Associate Theology Degree?

[chockfull]

He's got some balls using this salt covenant thing in the first place. I remember being taught how serious it was. Give me a BREAK!

Rosalie talked casually one morning before our weekly cabinet meeting about how much more the consequences are for people who break the salt covenant versus not being corps and leaving the ministry.

I dunno, the hardest consequence for me is decompressing from years of being salted to an abusive cult.

Rozilla I believe forced the Region Coords at one point to take a salt covenant with her enforcing their unquestioning loyalty.

In an interesting parallel, in Greek mythology Medusa had the mythical power to turn anyone into stone who gazed at her.

[So_crates]

In an interesting parallel, in Greek mythology Medusa had the mythical power to turn anyone into stone who gazed at her.

She also had snakes instead of hair and was defeated by a mirror.

SoCrates

Edited April 2, 2011 by So_crates

[skyrider]

He's got some balls using this salt covenant thing in the first place. I remember being taught how serious it was. Give me a BREAK!

Rosalie talked casually one morning before our weekly cabinet meeting about how much more the consequences are for people who break the salt covenant versus not being corps and leaving the ministry.

I dunno, the hardest consequence for me is decompressing from years of being salted to an abusive cult.

Yeah......absolutely!

Twi preached on the "consequences of breaking the salt covenant"......as they wallow deeper into sins of adultery, covetousness, lying, pride, lust, deceiving, abusing, lording over, etc. So, the way ministry is higher than OBEYING GOD AND ESCHEWING EVIL? Riiight....

In the deep shadows of sin.....wierwille, martindale, don, howard, rosalie, donna and others have feigned godliness. Yet, the MASK slipped years ago....when lies, adultery, plagairism and deception came front and center! The con is over....and the testimonies continue to come forward. The waves of destruction keep lapping at the shore of reality.

And, Rosalie.....might do well to remember Lot's wife, as she left Sodom & Gomorrah

.....pillar of salt, remember?

.

Edited April 2, 2011 by skyrider

[So_crates]

The thing that shocks me is how they come up with all the guilt trips for the rank and file that somehow doesn't hold for the leadership.

Salt covenant was one of them.

Another was we were told not to leave the field as WOWs. If we left the field it could affect our whole lives.

They quoted that verse in Proverbs about watching your mouth when you go into the temple and not to vow a vow you don't mean.

Then you look at leadership and their acting like ethics aren't even there.

SoCrates

Edited April 2, 2011 by So_crates

[skyrider]

The thing that shocks me is how they come up with all the guilt trips for the rank and file that somehow doesn't hold for the leadership.

Salt covenant was one of them.

Another was we were told not to leave the field as WOWs. If we left the field it could affect our whole lives.

They quoted that verse in Proverbs about watching your mouth when you go into the temple and not to vow a vow you don't mean.

Then you look at leadership and their acting like ethics aren't even there.

SoCrates

Twi has NO POWER over anyone......unless they allow it.

Their tactics are from the same playbook as tyrants and third world dictotors. Threats and thugocracy are the last desperate attempts at control.

The curtain has been pulled back....and the "emporer" has NO CLOTHES.

[waysider]

Twi has NO POWER over anyone......unless they allow it.

This kinda reminds me of the little boy whose mother said, "Johnnie, stop pulling the cat's tail." Little Johnnie responded with, "I'm just holding on; the cat's doing all the pulling."

They used that hedge of protection/spiritual bubble thing to hide behind a third party. "If you ever leave, you'll be sealing your own fate." See? They controlled you without letting you see it was they who were controlling the situation, not you.

Edited April 2, 2011 by waysider

[mstar1]

Then you look at leadership and their acting like ethics aren't even there.

They weren't -they didnt have to be.

TWI doctrine ( ie -'you are righteous now') left a convenient loophole where leaders were not required to act righteously, they already were, no matter what they did.

If they did experience any pangs of guilt, the TWI doctrine of 'forgiveness' was quick, easy, cheap, painless and personal and required no change of character

As long as someone 'spoke the word'or read a verse they were considered 'in fellowship', no matter what was going on.

In Pulp Fiction, Samuel L Jackson quoted the Old Testament before murdering his victims, its extreme but not that far off.. Quoting the bible isnt the be all end all, or proof of anything, anyone can do it regardless of character

[skyrider]

Religious leaders have been doing this since forever.....and people have been persecuted, at time, when trying to break free of their control.

Here in the western culture, we have it mild compared to those who are attempting to break the bondage of Islamic clerics. Check out the link below. Scroll down and watch the video as she defends her position.

Veena Malik

[waysider]

Remember this?...."Justified = Just as if I'd never sinned"

Instead of emphasizing the past tense nature of the statement, they placed it on a time continuum that essentially changed the meaning to.... "I can sin because I'm justified."

Edited April 2, 2011 by waysider

[mstar1]

Religious leaders have been doing this since forever.....and people have been persecuted, at time, when trying to break free of their control.

true enough but we are not talking about the time of the inquisition nor about fundamentalist Islam either.

TWI purported to be a christian organization( well maybe Im still unsure about that) but rejected established forms of church polity that offer any forms of checks and balances of power.

After 20 centuries, theyve had some experience at developing this!

Wierwille coming out of the Reformed Church surely knew about them ( I think that his Reformed church worked in the congregational model) but rejected the system so that he could be autonomous and would answer to no one

[skyrider]

Wierwille coming out of the Reformed Church surely knew about them ( I think that his Reformed church worked in the congregational model) but rejected the system so that he could be autonomous and would answer to no one

I couldn't agree more.

Wierwille searched and searched......until he came across B.G Leonard's class in Calgary, Alberta, Canada. When wierwille stole this work and started up his own class-based ministry it gave him complete autonomy from the church model.

Every step taken from then on.....was to strengthen this autonomy. The structure, the seclusion, the secrecy.....wierwille finally found his narcisstic niche.

[Twinky]

I couldn't agree more.

Wierwille searched and searched......until he came across B.G Leonard's class in Calgary, Alberta, Canada. When wierwille stole this work and started up his own class-based ministry it gave him complete autonomy from the church model.

Maybe you're giving a little too much credit here. Did he "search and search"? - sounds like a plan. Whereas it just may be that it was a "happy coincidence" that he came across something from someone living not too close, which he could plunder and pass off as his own, and took that opportunity.

[So_crates]

Maybe you're giving a little too much credit here. Did he "search and search"? - sounds like a plan. Whereas it just may be that it was a "happy coincidence" that he came across something from someone living not too close, which he could plunder and pass off as his own, and took that opportunity.

I'm more into the plan theory: There's just too many happy coincidences:

Just happen to find a class to sell

Just happen to find works to plagerize

Just happen to find the right people to cover up neferious acts

Way too many coincidences fo it to be an accident.

SoCrates

[OldSkool]

I'm more into the plan theory: There's just too many happy coincidences:

Just happen to find a class to sell

Just happen to find works to plagerize

Just happen to find the right people to cover up neferious acts

Way too many coincidences fo it to be an accident.

SoCrates

Which points the finger at someone with ability who is dedicated to his own evil purposes. Greater sin in my book.

[excathedra]

definitely

just like getting me on the motorcoach was a PLAN

it's not like we were lying there in the fields whispering sweet nothings and got carried away

barf

yes, i asked for a ride because i so wanted to see my fiance

yes, i was scared and hoping like hell it would just be a ride

but i had told him quite a few times before that i couldn't handle his spiritual rationale for teaching me the way of a man with a maiden

what a jerk he was really

what a jerk i was really

[OldSkool]

definitely

what a jerk i was really

Nope. Not in my book. I place the blame on the wolf. Not the one placing trust in a supposed holy man.

[Ham]

Twi has NO POWER over anyone......unless they allow it.

Their tactics are from the same playbook as tyrants and third world dictotors. Threats and thugocracy are the last desperate attempts at control.

The curtain has been pulled back....and the "emporer" has NO CLOTHES.

and it isn't exactly a "pretty" sight, either.

I mean.. how old, lots of extra hair where it does not ordinarily grow, etc. etc.

Not to mention various sections of the body sagging..

you get the idea.

not a pretty sight.

[Broken Arrow]

So, the way ministry is higher than OBEYING GOD AND ESCHEWING EVIL? Riiight....

Reminds one of Adolf Hitler. He was requiring officers, and I think even soldiers and a host to others to pledge a loyalty to him, not Germany, him. We had to pledge loyalty to TWI, not God, TWI.

[skyrider]

Reminds one of Adolf Hitler. He was requiring officers, and I think even soldiers and a host to others to pledge a loyalty to him, not Germany, him. We had to pledge loyalty to TWI, not God, TWI.

Looking back at twi...

The arrogance to pledge loyalty to twi, salted to their marching orders,......and it was the DEATH OF WIERWILLE to stop the madness. The insanity of it all. Not just the trustees, but men like Cvmm!ns, T0wns3nd, G33r, and others refusing to address the sins, the sexual predation, the adultery "research" of JS.

So, did wierwille's ministry become a reflection of WIERWILLE? Absolutely.

Mantindale stated publicly that he got the presidential mantle from wierwille because he OBEYED IMPLICITLY. No questions asked. He jumped when wierwille commanded him to jump. Yes, twi became that insane! Think how deeply whacked that is?!?

Then, when martindale is ousted because he "loosened up in the sex category" as WIERWILLE HAD COMMANDED HIM TO DO......rosalie take the helm and steers the ship back to all things wierwille. Huh? Really? The true meaning of insanity -- dolng the same things over and over again and expecting different results.

I am convinced that twi's salt covenant was a sordid sin pact....and the officers following wierwille became two-fold the "children of hell."

[Broken Arrow]

Mantindale stated publicly that he got the presidential mantle from wierwille because he OBEYED IMPLICITLY. No questions asked. He jumped when wierwille commanded him to jump. Yes, twi became that insane! Think how deeply whacked that is?!?

LCM claimed that VP said to someone he was counseling that the reason LCM was named president is because, "He never forgot who taught him the Word."

[skyrider]

LCM claimed that VP said to someone he was counseling that the reason LCM was named president is because, "He never forgot who taught him the Word."

....."never forget WHO taught him"...

WHO?.....WIERWILLE

Always about wierwille

[Broken Arrow]

....."never forget WHO taught him"...

WHO?.....WIERWILLE

Always about wierwille

That's riiiiight!

[johniam]

quote: He's got some balls using this salt covenant thing in the first place. I remember being taught how serious it was. Give me a BREAK!

Rosalie talked casually one morning before our weekly cabinet meeting about how much more the consequences are for people who break the salt covenant versus not being corps and leaving the ministry.

I dunno, the hardest consequence for me is decompressing from years of being salted to an abusive cult.

Interesting that twi taught that water baptism was just a physical ceremonial ritual that had no impact on being born again, yet, somehow the salt covenant, also a physical ritual, issued in major "consequences" if broken. During my wedding ceremony the reverend who married us said we had asked to do the salt covenant. Neither of us asked him to do that. By then I guess it was implied that if you wanted a twi clergyman to do your wedding you did the salt covenant. IMO it added about 1 minute of time to the ceremony. Didn't add or subtract to our marriage whatsoever.

[waysider]

The covenant of salt has its foundation in ancient history. Its a long standing custom of man, for the most part. But, is it dictated by scripture? Here are the only three occasions I know of that it is mentioned in the Bible:

II Chronicles 13:5 (NIV)

Don’t you know that the LORD, the God of Israel, has given the kingship of Israel to David and his descendants forever by a covenant of salt?

Numbers 18:19 (NIV)

19 Whatever is set aside from the holy offerings the Israelites present to the LORD I give to you and your sons and daughters as your regular share. It is an everlasting covenant of salt before the LORD for both you and your offspring."

Leviticus 2:13 (NIV)

Season all your grain offerings with salt. Do not leave the salt of the covenant of your God out of your grain offerings; add salt to all your offering

-------------

These scriptures are directed at specific individuals and specific groups.

There is nothing in the scriptures that indicate it is to be practiced in a wide spread sense. In fact, there is nothing to indicate the specifics of how it should be performed. It's simply a tradition of man... ageless, widespread, and documented in the Bible, perhaps, but not a ritual prescribed by scripture.

Edited April 5, 2011 by waysider

[skyrider]

II Chronicles 13:5 (NIV)

Don’t you know that the LORD, the God of Israel, has given the kingship of Israel to David and his descendants forever by a covenant of salt?

And....why does it seem like twi has perverted it to this?

II Corruptives 13:13 (TWI)

Don't you know that The Way International, the Gatekeeper of The Word, has given the True Ministry to Wierwille and his directors for deception by a seasoning of salt?