Shortly after Rosie and Donna ousted Craig they dropped a new research policy that effectively killed what little "biblical research" appeared to be taking place at HQ. Within this policy was the term proven ministry research. In other words, when it's considered proven, it's truth and truth doesn't change so there is no reason to ever question that piece of research again, it's proven. Nevermind this approach doesn't even resemble real research...anywho...
This is also CES/STF John S style---once he's "researched" and taught it, it is not open for question. He is a second-generation Wierwillian, just like Rosie and Donna... must come with the territory.
But, but, but.. he's a nice guy! (most of the time. until you question his "research").
Ham, it is odd that people think in such a vacuum when they say that someone has been nice 'to them'---therefore they are nice people! Everyone is nice at times to a few for gosh sakes!
Well, we had Rosie the Riverter---why not Rosie the Sanitizer. She can carry a plunger!
It's been documented here, and elsewhere (a.k.a. John Juedes site) that Wierwille plagiarized his supposed research from several sources.
Just some rambling thoughts.
They are good and sound rambling thoughts and this is helpful information in taking the initial step of questioning TWI theology. Thanks! TWI is a real hodgepodge of theology and spiritualism......even the relevant theology is so polluted that not much is worth keeping IMO. Although VP stole others ideas....he really didn't steal from many sound sources. I have often wondered what attracted VP to Bullinger and the other sources he stole material from? Trying to follow the curving path that leads to these sources is time consuming and trying to discern their theology is an exercise in futility. Mix in a real distrust of Christians in general and an arrogance towards real bible teachers and it is like a bottomless pit we can't dig ourselves out from.....it just keeps spiraling out and is a mess.
Someone on here did a great deal of the leg work .... the Snapping thread has some good information. I think it is a real eye opener. I am ever thankful to the poster who contributed that information.
We support things we believe in....that includes ministries. TWI is all about VP and his strange theology. The problem is....many of us were young, ignorant of theology and caught up in the whole thing when we were still developing and it is really difficult to see through it all.
It isn't a Christian group.... it is a heretical cult. It isn't your family or God's special household.....it is an anti-Christian group which at one time had Christians who got caught up for a time. The off shoots are not a new and better version of the same.....you can't take a rotten foundation and build on it without it eventually falling apart.
Sadly, there is a remnant of diehards willing to follow VP straight to hell. Not much we can do about that......but for those who want to be Christians, there are good sound bible teachers and good churches willing to embrace us. It can be difficult to realize how wrong we were and how totally caught up we were, but it beats staying in that nightmare.
Sadly, there is a remnant of diehards willing to follow VP straight to hell. Not much we can do about that
And why is this? I'm referring to the first half of your statement here..
there are several "camps" I think..
those who think the victoid wasn't "a bad man.." overall. Just a little "dirty".. we can clean it up, or sweep it under the rug.. with regards to their old ministry connection, it's don't ask, don't tell. And if asked, "well, that really isn't relevant now.."
then there are some who think there is no sanitation required. "God" can't have stains now, can he? The victoid was born of divine conception or something..
and go as far as to name their own offspring after herr vicmeister.. raise him thinking vic was some kind of saint.. perfect in all his ways before the "bad people" infiltrated the ministry.
that is less than sad..
I'm really thinking it is more about the money. Broken down, bankrupt in retirement years.. no *real* skills to do anything else. They just don't have the *right name* to pull it off..
It's almost like a scene The Boys from Brazil..
a new Fuhrer(vicster) for the twentieth century, the twenty-first century, the twenty-second century..
And why is this? I'm referring to the first half of your statement here..
there are several "camps" I think..
those who think the victoid wasn't "a bad man.." overall. Just a little "dirty".. we can clean it up, or sweep it under the rug.. with regards to their old ministry connection, it's don't ask, don't tell. And if asked, "well, that really isn't relevant now.."
then there are some who think there is no sanitation required. "God" can't have stains now, can he? The victoid was born of divine conception or something..
and go as far as to name their own offspring after herr vicmeister.. raise him thinking vic was some kind of saint.. perfect in all his ways before the "bad people" infiltrated the ministry.
that is less than sad..
I'm really thinking it is more about the money. Broken down, bankrupt in retirement years.. no *real* skills to do anything else. They just don't have the *right name* to pull it off..
It's almost like a scene The Boys from Brazil..
a new Fuhrer(vicster) for the twentieth century, the twenty-first century, the twenty-second century..
You ask really good questions and I wish I had the answers, maybe then I could be a help to those who need it the most.
If it is a familial relationship, well that brings up a whole different set of issues. Those are strong bonds and I think God designed it that way. I can't even imagine the inner conflict.... I think I would probably just shut it all too..
Old school I think you summed everything up.... All you need to do is put sources and evidence and then we should publish it and send it to everyone in TWI......
Well I guess that would be fruitless as they won't "consider" other peoples opinions for the devil may lead you astray.
Now, over the years the way international has spent many many hours working his books through many new editions. These new editions, without fail, are just a little cleaner and a little less contradictory.
So is this the main reason for proven ministry research? To clean up Wierwille's printed works and remove all the incriminating, contradictory material that was printed over the years? I mean it's real simple. Keep the basic principles Wierwille plagiarized, compare contradictory incidents and ramblings to basic principles and remove them if they don't match or are not able to be proven? mmmmmmm.....
When you also consider that two of the most revealing works (The Way Living in Love, and VP and Me) were removed from publication long ago or never released it goes along was in exposing the way international for hiding the true Wierwille. Also, countless hours of Wierwille teachings - Corps Mornings, various classes, SNS recordings, etc. are NOT publicly available anymore.
Now, the official party line around HQ before I left in 2008 was these old materials are not the same caliber presentation as what we release present day....gasp! You mean to tell me the greatest man of God to walk the earth since Jesus Christ fell short in his presentation of God's Word? The same man who screamed and cursed the in-residence way corps on the slightest whim left behind a legacy of materials that are substandard to what we are doing now, I mean this was "The Teacher!" His degree was in Homiletics and he couldn't present teachings that would stand the test of time?.....tsk.....tsk...
Or are the old materials too revealing?
Just some rambling thoughts.
OldSkool......like all things twi, one of the MAJOR REASONS why "old materials" are removed from publication is
the authors no longer stand with twi. You see, it just raises eyebrows and questions and suspicions.
Who is Elen@ Whites!de?
Why is she no longer standing with twi?
If twi is "living in love"........why is she a defector of that "love?"
Who is L. Craig Martindale?
Why is the 2nd twi president no longer the president?
Did he die? Was he fired?
Maybe I should google it?
Twi has been whitewash scrubbing their history.....since its inception.
Everytime a major player leaves........the scrubbing begins.
The John Lynn books disappeared from their bookstore around 1988.
Books, booklets, cartoon magazines, songs.......lots scrubbed after mass 1987 exodus.
OldSkool......like all things twi, one of the MAJOR REASONS why "old materials" are removed from publication is
the authors no longer stand with twi.
No doubt that is part of the equation. But my last 8 years in TWI were spent at HQ witnessing Rosalie deify Wierwille and erase Martindale. The difference between the two of them? Martindale got caught and Wierwille never did, even though it's common knowledge around HQ that he was an adulterer who taught Martindale. Heck, his own granddaughter told me the "rumors" were true. There is no doubt in my mind that Rosie and the gang are doing all they can to suppress the truth about Wierwille and present to the public the image he created for himself and hid behind.
No doubt that is part of the equation. But my last 8 years in TWI were spent at HQ witnessing Rosalie deify Wierwille and erase Martindale. The difference between the two of them? Martindale got caught and Wierwille never did, even though it's common knowledge around HQ that he was an adulterer who taught Martindale. Heck, his own granddaughter told me the "rumors" were true. There is no doubt in my mind that Rosie and the gang are doing all they can to suppress the truth about Wierwille and present to the public the image he created for himself and hid behind.
I understand......and agree with you.
In 1978, our 4th Corps Limb Coordinator left twi....even though, his Mom worked on staff at hq. And, even though
I never got to ask him the underlying reasons for his exit....I must say, it got my attention. Why the abrupt
decision? What did he see that I didn't see?
And, although I continued my involvement in twi....I saw red flags and hypocrisy time and time again. While on staff,
I firmly realized that the "wierwille marketing" was cunningly manufactured. Wierwille had an inner-circle of yes-men
who protected him on every turn. The wierwille motorcoach and clubhouse and dog kennels were like guarded areas.
In 1983, when wierwille wrecked his twig-hopper in Ontario.....it was hauled back to hq in complete secrecy!! The
Ambassador One staffers and other insiders set up a closed-in paint booth in the OSC Warehouse and repaired it and
repainted it....and added even more decals for those motorcycle shows. BUT......no one broke silence! No one leaked
the information that the twig-hopper had been wrecked. Neither did I. In the aura of wierwille-mogdom, this type of
incident would simply diminish wierwille's stature.
Suffice it to say......Rosalie knows that the mystique of wierwille is equivalent to having a goose who lays golden eggs.
Now granted, that goose isn't laying alot of eggs anymore......but a couple here and there is better than none. Without
the wierwille myth to market, the goose has flown south never to return.
In 1983, when wierwille wrecked his twig-hopper in Ontario.....it was hauled back to hq in complete secrecy!! The
Ambassador One staffers and other insiders set up a closed-in paint booth in the OSC Warehouse and repaired it and
repainted it....and added even more decals for those motorcycle shows. BUT......no one broke silence! No one leaked the information that the twig-hopper had been wrecked. Neither did I. In the aura of wierwille-mogdom, this type of incident would simply diminish wierwille's stature.
When Rosie took over I remember her telling people to write to her with any complaints they had. Well, I think she got more of a response than she had anticipated and many of the responses had to do with teachings that Craig introduced that seemed suspect at best. Once she opened that can of worms there were a lot of people speaking freely about those things. I think she realized what she had done and had to put out the fire of discontent. That was about the time she came out with the "proven ministry work" rule. If it had been taught by the ministry it was unquestionable. If the ministry had taught it, it had been researched and was the truth.
During the 90's Craig had tried to do away with VPW's name. It was rare to hear someone quote VPW's works, it was all about Craig. Even Rosie herself (who in public was quite the VPW worshipper)would gush about "our Reverend Martindale" and praise his unholy name. Craig did not allow people to quote VPW because it was now Craig's time to shine and the followers were to "get excited about what he's (Craig's) excited about". The "cop-outs" all had VPW's material but Craig proclaimed they were living in the past and following a dead man and that Craig had the "present truth".
When Craig was outed Rosie had quite the task in front of her. Craig's and VPW's teachings seem to be contradictory in places. If she suddenly returned to VPW's materials it would cause the lemmings to question if they had been misled. But the questioning had already started and some of the things Craig taught were easy to disprove. She stated early in her reign that the TWI was like a big ship and it took a long time to change directions. In other words, if she made the changes slowly enough maybe people would not notice they were heading in a different direction.
The end result is that the TWI became bland and boring, regurgitating the same thing over and over. Because the TWI had been stagnant in its doctrine for the past couple of decades or more their teachings have had no depth or life. Most old-timers lost interest and most newcomers were unimpressed. Classes were met with a giant yawn. The life of the ministry has to be in the "twig" because there certainly isn't any in Ohio.
They probably now have the TWI "ship" heading fully on the VPW course but they are decades behind. I've got no interest in following that course, but IF someone was interested then some of the off-shoots would probably be a better fit. They've been moving on while TWI was off course. Some of them have seen and acknowledged a few of the most obvious errors in VPW's teachings and corrected them. TWI has made the mistake of declaring anything that's been taught as truth and unquestionable. They are officially now a dull denomination.
She stated early in her reign that the TWI was like a big ship and it took a long time to change directions.
Craig proved how fast direction could be changed. That's a line of BS. She is deliberately slow on everything and horribly inept at managing anything. And she still has not been able to stop hemorrhaging followers and few there are.
When Rosie took over I remember her telling people to write to her with any complaints they had. Well, I think she got more of a response than she had anticipated and many of the responses had to do with teachings that Craig introduced that seemed suspect at best. Once she opened that can of worms there were a lot of people speaking freely about those things. I think she realized what she had done and had to put out the fire of discontent. That was about the time she came out with the "proven ministry work" rule. If it had been taught by the ministry it was unquestionable. If the ministry had taught it, it had been researched and was the truth.
I also remember during this time that after collecting all the complaints, rather than taking any action on them, it was addressed on Corps night that basically all of the US Corps were "unthankful for the Word" compared to the internationals, who they said suffered through great hardships to even get the most basic Word that was presented freely to the US Corps.
Also, with Rosie, this served to be a source of a list of dissenters, much like the Communist leadership of Stalin and Hitler used. The Communists would periodically open up speeches and lies that they were trying to change, thus soliciting opinions on how they could change. Once all the opinions were collected, they executed the people with differing opinions. Rosie did and does this by blackballing those who disagree. She won't do any of the dirty work herself, but has henchmen to perform it for her. People are kicked out, demoted, moved, "placed on probation", and this is done in complete silence. They stopped answering any questions about these actions that were performed in the night with no witnesses, and this produces the appropriate fear in the ranks of the followers to comply or end up like so-and-so. It's a reign of fear and terror, all governed by the yearly "placement meetings" where those involved partake in that evil.
This will be dealt with when Jesus Christ returns, as there aren't any followers with the b@ll$ to do like the inhabitants of the city Jezebel was staying in did and throw her over the wall. All a bunch of eunechs.
Though it now more resembles a row-boat, does it not?
It always did. You look at how quickly other Christian organizations of hundreds to thousands times the size of TWI can change to align with a new strategic direction. How about looking at companies and businesses? They change even quicker.
Hearing the tripe about "it's a world-wide organization and it takes time to change" is sickening to the stomach. They certainly can pass decrees on what they want to fast enough. However, changing to do things right requires a lawsuit and the threat of personal imprisonment for a high level person. It's stubbornness, hard-headedness, hard-heartedness, and flat out lies and manipulation. Why anyone would put themselves under that kind of authority is just mind-boggling.
When Rosie took over I remember her telling people to write to her with any complaints they had. Well, I think she got more of a response than she had anticipated and many of the responses had to do with teachings that Craig introduced that seemed suspect at best. Once she opened that can of worms there were a lot of people speaking freely about those things. I think she realized what she had done and had to put out the fire of discontent. That was about the time she came out with the "proven ministry work" rule. If it had been taught by the ministry it was unquestionable. If the ministry had taught it, it had been researched and was the truth.
Rosalie is a slow-learner.....
In 1981 at Corps Week, wierwille gave the way corps access to the microphone to ask questions. At this time, martindale was designated as president-elect....and many corps had pointed concerns with policies and/or the direction of twi. Well, it didn't take too long before wierwille and martindale got visibly agitated. Confrontation erupted and the question/answer time was shut down.
Around 1992 at Advanced Class Special....same deal. Martindale allowed for questions during the Sunday 'sharing' service.
When will Rosalie learn?
The discontent is there......in 1977, some weren't happy that twi wasn't going to use the new 'pfal '77 class to update the old version. With skinny-tie wierwille, some wanted to 'move on' with a growing surge of excitement. In 1978, wierwille had to confront and stifle corps who wanted to address new research with their corps research papers. Three 8th corps men had ventured into an area that wierwille disapproved.....and, in the years to follow, all corps research papers had to have twi approval BEFORE starting.
Twi has been suppressive for nearly 35 years.....at least.
Recommended Posts
Rejoice
This is also CES/STF John S style---once he's "researched" and taught it, it is not open for question. He is a second-generation Wierwillian, just like Rosie and Donna... must come with the territory.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
But, but, but.. he's a nice guy! (most of the time. until you question his "research").
the vicster on the other hand, had the ability to be a nice guy, accidentally, and on occasion.
rosie and the donster, on the other hand, I don't think they are either..
Maybe rosie will go down in way history being called "the Great Sanitizer"
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rejoice
Ham, it is odd that people think in such a vacuum when they say that someone has been nice 'to them'---therefore they are nice people! Everyone is nice at times to a few for gosh sakes!
Well, we had Rosie the Riverter---why not Rosie the Sanitizer. She can carry a plunger!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
geisha779
They are good and sound rambling thoughts and this is helpful information in taking the initial step of questioning TWI theology. Thanks! TWI is a real hodgepodge of theology and spiritualism......even the relevant theology is so polluted that not much is worth keeping IMO. Although VP stole others ideas....he really didn't steal from many sound sources. I have often wondered what attracted VP to Bullinger and the other sources he stole material from? Trying to follow the curving path that leads to these sources is time consuming and trying to discern their theology is an exercise in futility. Mix in a real distrust of Christians in general and an arrogance towards real bible teachers and it is like a bottomless pit we can't dig ourselves out from.....it just keeps spiraling out and is a mess.
Someone on here did a great deal of the leg work .... the Snapping thread has some good information. I think it is a real eye opener. I am ever thankful to the poster who contributed that information.
We support things we believe in....that includes ministries. TWI is all about VP and his strange theology. The problem is....many of us were young, ignorant of theology and caught up in the whole thing when we were still developing and it is really difficult to see through it all.
It isn't a Christian group.... it is a heretical cult. It isn't your family or God's special household.....it is an anti-Christian group which at one time had Christians who got caught up for a time. The off shoots are not a new and better version of the same.....you can't take a rotten foundation and build on it without it eventually falling apart.
Sadly, there is a remnant of diehards willing to follow VP straight to hell. Not much we can do about that......but for those who want to be Christians, there are good sound bible teachers and good churches willing to embrace us. It can be difficult to realize how wrong we were and how totally caught up we were, but it beats staying in that nightmare.
Edited by geisha779Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rejoice
Well said Geisha!
Thanks!
Edited by RejoiceLink to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
And why is this? I'm referring to the first half of your statement here..
there are several "camps" I think..
those who think the victoid wasn't "a bad man.." overall. Just a little "dirty".. we can clean it up, or sweep it under the rug.. with regards to their old ministry connection, it's don't ask, don't tell. And if asked, "well, that really isn't relevant now.."
then there are some who think there is no sanitation required. "God" can't have stains now, can he? The victoid was born of divine conception or something..
and go as far as to name their own offspring after herr vicmeister.. raise him thinking vic was some kind of saint.. perfect in all his ways before the "bad people" infiltrated the ministry.
that is less than sad..
I'm really thinking it is more about the money. Broken down, bankrupt in retirement years.. no *real* skills to do anything else. They just don't have the *right name* to pull it off..
It's almost like a scene The Boys from Brazil..
a new Fuhrer(vicster) for the twentieth century, the twenty-first century, the twenty-second century..
Link to comment
Share on other sites
geisha779
You ask really good questions and I wish I had the answers, maybe then I could be a help to those who need it the most.
If it is a familial relationship, well that brings up a whole different set of issues. Those are strong bonds and I think God designed it that way. I can't even imagine the inner conflict.... I think I would probably just shut it all too..
Rejoice....
:)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Naten00
Old school I think you summed everything up.... All you need to do is put sources and evidence and then we should publish it and send it to everyone in TWI......
Well I guess that would be fruitless as they won't "consider" other peoples opinions for the devil may lead you astray.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
skyrider
OldSkool......like all things twi, one of the MAJOR REASONS why "old materials" are removed from publication is
the authors no longer stand with twi. You see, it just raises eyebrows and questions and suspicions.
Who is Elen@ Whites!de?
Why is she no longer standing with twi?
If twi is "living in love"........why is she a defector of that "love?"
Who is L. Craig Martindale?
Why is the 2nd twi president no longer the president?
Did he die? Was he fired?
Maybe I should google it?
Twi has been whitewash scrubbing their history.....since its inception.
Everytime a major player leaves........the scrubbing begins.
The John Lynn books disappeared from their bookstore around 1988.
Books, booklets, cartoon magazines, songs.......lots scrubbed after mass 1987 exodus.
.
Edited by skyriderLink to comment
Share on other sites
OldSkool
No doubt that is part of the equation. But my last 8 years in TWI were spent at HQ witnessing Rosalie deify Wierwille and erase Martindale. The difference between the two of them? Martindale got caught and Wierwille never did, even though it's common knowledge around HQ that he was an adulterer who taught Martindale. Heck, his own granddaughter told me the "rumors" were true. There is no doubt in my mind that Rosie and the gang are doing all they can to suppress the truth about Wierwille and present to the public the image he created for himself and hid behind.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
skyrider
I understand......and agree with you.
In 1978, our 4th Corps Limb Coordinator left twi....even though, his Mom worked on staff at hq. And, even though
I never got to ask him the underlying reasons for his exit....I must say, it got my attention. Why the abrupt
decision? What did he see that I didn't see?
And, although I continued my involvement in twi....I saw red flags and hypocrisy time and time again. While on staff,
I firmly realized that the "wierwille marketing" was cunningly manufactured. Wierwille had an inner-circle of yes-men
who protected him on every turn. The wierwille motorcoach and clubhouse and dog kennels were like guarded areas.
In 1983, when wierwille wrecked his twig-hopper in Ontario.....it was hauled back to hq in complete secrecy!! The
Ambassador One staffers and other insiders set up a closed-in paint booth in the OSC Warehouse and repaired it and
repainted it....and added even more decals for those motorcycle shows. BUT......no one broke silence! No one leaked
the information that the twig-hopper had been wrecked. Neither did I. In the aura of wierwille-mogdom, this type of
incident would simply diminish wierwille's stature.
Suffice it to say......Rosalie knows that the mystique of wierwille is equivalent to having a goose who lays golden eggs.
Now granted, that goose isn't laying alot of eggs anymore......but a couple here and there is better than none. Without
the wierwille myth to market, the goose has flown south never to return.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
OldSkool
That is a trip.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
skyrider
And......it EXPOSES the double-standard hypocrisy that drips....and drips.....and drips at the way international.
That's why there was a cover-up.
That's why there was a vow of silence.
That's why the inner-circle exists....to protect the image.
That's why so many who were ONCE insiders.....are long gone!
Wouldn't it be fair to ask?
1) Mr. Wierwille......what caused you to be "out of fellowship" and wreck the twig-hopper?
2) Do you not realize what this looks like.....and how the ministry could be blamed?
3) Where was your believing? The Lord would have told you how to avoid this, but you didn't listen.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
PatAnswer
OldSkool
When Rosie took over I remember her telling people to write to her with any complaints they had. Well, I think she got more of a response than she had anticipated and many of the responses had to do with teachings that Craig introduced that seemed suspect at best. Once she opened that can of worms there were a lot of people speaking freely about those things. I think she realized what she had done and had to put out the fire of discontent. That was about the time she came out with the "proven ministry work" rule. If it had been taught by the ministry it was unquestionable. If the ministry had taught it, it had been researched and was the truth.
During the 90's Craig had tried to do away with VPW's name. It was rare to hear someone quote VPW's works, it was all about Craig. Even Rosie herself (who in public was quite the VPW worshipper)would gush about "our Reverend Martindale" and praise his unholy name. Craig did not allow people to quote VPW because it was now Craig's time to shine and the followers were to "get excited about what he's (Craig's) excited about". The "cop-outs" all had VPW's material but Craig proclaimed they were living in the past and following a dead man and that Craig had the "present truth".
When Craig was outed Rosie had quite the task in front of her. Craig's and VPW's teachings seem to be contradictory in places. If she suddenly returned to VPW's materials it would cause the lemmings to question if they had been misled. But the questioning had already started and some of the things Craig taught were easy to disprove. She stated early in her reign that the TWI was like a big ship and it took a long time to change directions. In other words, if she made the changes slowly enough maybe people would not notice they were heading in a different direction.
The end result is that the TWI became bland and boring, regurgitating the same thing over and over. Because the TWI had been stagnant in its doctrine for the past couple of decades or more their teachings have had no depth or life. Most old-timers lost interest and most newcomers were unimpressed. Classes were met with a giant yawn. The life of the ministry has to be in the "twig" because there certainly isn't any in Ohio.
They probably now have the TWI "ship" heading fully on the VPW course but they are decades behind. I've got no interest in following that course, but IF someone was interested then some of the off-shoots would probably be a better fit. They've been moving on while TWI was off course. Some of them have seen and acknowledged a few of the most obvious errors in VPW's teachings and corrected them. TWI has made the mistake of declaring anything that's been taught as truth and unquestionable. They are officially now a dull denomination.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
OldSkool
Yep, and one that cannot separate itself from VPW and his tarnished image. No matter how hard they try to scrub it clean.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
Though it now more resembles a row-boat, does it not?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
"She stated early in her reign that the TWI was like a big ship and it took a long time to change directions."
It took the Titanic less than 3 hours to....*change directions*.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
OldSkool
Craig proved how fast direction could be changed. That's a line of BS. She is deliberately slow on everything and horribly inept at managing anything. And she still has not been able to stop hemorrhaging followers and few there are.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
chockfull
I also remember during this time that after collecting all the complaints, rather than taking any action on them, it was addressed on Corps night that basically all of the US Corps were "unthankful for the Word" compared to the internationals, who they said suffered through great hardships to even get the most basic Word that was presented freely to the US Corps.
Also, with Rosie, this served to be a source of a list of dissenters, much like the Communist leadership of Stalin and Hitler used. The Communists would periodically open up speeches and lies that they were trying to change, thus soliciting opinions on how they could change. Once all the opinions were collected, they executed the people with differing opinions. Rosie did and does this by blackballing those who disagree. She won't do any of the dirty work herself, but has henchmen to perform it for her. People are kicked out, demoted, moved, "placed on probation", and this is done in complete silence. They stopped answering any questions about these actions that were performed in the night with no witnesses, and this produces the appropriate fear in the ranks of the followers to comply or end up like so-and-so. It's a reign of fear and terror, all governed by the yearly "placement meetings" where those involved partake in that evil.
This will be dealt with when Jesus Christ returns, as there aren't any followers with the b@ll$ to do like the inhabitants of the city Jezebel was staying in did and throw her over the wall. All a bunch of eunechs.
Edited by chockfullLink to comment
Share on other sites
chockfull
It always did. You look at how quickly other Christian organizations of hundreds to thousands times the size of TWI can change to align with a new strategic direction. How about looking at companies and businesses? They change even quicker.
Hearing the tripe about "it's a world-wide organization and it takes time to change" is sickening to the stomach. They certainly can pass decrees on what they want to fast enough. However, changing to do things right requires a lawsuit and the threat of personal imprisonment for a high level person. It's stubbornness, hard-headedness, hard-heartedness, and flat out lies and manipulation. Why anyone would put themselves under that kind of authority is just mind-boggling.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
skyrider
Rosalie is a slow-learner.....
In 1981 at Corps Week, wierwille gave the way corps access to the microphone to ask questions. At this time, martindale was designated as president-elect....and many corps had pointed concerns with policies and/or the direction of twi. Well, it didn't take too long before wierwille and martindale got visibly agitated. Confrontation erupted and the question/answer time was shut down.
Around 1992 at Advanced Class Special....same deal. Martindale allowed for questions during the Sunday 'sharing' service.
When will Rosalie learn?
The discontent is there......in 1977, some weren't happy that twi wasn't going to use the new 'pfal '77 class to update the old version. With skinny-tie wierwille, some wanted to 'move on' with a growing surge of excitement. In 1978, wierwille had to confront and stifle corps who wanted to address new research with their corps research papers. Three 8th corps men had ventured into an area that wierwille disapproved.....and, in the years to follow, all corps research papers had to have twi approval BEFORE starting.
Twi has been suppressive for nearly 35 years.....at least.
.
Edited by skyriderLink to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.