Hello. I'd like to step in and remind readers that some of us here are agnostics (I am) or atheists or whatever else who feel a moral obligation to speak up on topics pertaining to TWI and on our experiences in the group. We many not be Christians any more, but we have some perspectives that can help people decide whether to join The Way or get out of it, or stay away from offshoot groups who say they've fixed Way problems so their spin-off is better.
In my view, these spin-off groups are still perpetuating fundamentalism and cult-ish attitudes of "my interpretation of the Bible is right, yours is not."
DWBH and I share that moral compass that points us in the direction of speaking up, so do many others here. Calling out TWI policies and actions, and calling out former "public" leaders from the group who wielded their influence and caused harm, is part of a whistleblower's responsibility. Any of the offshoot leaders, etc., or staff at HQ are welcome to come here and debate, as I understand it.
Part of what I do, as it has evolved, has also been to interpret to the outside world (my friends who never heard of The Way and want to understand me) just what the heck we're talking about at this site (as in website) and our journeys as former-Way followers trying to recover.
One problem I face while "interpreting" is understanding where TWI "is at" these days at headquarters regarding this specific issue: Is their reluctance to put VPW's name on their website a court-ordered decision? A choice made from shame? A choice made...why?
Last month I wrote a letter to the Way Information Center, which is how you contact The Way these days, and asked that question. I sent the letter certified mail. No one has replied...yet. I thought it was only fair to give them a chance to say something about that. I am considering writing an article about the glaring absence of VPW from the website of the cult he started.
So, DWBH, I need a little more help. Could you clarify your view on the reason they don't mention VPW on their site? You left me with the impression they would be shooting themselves in the foot because so many people know about VP and LCM delinquency (understatement) issues that it makes the current iteration of The Way in New Knoxville want to disassociate from those men. The site says the group was founded in 1942. What is an outsider to make of a site that does not credit their founder or praise him like they used to? It is clear from other internet sites that VPW started The Way. It takes 2 seconds to discover that fact. What is up at HQ? Really.
I'd like some non-insider jargon to explain this to people who, for instance, are reading my blog.
There are so many other groups promoting their ties to VPW and his so-called works, they really don't need to invite scrutiny.
Here's an example from S.O.W.E.R.s website:
Our foundations are rooted in the principles taught in the Power for Abundant Living series and the Way Corps principles as enumerated by Dr. Wierwille and George Jess.
(You would think his own son and grandson would know he wasn't really a Dr., but I digress.)
All they really need to do is go through the motions, pretend to be something they are not, and avoid unwanted controversy. The money is already "in the bank".
Sorry if I was unclear. Rosie is not at all legally bound in any way to keep vic buried in the twit archives. Nothing in the Paul/Fern Allen lawsuit, precludes twit from saying whatever they want about dictor or his role in founding and building twit. dictor was dead for 15 years by the time the lawsuit came up for trial. There was nothing in that out-of-court settlement that had anything to do with vic. Da forehead and DEW, and Coward and Rosie and Donna were making sure vic and his memory were buried deep and forever from twit's current identity and corporate bio. Remember, EVERY ONE of the principal actors in twit then and now, were personally and directly involved with dictor and his moggyboy sex clubs. Donna was bangin' dictor and the twustees by 1973 already, her first year in da corpse. Rosie was right behind her having done the twustee pass-around sex dance with the twustees a year later in her first year in the 2nd family corpse. Within her first 2 months Rosie was already riveting herself into the hearts of vic, coward and da forehead with her freewheeling sex games. I was in-rez with the 2nd famy corpse. I have 4th corpse pals who told me all about how Rosie was in the sack. By the end of our 2nd month in-rez that year, 75-76, there were already 3 4th corpse guys who had enjoyed Rosie's MILF status she earned so quickly her first 8 weeks in-rez. Donna, who along with myself, helped run Rosie's first piffle at Christmount Camp in Black Mountain, NC, in August, 1974.
Donna had the New Bern, NC High School teacher in her back pocket right quick. Didn't take her long to have Rosie all hooked up in the twustees swinger's club real early in Rosie's twit career.
The Allen lawsuit was litigated 15 years after dictor's death. Da forehead, Coward, and Ding Don had been twustees that entire time. The charges and plea deals had nothing to do with vic or his classes and books. The three stooges had already removed and demoted vic from the center and face if twit. Vic and his legacy were far too damaging to them, and were increasingly well known, reported on in the media especially once the Internet got up and running, and increasingly embarrassing and legally troubling to twit. Da forehead had already cancelled the Rick and WOW programs. PFAL "error" was getting revised, and reversed daily. The twustees were making sure to clean up everything they could after dem fawg years. The loyalty oath letter from da twustees to the world in March, 1990 was the official beginning of the purge of the scourge, vic and geer and POP.....passing of a patriarch.....and the real facts about Vic's life and min-us-tray. Vic had become a total liability to Rosie and da Boyz. His perverted sexual pathologies sling with his criminal tax evasion, embezzlement, serial rape and sexual abuse of literally HUNDREDS of victims by just vic himself, let alone the other 3 criminals. Vic's alcoholism and Naziism were also widely known and proven. As I said, Vic's life and min-us-tray were a complete liability and disgrace to twit. The further they could remove him from twit the better. Da forehead was burying vic by 1990 already. So, the purposeful and rapid defamation and discarding of all things vic by Rosie and da Boyz was necessary because of the personal and direct involvement in the perverted serial sex and embezzlement schemes of vic by EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM....Da forehead, ding don, coward, Rosie and Donna. Vic never got caught while he was alive. The three musketeers and their 2 sluts, Donna and Rosie all got busted and are still trying to cover-up what the whole world already knows and has known since 1998. So yes, all association with vic and his life and min-us-try is a total liability for Tosie and twit today and has been since vic croaked in May, 1985. They would be committing corporate suicude to promote vic and his works like they used to back in the 80's. Like I saud, they're even better off keeping da forehead's classes and garbage as their current "word" than bringing up vic at all. The copyrights in Vic's classes and books is gone. They're all public domain now. Open to whoever is dumb enough to value them. And, the old Boyz like "rev" gerry wrenn, and jalvis the all knowing and entertaining, and finnegan, and "Dr. Dale Sides, and SOWERS, and cummins and geer are all keeping vic alive so their only source of credibility and income keeps that almighty dollar rolling in for them. Rosie and her cult live off the $65 million and have nothing else, and the offshoots continue to beg for money to waste on themselves and their vic ordained retirement programs.
I hope that answers your questions Charlene. If not, ask more! Your writings and blog help thousands! Thanks for all you do!
Sorry if I was unclear. Rosie is not at all legally bound in any way to keep vic buried in the twit archives. Nothing in the Paul/Fern Allen lawsuit, precludes twit from saying whatever they want about dictor or his role in founding and building twit. dictor was dead for 15 years by the time the lawsuit came up for trial. There was nothing in that out-of-court settlement that had anything to do with vic. Da forehead and DEW, and Coward and Rosie and Donna were making sure vic and his memory were buried deep and forever from twit's current identity and corporate bio. Remember, EVERY ONE of the principal actors in twit then and now, were personally and directly involved with dictor and his moggyboy sex clubs. Donna was bangin' dictor and the twustees by 1973 already, her first year in da corpse. Rosie was right behind her having done the twustee pass-around sex dance with the twustees a year later in her first year in the 2nd family corpse. Within her first 2 months Rosie was already riveting herself into the hearts of vic, coward and da forehead with her freewheeling sex games. I was in-rez with the 2nd famy corpse. I have 4th corpse pals who told me all about how Rosie was in the sack. By the end of our 2nd month in-rez that year, 75-76, there were already 3 4th corpse guys who had enjoyed Rosie's MILF status she earned so quickly her first 8 weeks in-rez. Donna, who along with myself, helped run Rosie's first piffle at Christmount Camp in Black Mountain, NC, in August, 1974.
Donna had the New Bern, NC High School teacher in her back pocket right quick. Didn't take her long to have Rosie all hooked up in the twustees swinger's club real early in Rosie's twit career.
The Allen lawsuit was litigated 15 years after dictor's death. Da forehead, Coward, and Ding Don had been twustees that entire time. The charges and plea deals had nothing to do with vic or his classes and books. The three stooges had already removed and demoted vic from the center and face if twit. Vic and his legacy were far too damaging to them, and were increasingly well known, reported on in the media especially once the Internet got up and running, and increasingly embarrassing and legally troubling to twit. Da forehead had already cancelled the Rick and WOW programs. PFAL "error" was getting revised, and reversed daily. The twustees were making sure to clean up everything they could after dem fawg years. The loyalty oath letter from da twustees to the world in March, 1990 was the official beginning of the purge of the scourge, vic and geer and POP.....passing of a patriarch.....and the real facts about Vic's life and min-us-tray. Vic had become a total liability to Rosie and da Boyz. His perverted sexual pathologies sling with his criminal tax evasion, embezzlement, serial rape and sexual abuse of literally HUNDREDS of victims by just vic himself, let alone the other 3 criminals. Vic's alcoholism and Naziism were also widely known and proven. As I said, Vic's life and min-us-tray were a complete liability and disgrace to twit. The further they could remove him from twit the better. Da forehead was burying vic by 1990 already. So, the purposeful and rapid defamation and discarding of all things vic by Rosie and da Boyz was necessary because of the personal and direct involvement in the perverted serial sex and embezzlement schemes of vic by EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM....Da forehead, ding don, coward, Rosie and Donna. Vic never got caught while he was alive. The three musketeers and their 2 sluts, Donna and Rosie all got busted and are still trying to cover-up what the whole world already knows and has known since 1998. So yes, all association with vic and his life and min-us-try is a total liability for Tosie and twit today and has been since vic croaked in May, 1985. They would be committing corporate suicude to promote vic and his works like they used to back in the 80's. Like I saud, they're even better off keeping da forehead's classes and garbage as their current "word" than bringing up vic at all. The copyrights in Vic's classes and books is gone. They're all public domain now. Open to whoever is dumb enough to value them. And, the old Boyz like "rev" gerry wrenn, and jalvis the all knowing and entertaining, and finnegan, and "Dr. Dale Sides, and SOWERS, and cummins and geer are all keeping vic alive so their only source of credibility and income keeps that almighty dollar rolling in for them. Rosie and her cult live off the $65 million and have nothing else, and the offshoots continue to beg for money to waste on themselves and their vic ordained retirement programs.
I hope that answers your questions Charlene. If not, ask more! Your writings and blog help thousands! Thanks for all you do!
Speaks volumes for the destruction of evil that so many experienced via wierwille's serial "scam-us-try"
and how rosa-lie climbed the ranks.
And....the offshoot-guys who double-down on vic's plagiarist works for filthy lucre.
Thx for all the detail DWBH and penworks too. I was actually unaware of early family corpse sexcapades but it doesn't surprise me.
IMO why VPW is not listed on theway.org is largely due to this site and search engine indexing. Rosie tried for a while to whitewash the vic's image but failed.
They don't use the foreheads class and haven't since his exile to akron. They had corpse teach live from the foreheads syllabus for a while. Then they made another one with Rupp and a couple other teachers.
So now they can bury the past, whitewash it over, and keep the $$$ flowing in by "letting the Word do the work" running a new indoctrination series.
They are running them now. Through coincidence I found out where a friend works the resident mental patient employee is signed up and has other mental patient grads love bombing them.
So what do I say about all this? Their sins they have hidden in their small little hearts, have not confessed it or changed,
"Through coincidence I found out where a friend works the resident mental patient employee is signed up and has other mental patient grads love bombing them."
Can you explain this? I didn't quite understand. (Maybe I need another quart of coffee to get me started.)
Yessiree SkyRider. That's why twit apologists like MRAP immediately go ad hominem as soon as they see my name anywhere. They don't even read what I write. They just see my name and go into the conditioned response from twit, TLTF, STFI of whatever offshoot and spinoff run by some twit minimog like Wrenn or lynn. Unlike Rosie, these liars don't have 20 years and $$65million worth of embezzled ABS to live on. So, they beg and beg some more and then pull the old guilt trip about tithe in the Old T. all that JEEZUS and Paul and dictor paul did to move da woid, so you should at least do 15% dontchya know. YOU OWE them that since you owe it to gawd and they're gawd's ordained. So, they make and re-make and re-make yet again their ever glitzier version of of their interpretation of vic's interpretation of Bulilinger's interpretation of the Bible and B. G. Leonard's and J.E. Stiles' interpretation of the "Holy Spirit field", and his adoption of all their "Keys To Understanding The Bible" and then inventing their own texts and MSS In whatever language they can find to "validate" their own work by claiming everybody else's as their own. Schoenheit, wrenn, and jallymog ALL blatantly plagiarize BULLINGER, B. G., vic, and whoever else they want in order to get those bleary-eyed, mind-numbed ex-wayfers to keep paying them so they can retire " fulltime" in their min-us-trays. The ONLY credentials they have are the ones they paid for in twit. The ones ordained by vic in the early corpses are the most prized. They stand to get the most ex-wayfers still stuck in vic'n'twit to slide right back into their comfort zone of paying somebody to move da woid over da woild for them, to assuage their collective guilt for not coming close to "doing da woid" in their own lives, not having any clue about what a relationship with The Boss, Jesus Christ is like, since He is absent in their world. Stuck at the right hand of gawd until they're all done moving their word over the world, and racking up rewards so Jesus gets to give them all a gold cookie at their super heroes only bema. THEN, when THEY're all done doing the moggy thang, busily usurping the place of the absent Christ for YOU, and telling you what's TO you and what's only FOR your learning, and giving YOU all sorts of legalistic, bizarre works to do to prove to yourself and them how spurchal you are. Why YOU might even be corpse material! Just take the class 20 more times and $10 a week for a year and we'll send you a free copy of something you already own. THAT's what moving the word means to them. Pay somebody to make up a bible class that reminds them of the good old days when they were young, carefree, and mobile. No debts and no kids. Free to worship vic and take his word up your foot and over the world all at the same time while you paid him for the privilege. Pretty cool careers these guys are shootin' for, no?
Okay. I think I got it. Sometimes the truth stinks and yet we ache to know it...and often we need to for our own sanity and healing process.
I hope that this thread, in response to Dana Fort's heartbreaking story, sheds more light on things, especially for her, since she started questioning the truthfulness of the whitewashed history of TWI she grew up with.
It is difficult, I know, to have to dredge this crappola out of the shed and into the sunshine for newbies like Dana who never heard any of this...I appreciate the energy it took for you, DWBH, to write this up, down, and sideways. It is draining. It is sickening to have to think about it all again. Go take a break and breathe long yoga breaths. That's what I do...
Cheers,
Penworks
:blink:/>/>
PS - If I were the website creator for TWI, I wouldn't mention his name, either.
"Through coincidence I found out where a friend works the resident mental patient employee is signed up and has other mental patient grads love bombing them."
Can you explain this? I didn't quite understand. (Maybe I need another quart of coffee to get me started.)
Or I should have had one before writing ;)
I mean that they are still running foundational classes. the new one is on DVD with 3 teachers, and they are recruiting people for it, signing them up, and continuing on the same way they always have. I have personal knowledge of details of this. So that's why I continue to add my voice alongside those like DWBH, skyrider, charlene, yourself, and others here.
so 20 years down the road from this point we don't have any more stories like Dana's. or mine. or yours. or any of ours.
Ya know, there's just a cruel (but laughable) irony to the whole absence of VP and the PLAF class. When we were "in", it was all that mattered to get that thing in front of people so's they could have that abundant life we were living..cough..Hell, people even died trying to make it happen. It was the most important thing in the world and now it's been stuck in the back of a closet and covered with moth balls. And, that's probably a good thing.
Yessiree SkyRider. That's why twit apologists like MRAP immediately go ad hominem as soon as they see my name anywhere. They don't even read what I write. They just see my name and go into the conditioned response from twit, TLTF, STFI of whatever offshoot and spinoff run by some twit minimog like Wrenn or lynn. Unlike Rosie, these liars don't have 20 years and $$65million worth of embezzled ABS to live on. So, they beg and beg some more and then pull the old guilt trip about tithe in the Old T. all that JEEZUS and Paul and dictor paul did to move da woid, so you should at least do 15% dontchya know. YOU OWE them that since you owe it to gawd and they're gawd's ordained. So, they make and re-make and re-make yet again their ever glitzier version of of their interpretation of vic's interpretation of Bulilinger's interpretation of the Bible and B. G. Leonard's and J.E. Stiles' interpretation of the "Holy Spirit field", and his adoption of all their "Keys To Understanding The Bible" and then inventing their own texts and MSS In whatever language they can find to "validate" their own work by claiming everybody else's as their own. Schoenheit, wrenn, and jallymog ALL blatantly plagiarize BULLINGER, B. G., vic, and whoever else they want in order to get those bleary-eyed, mind-numbed ex-wayfers to keep paying them so they can retire " fulltime" in their min-us-trays. The ONLY credentials they have are the ones they paid for in twit. The ones ordained by vic in the early corpses are the most prized. They stand to get the most ex-wayfers still stuck in vic'n'twit to slide right back into their comfort zone of paying somebody to move da woid over da woild for them, to assuage their collective guilt for not coming close to "doing da woid" in their own lives, not having any clue about what a relationship with The Boss, Jesus Christ is like, since He is absent in their world. Stuck at the right hand of gawd until they're all done moving their word over the world, and racking up rewards so Jesus gets to give them all a gold cookie at their super heroes only bema. THEN, when THEY're all done doing the moggy thang, busily usurping the place of the absent Christ for YOU, and telling you what's TO you and what's only FOR your learning, and giving YOU all sorts of legalistic, bizarre works to do to prove to yourself and them how spurchal you are. Why YOU might even be corpse material! Just take the class 20 more times and $10 a week for a year and we'll send you a free copy of something you already own. THAT's what moving the word means to them. Pay somebody to make up a bible class that reminds them of the good old days when they were young, carefree, and mobile. No debts and no kids. Free to worship vic and take his word up your foot and over the world all at the same time while you paid him for the privilege. Pretty cool careers these guys are shootin' for, no?
I may be crazy, but whenever I watch like JAL, or read some BS written by some of these offshoot guys, the question pops into my mind "how can a parasite survive sucking blood from another parasite?"
It's a dilemma. It's a paradox. It's a conundrum.
Ya know, there's just a cruel (but laughable) irony to the whole absence of VP and the PLAF class. When we were "in", it was all that mattered to get that thing in front of people so's they could have that abundant life we were living..cough..Hell, people even died trying to make it happen. It was the most important thing in the world and now it's been stuck in the back of a closet and covered with moth balls. And, that's probably a good thing.
Or it would be a good thing if it hadn't been chewed up, swallowed, regurgitated on the floor, mixed with a hidden elitist lifestyle, and the vomit reformed into nice little prepackaged MRE's for the next generation.
Boy! You Greasespotters can still get on a good roll!
Maybe I'm supposed to apoligize for my language now, or something? I see my post was edited by someone other than me?
Well.....I stand by what I originally posted. I apoligize if I used what whoever edited me thought was offensive rhetoric. Rhetoric is all it was. Sorry.
Thanks for doing whatever mods do around here these days. It's been awhile since I've messed up around here.
There's some kind of automatic moderation gizmo here that let's you know if you've said a bad word. Most of the time it works pretty well but it hasn't been perfected yet to the point of being able to wash your mouth out with soap.
LOL! It really is no great effort for me to recount the things I know and experienced firsthand. And, as Chockfull said and you re-iterated, i don't want any vestiges of this totalist horror that negatively interrupted and altered far too many innocent, idealistic souls to ever appear 20 years from now either.it's already been 30 years since all the stuff about Vic's been known. And, with today's 24/7/365 instantaneous info overload, nothing about insignificant, idiotic cults like twit, TLTF, STFI, SOWERS, the over-schmaltz "rev" gerry wrenn, former mayor of Mayberry, NC, livinghope ministries international, "Dr." Dale Sides and his B.G.Leonard rip-off liberating ministries international universal holy spirit manifestin' rightly divided warrior prophet version of of Vic's moghood, roodawakenings intergalactic I'm-a-poor-sick-levite-failed-doomsday-self-deluded-prophet-send-me-money-take-my-classes invention of the internets, Victor barnard and his River road fellowship of mostly ex-corpse grads.....yeah....one 14th corpse VB sits in a rural Braziluan jail awaiting extradition back to MN to face 59 separate counts if rape serial rape tape and sexual assault of at least 10 minor women with the consent of their ex-corpse parents like Carmen Tornambe. Oh, don't worry! They've been on Dr. Phil and John Walsh's CNN Most Wanted shows, so I'm breaking any confidences or spreading any lies. And, unfortunately, that's just the beginning of a long list of losers and sociopaths, unconfessed, and unconvicted criminals, unrepentant, unapologetic "Christian" leaders, and generally annoying self-promoters extraordinaire anywhere there's an electric plug and a keyboard.
So you bet we need to keep speaking up and out! Human lives literally hang in the balance. It is a question of human decency, common morality, and simple Justice. Religion or spiritual whatever has nothing to do with it. It's far more profound than that. It is a matter of the unalterable common blood, and spirit we ALL share as human beings. ONE BLOOD! ALL NATIONS! ONE RACE! ALL HUMANS! That's what it's about for me.........peace.
I don't want to derail this thread, but I think this is germane.
I sponsored a LOT of people in the Corps, including a few VERY attractive women. But NONE of them were ever solicited; and, for that matter, they were completely unaware of the evil going on. Now, this was at a time (late 70's through mid 80's) when there were hundreds of Corps, so it's not unbelievable that there were many who were clueless about it. Clearly, if it had been common knowledge, then one could only assume that all the Corps were complicit (since they didn't leave), and the ones I knew were far too principled for that. So, how was it all kept from the mainstream Corps folk (and, presumably, College Division, staff, etc.)?
Remember, EVERY ONE of the principal actors in twit then and now, were personally and directly involved with dictor and his moggyboy sex clubs. Donna was bangin' dictor and the twustees by 1973 already, her first year in da corpse. Rosie was right behind her having done the twustee pass-around sex dance with the twustees a year later in her first year in the 2nd family corpse. Within her first 2 months Rosie was already riveting herself into the hearts of vic, coward and da forehead with her freewheeling sex games.
This sex club had all the makings of a blackmail club!
Vic, donnie, howeird, marty, do-nana, rosa-lie.......no one will EVER break silence of all the banging
going on, BECAUSE it implicates the whole lot of 'em and crumbles the empire.
And, not just the sex club.....but the aura of "spirituality" that was bequeathed to each subsequent
president of da-way. Well, it sure came crashing down shortly after wierwille rode out in faux-glory
on his twig-hopper and straight to cancer treatment. So, vpee dies of a debbil spirit [cancer].....
don dies [age 60] shortly after craiggers is ousted by twi-lawyers for serial sexcapades, rosie lies
in a court deposition regarding lcm's preying on women starting in 1995, donna doesn't follow her
husband to Toledo [nor is she removed from active corps status THE STANDARD FOR SOME 25 YEARS]....
and widow wanda marries howard to become mrs. howard the f...duck
Don't ya just love a happy ending to wierwille's serial-sex-blackmail-elite-evil club?
(We were also in an in-residence type, communal setting and were socially isolated from "outsiders".)
For one thing, George, if you ever suspected something out of line was taking place, you had to be very, very, very careful about who you approached to discuss it. You were made to feel like you were at fault for even suspecting something might be amiss. "How dare you think such things about your brother or sister in Christ? You need to renew your mind and banish those thoughts." Even worse, admitting you have had such thoughts might get you accused of harboring devil spirits. Nobody wants to keep someone in the program if they have devil spirits. Know what I mean? So, part of it is a practice of denial in order to survive the environment.
Looking back on my own experience, I feel somewhat foolish for denying the reality of things I saw that now are very obvious to me. I thought, at the time, that what I was seeing was a product of my unrenewed mind. That's what I was told by leadership. I was embarrassed to even admit the thoughts had crossed my mind.
That's probably not a very good explanation but it's all I have at the moment.
edit: I think this might be something like what happens when a rape victim tries to expose the evil deeds of someone who is held in high esteem. They become the bad person for trying to tarnish the reputation of someone who is beloved. Or so that's how it is often played out. So, they convince themselves that maybe silence is the best course of action. You are probably aware there is a high profile case similar to this that is getting quite a bit of news coverage at the moment.
corps night meetings [nearly 3 hrs], meetings after corps meeting, 4-hr bless patrol shifts, corps twigs
assigned to prayer vigil shifts [1am-2am], fire alarm drills [3am?].....and if you were called out to do
extra, then it totally consumed your week. Need I say more?
None of this is difficult to understand, really. The whole program was segregated.
Think of that movie, Dirty Dancing....and the juxtaposed exposure of "happy vacationers"
as opposed to the sex romps in the housing units of the staffers.
Bingo!
They owned us from 5 A.M. until midnight, almost 7 days a week. I say almost because we were allowed some personal time on Sundays to do laundry and similar things. There was precious little time for introspection.
They owned us from 5 A.M. until midnight, almost 7 days a week. I say almost because we were allowed some personal time on Sundays to do laundry and similar things. There was precious little time for introspection.
The whole corps indoctrination was information-overload....and yeah, very little time for introspection.
Within the first couple of weeks, we were sitting thru pfal rehash, dale carnegie stuff, corps retemories,
class on thessalonians, corps night on romans, Christian ediquette, 16 keys to walking by the spirit,
challenged to learn all 325 corps names, renew mind class, dealing with the adversary class......
Basically, 4-hrs of work in the morning....and 4-hrs of class/study in the afternoons.
Lunchtimes could go for 80-90 minutes easily.....evolving into ANOTHER teaching.
Groups would be called out after lunch to meet in the Sonlight Room BEFORE heading to work or class.
With 325 in the 9th corps......another 160 in the 7th corps.....and College Division ON CAMPUS....
THE PLACE WAS AN UTTER BUZZFEST OF ACTIVITY. Wait in line here, there and everywhere.
The corps coordinators [and assistants] were like a tag-team of drill sergeants barking orders
to do this, get that done, stay vigilant, keep your room clean, help your corps sister, study more, etc.
The insanity of it all..........
And then......years later, we find out that wierwille, martindale, lynn, etc. were serial sex predators
banging the girls while we were in class....or on the field....or wherever.
Maybe, in the earlier years it was harder for the big-wigs to stay secluded and all.....but for the
larger corps, 7th corps-16th corps, there were 500-600 people on campus. And, quite often it was the
women who were assigned to close contact with mogs.....ie head table, back room, greenroom, teacher's
aide, house cleaners at lynn's apt in emporia, guests on vp's motor coach, etc. etc.
Obviously, those who SAW/EXPOSED and WERE APPALLED by sexual abuse.....were given the bums' rush.
Life is seldom as straight forward as we would like it to be. Suppose there is someone at work you suspect of stealing. You have a pretty solid idea they are but you have no way to prove it. Then again, maybe you're mistaken. Maybe you've misinterpreted something. What do you do? Who do you tell? You certainly can't just blatantly accuse them. Do you approach a superior? Maybe the superior is part of the problem. Then what? This is the sort of scenarios that played out in The Way training programs. People who did speak out and seek advise from superiors were often quickly removed from the picture. It's really a false assumption that people didn't speak out. The "adultery paper" is but one example.
So, you put those sort of thoughts on the back burner, and with little time for introspection, and in a state of constant sleep deprivation, they are eventually forgotten. These are some of the things that people don't always quite understand when they wonder why someone didn't "just say something".
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waysider
I'm so sorry, Dana. Such things should never have happened in an organization that was supposedly centered on God. Well, they never should have happened in ANY organization, for that matter. My hope
danafort
Update: It has been brought to my attention that my mom's marriage to her second husband was likely orchestrated by The Way in an effort to ensure that my mom would never talk about what happened with
penworks
Hello. I'd like to step in and remind readers that some of us here are agnostics (I am) or atheists or whatever else who feel a moral obligation to speak up on topics pertaining to TWI and on our expe
penworks
Hello. I'd like to step in and remind readers that some of us here are agnostics (I am) or atheists or whatever else who feel a moral obligation to speak up on topics pertaining to TWI and on our experiences in the group. We many not be Christians any more, but we have some perspectives that can help people decide whether to join The Way or get out of it, or stay away from offshoot groups who say they've fixed Way problems so their spin-off is better.
In my view, these spin-off groups are still perpetuating fundamentalism and cult-ish attitudes of "my interpretation of the Bible is right, yours is not."
DWBH and I share that moral compass that points us in the direction of speaking up, so do many others here. Calling out TWI policies and actions, and calling out former "public" leaders from the group who wielded their influence and caused harm, is part of a whistleblower's responsibility. Any of the offshoot leaders, etc., or staff at HQ are welcome to come here and debate, as I understand it.
Part of what I do, as it has evolved, has also been to interpret to the outside world (my friends who never heard of The Way and want to understand me) just what the heck we're talking about at this site (as in website) and our journeys as former-Way followers trying to recover.
One problem I face while "interpreting" is understanding where TWI "is at" these days at headquarters regarding this specific issue: Is their reluctance to put VPW's name on their website a court-ordered decision? A choice made from shame? A choice made...why?
Last month I wrote a letter to the Way Information Center, which is how you contact The Way these days, and asked that question. I sent the letter certified mail. No one has replied...yet. I thought it was only fair to give them a chance to say something about that. I am considering writing an article about the glaring absence of VPW from the website of the cult he started.
So, DWBH, I need a little more help. Could you clarify your view on the reason they don't mention VPW on their site? You left me with the impression they would be shooting themselves in the foot because so many people know about VP and LCM delinquency (understatement) issues that it makes the current iteration of The Way in New Knoxville want to disassociate from those men. The site says the group was founded in 1942. What is an outsider to make of a site that does not credit their founder or praise him like they used to? It is clear from other internet sites that VPW started The Way. It takes 2 seconds to discover that fact. What is up at HQ? Really.
I'd like some non-insider jargon to explain this to people who, for instance, are reading my blog.
Thanks,
Penworks
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waysider
There are so many other groups promoting their ties to VPW and his so-called works, they really don't need to invite scrutiny.
Here's an example from S.O.W.E.R.s website:
Our foundations are rooted in the principles taught in the Power for Abundant Living series and the Way Corps principles as enumerated by Dr. Wierwille and George Jess.
(You would think his own son and grandson would know he wasn't really a Dr., but I digress.)
All they really need to do is go through the motions, pretend to be something they are not, and avoid unwanted controversy. The money is already "in the bank".
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DontWorryBeHappy
Hi again Charlene!
Sorry if I was unclear. Rosie is not at all legally bound in any way to keep vic buried in the twit archives. Nothing in the Paul/Fern Allen lawsuit, precludes twit from saying whatever they want about dictor or his role in founding and building twit. dictor was dead for 15 years by the time the lawsuit came up for trial. There was nothing in that out-of-court settlement that had anything to do with vic. Da forehead and DEW, and Coward and Rosie and Donna were making sure vic and his memory were buried deep and forever from twit's current identity and corporate bio. Remember, EVERY ONE of the principal actors in twit then and now, were personally and directly involved with dictor and his moggyboy sex clubs. Donna was bangin' dictor and the twustees by 1973 already, her first year in da corpse. Rosie was right behind her having done the twustee pass-around sex dance with the twustees a year later in her first year in the 2nd family corpse. Within her first 2 months Rosie was already riveting herself into the hearts of vic, coward and da forehead with her freewheeling sex games. I was in-rez with the 2nd famy corpse. I have 4th corpse pals who told me all about how Rosie was in the sack. By the end of our 2nd month in-rez that year, 75-76, there were already 3 4th corpse guys who had enjoyed Rosie's MILF status she earned so quickly her first 8 weeks in-rez. Donna, who along with myself, helped run Rosie's first piffle at Christmount Camp in Black Mountain, NC, in August, 1974.
Donna had the New Bern, NC High School teacher in her back pocket right quick. Didn't take her long to have Rosie all hooked up in the twustees swinger's club real early in Rosie's twit career.
The Allen lawsuit was litigated 15 years after dictor's death. Da forehead, Coward, and Ding Don had been twustees that entire time. The charges and plea deals had nothing to do with vic or his classes and books. The three stooges had already removed and demoted vic from the center and face if twit. Vic and his legacy were far too damaging to them, and were increasingly well known, reported on in the media especially once the Internet got up and running, and increasingly embarrassing and legally troubling to twit. Da forehead had already cancelled the Rick and WOW programs. PFAL "error" was getting revised, and reversed daily. The twustees were making sure to clean up everything they could after dem fawg years. The loyalty oath letter from da twustees to the world in March, 1990 was the official beginning of the purge of the scourge, vic and geer and POP.....passing of a patriarch.....and the real facts about Vic's life and min-us-tray. Vic had become a total liability to Rosie and da Boyz. His perverted sexual pathologies sling with his criminal tax evasion, embezzlement, serial rape and sexual abuse of literally HUNDREDS of victims by just vic himself, let alone the other 3 criminals. Vic's alcoholism and Naziism were also widely known and proven. As I said, Vic's life and min-us-tray were a complete liability and disgrace to twit. The further they could remove him from twit the better. Da forehead was burying vic by 1990 already. So, the purposeful and rapid defamation and discarding of all things vic by Rosie and da Boyz was necessary because of the personal and direct involvement in the perverted serial sex and embezzlement schemes of vic by EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM....Da forehead, ding don, coward, Rosie and Donna. Vic never got caught while he was alive. The three musketeers and their 2 sluts, Donna and Rosie all got busted and are still trying to cover-up what the whole world already knows and has known since 1998. So yes, all association with vic and his life and min-us-try is a total liability for Tosie and twit today and has been since vic croaked in May, 1985. They would be committing corporate suicude to promote vic and his works like they used to back in the 80's. Like I saud, they're even better off keeping da forehead's classes and garbage as their current "word" than bringing up vic at all. The copyrights in Vic's classes and books is gone. They're all public domain now. Open to whoever is dumb enough to value them. And, the old Boyz like "rev" gerry wrenn, and jalvis the all knowing and entertaining, and finnegan, and "Dr. Dale Sides, and SOWERS, and cummins and geer are all keeping vic alive so their only source of credibility and income keeps that almighty dollar rolling in for them. Rosie and her cult live off the $65 million and have nothing else, and the offshoots continue to beg for money to waste on themselves and their vic ordained retirement programs.
I hope that answers your questions Charlene. If not, ask more! Your writings and blog help thousands! Thanks for all you do!
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skyrider
Speaks volumes for the destruction of evil that so many experienced via wierwille's serial "scam-us-try"
and how rosa-lie climbed the ranks.
And....the offshoot-guys who double-down on vic's plagiarist works for filthy lucre.
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chockfull
Thx for all the detail DWBH and penworks too. I was actually unaware of early family corpse sexcapades but it doesn't surprise me.
IMO why VPW is not listed on theway.org is largely due to this site and search engine indexing. Rosie tried for a while to whitewash the vic's image but failed.
They don't use the foreheads class and haven't since his exile to akron. They had corpse teach live from the foreheads syllabus for a while. Then they made another one with Rupp and a couple other teachers.
So now they can bury the past, whitewash it over, and keep the $$$ flowing in by "letting the Word do the work" running a new indoctrination series.
They are running them now. Through coincidence I found out where a friend works the resident mental patient employee is signed up and has other mental patient grads love bombing them.
So what do I say about all this? Their sins they have hidden in their small little hearts, have not confessed it or changed,
so it will be shouted from the rooftops.
Let those who seek wisdom read and learn.
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waysider
"Through coincidence I found out where a friend works the resident mental patient employee is signed up and has other mental patient grads love bombing them."
Can you explain this? I didn't quite understand. (Maybe I need another quart of coffee to get me started.)
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DontWorryBeHappy
Yessiree SkyRider. That's why twit apologists like MRAP immediately go ad hominem as soon as they see my name anywhere. They don't even read what I write. They just see my name and go into the conditioned response from twit, TLTF, STFI of whatever offshoot and spinoff run by some twit minimog like Wrenn or lynn. Unlike Rosie, these liars don't have 20 years and $$65million worth of embezzled ABS to live on. So, they beg and beg some more and then pull the old guilt trip about tithe in the Old T. all that JEEZUS and Paul and dictor paul did to move da woid, so you should at least do 15% dontchya know. YOU OWE them that since you owe it to gawd and they're gawd's ordained. So, they make and re-make and re-make yet again their ever glitzier version of of their interpretation of vic's interpretation of Bulilinger's interpretation of the Bible and B. G. Leonard's and J.E. Stiles' interpretation of the "Holy Spirit field", and his adoption of all their "Keys To Understanding The Bible" and then inventing their own texts and MSS In whatever language they can find to "validate" their own work by claiming everybody else's as their own. Schoenheit, wrenn, and jallymog ALL blatantly plagiarize BULLINGER, B. G., vic, and whoever else they want in order to get those bleary-eyed, mind-numbed ex-wayfers to keep paying them so they can retire " fulltime" in their min-us-trays. The ONLY credentials they have are the ones they paid for in twit. The ones ordained by vic in the early corpses are the most prized. They stand to get the most ex-wayfers still stuck in vic'n'twit to slide right back into their comfort zone of paying somebody to move da woid over da woild for them, to assuage their collective guilt for not coming close to "doing da woid" in their own lives, not having any clue about what a relationship with The Boss, Jesus Christ is like, since He is absent in their world. Stuck at the right hand of gawd until they're all done moving their word over the world, and racking up rewards so Jesus gets to give them all a gold cookie at their super heroes only bema. THEN, when THEY're all done doing the moggy thang, busily usurping the place of the absent Christ for YOU, and telling you what's TO you and what's only FOR your learning, and giving YOU all sorts of legalistic, bizarre works to do to prove to yourself and them how spurchal you are. Why YOU might even be corpse material! Just take the class 20 more times and $10 a week for a year and we'll send you a free copy of something you already own. THAT's what moving the word means to them. Pay somebody to make up a bible class that reminds them of the good old days when they were young, carefree, and mobile. No debts and no kids. Free to worship vic and take his word up your foot and over the world all at the same time while you paid him for the privilege. Pretty cool careers these guys are shootin' for, no?
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penworks
Okay. I think I got it. Sometimes the truth stinks and yet we ache to know it...and often we need to for our own sanity and healing process.
I hope that this thread, in response to Dana Fort's heartbreaking story, sheds more light on things, especially for her, since she started questioning the truthfulness of the whitewashed history of TWI she grew up with.
It is difficult, I know, to have to dredge this crappola out of the shed and into the sunshine for newbies like Dana who never heard any of this...I appreciate the energy it took for you, DWBH, to write this up, down, and sideways. It is draining. It is sickening to have to think about it all again. Go take a break and breathe long yoga breaths. That's what I do...
Cheers,
Penworks
:blink:/>/>
PS - If I were the website creator for TWI, I wouldn't mention his name, either.
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chockfull
Or I should have had one before writing ;)
I mean that they are still running foundational classes. the new one is on DVD with 3 teachers, and they are recruiting people for it, signing them up, and continuing on the same way they always have. I have personal knowledge of details of this. So that's why I continue to add my voice alongside those like DWBH, skyrider, charlene, yourself, and others here.
so 20 years down the road from this point we don't have any more stories like Dana's. or mine. or yours. or any of ours.
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penworks
I sure hope not! But we will do our best to deter them from happening...
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waysider
Ya know, there's just a cruel (but laughable) irony to the whole absence of VP and the PLAF class. When we were "in", it was all that mattered to get that thing in front of people so's they could have that abundant life we were living..cough..Hell, people even died trying to make it happen. It was the most important thing in the world and now it's been stuck in the back of a closet and covered with moth balls. And, that's probably a good thing.
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chockfull
I may be crazy, but whenever I watch like JAL, or read some BS written by some of these offshoot guys, the question pops into my mind "how can a parasite survive sucking blood from another parasite?"
It's a dilemma. It's a paradox. It's a conundrum.
Or it would be a good thing if it hadn't been chewed up, swallowed, regurgitated on the floor, mixed with a hidden elitist lifestyle, and the vomit reformed into nice little prepackaged MRE's for the next generation.
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DontWorryBeHappy
Boy! You Greasespotters can still get on a good roll!
Maybe I'm supposed to apoligize for my language now, or something? I see my post was edited by someone other than me?
Well.....I stand by what I originally posted. I apoligize if I used what whoever edited me thought was offensive rhetoric. Rhetoric is all it was. Sorry.
Thanks for doing whatever mods do around here these days. It's been awhile since I've messed up around here.
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waysider
There's some kind of automatic moderation gizmo here that let's you know if you've said a bad word. Most of the time it works pretty well but it hasn't been perfected yet to the point of being able to wash your mouth out with soap.
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DontWorryBeHappy
Thanks Charlene!
LOL! It really is no great effort for me to recount the things I know and experienced firsthand. And, as Chockfull said and you re-iterated, i don't want any vestiges of this totalist horror that negatively interrupted and altered far too many innocent, idealistic souls to ever appear 20 years from now either.it's already been 30 years since all the stuff about Vic's been known. And, with today's 24/7/365 instantaneous info overload, nothing about insignificant, idiotic cults like twit, TLTF, STFI, SOWERS, the over-schmaltz "rev" gerry wrenn, former mayor of Mayberry, NC, livinghope ministries international, "Dr." Dale Sides and his B.G.Leonard rip-off liberating ministries international universal holy spirit manifestin' rightly divided warrior prophet version of of Vic's moghood, roodawakenings intergalactic I'm-a-poor-sick-levite-failed-doomsday-self-deluded-prophet-send-me-money-take-my-classes invention of the internets, Victor barnard and his River road fellowship of mostly ex-corpse grads.....yeah....one 14th corpse VB sits in a rural Braziluan jail awaiting extradition back to MN to face 59 separate counts if rape serial rape tape and sexual assault of at least 10 minor women with the consent of their ex-corpse parents like Carmen Tornambe. Oh, don't worry! They've been on Dr. Phil and John Walsh's CNN Most Wanted shows, so I'm breaking any confidences or spreading any lies. And, unfortunately, that's just the beginning of a long list of losers and sociopaths, unconfessed, and unconvicted criminals, unrepentant, unapologetic "Christian" leaders, and generally annoying self-promoters extraordinaire anywhere there's an electric plug and a keyboard.
So you bet we need to keep speaking up and out! Human lives literally hang in the balance. It is a question of human decency, common morality, and simple Justice. Religion or spiritual whatever has nothing to do with it. It's far more profound than that. It is a matter of the unalterable common blood, and spirit we ALL share as human beings. ONE BLOOD! ALL NATIONS! ONE RACE! ALL HUMANS! That's what it's about for me.........peace.
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waysider
I really just show up here for the cookies and coffee.
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GeorgeStGeorge
I don't want to derail this thread, but I think this is germane.
I sponsored a LOT of people in the Corps, including a few VERY attractive women. But NONE of them were ever solicited; and, for that matter, they were completely unaware of the evil going on. Now, this was at a time (late 70's through mid 80's) when there were hundreds of Corps, so it's not unbelievable that there were many who were clueless about it. Clearly, if it had been common knowledge, then one could only assume that all the Corps were complicit (since they didn't leave), and the ones I knew were far too principled for that. So, how was it all kept from the mainstream Corps folk (and, presumably, College Division, staff, etc.)?
George
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skyrider
This sex club had all the makings of a blackmail club!
Vic, donnie, howeird, marty, do-nana, rosa-lie.......no one will EVER break silence of all the banging
going on, BECAUSE it implicates the whole lot of 'em and crumbles the empire.
And, not just the sex club.....but the aura of "spirituality" that was bequeathed to each subsequent
president of da-way. Well, it sure came crashing down shortly after wierwille rode out in faux-glory
on his twig-hopper and straight to cancer treatment. So, vpee dies of a debbil spirit [cancer].....
don dies [age 60] shortly after craiggers is ousted by twi-lawyers for serial sexcapades, rosie lies
in a court deposition regarding lcm's preying on women starting in 1995, donna doesn't follow her
husband to Toledo [nor is she removed from active corps status THE STANDARD FOR SOME 25 YEARS]....
and widow wanda marries howard to become mrs. howard the f...duck
Don't ya just love a happy ending to wierwille's serial-sex-blackmail-elite-evil club?
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waysider
From a FellowLaborers perspective:
(We were also in an in-residence type, communal setting and were socially isolated from "outsiders".)
For one thing, George, if you ever suspected something out of line was taking place, you had to be very, very, very careful about who you approached to discuss it. You were made to feel like you were at fault for even suspecting something might be amiss. "How dare you think such things about your brother or sister in Christ? You need to renew your mind and banish those thoughts." Even worse, admitting you have had such thoughts might get you accused of harboring devil spirits. Nobody wants to keep someone in the program if they have devil spirits. Know what I mean? So, part of it is a practice of denial in order to survive the environment.
Looking back on my own experience, I feel somewhat foolish for denying the reality of things I saw that now are very obvious to me. I thought, at the time, that what I was seeing was a product of my unrenewed mind. That's what I was told by leadership. I was embarrassed to even admit the thoughts had crossed my mind.
That's probably not a very good explanation but it's all I have at the moment.
edit: I think this might be something like what happens when a rape victim tries to expose the evil deeds of someone who is held in high esteem. They become the bad person for trying to tarnish the reputation of someone who is beloved. Or so that's how it is often played out. So, they convince themselves that maybe silence is the best course of action. You are probably aware there is a high profile case similar to this that is getting quite a bit of news coverage at the moment.
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skyrider
George.....the corps indoctrination...er, program was channeled and segregated at multiple levels.
In-residence corps were subjected to a work/study program that gave hardly 20-30 free-time without having
to be heading to the next meeting. Imagine alarm clocks going off at 4:15am, some hitting snooze-buttons
for another 10 minutes of sleep, another alarm clock going off.....and then, getting up at 4:50am and
heading over to top floor wierwille library....and IN YOUR SEAT by 5:20am [at least twice a week].
Add....aerobic points charts, floss charts, roll call, monthly household responsibilities [chair stringing?],
corps night meetings [nearly 3 hrs], meetings after corps meeting, 4-hr bless patrol shifts, corps twigs
assigned to prayer vigil shifts [1am-2am], fire alarm drills [3am?].....and if you were called out to do
extra, then it totally consumed your week. Need I say more?
None of this is difficult to understand, really. The whole program was segregated.
Think of that movie, Dirty Dancing....and the juxtaposed exposure of "happy vacationers"
as opposed to the sex romps in the housing units of the staffers.
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waysider
Bingo!
They owned us from 5 A.M. until midnight, almost 7 days a week. I say almost because we were allowed some personal time on Sundays to do laundry and similar things. There was precious little time for introspection.
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skyrider
The whole corps indoctrination was information-overload....and yeah, very little time for introspection.
Within the first couple of weeks, we were sitting thru pfal rehash, dale carnegie stuff, corps retemories,
class on thessalonians, corps night on romans, Christian ediquette, 16 keys to walking by the spirit,
challenged to learn all 325 corps names, renew mind class, dealing with the adversary class......
Basically, 4-hrs of work in the morning....and 4-hrs of class/study in the afternoons.
Lunchtimes could go for 80-90 minutes easily.....evolving into ANOTHER teaching.
Groups would be called out after lunch to meet in the Sonlight Room BEFORE heading to work or class.
With 325 in the 9th corps......another 160 in the 7th corps.....and College Division ON CAMPUS....
THE PLACE WAS AN UTTER BUZZFEST OF ACTIVITY. Wait in line here, there and everywhere.
The corps coordinators [and assistants] were like a tag-team of drill sergeants barking orders
to do this, get that done, stay vigilant, keep your room clean, help your corps sister, study more, etc.
The insanity of it all..........
And then......years later, we find out that wierwille, martindale, lynn, etc. were serial sex predators
banging the girls while we were in class....or on the field....or wherever.
Maybe, in the earlier years it was harder for the big-wigs to stay secluded and all.....but for the
larger corps, 7th corps-16th corps, there were 500-600 people on campus. And, quite often it was the
women who were assigned to close contact with mogs.....ie head table, back room, greenroom, teacher's
aide, house cleaners at lynn's apt in emporia, guests on vp's motor coach, etc. etc.
Obviously, those who SAW/EXPOSED and WERE APPALLED by sexual abuse.....were given the bums' rush.
.
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waysider
Life is seldom as straight forward as we would like it to be. Suppose there is someone at work you suspect of stealing. You have a pretty solid idea they are but you have no way to prove it. Then again, maybe you're mistaken. Maybe you've misinterpreted something. What do you do? Who do you tell? You certainly can't just blatantly accuse them. Do you approach a superior? Maybe the superior is part of the problem. Then what? This is the sort of scenarios that played out in The Way training programs. People who did speak out and seek advise from superiors were often quickly removed from the picture. It's really a false assumption that people didn't speak out. The "adultery paper" is but one example.
So, you put those sort of thoughts on the back burner, and with little time for introspection, and in a state of constant sleep deprivation, they are eventually forgotten. These are some of the things that people don't always quite understand when they wonder why someone didn't "just say something".
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Bolshevik
*cough*
Good thing the internet didn't exist.
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