Regarding the individual chapters in the Studies in Abundant Living, I,II,III series, these were originally small, individual paperbound commentaries that were handed out to class students until they (the commentaries) were later assembled into hardbound books. When I took the class in 1972, they were, at that point, hardbound but the individual chapters could be purchased through the bookstore. I still have most, if not all, of mine. There were also some that never made it into book form. These included some by Earl Burton, Peter Wade, Dorothy Owens and probably some I don't remember.
Regarding the individual chapters in the Studies in Abundant Living, I,II,III series, these were originally small, individual paperbound commentaries that were handed out to class students until they (the commentaries) were later assembled into hardbound books. When I took the class in 1972, they were, at that point, hardbound but the individual chapters could be purchased through the bookstore. I still have most, if not all, of mine. There were also some that never made it into book form. These included some by Earl Burton, Peter Wade, Dorothy Owens and probably some I don't remember.
See, they make the ole' huckster (Dr Wierwille - you know he wasn't really a doctor, don't you?) seem like he was an uber-intelligent scholar. In reality he, and others, started with all these commentaries that were later made into book form. This leads me to speculate that when he wasn't plagiarizing, he was printing the research department's works under his name. At least in part. Around the farm they make the man out to be some untouchable intellectual. I don't think the man was as bright as they say. I digress.
I think the book was at least born in plagiarism. the vicster started out with the day Jesus Christ died, three days three nights, others crucified.. cry of triumph, all of which were "refinements" of bullinger's work, except for the last one.. no idea where he got that from. Oh yeah, lamsa.
then he gets his "research(?)" team to fill in the blanks.
Just an observation and perhaps someone knows the answer. From my perspective, VPW's earlier books, such as the bible tells me so - etc, seem VERY elementary. In fact I understand that some of those early books were strung together from various tracts and pamphlets, the contents of which had been plagiarized from his mentors.
Fast forward a decade or two into TWI's hay-day and we have a book like Jesus Christ our Passover. It's a big thick book, carries many topics, seems to be well written (at least from memory.)
Did ole' Vic have the research department do the work and then he strung it together? Is that the modus operandi for all of the later books?
Just from my hazy memory it seems the older books were very disjointed and poorly written. I mean it's taken them years to edit Studies in Abundant Living, Volumes 1 through 5, and there are many editions of this series that have been released over the years. Then there are other books released under VPW's name that are in much better shape. My guess is he used other's work and called it his but it was all legal like because they were paid staff, therefore the work produced by the research department could be released under his name.
Just curious.
Waysider is right about the Studies in Abundant Living volumes originally being little booklets (I took PFAL in Dec. 1970 and got a whole stack of them.) They were stapled booklets. They were often transcriptions of little teachings from Sunday night or parts of topics covered in the PFAL class, since there was no PFAL book yet, not until the first version was published in July 1971. I have a copy from the first batch and the writing, I agree, is terrible. It's mostly a transcription from the PFAL tapes, but it doesn't include the entire PFAL class verbatim.
Before and after the Research Team at HQ was formed in the early 1980s, any publication under VPW's direction, such as JCOP, had VP's name on it, no matter how many other people contributed to the books, including Corps people and "faithful researchers" who never were in the Corps program, such as D*nna R*andall, VP's reserarch Secretary and W*later C*mmins (although I think he was in a special First Corps for couples or something in about 1975), and VP's eldest daughter, K&ren.
By the time I was at HQ on the Research Team (1984-86), the policy of having VP's name on these publications was standard procedure. Most of these people had college degrees and knew something about how to write. But having VP's name on the book was tradition. He had the ultimate say so about the research and writing.
One publication is an exception: The Concordance to the P-e-s-h-i-t-t-a- Version of the Aramaic N.T. (I worked on this) published in August 1985. VPW had no involvement with producing it other than providing financial funds to staff working on it. Credit is given this way: "Edited by the Way International Research Team." This decision was made, to the best of my remembrance, by WJC because VPW had died several months earlier. WJC was following precedent that VPW had begun. Although this publication is a text book of scholarly value, the usual attribution to the people responsible for the work is not given. I think the same is true of the Interlinear which came out a few years later. (P-e-s-h-i-t-t-a- has to be spelled with hyphens on this web site, otherwise a different word displays.)
My take on the reason that no one else's name but VPW (and WJC sometimes) are on the books (and I was there) is obvious to most of us here at GSC: VPW did not go by "worldly" academic standards. There were many people over the years who had contributed to the overall Aramaic project, so perhaps the list would have been too long to cite anyhow. One compensation was given, though. An issue of The Way Magazine came out around the time of the Concordance's publication and listed the names of the major contributors.
I might have this wrong, but I believe even the pamphlets were simply transcriptions of live teachings he did. His daughter, Karen, converted the teachings into written form and from there they were put into book form. She apparently has some actual background in editing. Then again, I have no idea where I heard this. I think if you read the acknowledgements at the beginning of the book he thanks Karen for her editing. I no longer have any materials. I may be totally wrong about this, but that's my recollection.
As far as the later writings, I'm not sure he wrote a single word. If I'm not mistaken, I think a young man (at the time) named Ch1p St@n$bury wrote the lion's share of Jesus Christ Our Passover. St@n$bury later resigned due to disagreements with Wierwille claiming the research team was nothing more than a group of "yes men" that rubber stamped Wierwille's biblical viewpoints. Wierwille said it, "broke his heart", and that he had been considering giving CS a byline on the book.
In regards to Jesus Christ Our Promised Seed, I think another individual named J0hn Cr0uch was the main contributor on that one.
Once again, these are my recollections. I'm sure Penworks can probably add more light to this.
I seem to recall W. Cummins mentioning that this practice wasn't any different from a college professor having his graduate students compile information for him to include in a book. Cummins also said it wasn't common practice for them to include their students as co-authors.
I might have this wrong, but I believe even the pamphlets were simply transcriptions of live teachings he did. His daughter, Karen, converted the teachings into written form and from there they were put into book form. She apparently has some actual background in editing. Then again, I have no idea where I heard this. I think if you read the acknowledgements at the beginning of the book he thanks Karen for her editing. I no longer have any materials. I may be totally wrong about this, but that's my recollection.
As far as the later writings, I'm not sure he wrote a single word. If I'm not mistaken, I think a young man (at the time) named Ch1p St@n$bury wrote the lion's share of Jesus Christ Our Passover. St@n$bury later resigned due to disagreements with Wierwille claiming the research team was nothing more than a group of "yes men" that rubber stamped Wierwille's biblical viewpoints. Wierwille said it, "broke his heart", and that he had been considering giving CS a byline on the book.
In regards to Jesus Christ Our Promised Seed, I think another individual named J0hn Cr0uch was the main contributor on that one.
Once again, these are my recollections. I'm sure Penworks can probably add more light to this.
I seem to recall W. Cummins mentioning that this practice wasn't any different from a college professor having his graduate students compile information for him to include in a book. Cummins also said it wasn't common practice for them to include their students as co-authors.
Yes, regarding K*aren, J. Cr*uch and Ch1p St@n$bury
Thanks for the history, first hand accounts, and information! Victor Paul Wierwille was a complete FAKE! Those who prop up his failed organization are following a whitewashed image of a man that never existed. Thank God I woke up, extracted my family, and got OUT of there.
Thanks for the history, first hand accounts, and information! Victor Paul Wierwille was a complete FAKE! Those who prop up his failed organization are following a whitewashed image of a man that never existed. Thank God I woke up, extracted my family, and got OUT of there.
This topic of TWI plagarism can be found throughout GSC forum threads. VP made money off books he nearly 100% stole from Bullinger and Stiles and others and claimed he wrote.
Visit this one of many articles by John Juedes, a long-time revealer of VPW fraudulent practices, plagarism, etc.
This topic of TWI plagarism can be found throughout GSC forum threads. VP made money off books he nearly 100% stole from Bullinger and Stiles and others and claimed he wrote.
Visit this one of many articles by John Juedes, a long-time revealer of VPW fraudulent practices, plagarism, etc.
vpw's claims to why he could get away with putting his name on the work of others
was explained by one poster as follows (who believed this tripe):
"By the way, are you aware of the usual process by which a highly esteemed college professor writes his books? He has his trusted graduate students write most of it, under the professor’s supervision. After training them and getting them to speak his language and utter his thoughts, the grad students become a secondary mouthpiece for the professor."
My response to it:
"The TRUTH of the matter is that if a professor attempted to have a student
write ANY portion of a book OR a dissertation he is going to attach his name
to-without featuring their name SPECIFICALLY as having written part of it-
the student could have the professor FIRED WITH CAUSE from the
institution, and the professor's reputation would be DESTROYED.
That's because colleges and universities take plagiarism
VERY, VERY SERIOUSLY.
Is it TECHNICALLY possible a professor (or professors) did this?
Yes-but "getting away with it" makes it no less a crime than theft
or murder ceases to be a crime if you don't get caught.
A professor may have a respected grad student REVIEW his work
before it's published-as a technical proofreader.
A professor may ask a respected grad student to COMPILE DATA-
which the professor will then read, evaluated, then write on.
That's not "writing" his book-not even a single letter of text."
One of the old posters/corps here actually wrote JC OP. VP stole it word for word and published it. And I maybe wrong but I believe he wrote the WHOLE thing while he was in the corps. If not the whole thing ~ a large part. We discussed it many times. I cannot elaborate, but I hope this helps you.
One of the old posters/corps here actually wrote JC OP. VP stole it word for word and published it. And I maybe wrong but I believe he wrote the WHOLE thing while he was in the corps. If not the whole thing ~ a large part. We discussed it many times. I cannot elaborate, but I hope this helps you.
Wow, thanks for that. I am (for once ) speechless.
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waysider
Regarding the individual chapters in the Studies in Abundant Living, I,II,III series, these were originally small, individual paperbound commentaries that were handed out to class students until they (the commentaries) were later assembled into hardbound books. When I took the class in 1972, they were, at that point, hardbound but the individual chapters could be purchased through the bookstore. I still have most, if not all, of mine. There were also some that never made it into book form. These included some by Earl Burton, Peter Wade, Dorothy Owens and probably some I don't remember.
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OldSkool
See, they make the ole' huckster (Dr Wierwille - you know he wasn't really a doctor, don't you?) seem like he was an uber-intelligent scholar. In reality he, and others, started with all these commentaries that were later made into book form. This leads me to speculate that when he wasn't plagiarizing, he was printing the research department's works under his name. At least in part. Around the farm they make the man out to be some untouchable intellectual. I don't think the man was as bright as they say. I digress.
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Ham
I think the book was at least born in plagiarism. the vicster started out with the day Jesus Christ died, three days three nights, others crucified.. cry of triumph, all of which were "refinements" of bullinger's work, except for the last one.. no idea where he got that from. Oh yeah, lamsa.
then he gets his "research(?)" team to fill in the blanks.
very, very carefully.
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penworks
Waysider is right about the Studies in Abundant Living volumes originally being little booklets (I took PFAL in Dec. 1970 and got a whole stack of them.) They were stapled booklets. They were often transcriptions of little teachings from Sunday night or parts of topics covered in the PFAL class, since there was no PFAL book yet, not until the first version was published in July 1971. I have a copy from the first batch and the writing, I agree, is terrible. It's mostly a transcription from the PFAL tapes, but it doesn't include the entire PFAL class verbatim.
Before and after the Research Team at HQ was formed in the early 1980s, any publication under VPW's direction, such as JCOP, had VP's name on it, no matter how many other people contributed to the books, including Corps people and "faithful researchers" who never were in the Corps program, such as D*nna R*andall, VP's reserarch Secretary and W*later C*mmins (although I think he was in a special First Corps for couples or something in about 1975), and VP's eldest daughter, K&ren.
By the time I was at HQ on the Research Team (1984-86), the policy of having VP's name on these publications was standard procedure. Most of these people had college degrees and knew something about how to write. But having VP's name on the book was tradition. He had the ultimate say so about the research and writing.
One publication is an exception: The Concordance to the P-e-s-h-i-t-t-a- Version of the Aramaic N.T. (I worked on this) published in August 1985. VPW had no involvement with producing it other than providing financial funds to staff working on it. Credit is given this way: "Edited by the Way International Research Team." This decision was made, to the best of my remembrance, by WJC because VPW had died several months earlier. WJC was following precedent that VPW had begun. Although this publication is a text book of scholarly value, the usual attribution to the people responsible for the work is not given. I think the same is true of the Interlinear which came out a few years later. (P-e-s-h-i-t-t-a- has to be spelled with hyphens on this web site, otherwise a different word displays.)
My take on the reason that no one else's name but VPW (and WJC sometimes) are on the books (and I was there) is obvious to most of us here at GSC: VPW did not go by "worldly" academic standards. There were many people over the years who had contributed to the overall Aramaic project, so perhaps the list would have been too long to cite anyhow. One compensation was given, though. An issue of The Way Magazine came out around the time of the Concordance's publication and listed the names of the major contributors.
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Broken Arrow
I might have this wrong, but I believe even the pamphlets were simply transcriptions of live teachings he did. His daughter, Karen, converted the teachings into written form and from there they were put into book form. She apparently has some actual background in editing. Then again, I have no idea where I heard this. I think if you read the acknowledgements at the beginning of the book he thanks Karen for her editing. I no longer have any materials. I may be totally wrong about this, but that's my recollection.
As far as the later writings, I'm not sure he wrote a single word. If I'm not mistaken, I think a young man (at the time) named Ch1p St@n$bury wrote the lion's share of Jesus Christ Our Passover. St@n$bury later resigned due to disagreements with Wierwille claiming the research team was nothing more than a group of "yes men" that rubber stamped Wierwille's biblical viewpoints. Wierwille said it, "broke his heart", and that he had been considering giving CS a byline on the book.
In regards to Jesus Christ Our Promised Seed, I think another individual named J0hn Cr0uch was the main contributor on that one.
Once again, these are my recollections. I'm sure Penworks can probably add more light to this.
I seem to recall W. Cummins mentioning that this practice wasn't any different from a college professor having his graduate students compile information for him to include in a book. Cummins also said it wasn't common practice for them to include their students as co-authors.
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penworks
Yes, regarding K*aren, J. Cr*uch and Ch1p St@n$bury
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OldSkool
Thanks for the history, first hand accounts, and information! Victor Paul Wierwille was a complete FAKE! Those who prop up his failed organization are following a whitewashed image of a man that never existed. Thank God I woke up, extracted my family, and got OUT of there.
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penworks
This topic of TWI plagarism can be found throughout GSC forum threads. VP made money off books he nearly 100% stole from Bullinger and Stiles and others and claimed he wrote.
Visit this one of many articles by John Juedes, a long-time revealer of VPW fraudulent practices, plagarism, etc.
Stolen Goods - How VP Wierwille plagarized from others to make Receiving the Holy Spirit Today
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OldSkool
Thanks, haven't been over there in a while, nor have I read all his works on the site. Will scoot on over this evening.
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WordWolf
Previous threads on the subject include:
vpw's plagiarized sources
Plagiarism 101
======================
vpw's claims to why he could get away with putting his name on the work of others
was explained by one poster as follows (who believed this tripe):
"By the way, are you aware of the usual process by which a highly esteemed college professor writes his books? He has his trusted graduate students write most of it, under the professor’s supervision. After training them and getting them to speak his language and utter his thoughts, the grad students become a secondary mouthpiece for the professor."
My response to it:
"The TRUTH of the matter is that if a professor attempted to have a student
write ANY portion of a book OR a dissertation he is going to attach his name
to-without featuring their name SPECIFICALLY as having written part of it-
the student could have the professor FIRED WITH CAUSE from the
institution, and the professor's reputation would be DESTROYED.
That's because colleges and universities take plagiarism
VERY, VERY SERIOUSLY.
Is it TECHNICALLY possible a professor (or professors) did this?
Yes-but "getting away with it" makes it no less a crime than theft
or murder ceases to be a crime if you don't get caught.
A professor may have a respected grad student REVIEW his work
before it's published-as a technical proofreader.
A professor may ask a respected grad student to COMPILE DATA-
which the professor will then read, evaluated, then write on.
That's not "writing" his book-not even a single letter of text."
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Dot Matrix
One of the old posters/corps here actually wrote JC OP. VP stole it word for word and published it. And I maybe wrong but I believe he wrote the WHOLE thing while he was in the corps. If not the whole thing ~ a large part. We discussed it many times. I cannot elaborate, but I hope this helps you.
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OldSkool
Wow, thanks for that. I am (for once
) speechless.
You too, WordWolf.
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