy and Peter will testify to the threat of false teachers and the negative impact of unsound doctrine. It is because unsound or distorted doctrine will generate bad practices.
You might want to check out the following books that are very specific in exposing the dark underbelly of an abusive and exploitative cult, how unsound doctrine has a deleterious effect on followers and the false hopes / wishful thinking being sold to folks through the preaching of the health and wealth gospel:
well hey...ya'll enjoy one another & your conclusions about life...I felt being an ex TWI that I owed it to exWayfers about what I'm finding on line..."the things that I do ye shall do and greater" are going on & even being video'd & if ya'll want to ignore them..so be it..
You think I have an agenda of recruiting to these ministries?? I realize there's been great discouragement amongst ya'll because of your negative TWI experiences..& yet Jesus's promise is still valid & happening...I was hoping someone here still had the fire they had in TWI to continue with their search & such is my hope..despite the implications alot of you have been throwing my way.
So go ahead ..DON"T check any of this out....stay safe & know that these are just money grubbing people out to deceive you and the rest of the world....Don't bother replying to this as I'm thru with what I'm offering...god help all of you who are in your own world of judgement..
For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. II Timothy 4:3 NIV
well hey...ya'll enjoy one another & your conclusions about life...I felt being an ex TWI that I owed it to exWayfers about what I'm finding on line..."the things that I do ye shall do and greater" are going on & even being video'd & if ya'll want to ignore them..so be it..
You think I have an agenda of recruiting to these ministries?? I realize there's been great discouragement amongst ya'll because of your negative TWI experiences..& yet Jesus's promise is still valid & happening...I was hoping someone here still had the fire they had in TWI to continue with their search & such is my hope..despite the implications alot of you have been throwing my way.
So go ahead ..DON"T check any of this out....stay safe & know that these are just money grubbing people out to deceive you and the rest of the world....Don't bother replying to this as I'm thru with what I'm offering...god help all of you who are in your own world of judgement..
As someone who's still a Christian, I found nothing in your posts to draw my interest-which is why I found nothing worth commenting on. What I found was some link-dumping (just a link with no real commentary), and some cheerful blurbing (boy howdy, this is some great stuff!)
Since this is a DISCUSSION forum, I expect to actually DISCUSS things. People who show up with just links usually are members of an ex-twi group who are posting links to their ex-twi group....and sometimes they pretend they're not a member of the group. (On an unrelated Christian board, I once ran into a drive-by post by Jeff of CES who said, in effect, "Gee, I found this website with some unusual stuff on it. What do you guys think?" with a link to his own content from the CES website. I responded immediately and called him on it. He never replied. Either it was a true drive-by and he never visited again, or he cut his losses when he realized he was caught.
So, your posts. They were vague comments about someone's content on YouTube. They didn't even have the direct links to the content. So, I would have had to look them up to find out about what you WEREN'T saying about it. On message-boards, playing coy (being vague and indirect) usually backfires in either the short or long-term.
I don't know WHY you posted that way. I just know that it's a formula for keeping me DISinterested.
Jim Jack, if you want to know about awesome teachers and people who do awesome things, I'd love you to come with me to either of the two churches I regularly attend, spend time with the ministers there and with the congregations, and come out with us on some of our many and varied genuine outreach and assistance events. You will find many who walk the talk, and talk the walk.
There are many people who are worthy of national and international respect, genuine scholarship, genuine very high level appointments (one is chaplain to the Queen), one is a peer of the realm (a genuine aristocrat) - and all are so humble, quiet, gentle, and inclusive. There are no TV evangelists, but from time to time the BBC broadcasts the Easter or a Christmas service from Bath abbey (where the Queen's chaplain has his "regular job" as the Rector of the abbey) and the rector is the nicest man who really points the way to Jesus and honours God. You want what he's got, not because he "sells" it in loud manner, but because of his quietness, peacefulness and confidence in the Lord. The peer has set up many programs to assist homeless and vulnerable people and is a real "mover and shaker" to get things done that bring Christ to the overlooked, and to build Christian unity among believers. Yet he's so self-effacing that he is easy to overlook. I know of several who have given land or large amounts of money for community projects (it's taken me a long time to find this out because they don't shout about it). I know people who have very little in financial terms, but spend their time and energy tirelessly doing things that benefit their community, because of their love for Christ and their desire to show that love.
In fact, I could write a very long list of awesome but very humble people that I meet through these churches and the other very active churches, of all denominations, throughout this city.
Jim Jack, I can arrange meetings for you with some mightily awesome Christian folks, who from genuine Christian love seek the wellbeing of their community in a huge variety of ways. I can't promise splashy miracles. I can promise genuine heart and genuine and observable turn-round in a myriad of ways, in people's lives.
Please let me know when you would like to come with me.
Jim Jack, if you want to know about awesome teachers and people who do awesome things, I'd love you to come with me to either of the two churches I regularly attend, spend time with the ministers there and with the congregations, and come out with us on some of our many and varied genuine outreach and assistance events. You will find many who walk the talk, and talk the walk.
There are many people who are worthy of national and international respect, genuine scholarship, genuine very high level appointments (one is chaplain to the Queen), one is a peer of the realm (a genuine aristocrat) - and all are so humble, quiet, gentle, and inclusive. There are no TV evangelists, but from time to time the BBC broadcasts the Easter or a Christmas service from Bath abbey (where the Queen's chaplain has his "regular job" as the Rector of the abbey) and the rector is the nicest man who really points the way to Jesus and honours God. You want what he's got, not because he "sells" it in loud manner, but because of his quietness, peacefulness and confidence in the Lord. The peer has set up many programs to assist homeless and vulnerable people and is a real "mover and shaker" to get things done that bring Christ to the overlooked, and to build Christian unity among believers. Yet he's so self-effacing that he is easy to overlook. I know of several who have given land or large amounts of money for community projects (it's taken me a long time to find this out because they don't shout about it). I know people who have very little in financial terms, but spend their time and energy tirelessly doing things that benefit their community, because of their love for Christ and their desire to show that love.
In fact, I could write a very long list of awesome but very humble people that I meet through these churches and the other very active churches, of all denominations, throughout this city.
Jim Jack, I can arrange meetings for you with some mightily awesome Christian folks, who from genuine Christian love seek the wellbeing of their community in a huge variety of ways. I can't promise splashy miracles. I can promise genuine heart and genuine and observable turn-round in a myriad of ways, in people's lives.
Please let me know when you would like to come with me.
Twinky, if you lived in DC, I would take you up on your offer!
Recommended Posts
waysider
I have no desire to watch it, but for those who do, here's the LINK.
Edited by waysiderclarity
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jim jack
Thanks waysider...this reminded me of the many many teachers we had that put their hearts into their sharings..over the years...for a 20 + aged guy..these people were good examples to me at that time...just really loved how this man gave of what God inspired in him..
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
I’m not interested in viewing the teaching nor do I have fond memories of the way we were following a charismatic cult leader. Judging by a previous thread you started - you still seem rather intent on “proselytizing” to an unreceptive audience:
thread: anyone ever hear or a follower of Todd White
…and as suggested on that thread you might try starting a thread in the doctrinal forum – where you can discuss a system of teachings on a particular topic. That way you might have better luck engaging others in a thoughtful conversation…I don’t mean to be rude – just stating my take on your posts - but your repeated efforts of “testifying” or “witnessing” to the great impact that an assortment of “teachers” has had on your life, does nothing for me.
Love & peace
T-Bone
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jim jack
unlike you...I do have many fond memories of others besides VPW who really gave it the best they could for our sakes)from the teaching platform)...this just reminded me of those special times as I'm learning some special stuff via thse guys..sorry that your experience was so sour....BUT perhaps there are others who did have an uplifiting experience those many many moons ago..perhaps this is for them...perhaps this goes l80 degrees opposite of sharing "unfond memories " of TWI...thus I don't see it as a doctrinal forum subject..its more about what GOOD I'm seeing in other people besides TWIers that makes alot of sense..I am not any kind of member of JGLM ministries..BUT am learning & trying alot of what they freely are sharing on line....this may be a bonafied blessing to others besides you...Love & Peace as well..to you dear friend..
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
Somehow that makes you feel entitled to come to GSC, a place maintained (time and $) by others, to proselytize to an unreceptive audience?
Edited by RockyLink to comment
Share on other sites
JayDee
Much of what I've read about JGL's personal background begs the question, why would I want to follow someone then or now that was dishonest about their education, ministry training, and business involvement?
I'm not saying the holy spirit wasn't involved in his life. I honestly don't know. It just makes it more difficult to get even a little bit excited about wanting to know more about men and women who seem to think he was something special somehow.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
Guess I’m old school…simple Christianity is simply Christ-centered - simple in that all it takes is what's already been provided for us by God:
2 Grace and peace be yours in abundance through the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord. 3 His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness. II Peter 1: 2, 3 NIV
I wonder how many folks would be interested in Christianity if all it provided was Jesus Christ. In my humble opinion, it seems rather popular now to market Christianity like some get-rich-quick scheme...something that holds the shortcuts to success...supposedly ways to tap into the power of God. It seems the least common denominator in all of that is what can you get out of Christianity. Thanks to the Internet we have a glut of supposed teachers who connive folks into thinking they desperately need whatever feel-good Pablum is being offered.
Personally I don’t see the need for any supposed middleman - like any of the guys you've mentioned…and while we're talking about it - with your lack of details and scope - you come across like a salesman for a product or service that you know very little about. You’ve said it yourself - how you don’t know much about them and even mentioned things that are questionable.
If you’re not a member of any of these ministries and seem to be afraid to discuss doctrine then how can you be so confident that what they teach is sound doctrine?
And what investigative standards are you employing that qualifies you to say “its more about what GOOD I'm seeing in other people besides TWIers that makes alot of sense.”? Where are these “other people” and how many are there? Can you please be more specific. And besides filling us in on the basis for your sweeping statements - perhaps you could share your fond memories of experiences you’ve had – again, please be specific. On your other thread you talked about miracles / healings - are you talking about miracles you've seen on You Tube? Are you talking about specific miracles you have done - please be specific in the details.
Many folks at Grease Spot endured enough of the feel-good Pablum teachings-and-false hopes-and-wishful thinking rigmarole to realize it’s really just all about supporting those who run the Mickey Mouse operation. The longer one stayed in TWI, getting ever more involved - the more one saw its twofold nature. Pleasant on the outside with its veneer of Christianity and yet inwardly such an abusive and exploitative system from the machinations of top leadership. typically in cults there's a support system in place (committed followers on staff and in leadership training programs) - the labor force that keeps the general populace of the cult interested in the charismatic leader and ensures their money keeps rolling in. That is the parasitic nature of a cult - the exploitative organization needs and feeds off the contribution of time/efforts, resources (money, possessions, etc.), and talents of its followers – yet contributes NOTHING in return. I venture to say you were in the general public of TWI - and not on staff or in the way corps - or you would know what I'm talking about.
Maybe you should have more of a concern for doctrine. Doctrine is inextricably linked to practice. Because what you believe directs what you do...Matthew 7 and the books of Timothy and Peter will testify to the threat of false teachers and the negative impact of unsound doctrine. It is because unsound or distorted doctrine will generate bad practices.
You might want to check out the following books that are very specific in exposing the dark underbelly of an abusive and exploitative cult, how unsound doctrine has a deleterious effect on followers and the false hopes / wishful thinking being sold to folks through the preaching of the health and wealth gospel:
The Cult That Snapped
Losing the Way
Undertow
Beyond Seduction
Edited by T-Boneclarity and typos
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jim jack
well hey...ya'll enjoy one another & your conclusions about life...I felt being an ex TWI that I owed it to exWayfers about what I'm finding on line..."the things that I do ye shall do and greater" are going on & even being video'd & if ya'll want to ignore them..so be it..
You think I have an agenda of recruiting to these ministries?? I realize there's been great discouragement amongst ya'll because of your negative TWI experiences..& yet Jesus's promise is still valid & happening...I was hoping someone here still had the fire they had in TWI to continue with their search & such is my hope..despite the implications alot of you have been throwing my way.
So go ahead ..DON"T check any of this out....stay safe & know that these are just money grubbing people out to deceive you and the rest of the world....Don't bother replying to this as I'm thru with what I'm offering...god help all of you who are in your own world of judgement..
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. II Timothy 4:3 NIV
Link to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
T-Bone said:
"I wonder how many folks would be interested in Christianity if all it provided was Jesus Christ."
We had a discussion here that revolved around some similar thoughts. It was quite animated, to say the least.
LINK
Edited by waysiderLink to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
As someone who's still a Christian, I found nothing in your posts to draw my interest-which is why I found nothing worth commenting on. What I found was some link-dumping (just a link with no real commentary), and some cheerful blurbing (boy howdy, this is some great stuff!)
Since this is a DISCUSSION forum, I expect to actually DISCUSS things. People who show up with just links usually are members of an ex-twi group who are posting links to their ex-twi group....and sometimes they pretend they're not a member of the group. (On an unrelated Christian board, I once ran into a drive-by post by Jeff of CES who said, in effect, "Gee, I found this website with some unusual stuff on it. What do you guys think?" with a link to his own content from the CES website. I responded immediately and called him on it. He never replied. Either it was a true drive-by and he never visited again, or he cut his losses when he realized he was caught.
So, your posts. They were vague comments about someone's content on YouTube. They didn't even have the direct links to the content. So, I would have had to look them up to find out about what you WEREN'T saying about it. On message-boards, playing coy (being vague and indirect) usually backfires in either the short or long-term.
I don't know WHY you posted that way. I just know that it's a formula for keeping me DISinterested.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Twinky
Jim Jack, if you want to know about awesome teachers and people who do awesome things, I'd love you to come with me to either of the two churches I regularly attend, spend time with the ministers there and with the congregations, and come out with us on some of our many and varied genuine outreach and assistance events. You will find many who walk the talk, and talk the walk.
There are many people who are worthy of national and international respect, genuine scholarship, genuine very high level appointments (one is chaplain to the Queen), one is a peer of the realm (a genuine aristocrat) - and all are so humble, quiet, gentle, and inclusive. There are no TV evangelists, but from time to time the BBC broadcasts the Easter or a Christmas service from Bath abbey (where the Queen's chaplain has his "regular job" as the Rector of the abbey) and the rector is the nicest man who really points the way to Jesus and honours God. You want what he's got, not because he "sells" it in loud manner, but because of his quietness, peacefulness and confidence in the Lord. The peer has set up many programs to assist homeless and vulnerable people and is a real "mover and shaker" to get things done that bring Christ to the overlooked, and to build Christian unity among believers. Yet he's so self-effacing that he is easy to overlook. I know of several who have given land or large amounts of money for community projects (it's taken me a long time to find this out because they don't shout about it). I know people who have very little in financial terms, but spend their time and energy tirelessly doing things that benefit their community, because of their love for Christ and their desire to show that love.
In fact, I could write a very long list of awesome but very humble people that I meet through these churches and the other very active churches, of all denominations, throughout this city.
Jim Jack, I can arrange meetings for you with some mightily awesome Christian folks, who from genuine Christian love seek the wellbeing of their community in a huge variety of ways. I can't promise splashy miracles. I can promise genuine heart and genuine and observable turn-round in a myriad of ways, in people's lives.
Please let me know when you would like to come with me.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Grace Valerie Claire
Twinky, if you lived in DC, I would take you up on your offer!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.