Would you attend a twig that worships wierwille?

[skyrider]

This subject came up on another thread....and the more I thought about it, the more repugnant it sounded.

Would you attend a twig that worships wierwille? Or, if a couple of faithful, long-standing deceivers.....er, "believers" were into the wierwille-worship thingy, could you stomach the idolatry in your midst? In my opinion, this is a serious subject and not something that one can dance around on.

In all my years of involvement, NOT ONCE do I remember wierwille confront the growing adulation that came his way. NOT ONCE....do I remember wierwille openly teach STOP THE IDOLATRY and make Jesus Christ your lord. The "man of God" buzzspeak and "Father in the Word" slobberfests by Geer, Martindale and Townsend didn't help matters either. Nor did wierwille and his "Man of God" silver bracelet.

The insanity of it all.

How can one claim to have *learned the word* in pfal.....only to succumb to wierwille-worship? If one is to even apply a sliver of truth from the advanced class, then one has given into seducing and deceiving spirits. Right? What a mess. In pursuit of truth, one ends up deceived and deceiving others.

I think this is what the scriptures depict when stating "the blind lead the blind and both fall into the ditch."

[excathedra]

i would never attend a twig that worships wierwille. i would never attend a twig period.

i agree that wierwille LOVED when we fawned (sp?) all over him. he was so insecure it is unbelievable. and he could be a real bastad in a split second.

i don't know what i make of all my time and experience there. i talk to god about it pretty frequently and i figure in the end he'll make it right and help me understand.

[WordWolf]

Every once in a while, vpw mixed his signals.

He'd set up all the stages to worship him

(all the stories setting him above everyone else,

stand when he entered to teach,

call him The Teacher,

etc)

and occasionally say directly not to do it.

Why?

Then people could say

"See? One time here, he said he didn't die for us

and it was Jesus we are to look to."

Meanwhile, if you didn't look to vpw for your

answers, you were in trouble if you were on grounds.

I wouldn't attend an anything that worshiped anyone.

I get uncomfortable with Jesus worship-and if any man

deserves worship it would be that Man and no other.

Anyone else might earn a snicker.

[Steve Lortz]

Hindsight is 20/20..... :-(

My Mom and Dad taught me that there are people I just ought to be respectful of. Wierwille destroyed THAT naivete. I haven't followed any religious leader since without first having a one-on-one with that leader regarding Jeremiah 17:5 "...Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departheth from the Lord," and letting her or him know that it is the Lord I trust, not them.

There is NOTHING... NOTHING... about The Way International that was not originally, intentionally perverted by Wierwille. The only way any good came from TWI was by God turning to good what the adversary meant for evil.

Love,

Steve

[krys]

WordWolf took the words out of my mouth, only he did so more eloquently!

[Ham]

Would you attend a twig that worships wierwille?

No.

That is one of main reasons I quietly walked away from one group. They probably still don't know (or even care) why they haven't seen me for over ten years..

[Keith]

I wouldn't attend any twig or religious service that worshiped anyone or anything except God and His Son.

That said I will say the best advice I ever got when it comes to the bible I got from VPW. Maybe it was a moment of honesty from him; I don't know. The only time I really met him he looked me directly in the eye and said. "Son, don't ever take anyone's word for what the word of God says." Then after a pause he added, "Not even mine." That was something I have always practiced. It got me in hot water in TWI, and it's gotten me in hot water with other groups as well.

[Ham]

Maybe.. is it possible that this was yet another Machiavellian maneuver to keep the ranks fighting among themselves? Sow discontent and disagreement between the ranks, and the eyes are then off of the Boss..

Train one group to be anal-retentive micro-managers, the bible be damned.. and train the underlings not to trust those directly above them..

[waysider]

The only time I really met him he looked me directly in the eye and said. "Son, don't ever take anyone's word for what the word of God says." Then after a pause he added, "Not even mine."

Just so you know, Keith, that line is scripted, word for word. It's from the Advanced Class. Later, in the same class, he gives advice that is contrary to that, telling us we must learn to become meek and follow the revelation coming from the "Man of God" without questioning and skepticism.

[excathedra]

sad to say i have become so jaded that at times i don't respect people who probably deserve it

and i'm sure i probably screwed my kid up

but i did try to teach him respect when it's due. i have more to say but i don't feel like it

it's so hard to tell and explain when you've been assaulted my those

[Keith]

Just so you know, Keith, that line is scripted, word for word. It's from the Advanced Class. Later, in the same class, he gives advice that is contrary to that, telling us we must learn to become meek and follow the revelation coming from the "Man of God" without questioning and skepticism.

I never took his advanced class so I wouldn't have known that. While I was in TWI I never really had any problems with local leadership.(72-77) If I had a problem with doctrine or something going on I always sent a letter to either VPW or when I very briefly came back in the 90's, to LCM; because that was where the problem was. Little did I know how big the problems were at the time. I understand one of those letters resulted in one of LCM's rants to the in residence corps. Sorry about that.

Edited May 10, 2013 by Keith

[chockfull]

That said I will say the best advice I ever got when it comes to the bible I got from VPW. Maybe it was a moment of honesty from him; I don't know. The only time I really met him he looked me directly in the eye and said. "Son, don't ever take anyone's word for what the word of God says." Then after a pause he added, "Not even mine." That was something I have always practiced. It got me in hot water in TWI, and it's gotten me in hot water with other groups as well.

If God didn't work in situations to help us even while we were caught up in a cult, then all of our lives would be nothing but a wasteland of lost time, money, and opportunity.

It's all hard to make sense of because it's incongruent. Here you have VPW with some sage advice. Later on that day, VPW very well could have been having sex with a young lady other than his wife on his motorcoach. Or plagiarizing someone's work.

Men are incongruent. God is not.

Edited May 10, 2013 by chockfull

[waysider]

Chock said:

Nothing but a wasteland of lost time, money, and opportunity.

This should appear on their letterhead, directly below the logo.

Edited May 10, 2013 by waysider

[PatAnswer]

I wouldn't attend any twig or religious service that worshiped anyone or anything except God and His Son.

That said I will say the best advice I ever got when it comes to the bible I got from VPW. Maybe it was a moment of honesty from him; I don't know. The only time I really met him he looked me directly in the eye and said. "Son, don't ever take anyone's word for what the word of God says." Then after a pause he added, "Not even mine." That was something I have always practiced. It got me in hot water in TWI, and it's gotten me in hot water with other groups as well.

Wierwille contradicted himself all the time.

Wierwille was a walking contradiction. That’s one of the reasons criticism didn’t stick to him. If someone said “he said this” then someone else could say “Well, he also said that”.

Wierwille told us we should stay with the group, no matter what. Let disagreements go.

Wierwille broke away from his group and started his own and was applauded for it.

Wierwille told us to believe and it would come to pass and that “wishing” was for losers.

Wierwille’s whole life is summed up in “I wish I were the man I knew to be”.

Wierwille told us not to have “private interpretation”, let the word interpret itself.

Wierwille consistently offered up his own opinion of the word and it became gospel.

Wierwille told us not to ask God for signs because God didn’t work that way and devil spirits would be more than happy to give us one.

Wierwille bragged how he asked God to show him white hearts, black hearts, horserace winners, etc. One of the greatest incidents he would use to show his relationship with God was a requested snow storm.

And the list goes on.

Why I didn’t see it sooner baffles me.

Don't give me this "all men are liars" and "all men are incongruous" crap. Most people who purport to stand for and represent God and least try to live by His standard.

As Excie would say, Pffffft.

[excathedra]

Wierwille told us to believe and it would come to pass and that “wishing” was for losers. Wierwille’s whole life is summed up in “I wish I were the man I knew to be”.

that was a dandy :)/>

i liked your whole post also

and of course that you quoted me ppppffffffftttttttt

Edited May 10, 2013 by excathedra

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

No, only Yahweh and Christ Jesus

[Ham]

Maybe we need a real visitation from the deity. It has apparently happened once. Or Twice. Maybe more times..

He holds the Majority of Creation. God bless Him.. he is God.

A pale, white faced, embarrassed fruitcake .. need not apply.

[WordWolf]

Wierwille contradicted himself all the time.

Wierwille was a walking contradiction. That’s one of the reasons criticism didn’t stick to him. If someone said “he said this” then someone else could say “Well, he also said that”.

Wierwille told us we should stay with the group, no matter what. Let disagreements go.

Wierwille broke away from his group and started his own and was applauded for it.

Wierwille told us to believe and it would come to pass and that “wishing” was for losers.

Wierwille’s whole life is summed up in “I wish I were the man I knew to be”.

Wierwille told us not to have “private interpretation”, let the word interpret itself.

Wierwille consistently offered up his own opinion of the word and it became gospel.

Wierwille told us not to ask God for signs because God didn’t work that way and devil spirits would be more than happy to give us one.

Wierwille bragged how he asked God to show him white hearts, black hearts, horserace winners, etc. One of the greatest incidents he would use to show his relationship with God was a requested snow storm.

And the list goes on.

Why I didn’t see it sooner baffles me.

Don't give me this "all men are liars" and "all men are incongruous" crap. Most people who purport to stand for and represent God and least try to live by His standard.

As Excie would say, Pffffft.

This bore repeating. All of it.