Did grandson Wierwille take his pappy seriously or something? When will the way international sue? I need some popcorn. These guys get bolder everyday. I bet some sort of smackdown will occur at some point if this keeps up!
Well, umm......isn't SOWERS affiliated with CFF?
And.....aren't two wierwille kids directly involved with desires to keep the wierwille flame burning?
I ran outta popcorn watching twi & geerites fight over the skunk-pelt mantle.....and now,
CFF via "sowers" keeps trying to nudge the others off the "we've got the word" pedestal.
I dunno enough about CFF to say. I mean their inner pipelines that feed their secret societies and such. I thought SOWERS was McMullen's group fronted by VPW. But I dunno.....
....or maybe they're silent partners, colluding to keeping the MLM cash cow alive?
Nah, she HATES CFF. I'll never forget Linder going on about how "CFF was waiting at the doors trying to pick off anyone they could." Context? We were dealing (him harshly I might add, and on Rosie's bidding) with two kids who had committed the unforgivable sin of attending a CFF fellowship in Saint Mary's. Problem was the two kids (twenty somethings) we just telling folks around HQ about how great the fellowships were. Oh, and one of them was going on about things he had seen on GSC - like how Donna Martindale was going on about a plane crash victim meeting her demise as a direct result of her Dad, who was ex-clergy, leaving the way ministry. (I couldn't find the link.) Oh - found it!
There would be none of this. The kid perceived to be the bad seed was basically railroaded into quitting and the other kid left staff shortly after, but he was a reverend's son so was handled a lot more gently.
I could elaborate, but all I need to say is this happened in the "kinder and gentler way international."
They are more evil now that subtlety has been forced into their ways.
Sure, but, CFF is not SOWERS. Intertwined with common relationships but independent of each other.
I can remember when General motors came out with a car called NOVA. It was an acronym.
N=Nova (Chevy)
O=Omega (Oldsmobile)
V=Ventura (Pontiac)
A=Apollo (Buick)
Same basic car but, minor differences in headlights, grills, etc.
That's how I see the relationship between TWI and SOWERS.
Minor cosmetic differences but, the same basic vehicle with VPW serving as the common powertrain for both.
Side note: In Spanish, "no va" means "it doesn't go". It's no surprise it flopped in Mexico.
Maybe SOWERS will flop, too, when the participants finally realize it's nothing more than a dressed up clone of a corrupt and evil organization. (It doesn't go.)
Edit: According to SNOPES, the "no go" anecdote is an urban legend. So, I apologize for that bit of misleading information. However, I still think it's only a matter of time before SOWERS starts to see the inherent problems associated with the TWI programs they're cloning.
Sure, but, CFF is not SOWERS. Intertwined with common relationships but independent of each other.
Ahhh! I did not know that but wrongly assumed that CFF was sort of running SOWERS in some way or another, like the way does camp gunnison.
I have steered clear of CFF ever since I reconnected with an old friend from my TWI days who RELENTLESSLY endeavored to sell me CFF's class as the cure all for life's ills.
Why not?
Oh let me count the ways:
- Out of touch
- Arrogant
- Benevolent dictators
- "They" know what the sheep need week from week
- Leadership have a special tap to God's keg of life
- Rosie hates change
- Rosie fights change
- Rosie kills change
I could continue. sorry for answering a rhetorical question...
Nah, she HATES CFF. I'll never forget Linder going on about how "CFF was waiting at the doors trying to pick off anyone they could." Context? We were dealing (him harshly I might add, and on Rosie's bidding) with two kids who had committed the unforgivable sin of attending a CFF fellowship in Saint Mary's. Problem was the two kids (twenty somethings) we just telling folks around HQ about how great the fellowships were. Oh, and one of them was going on about things he had seen on GSC - like how Donna Martindale was going on about a plane crash victim meeting her demise as a direct result of her Dad, who was ex-clergy, leaving the way ministry. (I couldn't find the link.) Oh - found it!
I'm sure CFF is "waiting at the doors trying to pick off anyone they could". They have no reach into mainstream Christianity, and rural Ohio isn't exactly the thriving Mecca of potential converts either. Wayne and Kevin have to put food on the table, and as a pattern it seems people who worked for TWI for decades seem ill-equipped to survive in the normal business world. Ironically, Rosie has only herself to blame. If she would have been a little nicer to Wayne, instead of raking him over the coals and getting him kicked out of TWI, and of course John Shroyer before that, and the Wierwille kids, there would not even be any CFF. But you can't change the spots on a leopard, neither can you change the vicious nature of Rosie.
Donna's delusional. So by force of logic then, her own kids are doomed to die because Craig left TWI? Oh, but never forget the power of rationalization. He was kicked out, so that's different. Also, about 98% of the Way Corps have all left TWI, and judging by Ning pictures they are all reasonably alive and kicking with families the same. Even the severe douches don't seem to be dying off.
Face it Rosie. You are your own worst enemy. And nobody's afraid of you anymore.
Ahhh! I did not know that but wrongly assumed that CFF was sort of running SOWERS in some way or another, like the way does camp gunnison.
Well, JP and Sherry are in CFF - the brother / sister thing - Sarah is JP's sister, married to Kevin, who runs CFF with Wayne. Little V2P2 is JP and Sherry's son. I heard that Kevin was not happy at all with V2P2 starting SOWERS but had to back off due to the family aspect. All those guys don't have the same vicious nature Rosie does. No, V2P2 is on his own - with financial backing from elsewhere.
Ok, I nearly spewed my coffee on that one!! :biglaugh:
And thanks for the background. My very short time around Kevin/Wayne/CFF was pleasant and I believe them to be very well intentioned, loving, caring people. They have made some doctrinal distinctions from TWI but in the end still have to build on the foundation of Vpig. Between that and being pitched to work for them I had to make like a tree and leave. I wish them the best.
So by force of logic then
We shall have none of that. It's a requisite to be done with logic upon graduation into the way corpse. Should there be logic applied, circular logic seems to work best to suit the board of dummies purposes.
But really......isn't this christian camp stuff traced back to this man?
I hate camping enough that if it had not died out by the time I hit TWI my life may have worked out entirely different with TWI.
And I wondered just who in the heck would join a SOWERS session anyway. Figures they would tap the largely nostalgic pool of CFF folks for that sort of thing.
Oh, and recruiting young people. 101 from Vicster da Trickster's hand book.
Oh, and putting them into very dangerous situations, such as hitch hiking across country. I am an able bodied, street wise, sort of individual and you would not catch me hitch hiking unless the I had NO other choice.
Ehhh...whats a couple pesky laws. With any luck V2P2 will be locked up along way and can draw comparisons between himself and Paul of Tarsus. It would be a P.R. dream come true!!
Isn't this one of the old wow pins? Ok, I will reiterate my shock that the way has not sued SOWERS yet. I wonder if Rozilla is just too tired?
Guess, little Victoid is into necromancy. :unsure:
Oh, Soers updated their website to announce the dates for the upcoming wow pinning, thus the pic. Anyone planning to go, I need a ride...see ya here there or in the air!
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waysider
....or maybe they're silent partners, colluding to keeping the MLM cash cow alive?
OldSkool
Ok, I nearly spewed my coffee on that one!! :biglaugh: And thanks for the background. My very short time around Kevin/Wayne/CFF was pleasant and I believe them to be very well intentioned, loving,
Twinky
"Wierwille Memorial Library"? T-shirt with "Be Strong" and 4.13 written on it? Blue banner with yellow writing "The Word.......of God" on it? I didn't see the door marked Exit - please point me in
OldSkool
Moderators. Do these guys deserve their own offshoot section yet? I don't wanna spam up the About the way section too bad.
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skyrider
Well, umm......isn't SOWERS affiliated with CFF?
And.....aren't two wierwille kids directly involved with desires to keep the wierwille flame burning?
I ran outta popcorn watching twi & geerites fight over the skunk-pelt mantle.....and now,
CFF via "sowers" keeps trying to nudge the others off the "we've got the word" pedestal.
:unsure:
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OldSkool
I dunno enough about CFF to say. I mean their inner pipelines that feed their secret societies and such. I thought SOWERS was McMullen's group fronted by VPW. But I dunno.....
ROFLMAO!
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Ham
I've wondered why rosie isn't sending the lawyers to beat the snot out of them as well.
I think it might be something like..
they might by relation have performance rights, but no publication rights.
Or maybe it's not worth fighting over..
or what else.. I dunno.
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waysider
....or maybe they're silent partners, colluding to keeping the MLM cash cow alive?
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OldSkool
Nah, she HATES CFF. I'll never forget Linder going on about how "CFF was waiting at the doors trying to pick off anyone they could." Context? We were dealing (him harshly I might add, and on Rosie's bidding) with two kids who had committed the unforgivable sin of attending a CFF fellowship in Saint Mary's. Problem was the two kids (twenty somethings) we just telling folks around HQ about how great the fellowships were. Oh, and one of them was going on about things he had seen on GSC - like how Donna Martindale was going on about a plane crash victim meeting her demise as a direct result of her Dad, who was ex-clergy, leaving the way ministry. (I couldn't find the link.) Oh - found it!
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/audio-sound-clips.html
www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/component/option,com_docman/Itemid,29/task,doc_download/gid,29/
There would be none of this. The kid perceived to be the bad seed was basically railroaded into quitting and the other kid left staff shortly after, but he was a reverend's son so was handled a lot more gently.
I could elaborate, but all I need to say is this happened in the "kinder and gentler way international."
They are more evil now that subtlety has been forced into their ways.
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waysider
Sure, but, CFF is not SOWERS. Intertwined with common relationships but independent of each other.
I can remember when General motors came out with a car called NOVA. It was an acronym.
N=Nova (Chevy)
O=Omega (Oldsmobile)
V=Ventura (Pontiac)
A=Apollo (Buick)
Same basic car but, minor differences in headlights, grills, etc.
That's how I see the relationship between TWI and SOWERS.
Minor cosmetic differences but, the same basic vehicle with VPW serving as the common powertrain for both.
Side note: In Spanish, "no va" means "it doesn't go". It's no surprise it flopped in Mexico.
Maybe SOWERS will flop, too, when the participants finally realize it's nothing more than a dressed up clone of a corrupt and evil organization. (It doesn't go.)
Edit: According to SNOPES, the "no go" anecdote is an urban legend. So, I apologize for that bit of misleading information. However, I still think it's only a matter of time before SOWERS starts to see the inherent problems associated with the TWI programs they're cloning.
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Ham
but it still no va.. snopes, or not.
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skyrider
This begs the question.....
If rosalie's twi is so awesome and wonderful now.......why would there be disgruntles wanting to leave?
Nevermind what CFF is attempting to do.....what's wrong with twi, Rosalie? Too much legalism, too much
micro-management, dead-pan teachings, fossilized personalities.......why is twi hemorrhaging? They could
change things within their control if they wanted to, but they don't. Why not?
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OldSkool
Ahhh! I did not know that but wrongly assumed that CFF was sort of running SOWERS in some way or another, like the way does camp gunnison.
I have steered clear of CFF ever since I reconnected with an old friend from my TWI days who RELENTLESSLY endeavored to sell me CFF's class as the cure all for life's ills.
Oh let me count the ways:
- Out of touch
- Arrogant
- Benevolent dictators
- "They" know what the sheep need week from week
- Leadership have a special tap to God's keg of life
- Rosie hates change
- Rosie fights change
- Rosie kills change
I could continue. sorry for answering a rhetorical question...
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chockfull
I'm sure CFF is "waiting at the doors trying to pick off anyone they could". They have no reach into mainstream Christianity, and rural Ohio isn't exactly the thriving Mecca of potential converts either. Wayne and Kevin have to put food on the table, and as a pattern it seems people who worked for TWI for decades seem ill-equipped to survive in the normal business world. Ironically, Rosie has only herself to blame. If she would have been a little nicer to Wayne, instead of raking him over the coals and getting him kicked out of TWI, and of course John Shroyer before that, and the Wierwille kids, there would not even be any CFF. But you can't change the spots on a leopard, neither can you change the vicious nature of Rosie.
Donna's delusional. So by force of logic then, her own kids are doomed to die because Craig left TWI? Oh, but never forget the power of rationalization. He was kicked out, so that's different. Also, about 98% of the Way Corps have all left TWI, and judging by Ning pictures they are all reasonably alive and kicking with families the same. Even the severe douches don't seem to be dying off.
Face it Rosie. You are your own worst enemy. And nobody's afraid of you anymore.
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chockfull
Well, JP and Sherry are in CFF - the brother / sister thing - Sarah is JP's sister, married to Kevin, who runs CFF with Wayne. Little V2P2 is JP and Sherry's son. I heard that Kevin was not happy at all with V2P2 starting SOWERS but had to back off due to the family aspect. All those guys don't have the same vicious nature Rosie does. No, V2P2 is on his own - with financial backing from elsewhere.
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OldSkool
Ok, I nearly spewed my coffee on that one!!
:biglaugh: 
And thanks for the background. My very short time around Kevin/Wayne/CFF was pleasant and I believe them to be very well intentioned, loving, caring people. They have made some doctrinal distinctions from TWI but in the end still have to build on the foundation of Vpig. Between that and being pitched to work for them I had to make like a tree and leave. I wish them the best.
We shall have none of that. It's a requisite to be done with logic upon graduation into the way corpse. Should there be logic applied, circular logic seems to work best to suit the board of dummies purposes.
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skyrider
Yeah.....when I said "affiliated" I was thinking of what you stated above.
No, SOWERS is not in the organizational chart of CFF......two separate entities, yet with common bonds.
Anyone who knew Doug McM back in the twi-days, remembers he was Howard's right-hand man and completely loyal
to the wierwille-utopia mentality......imo. If I recall correctly, Doug ran with the security-type guys like
Charlie Q. before patrolling the grounds became standard procedure.
With these "common relationships".....neither CFF nor SOWERS are competing in the same market. And really,
SOWERS doesn't have to invent the wheel.....just name-drop the grandpappy legacy alot, reprint the material in
updated brochures and tap the CFF pool of followers looking for nature and adventure.
But really......isn't this christian camp stuff traced back to this man?
Glenn Clark / Camps Farthest Out
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OldSkool
I hate camping enough that if it had not died out by the time I hit TWI my life may have worked out entirely different with TWI.
And I wondered just who in the heck would join a SOWERS session anyway. Figures they would tap the largely nostalgic pool of CFF folks for that sort of thing.
Oh, and recruiting young people. 101 from Vicster da Trickster's hand book.
Oh, and putting them into very dangerous situations, such as hitch hiking across country. I am an able bodied, street wise, sort of individual and you would not catch me hitch hiking unless the I had NO other choice.
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WordWolf
Hitchhiking is also ILLEGAL.
You think people who claimed to want to follow the Bible would actually, you know,
read it and follow the instructions....
1 Peter 2:13
Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme;
That means Christians are supposed to follow the law.
However, it's obvious they are not going to-
the choice is follow the Bible and do what God said,
or follow vpw practice and do what vpw said.
Obviously, they would rather follow the word of a man when it contradicts God and they can't
follow both.
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waysider
Mississippi (point A)
Code 63-3-1109 Solicitation of rides by pedestrians.
No person shall stand in a roadway for the purpose of soliciting a ride from the driver of any private vehicle.
----------------------------------------------------
New Mexico (point B)
Code 66-7-340 Pedestrians soliciting rides or business.
No person shall stand in a roadway for the purpose of soliciting a ride, employment or business from the occupant of any vehicle.
SOURCE
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OldSkool
Ehhh...whats a couple pesky laws. With any luck V2P2 will be locked up along way and can draw comparisons between himself and Paul of Tarsus. It would be a P.R. dream come true!!
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waysider
If they're gonna break THOSE laws, why not just go all out and break The Mann Act of 1910 like Grand-Daddy VPP did?
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OldSkool
May as well.
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waysider
"There's as much learning in hitch hiking violating The Mann Act as there is in studying Genesis".....VPP
My link
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Ham
I think it is.. CFF TOLERATES the sowers..
maybe that is the official stance.. I haven't communicated with with Kevin for a couple of years..
They have to, don't they?
If you don't mind me saying..
maybe I shouldn't say..
Sonny boy got money for nuttin and chicks for free.. yeah, that's the ticket. That's not working..
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OldSkool
Isn't this one of the old wow pins? Ok, I will reiterate my shock that the way has not sued SOWERS yet. I wonder if Rozilla is just too tired?
Guess, little Victoid is into necromancy. :unsure:
Oh, Soers updated their website to announce the dates for the upcoming wow pinning, thus the pic. Anyone planning to go, I need a ride...see ya here there or in the air!
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OldSkool
Maybe I missed this before, but V2P2 is the President of SOWERS! Ok, I'm off to play All Hail the Chief on my Peruvian nose harp.
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