Now, now....he's trying to change the subject and lob in an insult.
The only reason you started this thread was an angry reaction to stuff I posted on the sexual predators thread. Go ahead, continue lecturing me on how morally superior you are to me because I hate and you don't.
Just for the record, VP defined hate as...
1) intense dislike
2) the absolute hate of the devil, only possible to those born of the seed of the serpent among humans
BTW, any wayfers ever fly airplanes into megachurches? Or gay rights conventions? Or RCC or Jewish gatherings? I guess TWI was never committed enough to their "hate".
Now, now....he's trying to change the subject and lob in an insult.
The only reason you started this thread was an angry reaction to stuff I posted on the sexual predators thread. Go ahead, continue lecturing me on how morally superior you are to me because I hate and you don't.
Just for the record, VP defined hate as...
1) intense dislike
2) the absolute hate of the devil, only possible to those born of the seed of the serpent among humans
BTW, any wayfers ever fly airplanes into megachurches? Or gay rights conventions? Or RCC or Jewish gatherings? I guess TWI was never committed enough to their "hate".
I am just curious you seem to be very pro-TWI and pro-vpw.... Why do you come to GSC when the purpose of it is to help people walk away from what you are in support of....
If you Don't support TWI or VPW ummmm what do you like or dislike about each?
2) the absolute hate of the devil, only possible to those born of the seed of the serpent among humans
What authority did Wierwille have to redefine "hate"?
BTW, any wayfers ever fly airplanes into megachurches? Or gay rights conventions? Or RCC or Jewish gatherings? I guess TWI was never committed enough to their "hate".
False dilemma----Not at all related to the thread topic.
I am just curious you seem to be very pro-TWI and pro-vpw.... Why do you come to GSC when the purpose of it is to help people walk away from what you are in support of....
If you Don't support TWI or VPW ummmm what do you like or dislike about each?
Clear up my own ignorance....
And....to add to that, if you're so pro-twi:
1) Why don't you, johniam, go to twi home fellowships?
2) Why don't you abundantly share to twi and further their efforts?
3) Why do you hang with splinter groups and NOT the "genuine" groupmarch?
twi'ers have also told people that they or their family would drop dead if they left twi. Before you
excuse them by saying adults should know better, yes, MOST adults do-but those indoctrinated into
twi are trained to believe ridiculous nonsense and go to extremes defending twi.
When my mom left TWI a couple years ago her former fellowship coordinator went off on her and told her the exact same things and then some. Horrible things would happen to her and her family. And I bet some of you though this sort of thing didn't happen anymore in the way international.
I am just curious you seem to be very pro-TWI and pro-vpw.... Why do you come to GSC when the purpose of it is to help people walk away from what you are in support of....
If you Don't support TWI or VPW ummmm what do you like or dislike about each?
Clear up my own ignorance....
Not exactly pro twi. My family was forced out in 1994. Although my wife and I didn't meet until 1985, we each took foundational pfal in 1977. So after 18 years we were forced out. I have posted many unflattering things about twi on GSC, but I still try to separate what people do from what God has done. Some GSers are not very tolerant of this.
I don't currently support twi, financially or otherwise, but I was in it for 18 years. The dominant memories I have are of being loved by my brothers and sisters in Christ and visciously hated by twi's enemies. When I was in high school I was stoned every day, yet, people who didn't hang with me were at least civil to me. Now, nobody from my high school wants anything to do with me. Not other ex stoners, nor Christians. Nobody. They're all bigots...or at the least, very fearful, easily manipulated by a media label. I've paid a price for choosing twi, but I won't deny they caused major help in my life. "Give GOD the praise, for we know twi is a sinner". Yeah, well, at least twi was there for me at a critical time. I don't think I would have taken my own life were it not for twi, but I probably would have been in and out of prison. TWI gave me new friends allowing me to get away from my drug friends. My support of twi is for what they did for me in the past. I still go to a fellowship run by ex twi people. Interestingly, I just found out there is a current twi fellowship in the STL area. Thought about just going there and pretending I'm a new person for grins, but...naw!
As for VPW, I never knew him personally. As the main mouthpiece of twi IMO he was pleasant. On 2 occasions I met him up close, once at a weekend in the word, once at the house of His healing presence at a ROA. Again, both times, pleasant. Everybody here portrays him as this uber driven sex maniac. I have known several people going all the way back to high school whose lives revolved around their sex lives and who acted down right self righteous over how much sex they got, similar to someone who is self righteous over their church attendance, or over their abstination from eating meat, or whatever it is. You don't have to be religious to be self righteous. These people, all male, acted like they were morally superior to anyone who didn't make sex their number one prioroty. I never got that from VP. You could say he didn't act like that around certain people or at certain events, but that kind of thing is difficult to hide.
I like pfal. It still makes sense. They can micro analyze it all they want; I still SIT, I still get prayers answered, I still have peace in my heart. I shudder to think how my life might have turned out without twi/pfal. VP taught pfal, whether he originated the material or not.
quote:
1) Why don't you, johniam, go to twi home fellowships?
2) Why don't you abundantly share to twi and further their efforts?
3) Why do you hang with splinter groups and NOT the "genuine" groupmarch?
I think I've answered those questions, but shortly after I stopped going to twig TWI sent a few abs checks back to me telling me to give my money to whoever is teaching me the word. Weird, huh? Anybody else get a twi "rebate"?
Not exactly pro twi. My family was forced out in 1994. Although my wife and I didn't meet until 1985, we each took foundational pfal in 1977. So after 18 years we were forced out. I have posted many unflattering things about twi on GSC, but I still try to separate what people do from what God has done.
johniam....with all your postings, you still have a disconnect.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....then wierwille would NOT have FORCED OUT followers who fell asleep in his corps meeting....or the sexual predation would never have surfaced.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....then staff and corps women would not have been FORCED OUT to silence their outcries....nor would wierwille have labeled them "possessed" and remove all credibility.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....the whole organization would have not been a pyramid, tyrannical dictatorship.....nor would the corps program have been a secluded indoctrination camp.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....then grace would not have been used as a license to sin! Pfal was filled with private interpretation of a man's lust for sin and self-willed indulgences.
Not exactly pro twi. My family was forced out in 1994. Although my wife and I didn't meet until 1985, we each took foundational pfal in 1977. So after 18 years we were forced out. I have posted many unflattering things about twi on GSC, but I still try to separate what people do from what God has done. Some GSers are not very tolerant of this.
I think seperating out what people did from what God did is a good thing and important for deliverance. It's probably a fair criticism that some of us don't tolerate that well. However, to be fair sometimes I think you are deliberately baiting people.
I don't currently support twi, financially or otherwise, but I was in it for 18 years. The dominant memories I have are of being loved by my brothers and sisters in Christ and visciously hated by twi's enemies. When I was in high school I was stoned every day, yet, people who didn't hang with me were at least civil to me. Now, nobody from my high school wants anything to do with me. Not other ex stoners, nor Christians. Nobody. They're all bigots...or at the least, very fearful, easily manipulated by a media label. I've paid a price for choosing twi, but I won't deny they caused major help in my life. "Give GOD the praise, for we know twi is a sinner". Yeah, well, at least twi was there for me at a critical time. I don't think I would have taken my own life were it not for twi, but I probably would have been in and out of prison. TWI gave me new friends allowing me to get away from my drug friends. My support of twi is for what they did for me in the past. I still go to a fellowship run by ex twi people. Interestingly, I just found out there is a current twi fellowship in the STL area. Thought about just going there and pretending I'm a new person for grins, but...naw!
Yeah, people in society and mainstream Christianity don't know how to handle the "I've been in a cult" story well. I usually leave that part out, and just focus on the Christianity part. Just because God delivered me while I was under the authority of those idiots doesn't mean that I have to continue to be stupid enough to allow myself to be under any semblance of their authority in the future.
As for VPW, I never knew him personally. As the main mouthpiece of twi IMO he was pleasant. On 2 occasions I met him up close, once at a weekend in the word, once at the house of His healing presence at a ROA. Again, both times, pleasant. Everybody here portrays him as this uber driven sex maniac. I have known several people going all the way back to high school whose lives revolved around their sex lives and who acted down right self righteous over how much sex they got, similar to someone who is self righteous over their church attendance, or over their abstination from eating meat, or whatever it is. You don't have to be religious to be self righteous. These people, all male, acted like they were morally superior to anyone who didn't make sex their number one prioroty. I never got that from VP. You could say he didn't act like that around certain people or at certain events, but that kind of thing is difficult to hide.
VP was a flim-flam man, a snake oil salesman. The bulk of his "escapades" took place in the years of his life he was 55-65 yrs old. Not exactly the years one's libido is raging rampant. Probably more chilling was his false vision of himself as how he was "healing" these previously abused girls. VP came off very charismatic, which is why he fooled so many. LCM and RFR couldn't pull his act off. A screaming Okie lunatic and a controlling, stepford-positive southern hag somehow just don't seem to pull in the numbers.
I like pfal. It still makes sense. They can micro analyze it all they want; I still SIT, I still get prayers answered, I still have peace in my heart. I shudder to think how my life might have turned out without twi/pfal. VP taught pfal, whether he originated the material or not. quote:
He also taught us to worship him as a "father in the Word". That's where the leaven really keeps him encrusted.
I think I've answered those questions, but shortly after I stopped going to twig TWI sent a few abs checks back to me telling me to give my money to whoever is teaching me the word. Weird, huh? Anybody else get a twi "rebate"?
real simple. They think that you are, or potentially could be a "nutcase" or an embarrassment..
I was maneuvered out of just.. going to twig.. because they thought my then wife might potentially be "nuts"..
ask Frank123..
If I were you.. and in a lot of ways I am..
well, I'd ask a few questions.
every human soul I've aligned myself with has been for the lack of better words, nuts. Including myself.
:)
Honest to gawd..
a money grubbing, Republican (sorry) organization.. sending back to you the entrance fee..
"I never got that from VP. You could say he didn't act like that around certain people or at certain events, but that kind of thing is difficult to hide."
I wouldn't be so sure. The evening news is frequently replete with accounts of people who've been fooled by the unscrupulous. Many times, the people who are the most trusted turn out to be the very ones unworthy of trust. (Don't we already have a current thread that addresses that subject?)
As for VPW, I never knew him personally. As the main mouthpiece of twi IMO he was pleasant. On 2 occasions I met him up close, once at a weekend in the word, once at the house of His healing presence at a ROA. Again, both times, pleasant.
Both times......PUBLIC.
Both times......mere acknowledgement of one's presence.
With this background, I gain the understanding that you, johniam, were never around wierwille at all. So, all your postings, all your pontificating of wierwille's character and integrity is thru the pfal and/or teaching stage platform.
Some of us were on staff and brushed shoulders with wierwille on a daily basis.....lunch in the BRC, visiting with him on the wierwille porch or front lawn, dined with him via Mrs. W's invite, head table experiences, nightowls, one-on-one time, way prod. rehearsals, high country caravan stuff, etc. And, even then......there was a very PRIVATE, SEDUCTIVE SIDE OF WIERWILLE that many of us never seen. Some of the women have come forward with this information.
Johniam....your credibility to add to these discussions is definitely waning in my opinion. You have "outed" yourself on this one.
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OldSkool
Stop with the flame bait, trollkin.
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WordWolf
Now, now....he's trying to change the subject and lob in an insult.
Without meaning to, however, he's pointed out something we haven't discussed yet.
THE CONTRAST.
See,
at the GSC, a lot of us agree on a number of things,
like "it's wrong to drug and rape women" and "it's wrong to plagiarize things and claim you threw
away all your books and used only the Bible and a connection with God to write stuff"
and "men of God are supposed to conform to an acceptable standard of conduct that matches what
the Bible says", things like that.
We also disagree about many things-some are not Christians, some are adherents to a specific
denomination or a different one, others do not.
Why do we agree on a number of things yet disagree on so many others?
Well,
that's a matter of THINKING.
We each use our free will (as I see it) and DECIDE what to think.
If a religious leader says "The truth of a matter is A". we think about that.
Maybe it's A, maybe it's not-A. Maybe it's B, C or D.
Maybe sometimes it's A, and sometimes not-A or B.
When it came to twi, we were all told to think in a specific way, and social sanctions
(and sometimes other sanctions) were brought to enforce conformity if and when we disagreed.
In twi, there's a lot of uniformity of speech and "groupthink."
In the GSC, there's a lot of differences of opinion, but despite that, we agree on some things.
Why? Because we thought about them and it is sensible to think those things.
Examples:
1) It's a good idea to conform to the letter of the law for US citizens right now.
2) It's good to think for yourself.
3) vpw was a man who claimed to have a special connection with God, yet deceived everyone on a
grand scale, including HIMSELF.
Do we agree on them because we were TOLD? Do we agree on them because of INERTIA?
No. we thought for ourselves and came to similar conclusions despite getting there different ways.
==========================
So, twi told me who to hate.
However,
I don't hate who twi told me to hate.
Who do I hate now?
Well, child molesters and the like, rapists, like that.
I dislike the people who deceive others, including themselves.
I don't HATE them.
If the suggestion is that I "hate" twi, I do not. I dislike the organization, I dislike the
cadre running it, and I feel sorry for the people whose bodies and minds are still trapped therein.
If the suggestion is that I "hate" vpw, actually, I don't. I have CONTEMPT towards him,
and when he was alive, I would have been willing to kill him with my own hands for the
monstrous evil he performed on women for whom Christ died. That wouldn't have been out of hate,
but out of a sense of "cause and effect". He did actions which deserved a specific response,
and should have gotten it. I actually feel sory for lcm, because he once knew better, and vpw
destroyed his life and taught him to destroy the lives of others while thinking he was doing
God's will. lcm is a prisoner of the "education" he received in twi. He doesn't even know what
was wrong or why.
If the suggestion is that I "hate" other posters, I dislike when they decide to misuse the quote
function to deliberately confuse issues, and I dislike when they try and change the subject when
they see an intelligent discussion but don't like the subject matter but lack the evidence or
logic to make intelligent points against what they disagree with. I dislike when someone sees
an intelligent discussion, and thinks a reaction and a clever comment is somehow worthy of the
rest of the discussion. But I don't "hate" them. I FEEL SORRY for the posters when they do
that. Those posters are prisoners of twi, victims as much as any woman vpw raped.
They are still operating with the same "programs" vpw instilled-
-hate anyone who says bad things about vpw, even if they are 100% true
-live in ignorance that there's a LOT of things twi and vpw never knew, and make them your STANDARD
-make blanket accusations whenever you don't like something rather than try to understand it.
So, the suggestion that I'm "hating" something, actually,
illustrates what this thread is about, quite nicely.
A blanket accusation posted in ignorance, fueled by blind hatred.
Frankly, the thread was incomplete without a live example on it.
But someone volunteered to enter one. :)
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johniam
quote:
Now, now....he's trying to change the subject and lob in an insult.
The only reason you started this thread was an angry reaction to stuff I posted on the sexual predators thread. Go ahead, continue lecturing me on how morally superior you are to me because I hate and you don't.
Just for the record, VP defined hate as...
1) intense dislike
2) the absolute hate of the devil, only possible to those born of the seed of the serpent among humans
BTW, any wayfers ever fly airplanes into megachurches? Or gay rights conventions? Or RCC or Jewish gatherings? I guess TWI was never committed enough to their "hate".
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Naten00
I am just curious you seem to be very pro-TWI and pro-vpw.... Why do you come to GSC when the purpose of it is to help people walk away from what you are in support of....
If you Don't support TWI or VPW ummmm what do you like or dislike about each?
Clear up my own ignorance....
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waysider
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skyrider
And....to add to that, if you're so pro-twi:
1) Why don't you, johniam, go to twi home fellowships?
2) Why don't you abundantly share to twi and further their efforts?
3) Why do you hang with splinter groups and NOT the "genuine" groupmarch?
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WordWolf
I've posted plenty on this thread in 2 pages already that's worth discussing for or against,
and the only things you can find worth commenting on are ONE sentence from each of
2 lengths posts, which you use to level an insult. Now I feel sorry for you. I don't
know how much of my posts you actually read, but you certainly don't PERCEIVE most of
any of them. After months and months of you singling out little sentences and erasing
their contexts, I realize that the majority of the post becomes a mental BLUR and it's
like reading it as "blah blah blah 'something I can insult' blah blah blah."
(I might have noticed it sooner but I have lots of things on my mind.)
BTW, one of vpw's trademarks was making a lot of things about HIM and about twi that were
completely unrelated. According to him at different times, twi people living in California
prevented the San Andreas Fault from having earthquakes, and Oklahoma City from having one,
and so on. He supposedly was invited to meet the President when actually he requested an
invite to an event where the President appeared, and they never MET but they were in the
same reception hall at the same time.
Amazing how so many things around the GSC become about you-whether or not someone's mentioning you
or even thinking of you.
This thread is about a subject that's been on my mind for YEARS. I've noticed you're unable to actually
refute any point anyone's raised, and lowered the discussion to "yo momma" instead.
The part about radical fundamentalism takes off from discussions I had the other year with someone
else not on the GSC, after I read some news about a Muslim country and what people were being talked into.
As others have agreed, it's applicable to twi and post-twi experiences as well.
By definition, I was thinking of a NUMBER of people, which is obvious to anyone who reads even the
TITLE of the thread and understands it, let alone the first post. I addressed hatred of Jews as well
as other targets. Were you making anti-Semetic remarks on another thread lately?
It wouldn't even matter if I WAS trying to actually "lecture" you, you only cherry-pick out the things you
want to insult as it is. I could post something worthy of a Noble Peace Prize and you'd still be
objecting to it.
I never said I don't "hate"-in fact, I specified I hate child molesters, so, again, your reading
comprehension leaves something to be desired. So, you subtracted from the word of WordWolf, which means
you no longer have the word of WordWolf. As for being "morally superior", I said nothing about that.
You added to the word of WordWolf, which means you no longer have the word of WordWolf. You have what
vpw (incorrectly) referred to as "private interpretation".
So, one sentence, 3 errors (not actually lecturing when posting, moral superiority, not hating.)
I never even suggested it was wrong to have ANY hate, but there's SPECIFIC things that vpw adherents
all seem to hate in LOCKSTEP HARMONY.
A) He doesn't get to redefine words already in usage in the English language, and it's a bit
shocking that anyone would take his definitions seriously 25 years after he was dead, and over a decade
after he was exposed as a fraud, plagiarist, con man, and man of the flesh rather than a man who
walked after the Spirit.
B) Supposedly, according to his "definition", any "strong dislike" is a "hate"
(thus, missing a bus when you're in a hurry results in "hate")
and 1/2 his definition is impossible for anyone in twi to ever feel. That's a pretty disjointed
"definition", which makes sense when you realize the man's degree was in HOMILETICS and not
ENGLISH or PHILOLOGY or any related subject. He had no business pretending he knew enough to claim
a definition of an existing word-and changing it.
None of that addresses the screaming he did at people whenever he felt like it. Was that "hate"
as well?
He also taught twi'ers to hate the things I mentioned in the first post, even if he never sent
out a blunt memo saying "Henceforth, thou shalt hate the following groups...."
I'm curious if you're even aware that's what this thread is ABOUT.
Different radical fundamentalist groups have succeeded at different levels with their adherents.
twi'ers are not known for killing sprees-but they have been known for demanding abortions or beating
a child to the point he might actually die when what he needed was a medical exam and medication
to correct a chemical imbalance. twi'ers have also reduced a Holocaust survivor to tears when
they interrupted her INVITED appearance somewhere by screaming at her and calling her a liar.
Only one poster's intervention stopped one man from going off with a gun to shoot someone dead
because vpw said outright that someone should kill him.
twi'ers have also told people that they or their family would drop dead if they left twi. Before you
excuse them by saying adults should know better, yes, MOST adults do-but those indoctrinated into
twi are trained to believe ridiculous nonsense and go to extremes defending twi. That leaves aside
children who were told such things and were in real fear that they would drop dead.
So, SOME radical fundamentalist groups have succeeded more than vpw in instilling hatred, ignorance
and blanket accusations. Of course, they had a lead of centuries on him. For only having a few
decades, he was quite successful. Decades after his death, there's still people who refuse to
go beyond what vpw taught them, because he said "You can't go beyond what you've been taught"
and they accepted that. Putting yourself in chains and staying in them for decades is not
a sensible thing for an adult to do, whether the chains are steel or dogma.
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OldSkool
When my mom left TWI a couple years ago her former fellowship coordinator went off on her and told her the exact same things and then some. Horrible things would happen to her and her family. And I bet some of you though this sort of thing didn't happen anymore in the way international.
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waysider
"You can't go beyond what you've been taught."
Can't?....or don't want to?
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johniam
quote:
I am just curious you seem to be very pro-TWI and pro-vpw.... Why do you come to GSC when the purpose of it is to help people walk away from what you are in support of....
If you Don't support TWI or VPW ummmm what do you like or dislike about each?
Clear up my own ignorance....
Not exactly pro twi. My family was forced out in 1994. Although my wife and I didn't meet until 1985, we each took foundational pfal in 1977. So after 18 years we were forced out. I have posted many unflattering things about twi on GSC, but I still try to separate what people do from what God has done. Some GSers are not very tolerant of this.
I don't currently support twi, financially or otherwise, but I was in it for 18 years. The dominant memories I have are of being loved by my brothers and sisters in Christ and visciously hated by twi's enemies. When I was in high school I was stoned every day, yet, people who didn't hang with me were at least civil to me. Now, nobody from my high school wants anything to do with me. Not other ex stoners, nor Christians. Nobody. They're all bigots...or at the least, very fearful, easily manipulated by a media label. I've paid a price for choosing twi, but I won't deny they caused major help in my life. "Give GOD the praise, for we know twi is a sinner". Yeah, well, at least twi was there for me at a critical time. I don't think I would have taken my own life were it not for twi, but I probably would have been in and out of prison. TWI gave me new friends allowing me to get away from my drug friends. My support of twi is for what they did for me in the past. I still go to a fellowship run by ex twi people. Interestingly, I just found out there is a current twi fellowship in the STL area. Thought about just going there and pretending I'm a new person for grins, but...naw!
As for VPW, I never knew him personally. As the main mouthpiece of twi IMO he was pleasant. On 2 occasions I met him up close, once at a weekend in the word, once at the house of His healing presence at a ROA. Again, both times, pleasant. Everybody here portrays him as this uber driven sex maniac. I have known several people going all the way back to high school whose lives revolved around their sex lives and who acted down right self righteous over how much sex they got, similar to someone who is self righteous over their church attendance, or over their abstination from eating meat, or whatever it is. You don't have to be religious to be self righteous. These people, all male, acted like they were morally superior to anyone who didn't make sex their number one prioroty. I never got that from VP. You could say he didn't act like that around certain people or at certain events, but that kind of thing is difficult to hide.
I like pfal. It still makes sense. They can micro analyze it all they want; I still SIT, I still get prayers answered, I still have peace in my heart. I shudder to think how my life might have turned out without twi/pfal. VP taught pfal, whether he originated the material or not.
quote:
1) Why don't you, johniam, go to twi home fellowships?
2) Why don't you abundantly share to twi and further their efforts?
3) Why do you hang with splinter groups and NOT the "genuine" groupmarch?
I think I've answered those questions, but shortly after I stopped going to twig TWI sent a few abs checks back to me telling me to give my money to whoever is teaching me the word. Weird, huh? Anybody else get a twi "rebate"?
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skyrider
johniam....with all your postings, you still have a disconnect.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....then wierwille would NOT have FORCED OUT followers who fell asleep in his corps meeting....or the sexual predation would never have surfaced.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....then staff and corps women would not have been FORCED OUT to silence their outcries....nor would wierwille have labeled them "possessed" and remove all credibility.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....the whole organization would have not been a pyramid, tyrannical dictatorship.....nor would the corps program have been a secluded indoctrination camp.
If wierwille/twi were truly "of God"....then grace would not have been used as a license to sin! Pfal was filled with private interpretation of a man's lust for sin and self-willed indulgences.
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chockfull
I think seperating out what people did from what God did is a good thing and important for deliverance. It's probably a fair criticism that some of us don't tolerate that well. However, to be fair sometimes I think you are deliberately baiting people.
Yeah, people in society and mainstream Christianity don't know how to handle the "I've been in a cult" story well. I usually leave that part out, and just focus on the Christianity part. Just because God delivered me while I was under the authority of those idiots doesn't mean that I have to continue to be stupid enough to allow myself to be under any semblance of their authority in the future.
VP was a flim-flam man, a snake oil salesman. The bulk of his "escapades" took place in the years of his life he was 55-65 yrs old. Not exactly the years one's libido is raging rampant. Probably more chilling was his false vision of himself as how he was "healing" these previously abused girls. VP came off very charismatic, which is why he fooled so many. LCM and RFR couldn't pull his act off. A screaming Okie lunatic and a controlling, stepford-positive southern hag somehow just don't seem to pull in the numbers.
He also taught us to worship him as a "father in the Word". That's where the leaven really keeps him encrusted.
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Ham
real simple. They think that you are, or potentially could be a "nutcase" or an embarrassment..
I was maneuvered out of just.. going to twig.. because they thought my then wife might potentially be "nuts"..
ask Frank123..
If I were you.. and in a lot of ways I am..
well, I'd ask a few questions.
every human soul I've aligned myself with has been for the lack of better words, nuts. Including myself.
:)
Honest to gawd..
a money grubbing, Republican (sorry) organization.. sending back to you the entrance fee..
maybe, just maybe .. you're too far right wing.
It's an inquiry I would apply to myself..
if I needed to..
Maybe you don't want to see it..
sorry, the squirrel is drunk..
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waysider
"I never got that from VP. You could say he didn't act like that around certain people or at certain events, but that kind of thing is difficult to hide."
I wouldn't be so sure. The evening news is frequently replete with accounts of people who've been fooled by the unscrupulous. Many times, the people who are the most trusted turn out to be the very ones unworthy of trust. (Don't we already have a current thread that addresses that subject?)
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skyrider
Both times......PUBLIC.
Both times......mere acknowledgement of one's presence.
With this background, I gain the understanding that you, johniam, were never around wierwille at all. So, all your postings, all your pontificating of wierwille's character and integrity is thru the pfal and/or teaching stage platform.
Some of us were on staff and brushed shoulders with wierwille on a daily basis.....lunch in the BRC, visiting with him on the wierwille porch or front lawn, dined with him via Mrs. W's invite, head table experiences, nightowls, one-on-one time, way prod. rehearsals, high country caravan stuff, etc. And, even then......there was a very PRIVATE, SEDUCTIVE SIDE OF WIERWILLE that many of us never seen. Some of the women have come forward with this information.
Johniam....your credibility to add to these discussions is definitely waning in my opinion. You have "outed" yourself on this one.
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