Attracted to "nuttiness"

[waysider]

Why do ex-Way people seem to be so receptive to whatever conspiracy theory and bad science happens to be in vogue? Politics, medicine, scientific discoveries, medical news, health news, legislation....you name it. Was there something in our indoctrination that preconditioned us to ignore logic and jump on the latest bandwagon? O.K.....I'm not interested in debating any one particular issue, just curious about the basic concept in general.

[Ham]

Maybe it is genetic.. I think the real trick to pull it off is leave a carefully laid out trail of crumbs, so to speak.. and let the marks come up with the supposed correct conclusion.

It works generally well when dishonest statisticians use (greatly) truncated charts and carefully arranged numbers. I could arrange the data to the extent that one could come to the conclusion that funeral services cause car accidents.

Or that lung disease causes pollution.

[waysider]

So, what was it? Was it the idea that the World has been hiding some great secret from you? (Session #1), Knowing that you "know that you know", battle of the senses (Session #6), Renewed Mind (session #8), Having done all, STAND! (against critical thinking), or maybe it was the Advanced Class, where we were introduced to all the "behind the scenes" workings of life's processes ....or what?

[waysider]

I've heard we don't reach our mental maturity until we're about 25. (citation welcomed) If so, most of us were at a critical stage of mental development when we "got in the word". I was 21. Maybe that plays into it somehow.

Edited February 2, 2013 by waysider

[JavaJane]

I think it plays to the ego - it makes you special because you have information no one else does. Most people have been duped, but we have the truth as it hasn't been known since the first century...

And the irony is that they have been duped. Probably worse than most.

Also, it makes one feel there is order to things. That nothing just happens. This gives a better feeling of control... When in reality $#it just happens for no reason other than it happens. (Example - the law of believing let's you think that when something bad happens to someone it is because their believing isn't right, so as long as I keep my believing right the bad thing won't happen.)

[Human without the bean]

Might be cuz we didn't eat our spinach and we couldn't

see the boat about ready to sink.

[frank123lol]

pretty simple really,woodstock generation meets huckster,with I got the answers,great rehab,of course girls,pretty girls,and you could kissem.

[waysider]

pretty simple really,woodstock generation meets huckster,with I got the answers,great rehab,of course girls,pretty girls,and you could kissem.

That makes a lot of sense, Frank. But, what about now? Why, after all these years, are Ex-Wayfers so drawn to this kind of stuff?

[frank123lol]

They say a salesman is the easiest to sell to,exwayers sold a product.Me I am leary of everything.

[Human without the bean]

pretty simple really,woodstock generation meets huckster,with I got the answers,great rehab,of course girls,pretty girls,and you could kissem.

Thanks Frank. That just brought a gleam to my eye.

If only we didn't drink of the forbidden wine,,,,,,

Edited February 3, 2013 by Human without the bean

[Ham]

Its still in your head. just have to figure out how to release it..

Edited February 3, 2013 by Ham

[Twinky]

Why do ex-Way people seem to be so receptive to whatever conspiracy theory and bad science happens to be in vogue? Politics, medicine, scientific discoveries, medical news, health news, legislation....you name it. Was there something in our indoctrination that preconditioned us to ignore logic and jump on the latest bandwagon? O.K.....I'm not interested in debating any one particular issue, just curious about the basic concept in general.

Only some ex-Way people, surely. Probably the majority have gone on to live relatively normal lives (whatever "normal" might be).

In fact, you might even say that many ex Wayfers are more sceptical than the general populace regarding conspiracy theories and the latest snake-oil fad.

[WordWolf]

I think it plays to the ego - it makes you special because you have information no one else does. Most people have been duped, but we have the truth as it hasn't been known since the first century...

And the irony is that they have been duped. Probably worse than most.

Also, it makes one feel there is order to things. That nothing just happens. This gives a better feeling of control... When in reality $#it just happens for no reason other than it happens. (Example - the law of believing let's you think that when something bad happens to someone it is because their believing isn't right, so as long as I keep my believing right the bad thing won't happen.)

I do agree that SOME ex-twiers are a lot warier. "Once bitten, twice shy."

So, they always look for the hook at the other side of the bait.

As for those still gullible, I think this is the answer.

Something is "secret" or "hidden"? They have to have it.

And they lack the wit to tell it's NONSENSE, but well-written nonsense.

But it's SECRET nonsense, so they HAVE to think it's true and grab it.

[waysider]

As for those still gullible, I think this is the answer.

Something is "secret" or "hidden"? They have to have it.

And they lack the wit to tell it's NONSENSE, but well-written nonsense.

But it's SECRET nonsense, so they HAVE to think it's true and grab it.

Maybe, along with that, there is a sense of empowerment in "sharing" that information with the less informed masses.

Wasn't that the driving force behind witnessing PFAL class recruitment?

Edited February 3, 2013 by waysider

[WordWolf]

Maybe, along with that, there is a sense of empowerment in "sharing" that information with the less informed masses.

Wasn't that the driving force behind witnessing PFAL class recruitment?

Often, it was.

Outside of twi, there's a number of organizations with "secrets" that are worthless or

meaningless. However, since they label it with enough bells and whistles, members think

something special is being hidden. Thus, there's a lot of variations on the title

"guardian of the mysteries." That's pretty much part of the human condition, and

describes organizations that are current as well as historic.

People seem to want to feel like they're "insiders" to some special secret.

[waysider]

People seem to want to feel like they're "insiders" to some special secret.

Yeah. Session #1 of PLAF (The Wonder Class). "The Greatest Secret In The World Today".... and you can be privy to it for a mere $65.00.

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

and here I thought the greatest secret in the world today really was what is inside a woman's pocketbook btw, when saying nuttiness, remember Ham is a squirrel and proably is hungry, lol

[johniam]

I think it's just credibility. Look how much everybody mindlessly believes everything that has "education" or "science" attached to it in the world. I can't help but notice how much posters here attack VPs credibility down to the minutest detail.

One thing that really connected with a lot of people was the pfal session where VP got up from his desk and walked back and forth all slumped over while illustrating how the average Christian ambassador looks (all burdened down with sin not having any fun). He didn't do too much theatre like that in the film class. I bet he developed that over the 15 or so years he taught pfal live before filming it.

Again, credibility. VP sold the 'us versus them' aspect of his ministry very well. The ambassador analogy was part of that. It truly is ironic that during the LCM beast years (1994-2000) it was twi people who were constantly worried and burdened down with sin not having much fun. That is, when they weren't basking in the glow of their own sparks over being in the true household or whatever.

[waysider]

Look how much everybody mindlessly believes everything that has "education" or "science" attached to it in the world.

Time after time you have expressed disdain for higher learning and the scientific processes. Care to expound on why?

I can't help but notice how much posters here attack VPs credibility down to the minutest detail.

He invited scrutiny when he deliberately misrepresented himself.

Edited February 5, 2013 by waysider

[johniam]

quote...

Look how much everybody mindlessly believes everything that has "education" or "science" attached to it in the world.

Time after time you have expressed disdain for higher learning and the scientific processes. Care to expound on why?

I can't help but notice how much posters here attack VPs credibility down to the minutest detail.

He invited scrutiny when he deliberately misrepresented himself.

Not ALL education and science is bogus, but they are 2 consistent sources of the wisdom of this world. God has given all mankind permission to disdain the wisdom of this world.

VP sometimes misrepresented himself, but did he misrepresent God? If he did, then why is the emphasis always on VP?

You asked why ex wayfers seemed so gullible. You've gotten a nice spectrum of answers already. This is merely one more to add to the mix. Believe it if you need it; if you don't just pass it on.

[waysider]

Thank you for your reply, John. I must say, I find it rather..... interesting.

You said:

"God has given all mankind permission to disdain the wisdom of this world."

Really? Where did you find this?

You also said:

"VP sometimes misrepresented himself, but did he misrepresent God?"

I would have to say the answer to this is a resounding YES.

Incidently, I didn't ask why ex-Wayfers seem so gullible.

As Paul Simon said, "A man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.".

[Twinky]

C'm'on, Johniam. "Disdain the wisdom of the world"? Wisdom of the world might include instruction to look both ways before crossing a busy road. Wanna disdain that on a fast road?

What about - say - doctors? Is their wisdom simply "of the world"? Have they not observed, learned, some things about our wonderful God-designed bodies, and have the wisdom to know that (say) eating some things is good, eating other things is bad? That smoking causes a lot of problems and it's wiser not to smoke? That it's good to take a little exercise - for its many benefits on human bodies? Maybe they learned that simply by observation and empirical reflections. Maybe God taught it to them. Does that then change it from "worldly wisdom" to "Godly wisdom"? How do you tell the two apart, when someone tells you to look both ways before crossing a busy road?

What about - oh, so many things...John, use your God-given brain!!!!!!!!!

Maybe God gave us brains to figure a few things out for ourselves?

Maybe God taught a few things to doctors, teachers, parents, police officers, road sweepers, shopkeepers and other people in the area where you live, so that they can teach others?

One thing VPW taught us (cough) was that "They'll read you before they read the book."

If you read his lifestyle and expect that that represents the book - shoot, you really have been reading the wrong book.

You don't read, in glowing terms, that abuse of other people is Godly - rather the opposite. You don't read that God enslaves, takes captive; oppresses so much that mental illness results and hearts are broken, lives lost. You read quite the opposite.

And you see, in the life of Jesus, that he came to heal the broken hearted and to set captives free. Not exactly what VPW did - which would you rather believe? Which example is better to follow? Whose lifestyle better represents God? Whose lifestyle misrepresents God?

And that's before we even think about any specific other things that VPW said, that misrepresented God.

[johniam]

Aah. I'm back in business. I make a benign post on a benign thread and it's the news story of the year (lol).

[johniam]

1 Cor. 1:20 - Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

Sounds disdainful to me. Looking both ways before crossing a road is not the "wisdom of this world". It's horse sense. Any special ed person can do that. Any animal can do that. Jeez...

[OldSkool]

Aah. I'm back in business. I make a benign post on a benign thread and it's the news story of the year (lol).

To excuse Wierwille's lifestyle and actions for his "good words and fair speeches" is allowing yourself to stay deceived. It's up to you. So either VP was the next best thing to Jesus Christ on earth, except all these many people got together to lie about him, or he really was a lying, plagiarist who used the ministry to seduce young ladies onto his motor coach. And of course taught Craig how to do the same thing. I could continue.

Those who claim to represent God are to live at a very high standard. Wierwille did not do this. He was a greedy, drunken, hypocrite who served his own lusts at the expense of others and left a lot of shattered lives in his wake. He will answer for that one day.