Life is all about making mistakes and learning from them. That's part of how we grow and improve as individuals. If we don't do that, we're missing the boat. In retrospect, I learned a lot of lessons about trust, betrayal and the dark side of human nature from my time in The Way. It's quite possible I would have learned those lessons elsewhere had I not been involved with The Way. But you don't expect to learn those things from an organization that's supposed to be teaching you how to be a better Christian leader.
I met a lot of good people. I had a lot of fun times. Overall, I have to say, though, that the negative impact on my life outweighs the positive by a goodly amount. My involvement with The Way negatively affected my marriage, my family, my career, my relationship with friends and my overall sense of self worth. At this stage of my life, much of that damage is irreparable. Yes, I learned some valuable lessons. The cost of tuition was much too high.
My life changed for the better, considering where it quite likely would have ended up. I didn't cop too much flak whilst in, the flak from their religious toads came when I left lol. When I left, life improved even more, mentally, spiritually, financially, by about 500 percent.
Since I leaned towards amoral/immoral, I thought TWI would free me from the hypocrisy that I felt was rampant in most religious organizations. That notion got kicked to the curb fairly early on. I met my husband, and am grateful for that. Since he had already done the twig leader, WoW, and advanced class, I was spared those things. So beyond the people trying to tell me who to marry, what twig to attend, how to live, it was a great experience right up until the decision to leave.
Having grown up on a farm, and near a small town....my life was filled with sports, hunting, fishing,
motorcycles, water skiing, county fairs, 4-H competition, tractors, and wheat harvest.
During my sophomore year in high school, missionaries moved into the area and were active
in Central American outreach. It was at this point that I was introduced to Romans 10:9,10
and confessing/believing that Jesus was savior, mediator, and lord. Born again.
At college a few years later, WOW Ambassadors were excited about this class. I took it....
and so began my journey into the twi/vpw indoctrination. At times, my mind registered warning signs
of this "detour".....but the allure of youthfulness, zealousness and passion was too tempting. So,
class after class......and into the corps I went.
If I were to write a book, I'd say that this "twi experience" would consummate chapters 8-15
of my 30-chapter book. You see....twi was a significant portion of my life, and this experience
altered my life, but it doesn't define me. My bedrock core comes from my family, my faith, and
my upbringing.
Did I learn "commitment" from twi? No.
Did I learn "faith" from twi? No.
Did I learn "the Word" from twi? No.
In contemplating this twi-experience, I now see why I was perplexed when I read How to Enjoy the Bible
by Bullinger during my WOW year. In crediting Bullinger's work, I held deep suspicions that wierwille
had plagiarized the work. Time and time again, I asked myself why was all this adulation of wierwille
being splashed on The Way magazine if we're to give glory to God, not man?
Guess I was the "doubting Thomas" in the midst......because I smelled the manipulation and deception
early on. The reason that I didn't bolt was because there were so many genuine, good-hearted people
that I sincerely thought that we could right the ship. Alas, it didn't happen.
Did twi change me, good or bad? To me.....that's such a moot point. My journey in life, I believe,
is so much bigger than that twi-exposure. Even while "in"....life was happening all around me.
Marriage, children, school events, awards, competition, ball games,births and deaths, joys and sorrows
.....yeah, life.
The biggest take-aways from twi, for me......was the insidious deception and intent. The wolf
was in sheep's clothing and hailed as "the man of God." Now, I see why the Scriptures give us
a healthy dose of WARNINGS: deceivers, seducers, lords over God's heritage, ye hypocrites
[Matt. 15], leaven of the Pharisees, be doers of the Word and not hearers only, etc.
With twi in the distant rear-view mirror, I would say that the last 15 years have been quite good.
Thank God we exited twi before our boys were exposed to the gauntlet of classes and indoctrination.
Fast forward, and our oldest son graduated #1 in his medical school class and has received several
other honors since. Second son's business has been growing in leaps and bounds. Life, in full
measure, has been restored. God is good always.
I shudder to think what life would be like if I were still slogging along in cornfield heaven.
Chapters 21-30 of "my book" put a spring in my step to see what God has in store.
The last 5 chapters, since exiting twi in 1998, have been quite remarkable.
.
I love your narrative. Indeed, so much more for me since leaving. In significant ways, for me, twi represented a period of stunted emotional, social and intellectual growth.
I look back and think about the roads not taken. If I had the energy now that I had 40 years ago, I'd be in (or already through) law school and would be making even more positive impact on my community.
Instead, I'm thankful for my journey and that I've made it this far. I love me life at this stage. But I certainly do not give twi credit for it, though the rocky road that was twi for me did, of course, provide experience upon which I've been able to develop at least a little bit of wisdom. And like skyrider, I'm thankful for how successful my children (daughter and stepson) are today... and neither have had to go through twi to get there. :)
I consciously rejected a career path beyond one enlistment term in the Air Force because I couldn't see myself subservient to commanders for so long. When the light came on for me, in 1986, I knew I had had enough of twi and don't regret even one iota the decision to leave.
Another aspect to be considered is whether VPW/TWI's influence affected not just you but someone close to you, such as a family member or close friend, in such a way that the effects tricked down. Families were divided. Friendships were cast to the wayside. You don't have to have been an active part of The Way to have been affected.
Did twi/vpw change my life? Duh! Is the pope catholic.
First, it's not about me it's about God and what Christ accomplished for mankind. Nobody can screw that up. TWI got me in the habit of asking God for His help. That has never wavered. No matter how many times people have let me down, God has NEVER let me down. I still believe that the core things, the doctrine we were taught in twi is correct. It is especially alarming how much the world has promoted the opposite of what twi held dear. The gay marriage ruling is definitely a time to mourn for God's people.
Before twi, I was heading more and more into social isolation. From family, friends, society in general. TWI began to change all that. Beginning with the wow year was an 8 year period in which twi was like a sociological green house for me. This wasn't my plan; it just seems to be how it played out. A green house is a place where if a plant is struggling to survive in its natural environment, putting it in the greenhouse gave it climate controlled safety and nourishment, so that later it could be put back into its natural environment and have a much better chance of survival. For those 8 years, I lived with and hung out with wafers 24/7. This made an incredible impact. There were times when I needed to get a job RIGHT NOW but God always came through for me.
After the 8 years I moved back to where I lived when I got in the word. The change was obvious. I got a job and soon got promoted to management. I got married within 3 years. Seemingly, all the things I had no chance of accomplishing before twi, were happening. My unbelieving family was impressed. Still are to this day. This doesn't make me morally superior to anybody else. Religion isn't supposed to be about moral superiority; it's about God and what He has done for us. I know some of you don't believe that God had anything to do with twi. Well, I've never walked in your shoes/ you never walked in mine.
TWI made THE difference in my life. Forty years later.
I'm still trying to unlearn everything I was indoctrinated into from TWI.
I consider my whole time involved a total waste other than I'm starting to learn how to deal with abusive manipulative people based on my experiences in TWI, this I'm just learning now. All you people who still believe TWI's stuff are a big problem, you are like free-zone scientologists. It's ALL bunk, the bible, the characters in the bible, god, it's all a fiction. You people who are debating what TWI got right and what it got wrong are all missing the point that it was all based on a lie, and I'm not talking gas pumps I'm talking god, it's a grand illusion and those of you who still believe carry on the grand delusion.
I still haven't found the thing or the people or experience that makes me feel like I felt at some TWI events, but I haven't tried crack yet, don't think I will. I know those feelings were illusion my quest to research an understanding of der vurd, and witness to people a delusion. All a sad waste of life and time, spreading the TWI disease to others.
I will enjoy reading the flaming replies from the resident scumbags of GSC. Not saying everyone here are scumnags, just that there are certain people here who are SO SURE of themselves THAT THEY KNOW THAT THEY KNOW THAT THEY KNOW exactly what the word says and what gods will is, and especially they know how WRONG I AM for calling them on their cow pies.
Thanks for the topic. For me, it was bittersweet. It wasn't all good, and it wasn't all bad. I got into TWI at a time in my life when I was rock bottom and was suicidal. Once I was in TWI, life changed for me....I found a "Family" of sorts which I had never had and I found acceptance of myself and I had never experienced hugs from people like I did before getting into TWI. I was a "Believer". Since a child I had desired to be a "Missionary" so I thought this was God's answer for me to become that. I thought I would be a lifer cause I had never heard the bible taught like that, seen as many people committed as I saw. I thought it was the best ever. I did start seeing some things in people that didn't set right. I started having some questions in my mind about the doctrine. I started seeing some red flags here and there. But, I just discarded them because I was sure this is where God wanted me to be. Well, things got progressively worse and I started experiencing some verbal abuse as well as some physical abuse and it just got crazy Yet, I stayed because at that point I sincerely did not know how to leave. It wasn't until it started toppling down from the top that I saw the opening and I took it. I left I think it was like in 87 or something like that.
The Good things for me were, I met some really wonderful, loving, geniune people of whom a few are still in my life today. I obtained the mindset of reading the bible and believing it was indeed the Word of God. I learned alot about the Word that I never knew before. Alot of teaching I am not grateful for, but I am grateful that I learned who I am in Christ. And as I said I was rock bottom when I joined, and I believe that was a saving of my life for sure. There were many times of having fun, lots of laughter and just good times that made some memories for me.
The Bad things were when I left and realized all the things that I had believed were not necessary truth and I had heard about alot of the things that were going on in top leadership because I had a lot of corps friends even though I wasn't corps, I was angry. I was so upset that I felt that the "good years" in my life, meaning middle age....late 20's and 30's were gone. Time when people were planning and executing their careers, having families etc and here I was a mess, emotionally, mentally from being in TWI......I was bitter for a number of years until I sought some help to deal with things.
Most of the time, I don't have much remembrance of my 13 years in TWI. I have a life now that is pretty good. I still feel that many years were lost in my life, but then maybe not.....time will give me the answer to that.
So, to me it was bittersweet. I guess I have to say that obviously while in TWI I thought the good outweighed the bad....but after leaving I think the bad outweighed the good, I just couldn't see it when I was in it.
I have had to learn that there were decisions that I made that were in error. In other words, I can't blame everything on TWI.....I own my own stuff.
This has been my experience thus far in life with TWI....And I am very aware of the fact that others have had completely different experiences and we can't all be lumped into one little compartment.
Having no time in my life before TWI, I don't know what it changed.
I did learn about indifference. Both from within TWI and its fellowships, and from those not associated with TWI on the outside looking in, just watching.
I will enjoy reading the flaming replies from the resident scumbags of GSC. Not saying everyone here are scumnags, just that there are certain people here who are SO SURE of themselves THAT THEY KNOW THAT THEY KNOW THAT THEY KNOW exactly what the word says and what gods will is, and especially they know how WRONG I AM for calling them on their cow pies.
Seth
No wonder few people post here anymore with that kind of garbage allowed to stay up. Maybe you should look in the mirror junior.
Wordwolf, I have always liked and respected you. And I agree, he has the right to his opinion. But all these online atheists who hide behind a computer and hurl insults at someone just because of their belief in God get really old. I'd love to know how many people he has insulted to their face. I'm sure the answer is zero because these types of cowards never have a pair big enough to do that.
But whatever. I miss what this community used to be.
What I have kept, has been helpful and even essential. But I was selective and dropped so many things. Most of the wiser people did the same thing....pick and chose.
Wordwolf, I have always liked and respected you. And I agree, he has the right to his opinion. But all these online atheists who hide behind a computer and hurl insults at someone just because of their belief in God get really old. I'd love to know how many people he has insulted to their face. I'm sure the answer is zero because these types of cowards never have a pair big enough to do that.
But whatever. I miss what this community used to be.
Ad Hominem.
I use my real name, and picture, and will gladly trade telephone numbers and street addresses with anyone who cares to know it. I'm not hiding.
I didn't think his general insult to the majority of the posters here and all Christians in general was productive. But whatever, I have nothing more to say to junior. He can continue to show everyone how ignorant and childish he is.
Hurting people's feelings has never been THE dividing line
between what's acceptable here and what isn't-
. . .
Not trying to "flame" . . . Maybe just pointing out irony . . . Feelings/emotions were considered irrelevant in twi. We were drilled to ignore them. How do you communicate that hurting feelings is wrong to someone who doesn't "believe" in feelings?
Maybe I'm wrong, but I didn't get that Seth wants to fight. Just be open about who he is.
Bluzeman called me out as a coward who he theorized didn't say things like what I said in my first post on this thread to peoples faces.
Maybe he thinks I'm just trolling for a fight.
I however have been through lots of self-growth in my time since leaving TWI, many hours of study.
I do not fear religious bullies and passive aggressive people or people exhibiting sociopathic behavior.
I'm not here to make friends or to hurt people, I would like to connect with those who share my feelings.
I do find it troubling that people who once were involved with a christian high demand abusive group continue with the same dogma in any shape or form and think it's a good idea, let alone healthy.
The fact that someone is angry at what I said is a concern for that person, he/she may be delusional and dangerous.
I was directly emotionally and mentally hurt by a high ranking leader in TWI while on the WOW field 1992 - 1993.
I feel strongly that anyone who would defend such attitudes as the belief system of TWI as taught by VPW and his successors are mentally disturbed.
Personally I'm all about emotional growth, anyone who would discount me as a trouble maker because I call them out to wake up to reality are the ones who need to take a look at themselves. I'm doing it all the time how else could I write about something so divergent from the dogma of TWI and become so insulting to those who would defend it?
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Allan
My life changed for the better, considering where it quite likely would have ended up. I didn't cop too much flak whilst in, the flak from their religious toads came when I left lol. When I left, life
Rocky
I love your narrative. Indeed, so much more for me since leaving. In significant ways, for me, twi represented a period of stunted emotional, social and intellectual growth. I look back and think abo
WordWolf
He's entitled to his opinion, and the damage from twi/vpw is enough to get one angry. That having been said, personally, I would prefer that posts that antagonistic not be posted by people who ha
waysider
Life is all about making mistakes and learning from them. That's part of how we grow and improve as individuals. If we don't do that, we're missing the boat. In retrospect, I learned a lot of lessons about trust, betrayal and the dark side of human nature from my time in The Way. It's quite possible I would have learned those lessons elsewhere had I not been involved with The Way. But you don't expect to learn those things from an organization that's supposed to be teaching you how to be a better Christian leader.
I met a lot of good people. I had a lot of fun times. Overall, I have to say, though, that the negative impact on my life outweighs the positive by a goodly amount. My involvement with The Way negatively affected my marriage, my family, my career, my relationship with friends and my overall sense of self worth. At this stage of my life, much of that damage is irreparable. Yes, I learned some valuable lessons. The cost of tuition was much too high.
That's my take on it. Your mileage may vary.
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Allan
My life changed for the better, considering where it quite likely would have ended up. I didn't cop too much flak whilst in, the flak from their religious toads came when I left lol. When I left, life improved even more, mentally, spiritually, financially, by about 500 percent.
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Tzaia
Since I leaned towards amoral/immoral, I thought TWI would free me from the hypocrisy that I felt was rampant in most religious organizations. That notion got kicked to the curb fairly early on. I met my husband, and am grateful for that. Since he had already done the twig leader, WoW, and advanced class, I was spared those things. So beyond the people trying to tell me who to marry, what twig to attend, how to live, it was a great experience right up until the decision to leave.
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skyrider
Having grown up on a farm, and near a small town....my life was filled with sports, hunting, fishing,
motorcycles, water skiing, county fairs, 4-H competition, tractors, and wheat harvest.
During my sophomore year in high school, missionaries moved into the area and were active
in Central American outreach. It was at this point that I was introduced to Romans 10:9,10
and confessing/believing that Jesus was savior, mediator, and lord. Born again.
At college a few years later, WOW Ambassadors were excited about this class. I took it....
and so began my journey into the twi/vpw indoctrination. At times, my mind registered warning signs
of this "detour".....but the allure of youthfulness, zealousness and passion was too tempting. So,
class after class......and into the corps I went.
If I were to write a book, I'd say that this "twi experience" would consummate chapters 8-15
of my 30-chapter book. You see....twi was a significant portion of my life, and this experience
altered my life, but it doesn't define me. My bedrock core comes from my family, my faith, and
my upbringing.
Did I learn "commitment" from twi? No.
Did I learn "faith" from twi? No.
Did I learn "the Word" from twi? No.
In contemplating this twi-experience, I now see why I was perplexed when I read How to Enjoy the Bible
by Bullinger during my WOW year. In crediting Bullinger's work, I held deep suspicions that wierwille
had plagiarized the work. Time and time again, I asked myself why was all this adulation of wierwille
being splashed on The Way magazine if we're to give glory to God, not man?
Guess I was the "doubting Thomas" in the midst......because I smelled the manipulation and deception
early on. The reason that I didn't bolt was because there were so many genuine, good-hearted people
that I sincerely thought that we could right the ship. Alas, it didn't happen.
Did twi change me, good or bad? To me.....that's such a moot point. My journey in life, I believe,
is so much bigger than that twi-exposure. Even while "in"....life was happening all around me.
Marriage, children, school events, awards, competition, ball games,births and deaths, joys and sorrows
.....yeah, life.
The biggest take-aways from twi, for me......was the insidious deception and intent. The wolf
was in sheep's clothing and hailed as "the man of God." Now, I see why the Scriptures give us
a healthy dose of WARNINGS: deceivers, seducers, lords over God's heritage, ye hypocrites
[Matt. 15], leaven of the Pharisees, be doers of the Word and not hearers only, etc.
With twi in the distant rear-view mirror, I would say that the last 15 years have been quite good.
Thank God we exited twi before our boys were exposed to the gauntlet of classes and indoctrination.
Fast forward, and our oldest son graduated #1 in his medical school class and has received several
other honors since. Second son's business has been growing in leaps and bounds. Life, in full
measure, has been restored. God is good always.
I shudder to think what life would be like if I were still slogging along in cornfield heaven.
Chapters 21-30 of "my book" put a spring in my step to see what God has in store.
The last 5 chapters, since exiting twi in 1998, have been quite remarkable.
.
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Rocky
I love your narrative. Indeed, so much more for me since leaving. In significant ways, for me, twi represented a period of stunted emotional, social and intellectual growth.
I look back and think about the roads not taken. If I had the energy now that I had 40 years ago, I'd be in (or already through) law school and would be making even more positive impact on my community.
Instead, I'm thankful for my journey and that I've made it this far. I love me life at this stage. But I certainly do not give twi credit for it, though the rocky road that was twi for me did, of course, provide experience upon which I've been able to develop at least a little bit of wisdom. And like skyrider, I'm thankful for how successful my children (daughter and stepson) are today... and neither have had to go through twi to get there. :)
I consciously rejected a career path beyond one enlistment term in the Air Force because I couldn't see myself subservient to commanders for so long. When the light came on for me, in 1986, I knew I had had enough of twi and don't regret even one iota the decision to leave.
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waysider
Another aspect to be considered is whether VPW/TWI's influence affected not just you but someone close to you, such as a family member or close friend, in such a way that the effects tricked down. Families were divided. Friendships were cast to the wayside. You don't have to have been an active part of The Way to have been affected.
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johniam
Did twi/vpw change my life? Duh! Is the pope catholic.
First, it's not about me it's about God and what Christ accomplished for mankind. Nobody can screw that up. TWI got me in the habit of asking God for His help. That has never wavered. No matter how many times people have let me down, God has NEVER let me down. I still believe that the core things, the doctrine we were taught in twi is correct. It is especially alarming how much the world has promoted the opposite of what twi held dear. The gay marriage ruling is definitely a time to mourn for God's people.
Before twi, I was heading more and more into social isolation. From family, friends, society in general. TWI began to change all that. Beginning with the wow year was an 8 year period in which twi was like a sociological green house for me. This wasn't my plan; it just seems to be how it played out. A green house is a place where if a plant is struggling to survive in its natural environment, putting it in the greenhouse gave it climate controlled safety and nourishment, so that later it could be put back into its natural environment and have a much better chance of survival. For those 8 years, I lived with and hung out with wafers 24/7. This made an incredible impact. There were times when I needed to get a job RIGHT NOW but God always came through for me.
After the 8 years I moved back to where I lived when I got in the word. The change was obvious. I got a job and soon got promoted to management. I got married within 3 years. Seemingly, all the things I had no chance of accomplishing before twi, were happening. My unbelieving family was impressed. Still are to this day. This doesn't make me morally superior to anybody else. Religion isn't supposed to be about moral superiority; it's about God and what He has done for us. I know some of you don't believe that God had anything to do with twi. Well, I've never walked in your shoes/ you never walked in mine.
TWI made THE difference in my life. Forty years later.
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waysider
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Seth R.
I'm still trying to unlearn everything I was indoctrinated into from TWI.
I consider my whole time involved a total waste other than I'm starting to learn how to deal with abusive manipulative people based on my experiences in TWI, this I'm just learning now. All you people who still believe TWI's stuff are a big problem, you are like free-zone scientologists. It's ALL bunk, the bible, the characters in the bible, god, it's all a fiction. You people who are debating what TWI got right and what it got wrong are all missing the point that it was all based on a lie, and I'm not talking gas pumps I'm talking god, it's a grand illusion and those of you who still believe carry on the grand delusion.
I still haven't found the thing or the people or experience that makes me feel like I felt at some TWI events, but I haven't tried crack yet, don't think I will. I know those feelings were illusion my quest to research an understanding of der vurd, and witness to people a delusion. All a sad waste of life and time, spreading the TWI disease to others.
I will enjoy reading the flaming replies from the resident scumbags of GSC. Not saying everyone here are scumnags, just that there are certain people here who are SO SURE of themselves THAT THEY KNOW THAT THEY KNOW THAT THEY KNOW exactly what the word says and what gods will is, and especially they know how WRONG I AM for calling them on their cow pies.
Seth
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newlife
Thanks for the topic. For me, it was bittersweet. It wasn't all good, and it wasn't all bad. I got into TWI at a time in my life when I was rock bottom and was suicidal. Once I was in TWI, life changed for me....I found a "Family" of sorts which I had never had and I found acceptance of myself and I had never experienced hugs from people like I did before getting into TWI. I was a "Believer". Since a child I had desired to be a "Missionary" so I thought this was God's answer for me to become that. I thought I would be a lifer cause I had never heard the bible taught like that, seen as many people committed as I saw. I thought it was the best ever. I did start seeing some things in people that didn't set right. I started having some questions in my mind about the doctrine. I started seeing some red flags here and there. But, I just discarded them because I was sure this is where God wanted me to be. Well, things got progressively worse and I started experiencing some verbal abuse as well as some physical abuse and it just got crazy Yet, I stayed because at that point I sincerely did not know how to leave. It wasn't until it started toppling down from the top that I saw the opening and I took it. I left I think it was like in 87 or something like that.
The Good things for me were, I met some really wonderful, loving, geniune people of whom a few are still in my life today. I obtained the mindset of reading the bible and believing it was indeed the Word of God. I learned alot about the Word that I never knew before. Alot of teaching I am not grateful for, but I am grateful that I learned who I am in Christ. And as I said I was rock bottom when I joined, and I believe that was a saving of my life for sure. There were many times of having fun, lots of laughter and just good times that made some memories for me.
The Bad things were when I left and realized all the things that I had believed were not necessary truth and I had heard about alot of the things that were going on in top leadership because I had a lot of corps friends even though I wasn't corps, I was angry. I was so upset that I felt that the "good years" in my life, meaning middle age....late 20's and 30's were gone. Time when people were planning and executing their careers, having families etc and here I was a mess, emotionally, mentally from being in TWI......I was bitter for a number of years until I sought some help to deal with things.
Most of the time, I don't have much remembrance of my 13 years in TWI. I have a life now that is pretty good. I still feel that many years were lost in my life, but then maybe not.....time will give me the answer to that.
So, to me it was bittersweet. I guess I have to say that obviously while in TWI I thought the good outweighed the bad....but after leaving I think the bad outweighed the good, I just couldn't see it when I was in it.
I have had to learn that there were decisions that I made that were in error. In other words, I can't blame everything on TWI.....I own my own stuff.
This has been my experience thus far in life with TWI....And I am very aware of the fact that others have had completely different experiences and we can't all be lumped into one little compartment.
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johniam
I don't know how "flaming" this is, but, what happened today? Did somebody pee in your coffee?
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Bolshevik
Having no time in my life before TWI, I don't know what it changed.
I did learn about indifference. Both from within TWI and its fellowships, and from those not associated with TWI on the outside looking in, just watching.
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Bluzeman
No wonder few people post here anymore with that kind of garbage allowed to stay up. Maybe you should look in the mirror junior.
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WordWolf
He's entitled to his opinion, and the damage from twi/vpw
is enough to get one angry.
That having been said, personally, I would prefer that posts
that antagonistic not be posted by people who have the freedom
to do so or to refrain from doing so. He's lashing out at his
fellow posters and any lurkers who disagree with him, and
most of them had nothing to do with why he's angry.
Hurting people's feelings has never been THE dividing line
between what's acceptable here and what isn't-
remember the women who were chased off by men (always men)
who accused women who were victimized by vpw?
They never allowed vpw to be blamed, only the women,
and had no problems calling them liars.
Those posters were rarely run off, also.
IMHO, they were more hurtful than this general screed against
everyone of faith who reads here.
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Bluzeman
Wordwolf, I have always liked and respected you. And I agree, he has the right to his opinion. But all these online atheists who hide behind a computer and hurl insults at someone just because of their belief in God get really old. I'd love to know how many people he has insulted to their face. I'm sure the answer is zero because these types of cowards never have a pair big enough to do that.
But whatever. I miss what this community used to be.
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krys
What I have kept, has been helpful and even essential. But I was selective and dropped so many things. Most of the wiser people did the same thing....pick and chose.
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Seth R.
Ad Hominem.
I use my real name, and picture, and will gladly trade telephone numbers and street addresses with anyone who cares to know it. I'm not hiding.
Just PM me and ask if you are serious.
Seth
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Bluzeman
Oh look, internet tough guy wants to fight. You're hilarious junior.
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WordWolf
GENTLEMEN....
Do either of you really think this is productive?
Do you guys really want to fight it out in an alley or something?
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Bluzeman
I didn't think his general insult to the majority of the posters here and all Christians in general was productive. But whatever, I have nothing more to say to junior. He can continue to show everyone how ignorant and childish he is.
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Tzaia
Maybe I'm wrong, but I didn't get that Seth wants to fight. Just be open about who he is.
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Bolshevik
Not trying to "flame" . . . Maybe just pointing out irony . . . Feelings/emotions were considered irrelevant in twi. We were drilled to ignore them. How do you communicate that hurting feelings is wrong to someone who doesn't "believe" in feelings?
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Seth R.
Bluzeman called me out as a coward who he theorized didn't say things like what I said in my first post on this thread to peoples faces.
Maybe he thinks I'm just trolling for a fight.
I however have been through lots of self-growth in my time since leaving TWI, many hours of study.
I do not fear religious bullies and passive aggressive people or people exhibiting sociopathic behavior.
I'm not here to make friends or to hurt people, I would like to connect with those who share my feelings.
I do find it troubling that people who once were involved with a christian high demand abusive group continue with the same dogma in any shape or form and think it's a good idea, let alone healthy.
The fact that someone is angry at what I said is a concern for that person, he/she may be delusional and dangerous.
I was directly emotionally and mentally hurt by a high ranking leader in TWI while on the WOW field 1992 - 1993.
I feel strongly that anyone who would defend such attitudes as the belief system of TWI as taught by VPW and his successors are mentally disturbed.
Personally I'm all about emotional growth, anyone who would discount me as a trouble maker because I call them out to wake up to reality are the ones who need to take a look at themselves. I'm doing it all the time how else could I write about something so divergent from the dogma of TWI and become so insulting to those who would defend it?
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Seth R.
If he's Rico Magnelli? Yes.
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