Super Human Powers

[chockfull]

"Super Human Powers" and Christ in you. This really isn't that complicated. No, you don't have super human powers available for deployment at your whim. The key is God initiates that kind of stuff. If He needs my involvement in something, He will communicate so I can understand and provide the strength to carry out what He needs.

Those times in life IME are few are far between. Most of the time, it's chugging along with common sense going. I mean it doesn't take a ton of common sense to figure out certain things are wrong.

[waysider]

I mean it doesn't take a ton of common sense to figure out certain things are wrong.

This is where it gets weird. Part of the idea being taught in the advanced class was that sometimes you have to deliberately defy common sense and rely on your "super human" powers instead. Wierwille gave some example about a guy, who contrary to what common sense was telling him, went to a very busy train station and, defeating the odds, instantly located his wife, about whom he had no travel information. (I suspect the incident was another one of Wierwille's many fabrications.) I don't recall all the specifics.

I guess there was this idea that what you THOUGHT was common sense was really the devil trying to trick you out of revelation.

We really did live in a "bizzaro" kind of world, didn't we?

Edited January 9, 2014 by waysider

[Bolshevik]

Even at STS they'd state plainly that the words they spoke were more real than the chair you were sitting in.

So we willing give up our own individual idea of what's real and hand it to them to mold? I guess if you enjoy the high of a Superhuman feeling that comes with that slavery it's worth it to you.

[waysider]

Here are some excepts from the AC syllabus (pgs.5,6)

WORD OF KNOWLEDGE

It is not human knowledge highly developed----It is not guessing or imagination---It is not your analysis of a situation-you ascertain this by Word of Knowledge.

WORD OF WISDOM

It is not wisdom acquired by the five senses---It is not natural wisdom stemming from experience as the best teacher---It is not practical wisdom---It is not your analysis of what to do about a situation.

And, we were supposed to actively seek to excel at these practices, rather than rely on common sense.

Is it any wonder so many of us made bad life-decisions??

Edited January 9, 2014 by waysider

[GeorgeStGeorge]

I thought I was just watching an "Ah-nold" shoot em up, not the birth of the new world army following the rise of the seed of the serpent to power thus introducing Armageddon.

Well, if you were watching "End of Days"... :)

George

Here are some excepts from the AC syllabus (pgs.5,6)

WORD OF KNOWLEDGE

It is not human knowledge highly developed----It is not guessing or imagination---It is not your analysis of a situation-you ascertain this by Word of Knowledge.

WORD OF WISDOM

It is not wisdom acquired by the five senses---It is not natural wisdom stemming from experience as the best teacher---It is not practical wisdom---It is not your analysis of what to do about a situation.

And, we were supposed to actively seek to excel at these practices, rather than rely on common sense.

Is it any wonder so many of us made bad life-decisions??

To be fair, Waysider, none of that says that we are not to develop human knowledge and wisdom. It's just that those aren't spiritual manifestations.

George

[chockfull]

And, we were supposed to actively seek to excel at these practices, rather than rely on common sense.

Is it any wonder so many of us made bad life-decisions??

Yeah people got way overboard on those. Sniffing after signs. One of the splinter groups even got to the point where they were having "dueling revelation" messages. "I saw a spider on your head" "No, I saw a frog coming out of your mouth" Reading some of the accounts was like an episode of "The Real Housewives of NYC - Revelation Edition".

[Steve Lortz]

Yeah people got way overboard on those. Sniffing after signs. One of the splinter groups even got to the point where they were having "dueling revelation" messages. "I saw a spider on your head" "No, I saw a frog coming out of your mouth" Reading some of the accounts was like an episode of "The Real Housewives of NYC - Revelation Edition".

It's not good common sense to follow such leaders... much less to BE ONE!

(and I had the opportunity to be one... but the good sense not to!)

Love,

Steve

Edited January 10, 2014 by Steve Lortz

[waysider]

To be fair, Waysider, none of that says that we are not to develop human knowledge and wisdom. It's just that those aren't spiritual manifestations.

George

Context, George. It's a known fact that Wierwille denigrated "World Wisdom" frequently, beginning with his disparaging remarks in PFAL.

[skyrider]

Yeah.....common sense trumps twi's 'heavy-revy' any day of the week.

It got to the point where STRINGING CHAIRS WAS A SPIRITUAL EVENT.

Reminds me of the brc incident [i've shared this before].....

On my interim year at hq, I was assigned the responsibility of the BRC.

These household responsibilities rotated about every two months and I was given the duty

to oversee every meeting setup in the brc. Also, a number the in-resident corps [8th corps]

were assigned to the brc setup crew. And, of course the sunday teachings were of paramount

importance.....rows had to be strung in perfect alignment.

Well, after a few times of this....I noticed a neat little shortcut. If we turned off the

overhead lights and had those dim lover lights on, then the carpet impressions were readily

visible and we simply placed chairs on those carpet dents.....no strings, no hassle, no

problem! Rather than a 50-minute production to string chairs.....we could vacuum and align

those chairs in less than 20 minutes. That 8th corps crew loved me for it.

It was our little secret.....and common sense. :)

[WordWolf]

Context, George. It's a known fact that Wierwille denigrated "World Wisdom" frequently, beginning with his disparaging remarks in PFAL.

"World Wisdom" takes work to acquire. Of course vpw was against it- and denigrated it.

I do believe in Divine Revelation, but I also view "World Wisdom" with a LOT more respect

than people wanted me to in twi (unless it was THEIR World Wisdom that was being discussed.)

Knowledge is such an amazing thing for the most part, no matter what the source.

It's one reason I've poked behind curtains for decades and read information addressed to

INSIDERS down the years- making some FASCINATING discoveries people never meant to let slip.

I never went around broadcasting them because I looked around for my OWN learning and my

OWN understanding, not for everyone else's understanding.

[chockfull]

Yeah.....common sense trumps twi's 'heavy-revy' any day of the week.

It got to the point where STRINGING CHAIRS WAS A SPIRITUAL EVENT.

It was for me. It was an exercise in the renewed mind not to think about shooting myself while doing it. The ROA big tent was probably the most extreme example of this. 1:30 am and we only have 1 section to go!!!!!

[outandabout]

Yeah.....common sense trumps twi's 'heavy-revy' any day of the week.

It got to the point where STRINGING CHAIRS WAS A SPIRITUAL EVENT.

Reminds me of the brc incident [i've shared this before].....

On my interim year at hq, I was assigned the responsibility of the BRC.

These household responsibilities rotated about every two months and I was given the duty

to oversee every meeting setup in the brc. Also, a number the in-resident corps [8th corps]

were assigned to the brc setup crew. And, of course the sunday teachings were of paramount

importance.....rows had to be strung in perfect alignment.

Well, after a few times of this....I noticed a neat little shortcut. If we turned off the

overhead lights and had those dim lover lights on, then the carpet impressions were readily

visible and we simply placed chairs on those carpet dents.....no strings, no hassle, no

problem! Rather than a 50-minute production to string chairs.....we could vacuum and align

those chairs in less than 20 minutes. That 8th corps crew loved me for it.

It was our little secret.....and common sense. :)/>

If you were found out you probably would have been yelled at.

[chockfull]

I do believe in Divine Revelation, but I also view "World Wisdom" with a LOT more respect

than people wanted me to in twi (unless it was THEIR World Wisdom that was being discussed.)

My "common sense" view of revelation is that God is the Creator. If He needs to get my attention and communicate something He certainly knows how to do it and will do it if He deems it necessary. I mean He can even do extremes - like the Balaam's foot story, if necessary. One such example I have personally is I was traveling down the street on a moped. I hear someone yell "stop" really really loud and it scared me to the point I jammed on the brakes and laid down the bike. I stand up and look around only to find not a soul around, except for the large semi that just ran a stop sign about 20 feet in front of me. I actually looked around for about 10 minutes for who yelled. No pedestrians, no traffic on the street, not another soul. Finally it dawned on me. "That was God yelling at you". "No, couldn't have been. That's crazy." "What other explanation do you have?" "An alien with a spaceship opened a window and yelled through a translator?" "Okay, maybe not".

Anyway, yes I talk to myself and always have, and no unlike some I met in TWI I don't think my own thoughts are revelation. Most of life is praying and trying to use the grey matter God gave me. I figure if the Lord needs to get a message through He can although if I ever have a conversation with any talking donkeys I probably won't tell you guys because at least part of the message would be I need to be less thick-headed. And that's private. ;)

[Keith]

My "common sense" view of revelation is that God is the Creator. If He needs to get my attention and communicate something He certainly knows how to do it and will do it if He deems it necessary. I mean He can even do extremes - like the Balaam's foot story, if necessary. One such example I have personally is I was traveling down the street on a moped. I hear someone yell "stop" really really loud and it scared me to the point I jammed on the brakes and laid down the bike. I stand up and look around only to find not a soul around, except for the large semi that just ran a stop sign about 20 feet in front of me. I actually looked around for about 10 minutes for who yelled. No pedestrians, no traffic on the street, not another soul. Finally it dawned on me. "That was God yelling at you". "No, couldn't have been. That's crazy." "What other explanation do you have?" "An alien with a spaceship opened a window and yelled through a translator?" "Okay, maybe not".

Anyway, yes I talk to myself and always have, and no unlike some I met in TWI I don't think my own thoughts are revelation. Most of life is praying and trying to use the grey matter God gave me. I figure if the Lord needs to get a message through He can although if I ever have a conversation with any talking donkeys I probably won't tell you guys because at least part of the message would be I need to be less thick-headed. And that's private. ;)/>/>

I've had a few things like this happen in my life as well. I've also had times when I felt strongly that I needed to leave a place. I think it's possible that had I stayed something might have happened, but honestly I don't know. Mostly as mentioned I just try to use my head and trust that God will get my attention if I'm about to mess up badly. I've never felt like a superman, just blessed.

Like someone else mentioned I believe revelation is God's prerogative not ours. I will mention three incidents, you can take them however you wish, I can't prove any of them to you. Once, a long time after leaving TWI, while studying a passage I remember thinking about how a passage might related to a another one and looked at the other Bible on the table that happened to be open to that passage. It was short time later that it dawned on me I only had one bible out and there was now no sign of the second Bible on the table I was sitting at. The second was a time when I walked into the house while my wife was cooking fish and it smelled strongly of s**t. The smell disappeared once I realized it seemed to be coming from the pan of frying fish and threw it out. We looked at the rest of the package and quickly realized it had gone bad. Of course this last could have been usual sense of smell.

The third I've mentioned on this site before and while they were two separate events that day I think of them as the same. When I began returning to God after 13 years because I still distrusted church I went back to TWI headquarters with my wife and some friends knowing only that VPW had died since I left in '76. The first thing I saw when I got out of the car was a tree that was dying from it's roots. There were a few good leaves and branches on it, but it looked terrible on the trunk and near the ground. Then as I sat in the Auditorium and looked around I kept seeing patches of plaster fall from the wall with worms and decay underneath. I think I was getting a pretty clear picture of the state of TWI. So yes I believe in revelation.

Edited January 10, 2014 by Keith

[waysider]

Lots of good responses on this one.

Years ago, I did a work related mental exercise to increase observational abilities. The idea was to try to observe as much information in a short period of time as possible. For example: Pick someone out in the grocery store checkout line. What clothes were they wearing? Did they have any detectable odor of perfume? Was there any visible emotion in their expression? How tall or short were they? Did they seem overweight or underweight? The lesson in this was that one can condition oneself to be keenly aware of surroundings.

Given the proper amount of coaching, I believe it's possible for a person to start to think that their observation skills are more than they really are. To complicate matters, some will interpret their observations in a manner that does not reflect reality. I think this is what happened, to some extent, in The Way.

edit: It was never my intention to refute divine revelation. I was thinking more about how some people (myself included) allowed themselves to believe they were somehow super-humans in contrast to the "empties floating by". I've seen this in other fundamentalist groups besides The Way, as well.

Edited January 10, 2014 by waysider

[johniam]

quote:

edit: It was never my intention to refute divine revelation. I was thinking more about how some people (myself included) allowed themselves to believe they were somehow super-humans in contrast to the "empties floating by". I've seen this in other fundamentalist groups besides The Way, as well.

Tom Burke had a song called 'Would you like to be born again'. The first verse says,,,or would you rather be a jug. A jug is a human being with nothing inside; he's cracked but he's covered up with pride. He dresses flashy in the latest style, but he's just an empty on the rubbish pile. So if you let satan use you for a rug, you might grow up to be a jug.

Personally, I wouldn't recommend trying to interact with people with that mindset. If some atheist was trying to cram their view down your throat, then said mindset might be a good comeback, but how could you love someone with the love of God if you just thought of them as an 'empty'?

Jesus was the super human. He wasn't a body builder or a martial arts guy, or a rock star, politician, or anything this world likes to elevate; he had willingness to obey God 100% no matter what it cost him. All we had to do was say yes.

[chockfull]

I agree johniam. God looks at these "empties" with enough love to pay a ransom of His only Son for them.

But a snooty fundamentalist who had a ransom paid for their judgmental @$$ can now look at them as "less than human"?

I guess it just goes to show how God is God and people are dumb.