Leading people through that sort of thing is a little different from sitting at the head table and admonishing the Way Corps that "a general's suggestion is paramount [sic] to a command."
That was "tantamount" not "paramount," Steve.
I heard "paramount" a number of times from the head table at Emporia. That's why I put the [sic] into the quote. It really seemed stupid to hear that coming from a Corps Coordinator.
I heard "paramount" a number of times from the head table at Emporia. That's why I put the [sic] into the quote. It really seemed stupid to hear that coming from a Corps Coordinator.
And these people thought they could teach us "Greek" etc.
They don't understand English. And their errors in understanding the English language (in particular verb construction and tenses) pass all the way down until PFAL grads somehow reinvent themselves as knowing grammar, sentence construction etc...because they heard something in PFAL or copied it from some other person up the Way food chain.
Blind leading the blind...and so they all fall into misunderstandings and total ignorance...whilst all the time thinking themselves wise.
I don't think there was ever a lack of leadership. It's leadership in an appropriate direction that is lacking.
One of the hardest things to face when thinking about leaving is realizing that you have been duped, that you are living in a delusion. In short, that you have been had.
I wonder how many people still in are only in because they can't overcome the ego involved in wanting to be right?
Yeah.....the realization of having been duped is a biggie.
Then, the next full-frontal realization is.......IF I LEAVE TWI WHAT THEN?
1) All social networks and "friends" in twi.....gone, poof.
2) All those years of wasted energy, loss of opportunity and education......uuuugh.
3) How utterly embarrassing to tell my parents and past friends that twi is a cult.
4) Gee, do I go find a wierwille splinter group or is everything wierwille taught a sham?
5) Maybe, just find a church.....or take a break for awhile.
6) Job? Career? Back to college? Move away? What now?
I wonder how many people simply stay in because they don't want to deal with the tsunami of decisions?
Could it be that staying in a deceptive snare is EASIER than all the effort to climb up and out to freedom?
Yeah.....the realization of having been duped is a biggie.
Then, the next full-frontal realization is.......IF I LEAVE TWI WHAT THEN?
1) All social networks and "friends" in twi.....gone, poof.
2) All those years of wasted energy, loss of opportunity and education......uuuugh.
3) How utterly embarrassing to tell my parents and past friends that twi is a cult.
4) Gee, do I go find a wierwille splinter group or is everything wierwille taught a sham?
5) Maybe, just find a church.....or take a break for awhile.
6) Job? Career? Back to college? Move away? What now?
I wonder how many people simply stay in because they don't want to deal with the tsunami of decisions?
Could it be that staying in a deceptive snare is EASIER than all the effort to climb up and out to freedom?
Well said. I still shake my head in near-disbelief at all of these things. That I really lived through that, for 23 years. And outandabout is right, the longer you stay in, the harder it is to leave...for all of the above reasons.
And I was among their so-called leadership once, too. I didn't know jack about leading, but I wanted to learn more. I went into the Way Corpse because I wanted to learn what the advanced class promised but never fulfilled: to learn how to operate the other 6 manifestations--the revelation and impartation ones. Hoping to learn these in the advanced class, I left disappointed but without the courage to say so for fear of speaking up against the tides of popular belief. So when the emotional urge to go into the Way Corps hit (it was not a calling...it was an emotional, impulse decision made at the Rock of Ages), I thought then I'd certainly learn how to operate these manifestations to serve in the "household." Well the Corps doesn't teach the manifestations either, but does twist truth, part truth, and popularly believed sayings to control people. To make them feel like they're the best of the best of the best. Or to make them feel like they're dung if they're not doing "right" (per their definition).
Their so-called leadership can be summed up in the one phrase they use to control their leadership: The best leader is the best follower.
Wrong again, TWI! Craziest thing I've ever heard. Again, just a popularly believed saying that they use to control people (and one that doesn't even make sense; kinda like Rico's famous "You don't think! You only think you think!" WTF???).
Run while you can, people. And even if you think it's too late, run anyway!
I also had had wonderful management prior to twi and assumed better and better would be the twi corps experience (rather than corpse experience received).
For the most recent 11 years, I had the privilege of having an exceptionally awesome management team, for which I will be ever grateful. As OldSkool and others show, good management works.
Because I have had godly management I know first hand what a blessing that is. I am a "support staff" person with a long suit in loyalty and faithfulness. It's so nice to have godly people to work for.
To every good (i.e., godly) manager: Thank you so very much for how you help your people become better people by your work.
You do everything you're supposed to do...home studies, all the classes, canvass for free class locations, string chairs, make the coffee, run twigs, ABS and whatever else.
Then, you sit there in the BRC, with 250 other people and sink into a deep state of depression as you realize that (seemingly) you're the only one not "getting it".
You do everything you're supposed to do...home studies, all the classes, canvass for free class locations, string chairs, make the coffee, run twigs, ABS and whatever else.
Then, you sit there in the BRC, with 250 other people and sink into a deep state of depression as you realize that (seemingly) you're the only one not "getting it".
I came out of the advanced class thoroughly confused. Of course I bought the line that going way disciple would let me put all that knowledge into action. BS to that. It took me studying the material while in-residence to understand that the problem was with the material itself. It's disjointed to say the least. The class jumps all over the place. Not to mention vast portions of it are inaccurate.
I had an Uncle, my Mother's brother, that was in the Infantry "anti-tank" corp that serverd under Patton's command.
I remember my uncle saying Patton was tough as nails and a "very outspoken" commander. many times they would come into a town in Europe and see some of Pattons tanks waiting for fuel and supplies.
With Veterans day comming, i remember my Uncle going through WW2 from him and family telling of him landing on Omaha beach head through the Battle of the Bulge and then home without getting hurt, except from what my mother said about my Uncle getting a few scratches from raiding a frenchmans wine cellar. :P
As far as Way leaders when i was "in", 1974, were fair at the local level but...............on the higher lvl could be very deciving. (nothing new to people who worked with the ones at the top).
Remember our american Veterans this VEteran's day 2012 by saying thanks to those who have served and are still serving.
Outside boot camp, the military doesn't even yell that much --- so I have been told.
OS, some people in the military yell, and have temper tantrums. I've seen that. And then, there are people who ask their personal to do things without screaming at them. I hate being screamed at. If you need me to do something, just ask me to do it. I am an adult, and want to be treated like one.
We were forced to watch Patton in-residence. I wonder if anyone around there ever stopped to think that the damn3d movie is a Hollywood portrayal and not something meant to be emulated by Churches and such.
OS, It's one thing to play soldier, but it is another thing altogether, to be one. I think VPW liked watching Soldiers at play, but he was to scared to have been a real one. Several of the men in my family are combat veterans, and they knew/know the realities of war. I am also a Veteran, but I never served in combat. VPW had many opportunities during WWII, to serve in the military; he choose not too. I know by 1941, he was married, and had a son. But many married men with kids served in WW11. I know he claimed that he didn't want to fight against Germany, so he choose not to serve. Perhaps that is true; I don't know. But, I wonder if he was afraid of being killed, or captured. I know I would have been; and I am a woman. I think in his heart, he was a coward.
In my experience TWI's leadership embodies the worst of human nature. Politics, religion, and the business world, if you take all of the worst-cased scenarios with ego, power-mongering, throwing people under busses, taking credit for others work, extreme micromanagement, slander, libel, and self-aggrandizement, you will find all of that and more in TWI. And it got worse for me the longer I was in. I kept finding myself wondering why it was that I was treated much better in the secular business realm than I was by TWI leaders. Just one scenario I could understand as you could have a good job and a bad TWI leader. However, to see that time after time and leader after leader to me showed a pattern. Even the bad jobs I had with the worst managers were still much better than what I faced in TWI. The people that were being promoted up, given more responsibility and titles were worse and worse as time went on. Those that were the most two-faced excelled the most. One face of absolute compliance and @$$ kissing, and the other face of abusing those under them. Sheer hypocrisy. It reminded me of Jesus parable of the man forgiven a debt and abusing those under him that owed him. And the closer you get to the top leadership, the more blind people are, and the more corrupt people are.
You know people by their fruit. A Christian organization that produces evil fruit is a sham. TWI is a sham. Its leaders are a sham. The worst people rise to the top. They have the most ego, and are the most abusive. They are 100% deluded, as their own self image and that of their fellow leaders is that they are the "best in the world".
They are pathetic. They are losers.
Chock, great post!! It is so good, that I can't add anything to it.
Honestly it took me observing through 3 jobs and 10 years to come to the conclusion that evil was a pattern as opposed to believing more like what you said. What a waste of my life...
Chock, at least you learned. Some people in TWI, never learn, or don't care. I think a lot of us feel we wasted years of our lives in TWI, and perhaps we did.
You do everything you're supposed to do...home studies, all the classes, canvass for free class locations, string chairs, make the coffee, run twigs, ABS and whatever else.
Then, you sit there in the BRC, with 250 other people and sink into a deep state of depression as you realize that (seemingly) you're the only one not "getting it".
Way, I took the AC in the summer of 1985 in Rome City, In. What a waste of time, and money. I couldn't believe all that JBS S--t that was in it. I couldn't wait to leave, and get back to my real life.
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Steve Lortz
I heard "paramount" a number of times from the head table at Emporia. That's why I put the [sic] into the quote. It really seemed stupid to hear that coming from a Corps Coordinator.
Thanks for watching out for me, Twinky!
Love,
Steve
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Twinky
And these people thought they could teach us "Greek" etc.
They don't understand English. And their errors in understanding the English language (in particular verb construction and tenses) pass all the way down until PFAL grads somehow reinvent themselves as knowing grammar, sentence construction etc...because they heard something in PFAL or copied it from some other person up the Way food chain.
Blind leading the blind...and so they all fall into misunderstandings and total ignorance...whilst all the time thinking themselves wise.
I don't think there was ever a lack of leadership. It's leadership in an appropriate direction that is lacking.
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skyrider
Yeah.....the realization of having been duped is a biggie.
Then, the next full-frontal realization is.......IF I LEAVE TWI WHAT THEN?
1) All social networks and "friends" in twi.....gone, poof.
2) All those years of wasted energy, loss of opportunity and education......uuuugh.
3) How utterly embarrassing to tell my parents and past friends that twi is a cult.
4) Gee, do I go find a wierwille splinter group or is everything wierwille taught a sham?
5) Maybe, just find a church.....or take a break for awhile.
6) Job? Career? Back to college? Move away? What now?
I wonder how many people simply stay in because they don't want to deal with the tsunami of decisions?
Could it be that staying in a deceptive snare is EASIER than all the effort to climb up and out to freedom?
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What About It
Well said. I still shake my head in near-disbelief at all of these things. That I really lived through that, for 23 years. And outandabout is right, the longer you stay in, the harder it is to leave...for all of the above reasons.
And I was among their so-called leadership once, too. I didn't know jack about leading, but I wanted to learn more. I went into the Way Corpse because I wanted to learn what the advanced class promised but never fulfilled: to learn how to operate the other 6 manifestations--the revelation and impartation ones. Hoping to learn these in the advanced class, I left disappointed but without the courage to say so for fear of speaking up against the tides of popular belief. So when the emotional urge to go into the Way Corps hit (it was not a calling...it was an emotional, impulse decision made at the Rock of Ages), I thought then I'd certainly learn how to operate these manifestations to serve in the "household." Well the Corps doesn't teach the manifestations either, but does twist truth, part truth, and popularly believed sayings to control people. To make them feel like they're the best of the best of the best. Or to make them feel like they're dung if they're not doing "right" (per their definition).
Their so-called leadership can be summed up in the one phrase they use to control their leadership: The best leader is the best follower.
Wrong again, TWI! Craziest thing I've ever heard. Again, just a popularly believed saying that they use to control people (and one that doesn't even make sense; kinda like Rico's famous "You don't think! You only think you think!" WTF???).
Run while you can, people. And even if you think it's too late, run anyway!
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Kit Sober
I also had had wonderful management prior to twi and assumed better and better would be the twi corps experience (rather than corpse experience received).
For the most recent 11 years, I had the privilege of having an exceptionally awesome management team, for which I will be ever grateful. As OldSkool and others show, good management works.
Because I have had godly management I know first hand what a blessing that is. I am a "support staff" person with a long suit in loyalty and faithfulness. It's so nice to have godly people to work for.
To every good (i.e., godly) manager: Thank you so very much for how you help your people become better people by your work.
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excathedra
i hear you what -about-it
i graduated from the advanced class stupider than stupid (fu vp)
went into the way corp program
got good and ruined
love,e
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waysider
The Advanced Class....don't get me started!
You do everything you're supposed to do...home studies, all the classes, canvass for free class locations, string chairs, make the coffee, run twigs, ABS and whatever else.
Then, you sit there in the BRC, with 250 other people and sink into a deep state of depression as you realize that (seemingly) you're the only one not "getting it".
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Rejoice
Oh Geeze...I thought it was just ME! :blink:
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OldSkool
I came out of the advanced class thoroughly confused. Of course I bought the line that going way disciple would let me put all that knowledge into action. BS to that. It took me studying the material while in-residence to understand that the problem was with the material itself. It's disjointed to say the least. The class jumps all over the place. Not to mention vast portions of it are inaccurate.
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skyrider
Saying this stuff is really hard to admit.......uuugh.
But when I really get honest and think about it, I saw the manipulation EVEN BACK THEN.
1) The "release" groups that were actually INDOCTRINATION groups.
2) Corps branch leaders monitored speech/actions of assigned group each day.
3) Various teaching tangents with agendas -- 'Myth of the Six Million' & 'The Thirteenth Tribe'
4) Advanced class completes the spiritually-mature student. Now, stand with twi.
5) Promos for WOW & Corps....now go do something with this knowledge.
6) A smugness that we were now adv class grads.
7) Groupthink, collectively united under wierwille's teachings, no other scholars were welcome.
By 1978, nearly all adv class teachings were in-house.
All those revelations/healings/casting out devil spirits by others.....gone.
Twi had constructed their tower of babbling.....er, wierwille for all to come idolize.
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waysider
.....and "the initiation into the inner sanctum"
On a scale of 1-10, how lame was that?
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danteh1
I had an Uncle, my Mother's brother, that was in the Infantry "anti-tank" corp that serverd under Patton's command.
I remember my uncle saying Patton was tough as nails and a "very outspoken" commander. many times they would come into a town in Europe and see some of Pattons tanks waiting for fuel and supplies.
With Veterans day comming, i remember my Uncle going through WW2 from him and family telling of him landing on Omaha beach head through the Battle of the Bulge and then home without getting hurt, except from what my mother said about my Uncle getting a few scratches from raiding a frenchmans wine cellar. :P
As far as Way leaders when i was "in", 1974, were fair at the local level but...............on the higher lvl could be very deciving. (nothing new to people who worked with the ones at the top).
Remember our american Veterans this VEteran's day 2012 by saying thanks to those who have served and are still serving.
:beer:/> :dance:/> :beer:/>
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Grace Valerie Claire
OS, some people in the military yell, and have temper tantrums. I've seen that. And then, there are people who ask their personal to do things without screaming at them. I hate being screamed at. If you need me to do something, just ask me to do it. I am an adult, and want to be treated like one.
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Grace Valerie Claire
OS, It's one thing to play soldier, but it is another thing altogether, to be one. I think VPW liked watching Soldiers at play, but he was to scared to have been a real one. Several of the men in my family are combat veterans, and they knew/know the realities of war. I am also a Veteran, but I never served in combat. VPW had many opportunities during WWII, to serve in the military; he choose not too. I know by 1941, he was married, and had a son. But many married men with kids served in WW11. I know he claimed that he didn't want to fight against Germany, so he choose not to serve. Perhaps that is true; I don't know. But, I wonder if he was afraid of being killed, or captured. I know I would have been; and I am a woman. I think in his heart, he was a coward.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Chock, great post!! It is so good, that I can't add anything to it.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Chock, at least you learned. Some people in TWI, never learn, or don't care. I think a lot of us feel we wasted years of our lives in TWI, and perhaps we did.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Thomas, thanks for the laugh!! I used to love that show decades ago!!
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Grace Valerie Claire
Way, I took the AC in the summer of 1985 in Rome City, In. What a waste of time, and money. I couldn't believe all that JBS S--t that was in it. I couldn't wait to leave, and get back to my real life.
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