Most Fiery Confrontations Leveled at Dissenting Leadership

[100% Free]

DogLover.....I don't know how it happened, the reason for the accident. Wierwille was 66 years old at that time.

What I do know:

In 1983, when wierwille wrecked his twig-hopper in Ontario.....it was hauled back to hq in complete secrecy!! The front fender was bent some and the left side was scraped. A few decals had been knocked off. The guys in Flight Services, especially Jeff, were adept at paint detailing, pin-striping, leather upholstery, instrument panels, touch-up painting, etc. Therefore, the Ambassador One staffers and other insiders were designated to set up a closed-in paint booth in the OSC Warehouse and repaired it and repainted it....and added even more decals for those motorcycle shows.

Even to this day, few have ever heard about it. Kinda like a secret society......no one broke silence! No one leaked the information that the twig-hopper had been wrecked. In the aura of wierwille-mogdom, this type of incident would simply diminish wierwille's stature.

And, the mystique of wierwille lives on in the splinter groups today.

They would be hard pressed to rant and rave about the lack of good stewardship or slothfulness in the lives of others if this ever got out. Everyone else is always wrong or possesed.....

We were in that upstairs room over the dining room at Emporia, at the start of a meeting, LCM started yelling and acreaming at some corps who WALKED IN FRONT OF THE STAGE before the meeting started.

Yep. Can't admit a twileader had a wreck because it would make yelling and screaming at someone for accidently crossing in front of a stage seem stupid.

[100% Free]

From time to time when either of them went on one of their famous tirades, I thought it was a spiritual takeover.

I thought I was part of something important and Godly. But now I know I was only watching inept leaders throwing temper tantrums to avoid doing any real work. We should have called all of them a Waaaaahmbulance. Big immature egotistical self serving cry babies who did not serve God or God's people. Only served themselves.

[skyrider]

I thought I was part of something important and Godly. But now I know I was only watching inept leaders throwing temper tantrums

to avoid doing any real work.

Lots of those "inept leaders" learned how to leverage control of others...

....and splintered out to run their own "do it my way" show.

[skyrider]

The 3rd Wierwille Major Confrontation.....previously mentioned.

Sitting in the OSC Dining Room during Corps Night [those transition years moving from the BRC and waiting for the Auditorium to be built]........where wierwille was going thru his "literal translations according to usage" in the Book of Romans. While most corps took notes furiously, there were others in the back who didn't take these meetings quite so serious or spiritual.

Anyways..........about an hour into the corps meeting, and this 6th corps guy is starting to nod off. Problem was..... he was near the front, somewhere near the fourth or fifth row, and in eye-shot of wierwille. Well, the nodding increased and the closed-eyelids-duration was becoming visibly evident. And, even though a couple of nearby corps tried to help this fellow stay awake.........it just wasn't meant to be.

And, then it happened......wierwille's eyes fixed on a NODDING, DOZING CORPS GRAD who had the audacity, and no spirituality, to sleep while wierwille taught from Romans!!! This "act of disrespect" demanded the most intense verbal lashing that wierwille could muster......and thus it was. Red-faced with anger, and neck-veins visible...... wierwille launched into this tirade to strip bare every thread of self-worth that this corps grad had. On and on the verbal lashing went........not 20 stripes, not 25 stripes, not 30 stripes, not 35 stripes........BUT 39 VICIOUS, VERBAL STRIPES.......just one short of total and utter demoralization.

Wierwille's anger could not be contained.....he went back stage and Craig came out as if *to tag-team* the effort some more. It was horrendous and awful and disgraceful. Man, in hindsight.....I wish that I'd stood up and yelled at the top of my lungs........SHUT THE HECK UP AND LET HIM BE.

The corps guy was escorted from the room......and wierwille came back, after about 10 minutes, to finish his teaching. But we'd already SEEN his teaching and lifestyle......who needed to take more notes???

The next morning......word spread that the 6th Corps staff guy was fired and sent packing.

Need to add.......this corps guy, after seeking medical help awhile later, found out that he had a blood-sugar problem and he was treated for it. Prescription medicine helped him to not doze off. Guess wierwille nor martindale saw deep enough to HELP this guy

[excathedra]

it's just so disgusting -- that poor guy -- blood sugar or not -- he was the smartest person in the damn room

i have trouble sleeping and wish i could play some of those romans tapes

not really

i don't want to DIE of boredom

i know i'm being silly i apologize because it's really serious

honestly it's sick and he was sick and his going over all those words like "and" just shows what sick.....

[waysider]

Hey Kids!

Let's do a word study of "if"!

:sleep1: :sleep1:

[100% Free]

The 3rd Wierwille Major Confrontation.....previously mentioned.

Sitting in the OSC Dining Room during Corps Night [those transition years moving from the BRC and waiting for the Auditorium to be built]........where wierwille was going thru his "literal translations according to usage" in the Book of Romans. While most corps took notes furiously, there were others in the back who didn't take these meetings quite so serious or spiritual.

Anyways..........about an hour into the corps meeting, and this 6th corps guy is starting to nod off. Problem was..... he was near the front, somewhere near the fourth or fifth row, and in eye-shot of wierwille. Well, the nodding increased and the closed-eyelids-duration was becoming visibly evident. And, even though a couple of nearby corps tried to help this fellow stay awake.........it just wasn't meant to be.

And, then it happened......wierwille's eyes fixed on a NODDING, DOZING CORPS GRAD who had the audacity, and no spirituality, to sleep while wierwille taught from Romans!!! This "act of disrespect" demanded the most intense verbal lashing that wierwille could muster......and thus it was. Red-faced with anger, and neck-veins visible...... wierwille launched into this tirade to strip bare every thread of self-worth that this corps grad had. On and on the verbal lashing went........not 20 stripes, not 25 stripes, not 30 stripes, not 35 stripes........BUT 39 VICIOUS, VERBAL STRIPES.......just one short of total and utter demoralization.

Wierwille's anger could not be contained.....he went back stage and Craig came out as if *to tag-team* the effort some more. It was horrendous and awful and disgraceful. Man, in hindsight.....I wish that I'd stood up and yelled at the top of my lungs........SHUT THE HECK UP AND LET HIM BE.

The corps guy was escorted from the room......and wierwille came back, after about 10 minutes, to finish his teaching. But we'd already SEEN his teaching and lifestyle......who needed to take more notes???

The next morning......word spread that the 6th Corps staff guy was fired and sent packing.

Need to add.......this corps guy, after seeking medical help awhile later, found out that he had a blood-sugar problem and he was treated for it. Prescription medicine helped him to not doze off. Guess wierwille nor martindale saw deep enough to HELP this guy

I feel sick. Is that guy OK now? I hope so.

I heard the loyster was bitter about how he was treated.

I wonder if those who still defend him know about this stuff.

[waysider]

I heard the loyster was bitter about how he was treated.

Bitter???

The sorry SOB ought to thank his lucky stars nobody strung him up by his nutz.

[Kit Sober]

When I "met" Watchman Nee it was so exhilirating. Watchman Nee had this kind kind of kindness that I always knew a shepherd would have --- the kindness of quiet careful tenderness in which a sheep could rest and take comfort.

I had studied over and over the words of Jesus and it was always amazing to me how he never yelled (except like from the cross). But when he threw the animals out of the temple he "said" (simply said, not yelled), "you have made my Fathers house a den of thieves." Over and over it's like that where I thought the "righteous anger of yelling" would be confirmed in scripture, Jesus just "said."

And then I met Watchman Nee who did that. He had that careful kindness which took my breath away. He was already dead when I first heard of him, but his works were still being "written." (People who transcribed his sermons some 30+ years ago.

Anyway. There's no scripture for yelling and like others have pointed out, having no compassion for the person to whom you speak.

By the love you have one to another shall men know that you are my disciples is how Jesus spoke.

WIthout love (the charity kind of love) we are just clanging cymbals.

And Excathedra. . . I am one of those who LOVED the word "and" and have never tired of looking at it and seeing how and what it ties together. "But" etc. etc. I loved Donna Randall's class on little words that do big jobs. One of my favorites.

[skyrider]

I loved Donna Randall's class on little words that do big jobs. One of my favorites.

Kit......yes, good class.

People like Donna R. helped us to find those "diamonds in the rough."

Not sure when she left twi.....

[penworks]

I think it is part of the process of assuming summary judgement over people's lives. vp's grandkid's justification was "well ham, we have to be able to keep the TROOPS in line.."

same mentality.. I wonder how many scream-fests the followers have been subjected to so far..

You know, it's amazing we put up with it, but that we did (I should speak for myself) is an indication of the co-dependant relationship I had with Wierwille. I bought the snow story revelation which essentially made him infallible for all practical purposes and he knew I bought it.

BTW - keeping the troops in line is a galaxy away from the publically stated intentions of TWI on their web site like this one, the bold words are my emphasis:

"A follower of The Way is filled with and manifests power from on high, holy spirit, and freely avails himself of fellowship meetings for spiritual nurture and growth".

Edited January 25, 2012 by penworks

[cara]

quote: I always find it ironic how you, johniam, come to wierwille's defense.

Jesus did yell at Peter. He called him satan for impact. There's plenty of scripture in which it plainly says there was a spirit present when Jesus confronted it. Not when he said to peter get thee behind me satan. Perhaps YOU are the one who is twisting scripture. Sometimes people say blasphemous things because there's a spirit present; other times people say things because they have bad thinking habits and there doesn't have to be a spirit present.

Personally, I don't like being yelled at and I don't like yelling at people.

Maybe he was just asking him to stop being an adversary or accuser (just checked my brilliant dictionary that gives word roots).?

Dear ex-c, sorry about whatever hell it is.

Edited January 25, 2012 by cara

[chockfull]

Wierwille on his tirades. I remember something about how Mrs. W. used to go into his office, but wave a white flag coming in when she knew he was on a rampage. What a mean man.

[Ham]

mean is one thing.. unbridled, and mean, is another..

[skyrider]

mean is one thing.. unbridled, and mean, is another..

unbridled and mean is one thing..........ballistic and nuclear, is another

[waysider]

Wierwille on his tirades. I remember something about how Mrs. W. used to go into his office, but wave a white flag coming in when she knew he was on a rampage. What a mean man.

"He was a mean man."......Mrs. W.

(Overheard at the memorial service)

[Ham]

Wierwille on his tirades. I remember something about how Mrs. W. used to go into his office, but wave a white flag coming in when she knew he was on a rampage. What a mean man.

why is it that these descriptions give me visions of a sexually incompetent self-aggrandizing dictator marching rapidly and erratically around his office..

sowy..

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

with my apologies, i am only posting and reading because i need a moment away from the real hell i'm going through

that said,

wierwille was insane. i told you on here many times the time i walked past him and geer and b. geer delivering puppies. apparently she did something wrong and he went FRIKKIN NUTSO -- he talked to her like she was worse than dogsheet. and there was geer not saying a word.... i guess b. deserved it

there are so many other times

when i asked him to help someone in britain (again, a geer thing) and wierwille said, "HOW LONG DO I HAVE TO SUCK YOUR WAY CORPS ASSES"?!?! what a disgusting loser

If Wierwille had said something like that to me(if I had been married) and/or my wife I would have bitch slapped him and cussed him out, and I wouldn't have cared if he had me arrested for assualt and battery because if I knew the truth about him and verbally threatened him with telling the authorities about his behavior, and if there was a revolt against him by other people there, maybe TWI would have come to an end quicker and sooner. Boy Geer was a loser and a suck-up, and didn't deserve B.

[Watered Garden]

Re: the sixth corps guy who nodded off: If your blood sugar is high enough, you WILL nod off. I'm surprised that VP, being such a great and might man of God, didn't get revelation that this guy needed some medical help or at least ministered to him for healing of his blood sugar imbalance.

But then that wouldn't have scared the daylights out of the rest of the hapless souls in the room, would it?

Shame on him! Shame!

[chockfull]

Re: the sixth corps guy who nodded off: If your blood sugar is high enough, you WILL nod off.

I have heard more and more cases about TWI leadership missing very simple and basic medical causes for things, and instead going off on their own ego-based rantings,tirades, and Pharisee-like dumb@$$ advice (like "just keep serving"). They are the living embodiment of "knowledge puffs up but charity edifies". They walk around so puffed up with the idea of their own importance, and yet they are so blind.

Contrast this with how Jesus acted on earth. He had compassion and healed people. Can't you just picture him in a situation like this? Noticing a guy nodding off, and after his teaching taking the time to walk up to him, touch him, and heal him of his blood sugar issue? I can.

And Jesus example compared to these Pharisees in TWI are diametrically opposed.

[geisha779]

I have heard more and more cases about TWI leadership missing very simple and basic medical causes for things, and instead going off on their own ego-based rantings,tirades, and Pharisee-like dumb@$ advice (like "just keep serving"). They are the living embodiment of "knowledge puffs up but charity edifies". They walk around so puffed up with the idea of their own importance, and yet they are so blind.

This is funny to me now, but at the time it was devastating. I went to Emporia for the Advanced Class.....it was my WOW year and I was in the North East.....before that the South East. The climate change in Kansas wreaked havoc on my sinuses and throat, apparently I was just really sensitive to the dry heat. I had an annoying tickle in my throat that would send me into fits of coughing.

Wouldn't you know it....VP came to teach and sure enough....I had a coughing fit.....no amount of water helped. Of course, since the great man himself was teaching, the coughing(I wasn't the only one) just had to be devil spirits. He went off on this torrent about the coughing and the devil. I was, of course, crushed, I just had to be open to spirits because I couldn't control my cough.

Apparently the spirits were not enough to deter VP once he clapped that one oggley eye on me as he tried to play grab, pat, and leer. The look on his face was lecherous. That class, from the time I hit that campus, until the time I left was one long game of duck, hide, look away and run. I really do not see how any woman lived there unmolested. It was like open season the time I spent there.

[excathedra]

thank you cara

i agree thomas

not many women did, geisha

sorry kit, no offense intended

[100% Free]

Re: the sixth corps guy who nodded off: If your blood sugar is high enough, you WILL nod off. I'm surprised that VP, being such a great and might man of God, didn't get revelation that this guy needed some medical help or at least ministered to him for healing of his blood sugar imbalance.

But then that wouldn't have scared the daylights out of the rest of the hapless souls in the room, would it?

Shame on him! Shame!

Hi Watered Garden,

Nice to hear your point of view. I've missed your posts, have you been gone or did I just not see them? :)

[WordWolf]

I have heard more and more cases about TWI leadership missing very simple and basic medical causes for things, and instead going off on their own ego-based rantings,tirades, and Pharisee-like dumb@$$ advice (like "just keep serving"). They are the living embodiment of "knowledge puffs up but charity edifies". They walk around so puffed up with the idea of their own importance, and yet they are so blind.

Contrast this with how Jesus acted on earth. He had compassion and healed people. Can't you just picture him in a situation like this? Noticing a guy nodding off, and after his teaching taking the time to walk up to him, touch him, and heal him of his blood sugar issue? I can.

And Jesus example compared to these Pharisees in TWI are diametrically opposed.

Like when a kid needed medication to balance his blood chemistry and calm his behavior

(which worked soon after they started taking it) and "leadership" saying the way to calm

the kid was to beat him with a stick if he didn't calm down, and threaten to abandon him

in the woods if that didn't work?

I prefer lcm's own account of how a man had a psychiatric episode right in the middle

of vpw's teaching. Instead of doing anything to get him medical attention, vpw tried

confronting him (as if the guy could even understand that), and then sent the guy

home on a bus a few hours later. When the guy left, lcm worried about him. vpw insisted

he forget about the guy and he'd arrive home sooner or later. A WEEK later, he arrived

home, and was hardly the only one who left hq a wreck and was tossed on a bus.

A POSTER here related how vpw did that to them, and they wandered away at the first

connection and EVENTUALLY showed up somewhere.

vpw considered people DISPOSABLE.

======================

"Dr and LCM always fought for people to stay in the Corps.

There was an incident of a guy in the Corps who all of a sudden went

"gooney-bird". He started to babble and not make sense. LCM worked hard

with the guy to help him but he was incoherent. Dr, when he met him,

confronted him by asking- 'Son, how come you're letting your mind get

all scrambled?' The guy answered unintelligibly and Dr told him that it would

be best for him just to pack his bags and go home. The guy understood

that. He left.

LCM spent many hours and many long distance phone calls trying to make

sure the guy had gotten home from his bus ride home safely. Not being

able to verify his location, he was concerned. Dr told him to move on.

There's nothing you can do, he'll show up at home soon enough. A week

later the guy did show up at home."

www.greasespotcafe.com/ipb/topic/8019-vp-and-me-in-wonderland/

[outandabout]

I'm bipolar. Have been stable and on meds for years. In 1974 I went WOW and went into a psychotic episode. B@rb L@lly (then Gr@y) put me on a bus. I got off in Oklahoma City and ended up in jail. (long story) Some one who worked at the jail called my dad and he flew there & got me out. By the grace of God, I lived through it all. That's what they did to people.