All the "fake it 'til you make it.", "If I act excited, I'll be excited.", "Life is tremendous!" sort of doctrine that was being promoted by The Way during the 1970s is straight out of secular sales training classes and books (ie:Life Is Tremendous!/Charlie Jones, The Greatest Salesman in The World/Og Mandino, How To Make Friends And Influence People/Dale Carnegie, etc.) So, then, you might ask yourself... why were we being groomed as salesmen instead of servants of our fellow man? Well, the answer is obvious, PFAL was VPW's product and we were his sales force. After that reality sets in, you can start to ponder this... If the Bible really has every thing you need to know about everything and anything, why weren't we trained using scriptural materials rather than all these non-Biblical/pseudo-Biblical sources?
Excellent insight. More and more it's very apparant that this is a man-made organization operating man-made principles that just happen to be selling God. The personal gain is at the top of the organization - benefit was to VP, and currently the BOD.
I mean, is that how the examples in Acts that we based our whole "twig" thing out of worked? Did Peter and the other apostles teach the Jerusalem crew sales techniques so they could be sent all over the world to recruit? Did Paul teach people sales in his travels?
Yes, VP was building his little young starry-eyed sales force - that was the WOW experience, the Corps experience. It was of little concern the risk to the individual during either of those things. Take a young person out of their environment, out of their normal support systems like family and friends, and move them to a place you aren't going to tell them until the week before. That's isolation. That sets up control. Then keep moving them around for the rest of their lives. With each new place people move, they are completely dependant upon the organizational structure that TWI sets up.
It's a world-wide sales force built upon slave trading.
Next thing I knew, the women's coordinator and the house leader held me down in my bed and ministered to me! Did I ask for prayer? No I asked for a couple of aspirin and peace and quiet.
I was told to confess positives, such as "I did not have a headache, I felt wonderful, I was healed".
I once pretended to be sick because I didn't want to go to a session of the plaf class that was being run in the city. We had all been admonished to attend every session to show support. I was probably in charge of something dumb that really wasn't necessary.
Anyway, I lived in a wy home with several other believers. As we were all rushing around getting ready, I realized how badly I didn't want to go. I wanted solitude and to watch a movie of the week on TV. So i said I was sick. Of course my room mates prayed for me and one of them called the limb coord. I got on the phone with him, he prayed too. Then he gave me "permission" to stay home and rest.
I was home free! Yahoo! I made some popcorn and settled onto the couch happy as could be.
Then I heard it. A car pulling into the driveway. I peeked out the window and it was two believers coming to the door. I rushed to hide the popcorn under the sink and turned off the tv.
They had been sent by the limb coord to "bless me". They had been at the class and were chosen to minister to me because of how boldly these two held forth the word.
They stayed with me until all my room mates returned to all tell me how "blessed" "deliverd" and "awesome" taking this session for the 85 millionth time changed their lives.
This is one of the things that was so wrong about the whole thing. You weren't "allowed" to just say "No" to things you didn't really want to do. I mean, if my kid came to me in the middle of a big hockey game on T.V., asking for help with his bicycle chain, of course I wouldn't say "No". I blew the game off and helped him. But, that's how a family functions. These nimrods weren't my family.They were just some selfish bastages (that's the plural form ), making unreasonable demands on our time and good nature. We didn't owe them anything beyond common courtesy and they should have respected our decisions as individuals. But, of course, they didn't.
. . . . These nimrods weren't my family.They were just some selfish bastages (that's the plural form ), making unreasonable demands on our time and good nature. We didn't owe them anything beyond common courtesy and they should have respected our decisions as individuals. But, of course, they didn't.
Us vs. Them?
I don't know about you....but, I was right there among those who were expecting certain behavior from my fellow cultists. You were lucky I guess..I didn't escaped so unscathed that I can now separate my behavior in TWI from that of everyone else.
I was in a few classes....saw some people through......I guess I was among the selfish bastages.
What were you doing in TWI....trying to get people to leave?
LOL. Only because the Mother of one of my room mates sent him one for his birthday and he was a really nice guy who shared. Put it in the living room so we could all use it.
You mean the Limb leader didn't get revelation that you were faking it, and sent his 2 cohorts to double check on you?
Yeah. He must have "missed it." LOL.
This is one of the things that was so wrong about the whole thing. You weren't "allowed" to just say "No" to things you didn't really want to do. I mean, if my kid came to me in the middle of a big hockey game on T.V., asking for help with his bicycle chain, of course I wouldn't say "No". I blew the game off and helped him. But, that's how a family functions. These nimrods weren't my family.They were just some selfish bastages (that's the plural form ), making unreasonable demands on our time and good nature. We didn't owe them anything beyond common courtesy and they should have respected our decisions as individuals. But, of course, they didn't.
Right on. You said it well. I was tired and afraid of being reamed out for being honest. Work full time, twi over time. Couldn't say enough already, they would flip out.
You know, this topic could be mistaken for glossalia/SIT, because some have admited to faking that(not me personally since I started again about 11 years ago).
now i am so happy to say that, when people ask me to volunteer or donate or do something, i say no thanks and i don't give an explanation. i'm not rude but i don't feel compelled since i don't feel guilt or like i owe them one
If you say "no thank you" no explanation should be expected. I don't think that's rude. If you turned and walked away, or said some nasty that would be rude. But we were trained (dare I say brainwashed) to think we had to respond in the affirmative.
When Mr. Garden was in college, we shared a house with another couple who had a baby. Then the WC BL decided to bless us with her presence. She liked to run in the afternoon, and she felt it important that everyone she was around agree with that and accompany her. So she requested the mother of the baby go for a nice, invigorating, refreshing run with her, reasoning that the baby was asleep and wouldn't wake up for another half hour or so.
The mother indignantly refused; what if the baby did wake up and cry and she wasn't there? (this was a very small baby, less than one year.
Was the mother rude to refuse? He11 no she was prudent and she was right.
Was the BL an idiot or a great woman of God with perfect believing?
Ex, began speaking in tongues again in private prayer life after taking Nicky Gumbel's video class Alpha which includes discussion on glossalia but unlike PFAL never demonstrates how to do it. Also SIT softly in a bare whisper during Contemporary Worship during Prayers of the People(there is no vocal SIT with Interpretation, not encouraged at Lutheran Church I serve). Sorry if this is off topic. Now back to our regular programming already in progress.
now i am so happy to say that, when people ask me to volunteer or donate or do something, i say no thanks and i don't give an explanation. i'm not rude but i don't feel compelled since i don't feel guilt or like i owe them one
In the late 80s I lived in a house of believers in MI and this lady moved in with us. She would come up to you and say, "Would you be blessed to...(something nobody was ever blessed to do)?" We'd just look at her and say, "Nope!" This must've worked where she'd lived before, but after a few times she got the message. Yeah, stuff like that was pretty weird.
I really did miss an area of "faking it"......and that was to the outside world, especially to family and friends.
I had lots of people tell me it was a "cult" do not get involved. A minister I knew really tried to almost "scare" into not getting into it, which pushed me further into defending it. My parents, especially my mother was very fearful and upset about my involvement. But, you know I just "faked" really, really, being happy. That it was not harmful to me or to others. That it was a God's Word and God's ministry...that Everything was on the up and up. And really, I did not fully believe what I was saying. I was skeptical, and questioning things and at times in the beginning after taking the class, feeling like there was something "wrong" here, but I just didn't know what it was at the time. But I would have never told that to anyone, in or out of TWI
I was faking in TWI and I was faking it to the outside world. I was being two different people.....one for the outside to see and one that was the inner me.
I lost my friends on the outside, and my family pretty much didn't trust me anymore.
Simply put, I faked it a lot! I think it kind of turned into a survival tool...
In the late 80s I lived in a house of believers in MI and this lady moved in with us. She would come up to you and say, "Would you be blessed to...(something nobody was ever blessed to do)?" We'd just look at her and say, "Nope!" This must've worked where she'd lived before, but after a few times she got the message. Yeah, stuff like that was pretty weird.
haha, that's a good one. I'd forgotten about that line, but I must have heard it a thousand times. "Would you be blessed to clean out my car for me?" "No, but I would be blessed if you cleaned up the bathroom after you mess it up every fricking morning." haha. Reminds me also of the line we used at work, trying to get someone to volunteer for a crappy assignment.. "It's an opportunity to excel!" we would say, usually getting a stony silence in response.
About 98% of the time, using the word 'bless' in TWI was fake. It became robotic to say it after a while. But if you didn't say it, watch out. Right there is a good example of how TWI counterfeited and misrepresented truth. It's a wonderful thing to be blessed, that's for sure. But to use the word 'bless' and toss it around like we did, use it when it was not truly appropriate, was to corrupt its true meaning and rendering it meaningless.
Although this comment doesn't cover the entire "fake it" ground being covered here, I would suggest a bit of level setting.
Any culture and subset will have standards of behavior and acceptable norms that govern day to day interaction. They develop and change and evolve. This can include everything from body language to professional jargon.
There are things that are expected - for instance in the Way, the greeting "Bless you!", as a greeting that indicates intent, status, alliance. It became shorthand for "Hi!" but with the stronger meaning that indeed, "God" "bless" "You". Preferable to "God send you to He ll now - what are you still doing here!?!"
Of course when someone says "Good morning" and someone responds with "Good? Good? Don't you mean Best?" or comes up with "Exceedingly abundant above all things day to you!!!".....
It's time to back away slowly....
This happens in all kinds of interactions though - ever say "Good morning" to someone and have them respond "Is it? Is it really?".....it's the same kind of thing.
Social "graces" are supposed to help ease the day to day lifting of interacting. They will always evolve and there will never be a one size fits all. Say "Have a nice day!" long enough and someone will start to say "No, why don't YOU have a nice day!!!" sooner or later.
I know this doesn't cover the entire range and depth of this topic but thought to make note of it if perhaps to cast the smallest of light with minimum of shadow.
Just that some things are pretty normal behaviors and patterns but probably looked at more seriously here because they were associated with Way-fer behavior, or "god" or who knows what. People do all kinds of things to look right or good in others eyes, get some shine off something they have no interest in but want the benefits of.
They did follow suit there - very much so. There were the kinds of expected responses and actions that are being described here and they shaped the expectations of those in the group. From my observation of life that's pretty much par for the course. If someone doesn't like the norms, traditions and customs they're faced with they can not observe them, try to change them, find other people they're more comfortable with or I dunno - become a hermit and stare at the sky all day. There's always options.
I was talking with someone today and this very kind of thing was so apparent in our conversation - some things, like say "religious" convictions they have very clear, tight opinions and have no problem passing judgment ("righteous" judgment, of course of course...)......................but in normal day to day affairs, decisions, they vacillate and refuse to take strong positions even when they do in fact disagree with something.
Why? They're afraid of confrontation, they don't want to say something is "wrong" and prefer to talk about "gaps" and "issues". They use soft non-confrontational language for mundane day to day business and can't bear to say that someone's "wrong" - but rather refer to them as "being aligned differently"................... but hold strong positions about things like say, who's going to heaven and who isn't. I find that fascinating and really a revealing study in human nature - someone will definitively say who is or isn't going to spend eternity in heaven with God, but won't take a position on say, a run of the mill workflow process involving widget and geegaws. Inneresting.....
They conveniently don't grasp simple 1 plus 1 kinds of things in their work but have steady resolveon affairs of eternal business in God's domain. Why? They prefer to play nice, not ruffle feathers and as a result let others tromp all over them - for them it's easier to accept a lower quality of work than to push for better work and higher standards. When it comes to "spiritual" things their sense of right and wrong is clear. When it comes to day to day affairs and decisions there's less of a right and wrong and the emphasis is placed instead on maintaining a comfortable relationship with others. To me there's a disconnect there, and they're still learning how to bring the two together and be a whole person, not one person in regards to religious convictions and another in regards to day to day affairs. But we're all learning, and life is an ongoing process.
Hey, it's not the end of the world, they're very nice and do fine but can't see the conflict in how they think and approach things. I'm probably not going to influence that kind of thinking very heavily but I do try to toss a rock in the pond of easy-does-it once in awhile.
I feel badly for those who "faked" their convictions and actions to the point they were being something they were not. When we do that in regards to anything it's going to haunt us later. It's good to recognize it and deal with it and not let it linger or continue, I'd say.
I feel badly for those who "faked" their convictions and actions to the point they were being something they were not. When we do that in regards to anything it's going to haunt us later. It's good to recognize it and deal with it and not let it linger or continue, I'd say.
This reminds me of someone who did the opposite. Ralph. He was a high profile twi leader. He was a limb, region, and truck leader plus extention and outreach coordinator. Through all that, he got to teach a lot. He was passionate; he was as entertaining a speaker as John Lynn, Donnie Fugit, or anyone you could name. He was a very effective cheerleader for twi. Hearing him teach was often a shot in the arm. He definitely was not faking it.
His first assignment after corps graduation was in Detroit. He wasn't the limb leader yet, but he had some wows under him. He wrote a letter to the city of Detroit explaining that the noticeable drop in Detroit's crime rate was directly attributable to all the wows that came to the city. Not long after that 4 high powered rifle shots rang through a house where a pfal class was being run, one of which hit and knocked off a wooden table leg. Nobody was hit or hurt.
Few years later a friend of mine was sent wow to Detroit on his interim year. Ralph was at the limb HQ 100 miles away. Ralph visited this guy and the guy was hurting inside. Detroit is a tough town. They were at McDonalds and Ralph turned to a guy behind him and asked if the guy wanted to come to fellowship. The guy coldly said, "Why don't you take your act on the road?" Ralph responded loudly with, "Yeah! Why don't you f yourself!" There was a lady with small children a few feet away. Guy turned white as a sheet. Ralph didn't do that just to be a jerk; he did it to bless my friend whose feelings were hurt. Like I said...passionate...not faking it.
He wrote an article in that book 'The living word speaks' which was presented to VP during twis 40th year. The book was a collection of articles written by names we knew. Ralph's article documented places in the word where corrupt leaders in the church hurt God's people. He was 'agin' it.
Ralph used to post as Ralph D on waydale and I'm pretty sure he posted here by a different name as recently as a few years ago if not since. He no longer believes twi was a good thing. Again, he's not faking it. Do we have to be faking something to be in twi? Or a spinoff? The times I've faked it have been around outsiders, including my family.
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waysider
All the "fake it 'til you make it.", "If I act excited, I'll be excited.", "Life is tremendous!" sort of doctrine that was being promoted by The Way during the 1970s is straight out of secular sales t
chockfull
Excellent insight. More and more it's very apparant that this is a man-made organization operating man-made principles that just happen to be selling God. The personal gain is at the top of the organization - benefit was to VP, and currently the BOD.
I mean, is that how the examples in Acts that we based our whole "twig" thing out of worked? Did Peter and the other apostles teach the Jerusalem crew sales techniques so they could be sent all over the world to recruit? Did Paul teach people sales in his travels?
Yes, VP was building his little young starry-eyed sales force - that was the WOW experience, the Corps experience. It was of little concern the risk to the individual during either of those things. Take a young person out of their environment, out of their normal support systems like family and friends, and move them to a place you aren't going to tell them until the week before. That's isolation. That sets up control. Then keep moving them around for the rest of their lives. With each new place people move, they are completely dependant upon the organizational structure that TWI sets up.
It's a world-wide sales force built upon slave trading.
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100% Free
I once pretended to be sick because I didn't want to go to a session of the plaf class that was being run in the city. We had all been admonished to attend every session to show support. I was probably in charge of something dumb that really wasn't necessary.
Anyway, I lived in a wy home with several other believers. As we were all rushing around getting ready, I realized how badly I didn't want to go. I wanted solitude and to watch a movie of the week on TV. So i said I was sick. Of course my room mates prayed for me and one of them called the limb coord. I got on the phone with him, he prayed too. Then he gave me "permission" to stay home and rest.
I was home free! Yahoo! I made some popcorn and settled onto the couch happy as could be.
Then I heard it. A car pulling into the driveway. I peeked out the window and it was two believers coming to the door. I rushed to hide the popcorn under the sink and turned off the tv.
They had been sent by the limb coord to "bless me". They had been at the class and were chosen to minister to me because of how boldly these two held forth the word.
They stayed with me until all my room mates returned to all tell me how "blessed" "deliverd" and "awesome" taking this session for the 85 millionth time changed their lives.
Boy, that sure back fired on me! LOL!
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outandabout
Taking PFAL over and over again was so much fun.
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Thomas Loy Bumgarner
You mean the Limb leader didn't get revelation that you were faking it, and sent his 2 cohorts to double check on you?
why, you were suppose to memorize the class so in your sleep you would mumble everything while dreaming you were replacing Wierwille as The Teacher
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excathedra
you lucky bastud you had a TV
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waysider
This is one of the things that was so wrong about the whole thing. You weren't "allowed" to just say "No" to things you didn't really want to do. I mean, if my kid came to me in the middle of a big hockey game on T.V., asking for help with his bicycle chain, of course I wouldn't say "No". I blew the game off and helped him. But, that's how a family functions. These nimrods weren't my family.They were just some selfish bastages (that's the plural form
), making unreasonable demands on our time and good nature. We didn't owe them anything beyond common courtesy and they should have respected our decisions as individuals. But, of course, they didn't.
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geisha779
Us vs. Them?
I don't know about you....but, I was right there among those who were expecting certain behavior from my fellow cultists. You were lucky I guess..I didn't escaped so unscathed that I can now separate my behavior in TWI from that of everyone else.
I was in a few classes....saw some people through......I guess I was among the selfish bastages.
What were you doing in TWI....trying to get people to leave?
We ALL did selfish things in some way or another.
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100% Free
you lucky bastud you had a TV
LOL. Only because the Mother of one of my room mates sent him one for his birthday and he was a really nice guy who shared. Put it in the living room so we could all use it.
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waysider
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GrouchoMarxJr
I never could fake it too well...maybe that's why I didn't make it too well in twi either...
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Thomas Loy Bumgarner
You know, this topic could be mistaken for glossalia/SIT, because some have admited to faking that(not me personally since I started again about 11 years ago).
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excathedra
how did you start again thomas off topic?
-----
now i am so happy to say that, when people ask me to volunteer or donate or do something, i say no thanks and i don't give an explanation. i'm not rude but i don't feel compelled since i don't feel guilt or like i owe them one
hope that makes sense without sounding too rude
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Watered Garden
If you say "no thank you" no explanation should be expected. I don't think that's rude. If you turned and walked away, or said some nasty that would be rude. But we were trained (dare I say brainwashed) to think we had to respond in the affirmative.
When Mr. Garden was in college, we shared a house with another couple who had a baby. Then the WC BL decided to bless us with her presence. She liked to run in the afternoon, and she felt it important that everyone she was around agree with that and accompany her. So she requested the mother of the baby go for a nice, invigorating, refreshing run with her, reasoning that the baby was asleep and wouldn't wake up for another half hour or so.
The mother indignantly refused; what if the baby did wake up and cry and she wasn't there? (this was a very small baby, less than one year.
Was the mother rude to refuse? He11 no she was prudent and she was right.
Was the BL an idiot or a great woman of God with perfect believing?
Do I really have to answer that?
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excathedra
oh what a bunch of misguided losers yours truly included
i was just saying on bluze's political thread -- i feel so hollow -- i wish i didn't
i don't feel that way when it comes to my child and my family
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Thomas Loy Bumgarner
Ex, began speaking in tongues again in private prayer life after taking Nicky Gumbel's video class Alpha which includes discussion on glossalia but unlike PFAL never demonstrates how to do it. Also SIT softly in a bare whisper during Contemporary Worship during Prayers of the People(there is no vocal SIT with Interpretation, not encouraged at Lutheran Church I serve). Sorry if this is off topic. Now back to our regular programming already in progress.
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johniam
QUOTE:
now i am so happy to say that, when people ask me to volunteer or donate or do something, i say no thanks and i don't give an explanation. i'm not rude but i don't feel compelled since i don't feel guilt or like i owe them one
In the late 80s I lived in a house of believers in MI and this lady moved in with us. She would come up to you and say, "Would you be blessed to...(something nobody was ever blessed to do)?" We'd just look at her and say, "Nope!" This must've worked where she'd lived before, but after a few times she got the message. Yeah, stuff like that was pretty weird.
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newlife
I really did miss an area of "faking it"......and that was to the outside world, especially to family and friends.
I had lots of people tell me it was a "cult" do not get involved. A minister I knew really tried to almost "scare" into not getting into it, which pushed me further into defending it. My parents, especially my mother was very fearful and upset about my involvement. But, you know I just "faked" really, really, being happy. That it was not harmful to me or to others. That it was a God's Word and God's ministry...that Everything was on the up and up. And really, I did not fully believe what I was saying. I was skeptical, and questioning things and at times in the beginning after taking the class, feeling like there was something "wrong" here, but I just didn't know what it was at the time. But I would have never told that to anyone, in or out of TWI
I was faking in TWI and I was faking it to the outside world. I was being two different people.....one for the outside to see and one that was the inner me.
I lost my friends on the outside, and my family pretty much didn't trust me anymore.
Simply put, I faked it a lot! I think it kind of turned into a survival tool...
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OperaBuff
haha, that's a good one. I'd forgotten about that line, but I must have heard it a thousand times. "Would you be blessed to clean out my car for me?" "No, but I would be blessed if you cleaned up the bathroom after you mess it up every fricking morning." haha. Reminds me also of the line we used at work, trying to get someone to volunteer for a crappy assignment.. "It's an opportunity to excel!" we would say, usually getting a stony silence in response.
About 98% of the time, using the word 'bless' in TWI was fake. It became robotic to say it after a while. But if you didn't say it, watch out. Right there is a good example of how TWI counterfeited and misrepresented truth. It's a wonderful thing to be blessed, that's for sure. But to use the word 'bless' and toss it around like we did, use it when it was not truly appropriate, was to corrupt its true meaning and rendering it meaningless.
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socks
Although this comment doesn't cover the entire "fake it" ground being covered here, I would suggest a bit of level setting.
Any culture and subset will have standards of behavior and acceptable norms that govern day to day interaction. They develop and change and evolve. This can include everything from body language to professional jargon.
There are things that are expected - for instance in the Way, the greeting "Bless you!", as a greeting that indicates intent, status, alliance. It became shorthand for "Hi!" but with the stronger meaning that indeed, "God" "bless" "You". Preferable to "God send you to He ll now - what are you still doing here!?!"
Of course when someone says "Good morning" and someone responds with "Good? Good? Don't you mean Best?" or comes up with "Exceedingly abundant above all things day to you!!!".....
It's time to back away slowly....
This happens in all kinds of interactions though - ever say "Good morning" to someone and have them respond "Is it? Is it really?".....it's the same kind of thing.
Social "graces" are supposed to help ease the day to day lifting of interacting. They will always evolve and there will never be a one size fits all. Say "Have a nice day!" long enough and someone will start to say "No, why don't YOU have a nice day!!!" sooner or later.
I know this doesn't cover the entire range and depth of this topic but thought to make note of it if perhaps to cast the smallest of light with minimum of shadow.
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excathedra
so what the heck are you saying socksie ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
i guess i should say i faked being happy when i was sad
but it was my usual mo
love you
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Ham
how come da way couldn't follow suit here..
what was it they called, and (curiously) abhorred.. situational ethics?
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socks
Just that some things are pretty normal behaviors and patterns but probably looked at more seriously here because they were associated with Way-fer behavior, or "god" or who knows what. People do all kinds of things to look right or good in others eyes, get some shine off something they have no interest in but want the benefits of.
They did follow suit there - very much so. There were the kinds of expected responses and actions that are being described here and they shaped the expectations of those in the group. From my observation of life that's pretty much par for the course. If someone doesn't like the norms, traditions and customs they're faced with they can not observe them, try to change them, find other people they're more comfortable with or I dunno - become a hermit and stare at the sky all day. There's always options.
I was talking with someone today and this very kind of thing was so apparent in our conversation - some things, like say "religious" convictions they have very clear, tight opinions and have no problem passing judgment ("righteous" judgment, of course of course...)......................but in normal day to day affairs, decisions, they vacillate and refuse to take strong positions even when they do in fact disagree with something.
Why? They're afraid of confrontation, they don't want to say something is "wrong" and prefer to talk about "gaps" and "issues". They use soft non-confrontational language for mundane day to day business and can't bear to say that someone's "wrong" - but rather refer to them as "being aligned differently"................... but hold strong positions about things like say, who's going to heaven and who isn't. I find that fascinating and really a revealing study in human nature - someone will definitively say who is or isn't going to spend eternity in heaven with God, but won't take a position on say, a run of the mill workflow process involving widget and geegaws. Inneresting.....
They conveniently don't grasp simple 1 plus 1 kinds of things in their work but have steady resolveon affairs of eternal business in God's domain. Why? They prefer to play nice, not ruffle feathers and as a result let others tromp all over them - for them it's easier to accept a lower quality of work than to push for better work and higher standards. When it comes to "spiritual" things their sense of right and wrong is clear. When it comes to day to day affairs and decisions there's less of a right and wrong and the emphasis is placed instead on maintaining a comfortable relationship with others. To me there's a disconnect there, and they're still learning how to bring the two together and be a whole person, not one person in regards to religious convictions and another in regards to day to day affairs. But we're all learning, and life is an ongoing process.
Hey, it's not the end of the world, they're very nice and do fine but can't see the conflict in how they think and approach things. I'm probably not going to influence that kind of thinking very heavily but I do try to toss a rock in the pond of easy-does-it once in awhile.
I feel badly for those who "faked" their convictions and actions to the point they were being something they were not. When we do that in regards to anything it's going to haunt us later. It's good to recognize it and deal with it and not let it linger or continue, I'd say.
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excathedra
thanks, i get it
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johniam
quote:
I feel badly for those who "faked" their convictions and actions to the point they were being something they were not. When we do that in regards to anything it's going to haunt us later. It's good to recognize it and deal with it and not let it linger or continue, I'd say.
This reminds me of someone who did the opposite. Ralph. He was a high profile twi leader. He was a limb, region, and truck leader plus extention and outreach coordinator. Through all that, he got to teach a lot. He was passionate; he was as entertaining a speaker as John Lynn, Donnie Fugit, or anyone you could name. He was a very effective cheerleader for twi. Hearing him teach was often a shot in the arm. He definitely was not faking it.
His first assignment after corps graduation was in Detroit. He wasn't the limb leader yet, but he had some wows under him. He wrote a letter to the city of Detroit explaining that the noticeable drop in Detroit's crime rate was directly attributable to all the wows that came to the city. Not long after that 4 high powered rifle shots rang through a house where a pfal class was being run, one of which hit and knocked off a wooden table leg. Nobody was hit or hurt.
Few years later a friend of mine was sent wow to Detroit on his interim year. Ralph was at the limb HQ 100 miles away. Ralph visited this guy and the guy was hurting inside. Detroit is a tough town. They were at McDonalds and Ralph turned to a guy behind him and asked if the guy wanted to come to fellowship. The guy coldly said, "Why don't you take your act on the road?" Ralph responded loudly with, "Yeah! Why don't you f yourself!" There was a lady with small children a few feet away. Guy turned white as a sheet. Ralph didn't do that just to be a jerk; he did it to bless my friend whose feelings were hurt. Like I said...passionate...not faking it.
He wrote an article in that book 'The living word speaks' which was presented to VP during twis 40th year. The book was a collection of articles written by names we knew. Ralph's article documented places in the word where corrupt leaders in the church hurt God's people. He was 'agin' it.
Ralph used to post as Ralph D on waydale and I'm pretty sure he posted here by a different name as recently as a few years ago if not since. He no longer believes twi was a good thing. Again, he's not faking it. Do we have to be faking something to be in twi? Or a spinoff? The times I've faked it have been around outsiders, including my family.
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