I wonder if these guys ever were around TWI because they sure hit the nail on the head about a lot of things.
Not that TWI is the only organization this stuff happens in.
But stuff like "cleanse the household" and "spiritual suspicion" sure ring a bell. And finding devil spirits in people and kicking them out, the people that is, instead of the spirits.
And the list of questions to ask yourself? Yes to ALL of them!
Reminds me of being at a booth at the state fair where everyone in the branch HAD to spend time there to promote TWI and JC is not God etc.
Some one from Jehovah's Witnesses came by and we were talking about how both our groups understood JC was not God, but the Jehovah guy commented "But we don't exert as much control over our members as you."
The guy I was at the booth with got all defensive and started claiming that TWI wasn't at ALL controlling, etc. I'm standing there with him thinking, "They made us be here at this booth, didn't they?"
Yep they were! Belle this is written by Jeff Rath and distributed by Christian Family Fellowship. He also has a follow-up called Recovery from Spiritual Abuse. I think you can still get them free by contacting CFF. Or I think I still have some also here.
Thanks WhiteDove! I do remember reading a lot of Jeff Rath's stuff. He's very good and very easy to read and understand.
I'm posting the stuff here because I know of a few people who are lurking here who need to read this stuff. They can't order things or take things home with them because of their situations and I understand having been in that same situation. Posting it here, they have access to it and can print it out and burn it once they read it, or just read it at their leisure when they do get to come to GSpot.
If you have additional posts or information that would be helpful, please do post what you can. Since it had already been posted before, Jeff wouldn't mind, would he?
Understood I was just saying for anyone that could and wanted one I think they are still around. If not I will get them one. I don't think Jeff would mind you posting at all.
Here is a link to his homepage you can read it online under teachings.
WhiteDove, thank you. I did not understand at first. Jeff's site is very good; I got stuck on there for a little while yesterday and will have to go back. :)-->
It really stinks having to hide things from your family and not being able to read whatever you want to, especially things about spiritual abuse. When I took the book home, my ex took it from me and begged me to wait 30 days and then I could have the book back if I felt like it at that time. By the time the 30 days rolled around he had forgotten what he did with it. I went and bought another one, but hid that one from him.
The fact that someone can't share everything with the one person they should be able to, is very disturbing and difficult to handle. That alone should have been a deciding factor for me, but I'm a little slow and a little too optomistic at times. It only took me five more years to see it. I hope it doesn't take others that long; life really is too short.
I'm posting the stuff here because I know of a few people who are lurking here who need to read this stuff. They can't order things or take things home with them because of their situations....
Belle......good thread and its good to bring this topic to the forefront again.
From my own experience, I know that it took me a few years to acknowledge and confront twi legalism and hypocrisy that was staring me in the face! Little by little, the evidence kept mounting and became irrefutable.
TIMING is everything! Exit twi on your own terms and at your choosing!!!
Thanks! It's helped ME a lot reading over these things again.
quote:
2 Corinthians 11:12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.
11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
Whether the abuser is a truly evil false prophet or a good man making bad mistakes. You must cut off the influence of the abuser.
Regardless of what people think of vee pee and the "value" of what he contributed Bible-wise to their lives, he was evil. Some think he was a truly evil false prophet, but others think he was a good man making bad mistakes. Regardless, he was a bad man and so are his henchmen who still run his company and they should be cut off!
I too was raised Lutheran, my Mother being from Germany (she met and worked for Hitler though)
Our Private Lutheran School (1-8), we had a few teachers that 'others' in the Church regarded a bit too liberal in their methods.
Eighth Grade, we had mandatory DEBATES. Topics were all over the place, including RELIGION. Many kids were not from church going families... The debates for some were highly IRREVEREND. Parents would call and complain.
The teachers thought children needed to learn to think for themselves. If something is TRUE, there will be clear documentation to back it up. To stand up for something will sometimes require work, research, and being able to vocalize your opinion.
Looking back, those teachers were right on. They understood that blindly following is dangerous.
Glad to see you here. Thanks for sharing. Hopefully your actions will inspire some lurkers to stop, think and become FREE.
SV...
Thank you.
My actions occurred 10 years ago this past March.
For some lurkers, it will be difficult because they have family and some have put their whole lives in the ministry.
The main thing and it is the best example of Spiritual Abuse that keeps a lot of people "in" is FEAR. That ministry implanted that FEAR of "Terrible things will happen to anyone who leaves TWI."
10 years ago, I reached a point that I didn't give a fly if something terrible will happen to me when I leave. So I left.
So far we have had nothing but good things happen since we left!! The release of pressure was amazing! And yes it was scary to take the final plunge and actually say "See Ya!!" I am so glad I did it. I am almost a completely different person --and it has been less than a year since I left. Our Heavenly Father is so much bigger than twi made Him out to be and He is definitely not confined to only being concerned about twi's "faithful"
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Steve!
This should be a must read for anyone still "in".
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outandabout
I wonder if these guys ever were around TWI because they sure hit the nail on the head about a lot of things.
Not that TWI is the only organization this stuff happens in.
But stuff like "cleanse the household" and "spiritual suspicion" sure ring a bell. And finding devil spirits in people and kicking them out, the people that is, instead of the spirits.
And the list of questions to ask yourself? Yes to ALL of them!
Reminds me of being at a booth at the state fair where everyone in the branch HAD to spend time there to promote TWI and JC is not God etc.
Some one from Jehovah's Witnesses came by and we were talking about how both our groups understood JC was not God, but the Jehovah guy commented "But we don't exert as much control over our members as you."
The guy I was at the booth with got all defensive and started claiming that TWI wasn't at ALL controlling, etc. I'm standing there with him thinking, "They made us be here at this booth, didn't they?"
I have that book around here somewhere....
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WhiteDove
Yep they were! Belle this is written by Jeff Rath and distributed by Christian Family Fellowship. He also has a follow-up called Recovery from Spiritual Abuse. I think you can still get them free by contacting CFF. Or I think I still have some also here.
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Belle
Thanks WhiteDove! I do remember reading a lot of Jeff Rath's stuff. He's very good and very easy to read and understand.
I'm posting the stuff here because I know of a few people who are lurking here who need to read this stuff. They can't order things or take things home with them because of their situations and I understand having been in that same situation. Posting it here, they have access to it and can print it out and burn it once they read it, or just read it at their leisure when they do get to come to GSpot.
If you have additional posts or information that would be helpful, please do post what you can. Since it had already been posted before, Jeff wouldn't mind, would he?
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WhiteDove
Understood I was just saying for anyone that could and wanted one I think they are still around. If not I will get them one. I don't think Jeff would mind you posting at all.
Here is a link to his homepage you can read it online under teachings.
http://home.flash.net/~jwr2/
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Belle
WhiteDove, thank you. I did not understand at first. Jeff's site is very good; I got stuck on there for a little while yesterday and will have to go back. :)-->
It really stinks having to hide things from your family and not being able to read whatever you want to, especially things about spiritual abuse. When I took the book home, my ex took it from me and begged me to wait 30 days and then I could have the book back if I felt like it at that time. By the time the 30 days rolled around he had forgotten what he did with it. I went and bought another one, but hid that one from him.
The fact that someone can't share everything with the one person they should be able to, is very disturbing and difficult to handle. That alone should have been a deciding factor for me, but I'm a little slow and a little too optomistic at times. It only took me five more years to see it. I hope it doesn't take others that long; life really is too short.
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skyrider
Belle......good thread and its good to bring this topic to the forefront again.
From my own experience, I know that it took me a few years to acknowledge and confront twi legalism and hypocrisy that was staring me in the face! Little by little, the evidence kept mounting and became irrefutable.
TIMING is everything! Exit twi on your own terms and at your choosing!!!
:D--> :D-->
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GeorgeStGeorge
Very enjoyable reading. Thanks, Belle!
George
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Belle
Thanks! It's helped ME a lot reading over these things again.
Regardless of what people think of vee pee and the "value" of what he contributed Bible-wise to their lives, he was evil. Some think he was a truly evil false prophet, but others think he was a good man making bad mistakes. Regardless, he was a bad man and so are his henchmen who still run his company and they should be cut off!
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Bob
Castration? :D-->:D-->:D-->
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Belle
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Belle
And another one bites the dust.....
For my lurking new buddy newly free from the bondage of kool-aid!
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SafariVista
Thanks Belle for bringing this up again.
I too was raised Lutheran, my Mother being from Germany (she met and worked for Hitler though)
Our Private Lutheran School (1-8), we had a few teachers that 'others' in the Church regarded a bit too liberal in their methods.
Eighth Grade, we had mandatory DEBATES. Topics were all over the place, including RELIGION. Many kids were not from church going families... The debates for some were highly IRREVEREND. Parents would call and complain.
The teachers thought children needed to learn to think for themselves. If something is TRUE, there will be clear documentation to back it up. To stand up for something will sometimes require work, research, and being able to vocalize your opinion.
Looking back, those teachers were right on. They understood that blindly following is dangerous.
TWI should try this DEBATE method
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FreeFromCults
TWI won't do it because they don't allow independent thinking. They keep on spouting "be of one mind" or "be like-minded" (how I hate these terms).
It is either accept their doctrines without question or take a hike and be shunned.
To me, I decided enough is enough that I took a hike, not caring if I lost contact or if I become a "greasespot by midnight"
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SafariVista
((((((((FreeFromCults))))))))
Glad to see you here. Thanks for sharing. Hopefully your actions will inspire some lurkers to stop, think and become FREE.
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FreeFromCults
SV...
Thank you.
My actions occurred 10 years ago this past March.
For some lurkers, it will be difficult because they have family and some have put their whole lives in the ministry.
The main thing and it is the best example of Spiritual Abuse that keeps a lot of people "in" is FEAR. That ministry implanted that FEAR of "Terrible things will happen to anyone who leaves TWI."
10 years ago, I reached a point that I didn't give a fly if something terrible will happen to me when I leave. So I left.
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penguin
So far we have had nothing but good things happen since we left!! The release of pressure was amazing! And yes it was scary to take the final plunge and actually say "See Ya!!" I am so glad I did it. I am almost a completely different person --and it has been less than a year since I left. Our Heavenly Father is so much bigger than twi made Him out to be and He is definitely not confined to only being concerned about twi's "faithful"
Welcome to true freedom!
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Twinky
Thought it might be useful to bump up this old thread, for the benefit of people who have found the Cafe in the past few years.
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cman
Funny, I see this kind of abuse in the business world, at my work as well.
Intimidation tactics, and to cause division for personal benefit, or grudges, and not professional.
Thanks for bringing this up Twinky.
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