So---- there's old Doc Vic, at the very tip-top of our lift lists, with thousands of people all speaking in tongues for him, using the "Way approved" camera-focus technique, coupled with the infallible "law of believing" that "works for saint and sinner alike". And, yet, it all seems to have been for naught. The old cooter just went right on living his usual life of drunkenness and debauchery. And then, in the end, he just got the life sucked out of him by those pesky old cancer spirits that he warned us to be on the look out for.
So---- there's old Doc Vic, at the very tip-top of our lift lists, with thousands of people all speaking in tongues for him, using the "Way approved" camera-focus technique, coupled with the infallible "law of believing" that "works for saint and sinner alike". And, yet, it all seems to have been for naught. The old cooter just went right on living his usual life of drunkenness and debauchery. And then, in the end, he just got the life sucked out of him by those pesky old cancer spirits that he warned us to be on the look out for.
What's it all mean?
A thousand voices chanting
apathetically in time
while the epitaph's recited
in an faultless droning rhyme
One of three things:
1. He didn't have the believing he claimed
2. He didn't have the connections he claimed
3. There is no such thing as the law of believing.
I gravitate toward #3. My reasoning has always been: if the law of believing was as important as they made it out to be wouldn't Saint Vic had done more study on it and had manifesting down to a science?
Instead what do you get when you discuss believing? Meaningless analogies and worthless bromides:
1. The camera analogy
2. Your sitting in that chair because of your believing
3. You are where you are today because of your believing, you will be where you will be tomorrow because of you believing.
Nothing to help you understand it to the point of where you can see where you errored and therefore failed. Even the law of attraction set did a more detailed job of explaining how they thought what we were taught was believing worked.
I once asked someone how I could tell if I was believing for something. Their answer: You get it. If you didn't get it you didn't believe enough.
So the only way you know if you have enough believing is by the results. A silly way of measuring things. Can you see waiting until you run out of gas to fill the tank? Or waiting until the pantry is empty to buy more food? Or waiting until your broke to go out and get a job?
There was nothing in the law of believing to provide you with mid-course corrections, it was all black or white.
Besides not being biblical, it is also a slap in the face for those who were killed because of their faith, including some people noted in the Bible itself. VP taught that they died because of their lack of believing; how arrogant! I'm all for having a positive attitude. All things remaining equal, it's better than having a negative one. But this belief that we are somehow superhuman with the power to direct the Will of God Himself, that is ridiculous.
This belief also makes it more difficult to relate to God personally. It is no longer necessary to converse with God and struggle with Him since He will do whatever we ask as long as we believe properly. In fact, depending on who was talking, actually conversing with God about something could also be a sign for lack of believing.
So---- there's old Doc Vic, at the very tip-top of our lift lists, with thousands of people all speaking in tongues for him, using the "Way approved" camera-focus technique, coupled with the infallible "law of believing" that "works for saint and sinner alike". And, yet, it all seems to have been for naught. The old cooter just went right on living his usual life of drunkenness and debauchery. And then, in the end, he just got the life sucked out of him by those pesky old cancer spirits that he warned us to be on the look out for.
What's it all mean?
A thousand voices chanting
apathetically in time
while the epitaph's recited
in an faultless droning rhyme
VPW was either a con or self-deluded . . . his followers were either conned or seeking escape and willing to except anything . . . damned the cost.
The God of The Way International is weak, boring, and useless. Just the way the followers want him. They are free to continually change stories about life and themselves. It's easier that way.
Besides not being biblical, it is also a slap in the face for those who were killed because of their faith, including some people noted in the Bible itself. VP taught that they died because of their lack of believing; how arrogant! I'm all for having a positive attitude. All things remaining equal, it's better than having a negative one. But this belief that we are somehow superhuman with the power to direct the Will of God Himself, that is ridiculous.
This belief also makes it more difficult to relate to God personally. It is no longer necessary to converse with God and struggle with Him since He will do whatever we ask as long as we believe properly. In fact, depending on who was talking, actually conversing with God about something could also be a sign for lack of believing.
What a damaging doctrine!
. . . and thou holdest fast my name, and hast not denied my faith, even in those days wherein Antipas my faithful martyr, who was slain among you. . . . .
Faithful martyr? According to VP's understanding that is a oxymoron. There is no such thing as a faithful martyr........
Right Geisha, not to mention the heros of the faith listed in Hebrews 11.
They were supposed to be our proof of how the law of believing works. And now that you know that the law of believing was a crock of hooey, what do you do with everything we were taught about The Book of Hebrews?
They were supposed to be our proof of how the law of believing works. And now that you know that the law of believing was a crock of hooey, what do you do with everything we were taught about The Book of Hebrews?
Stop trying to explain how "sawn assunder" got in there . . .
They were supposed to be our proof of how the law of believing works. And now that you know that the law of believing was a crock of hooey, what do you do with everything we were taught about The Book of Hebrews?
TWI gave the standard cop-out...The Book of Hebrews wasn't written directly to The Church, it was written for our learning. That makes no sense either. Also, all those guys lived prior to Christ's ascension and the pouring out of the gift of holy spirit had not happened. Today's believers can walk in greater power. I'm not saying for one second I believe any of that, I'm just giving you the TWI response.
So if your question is what do we do with everything we were taught about Hebrews, we throw it in the garbage along with just about everything else we were taught from that group.
If you are wondering how we really are supposed to view the book of Hebrews, well, that's another thread.
I think what VP taught was a false faith. It wasn't just believing equals receiving..... VP said something to the effect "SIT was the external proof in the senses realm of the internal reality and presence of the power of the HS.
I should have read Hebrews.
I was tricked by a sign.....and it was pretty devious..... the person we are to put our faith in....is the only one who gives us our assurance. He is the only one who can and if He is worthy of faith....our assurance has to be Him....nothing else will do. Yet my assurance was that sign. "Heaven bound and all hell can't stop us"....when I think about it...it took the place of genuine faith in Christ alone. If you believe the scriptures...some of us got tricked right out of salvation. We don't require a sign....we don't get our assurance from a sign.....we have faith in the Lord alone. I didn't need to Lo Shanta...I needed saving faith.
It was Pilate and those who mocked Jesus who wanted a sign.
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Bolshevik
Well there you go considering second thoughts again . . . I see where the hole in the hedge was made . . .
. . . But the faithful will stay the course . . .
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waysider
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teachmevp
You know VeePee wasn't a doctor?
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T-Bone
it means you can take him off the lift list now
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So_crates
One of three things:
1. He didn't have the believing he claimed
2. He didn't have the connections he claimed
3. There is no such thing as the law of believing.
I gravitate toward #3. My reasoning has always been: if the law of believing was as important as they made it out to be wouldn't Saint Vic had done more study on it and had manifesting down to a science?
Instead what do you get when you discuss believing? Meaningless analogies and worthless bromides:
1. The camera analogy
2. Your sitting in that chair because of your believing
3. You are where you are today because of your believing, you will be where you will be tomorrow because of you believing.
Nothing to help you understand it to the point of where you can see where you errored and therefore failed. Even the law of attraction set did a more detailed job of explaining how they thought what we were taught was believing worked.
I once asked someone how I could tell if I was believing for something. Their answer: You get it. If you didn't get it you didn't believe enough.
So the only way you know if you have enough believing is by the results. A silly way of measuring things. Can you see waiting until you run out of gas to fill the tank? Or waiting until the pantry is empty to buy more food? Or waiting until your broke to go out and get a job?
There was nothing in the law of believing to provide you with mid-course corrections, it was all black or white.
SoCrates
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Broken Arrow
Besides not being biblical, it is also a slap in the face for those who were killed because of their faith, including some people noted in the Bible itself. VP taught that they died because of their lack of believing; how arrogant! I'm all for having a positive attitude. All things remaining equal, it's better than having a negative one. But this belief that we are somehow superhuman with the power to direct the Will of God Himself, that is ridiculous.
This belief also makes it more difficult to relate to God personally. It is no longer necessary to converse with God and struggle with Him since He will do whatever we ask as long as we believe properly. In fact, depending on who was talking, actually conversing with God about something could also be a sign for lack of believing.
What a damaging doctrine!
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Bolshevik
VPW was either a con or self-deluded . . . his followers were either conned or seeking escape and willing to except anything . . . damned the cost.
The God of The Way International is weak, boring, and useless. Just the way the followers want him. They are free to continually change stories about life and themselves. It's easier that way.
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geisha779
. . . and thou holdest fast my name, and hast not denied my faith, even in those days wherein Antipas my faithful martyr, who was slain among you. . . . .
Faithful martyr? According to VP's understanding that is a oxymoron. There is no such thing as a faithful martyr........
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Broken Arrow
Right Geisha, not to mention the heros of the faith listed in Hebrews 11.
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waysider
They were supposed to be our proof of how the law of believing works. And now that you know that the law of believing was a crock of hooey, what do you do with everything we were taught about The Book of Hebrews?
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Bolshevik
Stop trying to explain how "sawn assunder" got in there . . .
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Broken Arrow
TWI gave the standard cop-out...The Book of Hebrews wasn't written directly to The Church, it was written for our learning. That makes no sense either. Also, all those guys lived prior to Christ's ascension and the pouring out of the gift of holy spirit had not happened. Today's believers can walk in greater power. I'm not saying for one second I believe any of that, I'm just giving you the TWI response.
So if your question is what do we do with everything we were taught about Hebrews, we throw it in the garbage along with just about everything else we were taught from that group.
If you are wondering how we really are supposed to view the book of Hebrews, well, that's another thread.
Edited by Broken ArrowLink to comment
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geisha779
Hebrews is about Jesus Christ and faith.
I think what VP taught was a false faith. It wasn't just believing equals receiving..... VP said something to the effect "SIT was the external proof in the senses realm of the internal reality and presence of the power of the HS.
I should have read Hebrews.
I was tricked by a sign.....and it was pretty devious..... the person we are to put our faith in....is the only one who gives us our assurance. He is the only one who can and if He is worthy of faith....our assurance has to be Him....nothing else will do. Yet my assurance was that sign. "Heaven bound and all hell can't stop us"....when I think about it...it took the place of genuine faith in Christ alone. If you believe the scriptures...some of us got tricked right out of salvation. We don't require a sign....we don't get our assurance from a sign.....we have faith in the Lord alone. I didn't need to Lo Shanta...I needed saving faith.
It was Pilate and those who mocked Jesus who wanted a sign.
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