What were your expectations for the A.C.?

[Human without the bean]

Whenever TMOGFOT (not correctly put) would come on the scene we were always

encouraged to make love offerings as a sign of respect. And,what I expected from the

AC was to know the love of Christ Eph. 3:19 and manifest all 9 operations, which

I never did.

All that time, money, work, energy combined, you'd figure I could at least

buy one of the revelation manifestations? :o

[waysider]

Yeah. Didn't we all think we were gonna come away from there, knowing how to operate revelation?

[skyrider]

Yeah. Didn't we all think we were gonna come away from there, knowing how to operate revelation?

Well....it does make one wonder who walks via the spirit of God and the limits of said revelation. After all,

wierwille was highly touted in receiving an abundance of revelation......yet, he picked martindale as next

twi-president. And, how did that work out?

[waysider]

Thousands of people sat through the AC. How many picked up a "cookie" or two about Wierwille's true character and lifestyle?

(It doesn't lend much credibility to his ramblings on the "revelation" manifestations.)

[OperaBuff]

Well....it does make one wonder who walks via the spirit of God and the limits of said revelation. After all,

wierwille was highly touted in receiving an abundance of revelation......yet, he picked martindale as next

twi-president. And, how did that work out?

Bingo! We have a bingo!

Wierwille didn't pick Martindale to carry on, he picked him to cover up. But even that didn't work out, revelation or no.

I never took the AC, but like everyone else I assumed it was two weeks of powerful teachings, chock full of deep spiritual insight. I'm rather surprised to read the comments in this thread that it really wasn't. Though, I suppose i shouldn't be surprised. Next you'll be telling me those green and white rectangular AC grad name tags held no special powers.

[skyrider]

Wierwille didn't pick Martindale to carry on, he picked him to cover up.

Wierwille publically stated that the reason why martindale was chosen was......he always OBEYED and JUMPED

when wierwille gave the order. Now, really....doesn't that dismantle every sound-byte, every one-liner,

every retemory of how believers (let alone, apostle/prophet/teacher) are to walk via the spirit?

Think about that for a bit and let it REALLY SOAK IN......wierwille chooses martindale because the guy would

snap to attention and obey his mentor. Is that the take-away from this? So, martindale climbs the corporate

ladder year after year and the successes are pleasing to the CEO........and..????

Now, tell me again why I should take the advanced class?

[OldSkool]

Now, tell me again why I should take the advanced class?

You and a lot of other people want the answer to that question. New student numbers have been so bad that Rosalie started bringing in grads to take the class, of course the kicker is staff numbers are so low that the grads have to work to help support the class. Also, a vast majority of new students are way kids whose parents send them to the class. Probably the number one deterrent for new students is having to be debt free to take the advanced class. Rozilla has been in a corn field since the 70's and surrounded by boot licking yes men for more than a decade. She could not be any further out of touch with reality, unless she slips into Alzheimer or something.

I would like to thank Rev. Rivenbark and The Board of Directors for doing such a tremendous job moving the word and for making it so hard for new students to take the class with their goof ball no debt policy, that hardly anyone shows up!

Really, Rosie should start posting here. With her policies and how she has made everything so boring and drab, she is running more people away from the way international than I ever could here at GSC.

[WordWolf]

Wierwille publically stated that the reason why martindale was chosen was......he always OBEYED and JUMPED

when wierwille gave the order. Now, really....doesn't that dismantle every sound-byte, every one-liner,

every retemory of how believers (let alone, apostle/prophet/teacher) are to walk via the spirit?

Think about that for a bit and let it REALLY SOAK IN......wierwille chooses martindale because the guy would

snap to attention and obey his mentor. Is that the take-away from this? So, martindale climbs the corporate

ladder year after year and the successes are pleasing to the CEO........and..????

Now, tell me again why I should take the advanced class?

I know he stated that PRIVATELY when someone asked him.

I don't think it was stated PUBLICKLY. (Remember, vpw used ONE face for the public and AT LEAST ONE MORE

in private. So, he could be more candid in private.)

What I had been told of lcm's selection was that it was like Acts 1 and the lots were cast for him.

This, of course, was a complete LIE, since actually people said they thought someone ELSE

was a better choice-Walter, etc. vpw had lcm picked YEARS in advance. (See "vp and me".)

vpw then told everyone to submit their recommendations to deceive them.

If we had known lcm was picked purely because he hopped whenever vpw said "frog", then

we would have had a strong clue we needed to look deeper into things. vpw passed along the teachings

of others concerning the spirit- Stiles, Leonard, Bullinger- but in PRACTICE never UNDERSTOOD

them and certainly didn't PRACTICE them. Oh, he occasionally PRETENDED he did, but the more we

look into things, the more that becomes OBVIOUSLY a SHAM.

The man demonstrated speaking in tongues with the same sentence every time. He not only was

faking it, he wasn't even trying hard to fake it because his audience was ready to disbelieve

any evidence he was lying. He faked what he claimed was the FOUNDATION for 9 manifestations.

If he faked the FOUNDATION, the entire STRUCTURE was faked or flawed. That's why the Advanced

class has a lot of lofty talk, but no demonstrations of divine power.

=========================

What did I expect?

I expected truly ADVANCED material- deep, profound stuff I'd need to struggle to keep up with.

I had a notepad and prepared to take notes and record my notes with comments between the classes

so I could study them later in much greater detail. However, the material was a LOT lighter than

expected. Tellingly, even cg commented-when running it in Gartmore- that we were covering some

basic things- but he was very clever. He made it sound like we WOULD have covered more Advanced

material, but the students needed a brush-up on some things instead. Rather than jump into

instructions on healing in greater detail, we spent entire sessions on "God loves you" "God heals

you". Supposedly, that was the fault of the students who failed to arise sufficiently to just

jump in after a few minutes of instruction. Also, what instruction there WAS, was heavy on

intellectual factoids and very light on practicality of healing. I've gotten some more insightful

comments SECOND-HAND from a Christian nurse who explained healing-to someone who was passing along

what she remembered the nurse saying.

The Advanced class is built up as incredibly deep and insightful, as being the class for those who

have "arrived", so to speak. Compared to what is CLAIMED, what is DELIVERED is actually quite

a disappointment. By now, this should be no surprise- twi's practice has regularly been to

use the sizzle to sell the steak- then to put cheap burgers on the plates and claim that it's

sirloin steak and that anyone who doesn't understand that isn't "spiritual." That's pretty much

how it does EVERYTHING.

[skyrider]

I know he stated that PRIVATELY when someone asked him.

I don't think it was stated PUBLICKLY. (Remember, vpw used ONE face for the public and AT LEAST ONE MORE

in private. So, he could be more candid in private.)

I'm quite certain that wierwille shared this information at hq during lunchtime......so, perhaps

you are correct WW, depending on how one views "privately" vs "publicly." To me, he said it in a

public setting.....albeit, at hq with the staff present.

But....I can clearly see how another person might say that this was not known to the general public.

.

Edited January 9, 2012 by skyrider

[chockfull]

Really, Rosie should start posting here. With her policies and how she has made everything so boring and drab, she is running more people away from the way international than I ever could here at GSC.

That's kind of funny. Of course the allegations from TWI about GSC are that we are running people off. That couldn't be further from the truth. We are speaking the unadulterated, uncensored truth here. The way you know it is the way it is real, and doesn't sound like one of the Stepford Wives robots. It is backed by account after account of facts regarding the leadership of TWI. Individually, those accounts are stifled, and the shunning practice keeps TWI followers from hearing them or thinking about them. The shunning also keeps patterns from being seen. Collectively, in a place where all get to tell their story freely, the voices are not shut down by the Pharisees. The truth is that the buffoons in charge of TWI are running people off. Their morally reprehensible behavior, which they hide behind closed doors, and the putrid fruit in their lives shows forth truer than anything. Their knees, on which they prostrate themselves, and their lips, which continually kiss the ring of the current "pope" are full of idolatry being putrid to God. If people see that unmasked, and leave TWI because of an upset spiritual stomach, that's not the fault of those telling it like it is. That's the fault of those not living it. Those who as Paul said "seemed to be somewhat, but added nothing to me". Their pomp, position, and treachery will all be brought down by Jesus Christ one day, and they will be ashamed.

We here at GSC aren't sucking the life out of the teachings at TWI making them worse than processed elevator musack. They do that all on their own. We don't have onerous rules governing each other here. They do that.

What should you expect out of the Advanced Class run by that group of morons?

Duller and Dullerer

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

never took the AC but learned more from Sam Storms, Dennis Bennet, David Ireland(all Whitaker House published books) and yes got a copy of Advanced Class outline/syllabus from a former Wayfer.

[WordWolf]

I'm quite certain that wierwille shared this information at hq during lunchtime......so, perhaps

you are correct WW, depending on how one views "privately" vs "publicly." To me, he said it in a

public setting.....albeit, at hq with the staff present.

But....I can clearly see how another person might say that this was not known to the general public.

.

I was unaware, until today, that he'd said it during lunchtime.

[mudflaps]

I took LCM's A.C. in the late 90's.I expected to be amazed to learn about the other manifestations,looking back though I think the scriptures they taught related well to the manifestations,but as far as how to operate the manifestations they did not have a clue,reason being they just cannot get it through their heads that it's up to God to give revelation,heal etc.,It's not up to the wayfer.

Off the subject,E& H#%*!y coordinated my class and I think that guy has some issues.Is he still around?

[OldSkool]

Off the subject,E& H#%*!y coordinated my class and I think that guy has some issues.Is he still around?

As far as I know. It's alleged that his Mrs. used to arrange for in-rez corps women to be in cabin 12 the same time LCM was so he could be with them. Also, that she had her affairs with him as well. I understand the husband knows about this and a lot of damage control was put in place with them. They left Gunnison and were at HQ for a stretch, E had a few high profile assignments, taught corps meetings, etc. Then they went to Dayton to do a branch and have since been reassigned to another branch out west. Not sure where they are now.

[excathedra]

Next you'll be telling me those green and white rectangular AC grad name tags held no special powers.

you need to get a green and white or white and green corps tag for the special powers

[skyrider]

you need to get a green and white or white and green corps tag for the special powers

Yeah.....but the wood-grain nametags have direct connections to 'The Force being with you.'

[Twinky]

OldSkool, are you saying that Jacqui H is another of LCM's women? If so, when, what sort of time period?

(Mind you, doesn't surprise me...have ceased to be surprised by such revelations.

I thought the H0rn3ys were basically all right. J was quite fun to be around and quite laid back. E had a sterner side. He liked getting stuck into work though, hard worker, led from the front as far as I could ascertain. (They were my Corps Coords). He gave us some serious tickings-off though and once threatened to kick us all out because some weren't wearing hats on a calm day when the air temp was subzero, and a few other things like that. I got the impression that it wasn't really "him" but something he'd learned as an add-on, or been told to do or was trying to measure up to doing.

Anyway back to the AC - too long ago to remember, but from high expectations, I wondered if I'd missed something.

I did find some time afterwards though to study (alone) various words relating to healing, cure, etc, an interest from the AC.

Also studied some stuff about what are signs, what are miracles, and what are wonders, and who each is aimed at. That was interesting.

Edited January 10, 2012 by Twinky

[OldSkool]

OldSkool, are you saying that Jacqui H is another of LCM's women? If so, when, what sort of time period?

(Mind you, doesn't surprise me...have ceased to be surprised by such revelations.

I private messaged you.

[socks]

It was so weird. I'd heard about the A.C. for a couple years and understood it to be great, who wouldn't want it? There were a few running around the country that I'd heard of and all reports were on how effective they were and that the results were even cooler than expected. So I figured, heck yeah. I was young but knew a good deal when I saw one, even then.

So I got the paperwork and started saving for it but had some questions once I started looking through the agreement for the A.C.. The information was so confusing and I knew that confusion was wrong. That was my first indication that something was outta whack and I probably should have known better but I had heard such good things about this A.C.. So I called back to the Way Nash in Ohio and got either Dorothy or Rhoda, I forget which of them and told them I really needed to talk through some things.

They were very nice and asked me what questions I had about the A.C. and I hit them with the biggest one right off -

why was it going to take two weeks to finish the Air Conditioning?!

I'd gotten quotes for 1-2 days at most. from others and it just seemed like a long time.

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

It was so weird. I'd heard about the A.C. for a couple years and understood it to be great, who wouldn't want it? There were a few running around the country that I'd heard of and all reports were on how effective they were and that the results were even cooler than expected. So I figured, heck yeah. I was young but knew a good deal when I saw one, even then.

So I got the paperwork and started saving for it but had some questions once I started looking through the agreement for the A.C.. The information was so confusing and I knew that confusion was wrong. That was my first indication that something was outta whack and I probably should have known better but I had heard such good things about this A.C.. So I called back to the Way Nash in Ohio and got either Dorothy or Rhoda, I forget which of them and told them I really needed to talk through some things.

They were very nice and asked me what questions I had about the A.C. and I hit them with the biggest one right off -

why was it going to take two weeks to finish the Air Conditioning?!

I'd gotten quotes for 1-2 days at most. from others and it just seemed like a long time.

O good God crash cymbal please

[socks]

Sorry.

I had another dust up with the same year - due to the fact that I'd been without A.C. for several months that summer my sinuses and ears were really plugged up and I had trouble hearing. Total drag.

Even bigger drag then when I had to complain to them after the A.C. because I'd understood them to say that after the A.C. finished up each of us would then get our own A.C. Grad Maytag. I needed appliances and despite the fact that I thought they said they were green I figured hey - what a cool deal - A.C. and a new, green Fridge.

You can imagine my surprise when they handed me that little green nametag.

So weird, SO weird.

[waysider]

You should have known something was amiss... Harvest Gold was all the rage that year.

Edited January 11, 2012 by waysider

[TrustAndObey]

Wasn't it during AC '98 that LCM got caught by some NOT in the know. And that produced a whole backlash of cover ups, write offs, and good byes?!

I wished I would have had the learning they gleaned from the class! Keep your wife away from the MOG! Would have saved me a good number of years had I known!

[socks]

Stylin' ways! But alas I was young.

Having a "Harmony" in the home was another, although by the end of PFAL I realized there was no Harmony being handed out, not even a Kay for that matter..

I was a Gibson man by that time but heck, I could have used a Harmony for solo gigs. But again - fooled!

[waysider]

Edited January 11, 2012 by waysider