For the most part, a certain level of education was a cutoff in twi.
If your education exceeded a certain point, you were discouraged.
That point generally was "know enough on a subject to be able to document
that twi's top idiot who's making things up as he;s going along
is completely wrong."
In twi, vpw was assumed to be correct no matter WHAT he said, as if he
was some sort of expert on EVERYTHING. vpw DID put himself forth as an
expert on everything- he had opinions on all subjects and expounded at
length whether or not he actually UNDERSTOOD the subject.
lcm did the same and moreso. He was easier to catch at it because vpw
KNEW he was conning people and deceiving them. lcm was convinced vpw
was telling the truth and following correct policies, so he never tried
to moderate his tactics. He was upfront and direct with his nonsense-
which makes it easier to detect.
Honestly, was there ever a statement on, for example, world history,
US foreign policy, or US history from either of them that was completely
accurate? vpw quoted the Liberty Lobby and other nuts, spoke against
Holocaust history (as did lcm) and spouted various bits of nonsense from
his favorite authors. As long as he had a source, he ran with it.
lcm was twice as nutty, and didn't need even 1 nut to write things down
first. Anyone remember his rant about the Pope's aircraft carrier?
A knowledge of physics or cosmology was also apparently frowned upon if LCM's statement about the earth being the center of the universe went unchallenged. .I don't think there actually is a static center to our expanding universe.
But, isn't that statement by LCM incredibly telling?
Looking back....any talk of "seed boys" seems outrageous to me. Then again....if VP or LCM were going to have the inside track on anything.....it would probably be the function of evil. They were masters in this regard.
Wierwille opened a Living Victoriously session by stating, "Religion is the opiate of the people." I put it in the category of outrageous because that is actually a quote from The Communist Manifesto by Karl Marx. Wierwille never attributed this statement as a quote and he certainly didn't say it was from The Communist Manifesto. That was representing someone's idea as his own. In other words, it was plagiarism. I'm sure someone in that audience recognized the quote. I wonder if he was ever called out on it.
I had read bits and pieces of Karl Marx's writings (or at least the English translations) before I became involved with The Way so, when I heard Wierwille misquote it (Advanced Class, perhaps?), I knew the source, even though he did not cite it. Here, by the way, is what Marx actually said: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx
The erroneous point that Wierwille was attempting to make was that The Way wasn't a religion and, thus, it was superior to other belief systems. (The guy was a pompous azz.)
I have mentioned this one before, but it is worth repeating...
After the meeting where we heard LCM talk about how he was stepping down due to a one-time consensual affair (as if that isn't outrageous enough of a statement) a fellowship coordinator said, "What do we do now if the body has no head?"
That about sums it up... LCM was up there with Jesus Chris in the minds of some of the people in TWI. VP must have been God in comparison.
One time VP told the Corps, "If you live to be 50 you will be very fortunate." I'm now 62.
So much for all that stuff in pfal about living as long as we will as a result of our believing....
I had read bits and pieces of Karl Marx's writings (or at least the English translations) before I became involved with The Way so, when I heard Wierwille misquote it (Advanced Class, perhaps?), I knew the source, even though he did not cite it. Here, by the way, is what Marx actually said: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx
The erroneous point that Wierwille was attempting to make was that The Way wasn't a religion and, thus, it was superior to other belief systems. (The guy was a pompous azz.)
Sheesh, it's reasonably well-known. Any Calvin and Hobbes fan should recognize that as Karl Marx.
(A Sunday comic quoted Marx on the subject.)
Doesn't surprise me- vpw was so used to not getting caught plagiarizing things that evemtually he
figured nobody would ever catch him on using anything ever.
I have mentioned this one before, but it is worth repeating...
After the meeting where we heard LCM talk about how he was stepping down due to a one-time consensual affair (as if that isn't outrageous enough of a statement) a fellowship coordinator said, "What do we do now if the body has no head?"
That about sums it up... LCM was up there with Jesus Chris in the minds of some of the people in TWI. VP must have been God in comparison.
This should be old news.
His wife spoke from the stage at the ROA '89.
She spoke for maybe 10 minutes.
She twice referred to lcm as
"our spiritual leader"
and once as
"our spiritual head."
1 Corinthians 11:3
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
Well, she did all lcm's thinking (when any was done), and rfr did HER thinking.
So, in twi, it was something like
"the head of the woman is the man, and the head of every man is craig, and the head of craig is donna, and the head
of donna is rosalie, and Christ and God say whatever we want them to."
It sure would be nice to hear an honest confession of that...
The erroneous point that Wierwille was attempting to make was that The Way wasn't a religion and, thus, it was superior to other belief systems. (The guy was a pompous azz.)
what he wanted was the privilege and award, without any kind of accountability.
It's a thing a lot of teen agers go through. They want the reward, the benefit, without the effort.. the investment. Instant success..
the dumb bastard had it for about one and a half seconds..
quote: I had read bits and pieces of Karl Marx's writings (or at least the English translations) before I became involved with The Way so, when I heard Wierwille misquote it (Advanced Class, perhaps?), I knew the source, even though he did not cite it. Here, by the way, is what Marx actually said: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx
The erroneous point that Wierwille was attempting to make was that The Way wasn't a religion and, thus, it was superior to other belief systems.
VP quoted Marx saying religion is the opiate of the people in that teaching 'the way of life and death'. He said that's the only thing those birds (communists) ever got right. I think it's interesting that religion is considered an inferior belief system, and subsequently is discriminated against, by the so called 'educated' world.
VP quoted Marx saying religion is the opiate of the people in that teaching 'the way of life and death'. He said that's the only thing those birds (communists) ever got right. I think it's interesting that religion is considered an inferior belief system, and subsequently is discriminated against, by the so called 'educated' world.
Really, John? Education and religion are at odds? Why, then, do you suppose there are still credible institutions offering doctorate programs in theology?
Too many to count. But the one that comes to mind at the moment is from Emogene Allen at our first Departmental Staff Meeting in The Way International Bookstore in October 1982:
"I thought this year I got the cream of the crop, but now I know I got the scum from the crick!"
How mean. What an awful thing to say. She had no right to say that to others. Shame on her.
One of my last branch meetings the little bug who ran the place stated that "if you leave The Way International, whether of your own volition or whether we decide you are unworthy of the privilege of fellowshipping with us, AT THAT VERY MOMENT the spirit within you dies, and shortly thereafter your physical body shall die also, because it is impossible to exist outside of the household of God."
Uh, that was about 1995 or 1996. Guess what moron? I'M STILL HERE!
Can only say that - like the one posted above by WG - that these comments are so bizarre ... it's hard to imagine anybody at all making them.
Especially when you only have to open your eyes...
Can't exist outside the household of God? (Assuming such a thing exists) - well, since there are zillions of people on this planet alive and well, that must logically (TWI logic) make them part of the household of God. Since they exist and all. Some of 'em are Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, animists, pagans...and even Christians. Real living breathing SITing existing Christians.
(Not that I want to dissect these crazy comments.)
Not exactly session 1 of PFAL; nobody would make it past the coffee break.
I remember that I used to think (when I was really down on myself after a bad facemelting by leadership and contemplating what I would do if I was made mark and avoid) that it would be better to never know God than to live at the level of The Way International (the best of the bestest) and then be outside the walls of the Household, the fortress of Zion... Because since I knew God at that high level and had caused such problems for the Adversary that without God to protect me (He CAN'T outside the Household, dontcha know?) I would face a fate worse than death.
I actually started planning my suicide at that point. Better to be dead than outside the walls of Zion.
Wow. Somehow I made it out alive. God's grace abounds - He sent my husband who got me out. Thank God!
I remember that I used to think (when I was really down on myself after a bad facemelting by leadership and contemplating what I would do if I was made mark and avoid) that it would be better to never know God than to live at the level of The Way International (the best of the bestest) and then be outside the walls of the Household, the fortress of Zion... Because since I knew God at that high level and had caused such problems for the Adversary that without God to protect me (He CAN'T outside the Household, dontcha know?) I would face a fate worse than death.
I actually started planning my suicide at that point. Better to be dead than outside the walls of Zion.
Wow. Somehow I made it out alive. God's grace abounds - He sent my husband who got me out. Thank God!
That kinda sums up how I felt at the advanced class.
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Broken Arrow
TWI doctrine is the immodium of the people.
outandabout
Okie said "Staying Alive" starring John Travolta was a rip-off of Athletes of the Spirit. When training for AOL, Okie used Travolta's book on how to get fit and toned. I think it was Sylvester Stall
100% Free
Top leader once said: "Slavery was not as bad as it was made out to be. They were in loving households and were taken care of." I'm still gagging over that one.
geisha779
A knowledge of physics or cosmology was also apparently frowned upon if LCM's statement about the earth being the center of the universe went unchallenged. .I don't think there actually is a static center to our expanding universe.
But, isn't that statement by LCM incredibly telling?
Looking back....any talk of "seed boys" seems outrageous to me. Then again....if VP or LCM were going to have the inside track on anything.....it would probably be the function of evil. They were masters in this regard.
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skyrider
Narcissism short-wires the brain somehow...... :)
Will Rogers is quoted as saying, "Everybody is ignorant, just on different subjects."
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outandabout
One time VP told the Corps, "If you live to be 50 you will be very fortunate." I'm now 62.
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Broken Arrow
Wierwille opened a Living Victoriously session by stating, "Religion is the opiate of the people." I put it in the category of outrageous because that is actually a quote from The Communist Manifesto by Karl Marx. Wierwille never attributed this statement as a quote and he certainly didn't say it was from The Communist Manifesto. That was representing someone's idea as his own. In other words, it was plagiarism. I'm sure someone in that audience recognized the quote. I wonder if he was ever called out on it.
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waysider
I had read bits and pieces of Karl Marx's writings (or at least the English translations) before I became involved with The Way so, when I heard Wierwille misquote it (Advanced Class, perhaps?), I knew the source, even though he did not cite it. Here, by the way, is what Marx actually said: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx
The erroneous point that Wierwille was attempting to make was that The Way wasn't a religion and, thus, it was superior to other belief systems. (The guy was a pompous azz.)
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JavaJane
I have mentioned this one before, but it is worth repeating...
After the meeting where we heard LCM talk about how he was stepping down due to a one-time consensual affair (as if that isn't outrageous enough of a statement) a fellowship coordinator said, "What do we do now if the body has no head?"
That about sums it up... LCM was up there with Jesus Chris in the minds of some of the people in TWI. VP must have been God in comparison.
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WordWolf
So much for all that stuff in pfal about living as long as we will as a result of our believing....
Sheesh, it's reasonably well-known. Any Calvin and Hobbes fan should recognize that as Karl Marx.
(A Sunday comic quoted Marx on the subject.)
Doesn't surprise me- vpw was so used to not getting caught plagiarizing things that evemtually he
figured nobody would ever catch him on using anything ever.
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WordWolf
This should be old news.
His wife spoke from the stage at the ROA '89.
She spoke for maybe 10 minutes.
She twice referred to lcm as
"our spiritual leader"
and once as
"our spiritual head."
1 Corinthians 11:3
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
Well, she did all lcm's thinking (when any was done), and rfr did HER thinking.
So, in twi, it was something like
"the head of the woman is the man, and the head of every man is craig, and the head of craig is donna, and the head
of donna is rosalie, and Christ and God say whatever we want them to."
It sure would be nice to hear an honest confession of that...
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chockfull
LOL.
That about describes it.
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Broken Arrow
TWI doctrine is the immodium of the people.
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Ham
what he wanted was the privilege and award, without any kind of accountability.
It's a thing a lot of teen agers go through. They want the reward, the benefit, without the effort.. the investment. Instant success..
the dumb bastard had it for about one and a half seconds..
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Ham
it sure would be nice, wouldn't is..
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johniam
quote: I had read bits and pieces of Karl Marx's writings (or at least the English translations) before I became involved with The Way so, when I heard Wierwille misquote it (Advanced Class, perhaps?), I knew the source, even though he did not cite it. Here, by the way, is what Marx actually said: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx
The erroneous point that Wierwille was attempting to make was that The Way wasn't a religion and, thus, it was superior to other belief systems.
VP quoted Marx saying religion is the opiate of the people in that teaching 'the way of life and death'. He said that's the only thing those birds (communists) ever got right. I think it's interesting that religion is considered an inferior belief system, and subsequently is discriminated against, by the so called 'educated' world.
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waysider
Really, John? Education and religion are at odds? Why, then, do you suppose there are still credible institutions offering doctorate programs in theology?
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Ham
The Victoid was a moron.
Jeremiah's exhortation was to go surrender to the supposed "enemy"..
that was the way of life.
If you want to stay in your hole and claim "abundance", "victory", or some such nonsense, you will perish..
You'd be better off to learn Chinese while you can..
They already pretty much occupy Saginaw Valley I understand. Will be the largest employer this year..
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Ham
Sorry if these are scary thoughts.
I just hope they can figure out how to produce wine with locally grown vegetation.
Not that I am not willing to offer the knowledge and guidance, however..
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100% Free
How mean. What an awful thing to say. She had no right to say that to others. Shame on her.
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Watered Garden
One of my last branch meetings the little bug who ran the place stated that "if you leave The Way International, whether of your own volition or whether we decide you are unworthy of the privilege of fellowshipping with us, AT THAT VERY MOMENT the spirit within you dies, and shortly thereafter your physical body shall die also, because it is impossible to exist outside of the household of God."
Uh, that was about 1995 or 1996. Guess what moron? I'M STILL HERE!
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Jbarrax
WoW! That takes the cake.
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Twinky
Can only say that - like the one posted above by WG - that these comments are so bizarre ... it's hard to imagine anybody at all making them.
Especially when you only have to open your eyes...
Can't exist outside the household of God? (Assuming such a thing exists) - well, since there are zillions of people on this planet alive and well, that must logically (TWI logic) make them part of the household of God. Since they exist and all. Some of 'em are Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, animists, pagans...and even Christians. Real living breathing SITing existing Christians.
(Not that I want to dissect these crazy comments.)
Not exactly session 1 of PFAL; nobody would make it past the coffee break.
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JavaJane
I remember that I used to think (when I was really down on myself after a bad facemelting by leadership and contemplating what I would do if I was made mark and avoid) that it would be better to never know God than to live at the level of The Way International (the best of the bestest) and then be outside the walls of the Household, the fortress of Zion... Because since I knew God at that high level and had caused such problems for the Adversary that without God to protect me (He CAN'T outside the Household, dontcha know?) I would face a fate worse than death.
I actually started planning my suicide at that point. Better to be dead than outside the walls of Zion.
Wow. Somehow I made it out alive. God's grace abounds - He sent my husband who got me out. Thank God!
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Ham
I was one of those who were sent, but not in your particular context..
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waysider
That kinda sums up how I felt at the advanced class.
(Not the husband part, of course....Heh.)
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Ham
I still think.. the most outrageous statement that possible could be is..
"we(?) are family.."
you threw away your wild card..
now it cuts both ways..
what do you do now?
Hide from what?
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