"Abundant Life" is wayspeak for twi exploitation

[skyrider]

Wierwille presented John 10:10 as his centerpiece for twi involvement. This verse was his launching pad.

And, the first point of recognition......the thief will steal, kill and destroy. But hey, if you

want an alternative, there is a way to get to the "abundant life."

In pfal, wierwille pointedly declares.....when he looked around and SAW that non-christians were living a

more abundant life than the christians. Yes, wierwille saw this. What did he SEE? He never did say, but

spoke in vague generalities that "christians were not living the more abundant life."

This illusive bait, with a hook in it, was.......the more abundant life that Jesus proclaimed.

Session after session, the student sits in this pfal class as wierwille adds dozens of items to this shopping cart

that one must do to HAVE this "more abundant life." Not surprisingly, one needs to study....rightly divide....no

private interpretation....in the verse....in context....used before....punctuation....italics....dispensations....

etc. etc. to be a good workman of the word and stand approved before God. Good thing wierwille was "The Teacher."

By Session 9, the pfal student is introduced to the holy spirit field and these manifestations in abundant living,

i.e. walking by the spirit or spiritual abundance. At this point, all the prerequisites of walking spiritually are

outlined and elaborated by wierwille. Note: more classes to follow....specifically, intermediate & advanced class.

But hey......can I ask a question? No, not just that one....but a few more?

You know, like in the Book of Acts, when the Apostle Paul was in prison and the Lord shook the prison walls via an

earthquake and the jailer believed and released Paul.....things like that. Could you, Dr. Wierwille, specifically

elaborate on a number of unique, miraculous incidents where the power of God was demonstrated? And, in pfal......

why are your weak, anemic and paltry examples so vague, so inconsequential?

So......nearly eleven years in wierwille's ministry before his death AND I NEVER SAW HIM DEMONSTRATE GOD'S POWER.

No signs, no miracles, no revelations, no healings..............EQUALS NO ABUNDANCE according to "his class"

definition. IMO.....he didn't do what he claimed that he built his ministry on. And, I've always held to the

fact that "if" wierwille would have performed some great public display of God's power.....it would have been

proclaimed and shouted from the rooftops and talked about for decades!!

Wierwille sold a product that he never believed in.

<_<

[Steve Lortz]

yep

Love,

Steve

[OldSkool]

So......nearly eleven years in wierwille's ministry before his death AND I NEVER SAW HIM DEMONSTRATE GOD'S POWER.

No signs, no miracles, no revelations, no healings..............EQUALS NO ABUNDANCE according to "his class"

definition. IMO.....he didn't do what he claimed that he built his ministry on. And, I've always held to the

fact that "if" wierwille would have performed some great public display of God's power.....it would have been

proclaimed and shouted from the rooftops and talked about for decades!!

Wierwille sold a product that he never believed in.

<_<

When is was at HQ, as recently as 2008, there were still rumors about the good ole' days. The days when signs, miracles, and wonders were everywhere. The days when Wierwille walked among his sheep. Wierwille was renowned, as well as Uncle Harry, for many healings. None of them were verifiable, but renowned none the less. Then there were the myriad excuses for why all of that supposedly ceased. Personally, I tried for over two years to use what was taught and NEVER got any of the results promised. No matter how excited I got, how much I believed, how much I tried, it all fell flat.

[waysider]

As I mentioned on another thread recently, when there was a large "healing event" at ROA (1973?), Wierwille did not participate. Instead, he stood on stage, behind the podium, and jabbered away into the microphone. Even though I was supposed to participate in that service ("ALL advanced class grads report to the front of the stage, immediately."), I sat it out and observed from the audience. All I witnessed was the usual "ministering" mumbo-jumbo that had become so common but, on a much larger scale. I did not see anything producing miracles, wonders, healings or any such thing...and I was in a much better position to observe than the participants.

As for abundant life:

It was clearly promoted, at the outset of PFAL, as being material, even though the principle scripture being utilized (John 10:10) was used out of context. Later, when it became apparent there was error in the teaching, the default explanation was that it was really spiritual. If you didn't understand that, it was your own fault for not believing, not renewing your mind, not speaking in tongues enough, not taking all the available classes, not stringing the chairs precisely enough, not using the correct ratio of yesterday's coffee to stretch the current batch, etc, and so on and so forth.

[OldSkool]

not using the correct ratio of yesterday's coffee to stretch the current batch

Ewwww. Yuck!

[chockfull]

In pfal, wierwille pointedly declares.....when he looked around and SAW that non-christians were living a

more abundant life than the christians. Yes, wierwille saw this. What did he SEE? He never did say, but

spoke in vague generalities that "christians were not living the more abundant life."

Apparently from looking at the fruit of VP's life what he considered the "abundant life" was 2 planes, a Coach, unlimited gifts from minions, motorcycles, a driver/butler/personal servant, unlimited flowing Drambuie,unlimited cigarettes, and multiple young sex partners.

Of course that is different from what he SAID.

[OldSkool]

Apparently from looking at the fruit of VP's life what he considered the "abundant life" was 2 planes, a Coach, unlimited gifts from minions, motorcycles, a driver/butler/personal servant, unlimited flowing Drambuie,unlimited cigarettes, and multiple young sex partners.

Of course that is different from what he SAID.

And for the average follower the abundant life was a WOW mobile and sub standard rentals shared at least two to a bedroom.

[waysider]

PFAL....pg. 3

........In contrast to these Christian people, I could see that the secular world of non-Christians were manifesting a more abundant life than were members of the Church.

....................................

So, then, remind me again why WE needed a class but they didn't. :wacko:

Edited August 24, 2012 by waysider

[skyrider]

PFAL....pg. 3

........In contrast to these Christian people, I could see that the secular world of non-Christians were manifesting a more abundant life than were members of the Church.

Gee.....could he be MORE vague?

Wierwille could see the secular world.......the WHOLE of America? or the WHOLE world?

How did he know if they were "non-Christians?"

What qualifies as manifesting a more abundant life?

Did he survey members of his church and other churches?

Unbelievable......that people still buy into this clap-trap.

.

Edited August 24, 2012 by skyrider

[Steve Lortz]

One time, while I was still pretty "new in the Word" I got a call from an acquaintance whose young teen daughter was in the hospital. The docs had just done exploratory surgery in the daughter's abdomen. It was full of scar tissue and infection. The docs closed her back up and started pumping her full of antibiotics. They told the mom that they would have to go back in and remove all the daughter's female plumbing once the infection had gone down. The mom wanted me to come pray with her daughter.

I asked the lady who was undershepherding me to come along. She was an advanced class grad, but she was neither Corps nor a$$hole. On the way to the hospital, she prayed for the girl to be coming to, and all the relatives to be leaving when we got there. That happened. We spent about 45 minutes or so in the hospital room with the mother and daughter, mostly just chatting and encouraging them. We all joined together for a brief prayer before leaving. The lady who was undershepherding me led the prayer, and everybody got a chance to participate. We didn't have "worship manifestations". It wasn't any big, showy thing, just a fairly prosaic prayer for the daughter's blessing and healing. And we left.

Three days later, when the docs opened her up again, they couldn't find anything wrong. Even the scar tissue was gone.

Both the mom and the daughter were grateful to God, but they didn't mistakenly think WE had been responsible for the healing, nor did we try to take the credit, which properly belonged to God. Neither of them ever took the class or even came to twig.

That's my one personal experience with obviously miraculous healing while involved with TWI. I heard several stories from other people whose accounts I trusted, though none of those stories involved leaders above the twig level, all of them promoted faith in God, but none of them promoted Way-specific doctrine. None of them made any widespread news and none of them resulted in massive numbers of people converting to Christianity, much less the Way.

I myself experienced a lot of synchronistic events, that is, seemingly meaningful coincidences, many of which were in response to my own prayers.

I took the advanced class a couple of years later, but looking back, it seems that a lot of my earlier spontaneity had dried up, replaced by the "16 keys to walking in the spirit" by that time. The advanced class was a disappointment, and I saw no sign of spiritual power in it. After leaving the Way in 1987, and doing some cursory research into the things we had been taught in the advanced class, I found out that some of the things that had impressed Wierwille most in his "quest" for a knowledge of spiritual matters had been frauds. Either Wierwille had been suckered in himself by the hoaxes, or he was just perpetrating them again on us.

I saw NO spiritual power in my Corps training. That was 100% trying to perfect the flesh by means of the flesh. I never saw any spiritual power at a root location.

I had a lot of fun on L.E.A.D., while in the mountains, not while hitch-hiking back and forth. But then again, I had been solo-backpacking for about a decade. Does it count as a miracle that I didn't have to cut my own toes off due to frost-bite? Now THERE'S the Abundant Life for you!

Love,

Steve

Edited August 24, 2012 by Steve Lortz

[OldSkool]

Three days later, when the docs opened her up again, they couldn't find anything wrong. Even the scar tissue was gone.

And praise and glory to God for her healing!

[chockfull]

Amazing story Steve. Funny, looking back the healings and miracles I've participated in have had not a thing to do with TWI and had everything to do with God, another person, and a need. Not one signed up for the class.

[skyrider]

From where I sit today.......in pfal, wierwille did the "sleight-of-hand" trick and STUDYING SCRIPTURE

become the summit climb of twi's more abundant life. The more one embraced twi doctrine.....er, "The Word"

--- the higher rung on the ladder he climbed AND more spiritual he was touted.

Made in the image of wierwille, the "researchers and teachers" were highly prized.....as long as he/she

stayed tethered to twi doctrine. The scriptural "members in particular".....builders, craftsmen, cooks,

pilots, etc.....was no where to be found in twi's caste system.

The staffers had/have their station in twi's "abundant life".....and rarily see upward mobility. It speaks

volumes to the exploitation.

Heck, when vice presidents and cabinet members are shuffled out the back door by the chagrin and whim of the

matriarch, rosalie's, decisions.....it reeks of rottenness.

[waysider]

Maybe there was a misprint and it was really supposed to be called Power For Aberrant Living.

[OldSkool]

Heck, when vice presidents and cabinet members are shuffled out the back door by the chagrin and whim of the

matriarch, rosalie's, decisions.....it reeks of rottenness.

There are no job descriptions for cabinet positions, unless they invented them since I left. Doing a good job was totally arbitrary to being in Rosalie's good graces. It was explained to me when I brought this up that it was that way by design.

[chockfull]

There are no job descriptions for cabinet positions, unless they invented them since I left. Doing a good job was totally arbitrary to being in Rosalie's good graces. It was explained to me when I brought this up that it was that way by design.

My only response to this is for us all to sing to Rosalie a resounding chorus of "if you're ugly and you know it hit your face" (from another thread).

Edited August 25, 2012 by chockfull

[outandabout]

Steve's post above got me thinking - it seems as though the signs & miracles & answered prayers were more in spite of TWI rather than because of it. It was believers' purity of heart and their genuine love of God's Word that brought about those things.

Then it all got shot to sh1t.

[excathedra]

i agree with steve and outie and others

god was (and of course is) so wonderful that many miracles did happen in spite of wierwille

oh, i just think about my own college days, north carolina, kansas, many others -- i see how god was so right there, but wierwille wasn't

i also saw people healed/delivered/whatever, but it wasn't because they were pfal grads or at a mandatory healing session where advanced class grads had to step forward, you know?