Super Hero TV

[Raf]

Once again impressed with Flash, and Supergirl continues to grow on me. They've done a really good job of making it so that Supergirl is grounded in its own reality. And it's genuinely fun (something Man of Steel was not).

[GeorgeStGeorge]

If you haven't seen this week's Flash (4/19), don't read this until you have! :)

So...I'm confused. Is Zoom Zolomon Hunter, or Jay Garrick? If the former, then the latter could be the "Man in the Iron Mask." :blink:

George

[GeorgeStGeorge]

If you haven't seen this week's Flash (4/19), don't read this until you have! :)/>

So...I'm confused. Is Zoom Zolomon Hunter, or Jay Garrick? If the former, then the latter could be the "Man in the Iron Mask." :blink:/>

Make that Hunter Zolomon.

George

[GeorgeStGeorge]

So, why doesn't Rip Hunter just go all "Pilgrim" and kill Savage when he was a boy?

George

[Raf]

Caught up on Flash and Arrow. A few episodes behind on Legends.

Supergirl outperformed my expectations. I was really pleased with its debut season. It may cost too much to warrant a renewal, though, which would really suck. Don't end on a "cliffhanger" if you don't know 100% you'll get renewed!

[GeorgeStGeorge]

Caught up on Flash and Arrow. A few episodes behind on Legends.

Supergirl outperformed my expectations. I was really pleased with its debut season. It may cost too much to warrant a renewal, though, which would really suck. Don't end on a "cliffhanger" if you don't know 100% you'll get renewed!

Apparently, Supergirl was CBS' #1 new drama, but it does have high costs to produce. There's talk of CW picking it up (if CBS doesn't renew).

George

[WordWolf]

I'm caught up on Arrow and Flash until this past Sunday.

I'm 1 episode behind on LoT and just finished Supergirl.

(I'm 1 behind on Gotham & seriously behind on Agent Carter

and MAOS. We'll catch up on those during the slow season.)

I'm pretty sure I know what's in the pod. BTW, anyone remember

the word "Omegahedron?" I bet Helen Slater does.

Can't they just put Jimmy in ONE bow tie, or make a reference to

him having given them up completely?

As far as Arrow goes, I'm seriously disappointed in Ollie that the

stone was all still intact. I SO expected the smaller keystone to

be a FAKE and for the real one to have been pulverized and scattered

as pebbles in faraway places.

Personally, I think the "Genesis" plan sounds STUPID. If you want to

clear an area and leave it open for moving in, then a LIMITED chemical

strike and explosive strike, coupled with The Undertaking's earthquake

machine, would be the way to go. Hard radiation ruins the target, and if

anyone thought of biological warfare, those things will eventually get past

any security AND mutate so inoculation will be marginally useful at best.

So, hit the real estate without disease or radiation, and you can use the

land later.

[Raf]

The most recent episode of LOT was very good. Redeem-the-series good.

[GeorgeStGeorge]

Good news: Supergirl picked up by CW for next season.

Bad news: end of last week's Flash. :(

George

[GeorgeStGeorge]

Good news: Flash season finale makes up for previous episode. But next season -- Flashpoint?

George

[Raf]

We already know how this ends for Flash. It can't last for more than a couple of episodes without seriously disrupting all three series. So he has to go back, stop himself from interfering, save his 11-year-old self, then stop May 2015 Barry Allen from interfering.

[GeorgeStGeorge]

We already know how this ends for Flash. It can't last for more than a couple of episodes without seriously disrupting all three series. So he has to go back, stop himself from interfering, save his 11-year-old self, then stop May 2015 Barry Allen from interfering.

Actually, when he went back the first time to stop it, didn't another version of him wave himself off?

George

[Raf]

Yes. That's the next version that has to go back.

[WordWolf]

Yes. That's the next version that has to go back.

Mrs Wolf and I were trying to get straight which versions did what.

We know one Flash went back and rescued Henry and young Barry.

We know one Flash went back and signaled another to stop.

We know one Flash went back and tried to stop Reverse-Flash (and was signaled to stop).

We know one Flash (5/2015) went back and disrupted time by smacking Reverse-Flash.

Other than the last one, there can be overlap.

Mrs Wolf (who agreed that this will all be retconned-as do I) said that the

Flash that saved Henry and Barry was seen exiting the house before 5/2015

entered the house.

I THINK the one that tried to stop Reverse-Flash was the one that observed

5/2015 act, beat him to it, made a face showing he approved, then vanished-

either by going home or because his timeline was disrupted completely.

After all, we're now in Grandfather Paradox mode (Mrs Wolf said it's a

Double-Loop that ends the scene in a diverging, different timeline than

the previous one. If it's not addressed, it logically should ISOLATE

the storyline from the Arrowverse (like Supergirl) rather than damage

the rest of the Arrowverse permanently.

(I think that thinks too highly of the writers and that won't happen

even if it's more logical.)

With no Eobard Thawne to go kill and replace Harrison Wells, STAR Labs is

constructed on schedule- 10 years after we saw in Season 1. That means Barry

has a decade to wait before any of them get metahuman powers from the incident.

As Barry has time powers, he MAY be immune to the effects of his own trip,

or he may NOT be. Either way, the Black Flashes should go after him for this

blatant disruption of time- as should the Time Masters.

(We have NOT finished watching LoT, so don't tell us how the last 2 episodes

go!)

BTW, I thought that Vibe's vision was going to come true by having Vibe blow

the doomsday device into an Earth 2 portal and closing the portal. By dooming

Earth 2, he would have saved Earths 3-52 since they're not connected centrally

to Earth 2 the way they're connected to Earth 1.

I THINK we're all in agreement that the next Barry to go back will be the

one who stopped another, and will be the one who restores the timeline back

to the status quo for the series.

Anyone else think they're going to drag out interminably about giving Wally and

Jessie their speed?

[GeorgeStGeorge]

Anyone else think they're going to drag out interminably about giving Wally and

Jessie their speed?

I say, middle of next season. As for Jesse, though, it depends on how much Earth-Two we get. It seems as though everyone from earths other than 1 are leaving the show.

George

[Raf]

Here's my thought on the day of Nora's death, and I'll divide it into Year 2000 (the original event), May 2015 (last year's finale) and May 2016 (this year's finale). And I'll add NEXT TIME for the inevitable next time.

Year 2000: We see one Barry and one Thawne. That Barry rescues his younger self. Question: Is he there to stop Thawne or to rescue himself?

May 2015: We learn a second Barry is on the scene. He is waved off by another Barry, and does not save his mother. Question: Is it the same Barry as Year 2000? Or is this a third Barry?

So we know so far there are at least two Barrys at the scene, and one of them knows enough to wave the other off. This can be explained by two Barrys on scene or three.

May 2016: A third (at least) Barry shows up. He actually disrupts the cycle. May 2015 Barry disappears, ala Marty McFly's family photo. Where did Barry from Year 2000? The timeline is now disrupted. He's gone the same way May 2015 Barry is. But his rescue of himself is not undone (because TV).

NEXT TIME: May 2016 Barry will either disappear or, more likely, be powerless upon his return. We'll have a story arc of a few episodes to show how bad he screwed things up. "Arrow" and "LOT" will continue as if nothing happened, which will be the audience's signal that the timeline does eventually get repaired. The Speed Force will let Next season's Barry know he's been a bad boy and restore his power so that he can fix his mess. He becomes NEXT TIME Barry, going back and revealing that he was Year 2000 Barry all along. FIRST he will stop May 2016 Barry from interfering. Then he will save his younger self from Thawne. Then he will wave off May 2015 Barry. And all will be restored.

I see this happening in a few episodes at most. In that time: Eddie Thawne will be alive. So will both Barry's parents. Harrison Wells will really be Harrison Wells. His wife will be alive. He will be a decade away from the particle accelerator. (It is possible that the series will fast forward 10 years to the correct timeline in which Barry becomes the Flash a decade later than we've seen, and the Barry that goes back in Year 2000. Either way, there are only three Barrys on scene, one of whom has to be stopped in order for the timeline to be restored).

WordWolf: The Time Masters are an x-factor in all this, as you will see when you catch up on LOT.

[GeorgeStGeorge]

I think two of the Barrys are time-remnants who, according to this TV show, are autonomous, and go back in time, one to save Nora, the other to stop him. The third Barry is actually Jay Garrick of Earth FOUR, who has no idea why he's there.

Seriously, thinking about this stuff too hard makes my head hurt. I'm just going to enjoy the ride. Before next fall, though, I suggest you buy or rent the DVD "Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox." (It's a lot easier than buying all of the comics. The cartoon stayed pretty faithful.)

They probably won't cross this over with Arrow, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a visit from the Legends of Tomorrow.

George

[Raf]

I saw Flashpoint on Netflix. I found it confusing because they didn't actually show him going back to save his mom.

[WordWolf]

I have the cartoon here. I wasn't sure it was worth watching...

[Raf]

Arrow has lost its way.

[GeorgeStGeorge]

Arrow has lost its way.

I get what you're saying, but almost every long-running show has to re-invent itself periodically. Legends of Tomorrow can't always be about chasing down Vandal Savage, so there's a new premise for next season. As we've opined above, there's no telling what will happen with Flash next season. (It would be great if the altered timeline left Captain Cold alive, but the Vanishing Point controller destroyed.)

I'm not privy to contract considerations, but I suspect that Oliver will "get the band back together" sooner rather than later.

George

[Raf]

I'm talking about telling a story that was not grounded in reality, like the first two seasons. Who's he going to fight next, Satan? The whole magic element just killed the tone they'd set for the show.

And the whole world? He saves the whole world? What happens next seasom? Darkseid?

[GeorgeStGeorge]

I'm not sure I consider the first two seasons "grounded in reality." Maybe you just mean suspending your belief a little less.

Dealing with more powerful adversaries means more guest appearances from other heroes! :)

Back to Flash, I wonder if the altered timeline will allow the Supergirl universe to merge in...

George

[WordWolf]

He's talking about the level of the threats.

Arrow was at the level of the Bat-Family (Batman, Robin, Nightwing, etc.)

and lately it's looking more towards the Super-Family (Superman, Supergirl, Krypto, etc.)

The street-level, non-powered stuff where the here MIGHT save a city but usually

does so by cleaning the streets each night,

rather than "the world will be destroyed if we fail."

At worst, Starling would have been destroyed and the survivors relocated to

Midway, Opal, Central, Keystone, Hub, St Roche, etc.

Continuing to re-power Dahrk returns the "kills with a gesture, bulletproof"

thing, threatening to destroy the planet raises the stakes high for an athlete

who punches people out or shoots them with arrows.

[GeorgeStGeorge]

Continuing to re-power Dahrk returns the "kills with a gesture, bulletproof"

thing, threatening to destroy the planet raises the stakes high for an athlete

who punches people out or shoots them with arrows.

Let's not forget his team of top level martial artists and computer hackers. (It seems that every show these days has someone who can hack pretty much every system. Arrow has at least two (Felicity and her dad) and maybe three (Curtis).)

As was pointed out in "The Last Action Hero," the threats always get worse in the sequels.:)

I guess we can agree to disagree, here.

What I"VE found most annoying about the series is that every episode someone threatens to, or does, quit the team. Of course, touchy-feely is pretty much the hallmark of a CW series.

George