I took the Advanced Class in New Knoxville around 1972 or so...
Victor taught that homosexuality was a devil spirit in that class.
delusional pea-brain
That teaching has been present in every Advanced Class in TWI since then. There are categories of devil spirits taught and recorded in the syllabi called "homosexual spirits". Also, TWI has it's "Believer's Family Class" that teaches God designed sexual relationships to be between one couple - man and woman. That teaching is pretty much a reflection of fundamentalist Christianity.
Modern psychology tends to point to evidence that males determine their sexual preference early on and typically do not change. Females can change sexual preference more often. Those aren't absolute rules, but seem to be general trends. Those not in a "traditional" based sexual orientation hide or are persecuted.
I'm not sure I want to demonize all those holding Fundamentalist views. By the same token I don't want to contribute towards the persecution of those with non-traditional sexual preferences.
However, I do want to highlight that the current leadership of TWI is leading a double-standard life - saying one thing with their rules they impose on everyone else, and yet quite another in their personal lifestyle. This is hypocrisy, and is wrong.
I caught two queer dudes in their room in Uncle Harry dorm once. They'd just commenced, but were not "flagrante' dilicto" just yet, but they were gettin after it. I was deliverin' the mail. Custom was, when delivering the mail, you knocked on the dorm door and waited. If no one answered, you knocked again and then waited again. So, that's what happened. And finally after waiting the polite amount of time after the second knock to then go in and put the mail on the dresser, I did so. And when I walked in, they were all en twined. Shocked the livin crapola outa me! It was rough for this cave man to be seein something like that! I dumped the mail on the dresser and got the hell out! I was thinkin; "These guys are in the Corps?!" I reported them, but they were not kicked out. They were talked to by JAL and the Red Dragon though. I liked one of them, the other one was an azz hole. The good guy went on to marry a friend of mine and they had a happy marriage for awhile. They are broke up now though. The other one's dead.
We used to sing this tune in Junior High School and sing it like this: "Jock full of nuts...." But you know how seventh and eighth graders are. Sounds kinda gay, if you swing that way. "Jock full O nuts?" Get it? Hah hawww!
But the history of this particular coffee really is quite interesting, and, the music and vocals are most excellent! Enjoy Chockfull!!
That really is a cool link isn't it. And so, I didn't know they still made that coffee. I think I'll check and see if they sell it here in Juneau, Alaska and buy some. I mean, the "official coffee of the NY Yankees"? It may not be "grind yer own", but it must be pretty decent if it earned that motto. Oh, and the gay thing. My time in The Way and in The Way Corps was about the same time frame of Sunesis. And, I was under the impression that any and all gay activity was taboo. The Scriptures are/were clear to me that it's a definite "no no", and since "It Is Written" was supposed to be our motto, I figured that anyone caught at it would be out on their azz. But, now that I think of it, I remember two other incidents. One, a Corps bro went home for some family emergency, and while there got drunk and had a gay liason with an old friend. He actually fessed up to it when he came back to Emporia, and was told that he couldn't graduate, and that he would have to go through his entire final year all over again without incident. And that's what he did. And, he's married with children and is a fine fellow. So, I was happy to see the element of forgiveness.
The other guy, a really good friend of mine turned out to be gay, and after his first year on the field after we graduated, went back to his old lifestyle and never was involved in The Way ever again. It was funny, because I never once thought of him as a one time gay guy. Yet, after I learned that he'd gone back to it, I saw then that there lots and lots of things that he'd said to me that were really quite provocative in a homosexual way. But, I never thought a thing of it. Once, when a bunch of us guys were staying in the "Waytels" (plywood shacks with bunks in the Way Woods), we were "panty raided" by the girls in the Waytel next to us. Yeah, they took us by surprise and came in and threw toilet paper all around and screamed and then ran out giggling. We were like; "What???" Shoot, we began to say, they were all wearing their bathrobes or house coats or whatever the hell wimmin call those things. Not even a teddy or a nightie amongst 'em. "We'll get 'em back and give 'em a real show"! So, we planned to get them back the next night. So, here is what we did. We practiced the song "Oh we love you love you love you" (that birthdays song), and when we practiced it, we were all naked, in a line, with our arms over our shoulders, like the Rockettes with our willies wavin'. And as we sang, we kicked our legs like the Rockettes, all though obviously not as high as the Rockettes, but in time with the song. We even did pelvic thrusts in between the verses. You know; "And we'll sing it once again-ugh ugh!" It really was pretty funny. And there was this guy, my pal, in there naked with the rest of us buff young studs, and, little did I know how much he may have been enjoying himself! I mean, if when I was in The Corps, and since my sexual preference is definitely Women, I am sure I would have completely loved it if I found myself in a dance line, naked with a bunch of pretty naked women! He must have really loved that practice session that we had that hot summer night. And so, naked (about eight of us), we all trooped out the door, went to the girls's Waytel, and tried to go in their front door. But, it wouldn't open and they were yellin at us to "go away". Turns out they were ready for us and had barricaded the door with something, and if we forced it, we would have broken something and gotten into trouble. And so, we didn't get to do our little Performance. Too bad you missed it girls! But my friend didn't...
Wasn't there some guy who wrote a book about being gay and the lifestyle and getting delivered by PFAL and being in the WC and all? I believe this person even was married. From his book, fictionalized as it was and truly weird as it was, it was apparent he idolized VPW and yet I think he eventually divorced his wife and went back to the lifestyle of a gay man.
The book is called "The Hope Of Glory (In Search Of The Light)" by David Charles Craley I still have a copy. I just went to my bookshelf to read the title so I could give it to you correctly. I only read it once. I have thought about re-reading it, but I remember it as a really weird story. At the end of the book, after his "homo spirits" were cast out (in graphic detail), he went on to seriously idolize Dr. Wierwille in a fictitious and very strange way. I remember as a Corps guy seriously wondering about Craley and how he idolized VP, and "why was it that VPW allowed this type of ending to the book"? Granted it was Craley's book and he could say what he wanted to say. But Craley also regarded the MOG's opinion very highly, so, I guess that type of "idol fiction" had VP's blessing or Craley would have changed it...
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Nottawayfer
Well said!
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waysider
"I took the Advanced Class in New Knoxville around 1972 or so...
Victor taught that homosexuality was a devil spirit in that class.
delusional pea-brain"
I'll bet that hot root we had to chew at the initiation into the inner sanctum was really some kind of magic potion to ward off debuhl spurts.
Too bad VP didn't chew any of it.
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chockfull
That teaching has been present in every Advanced Class in TWI since then. There are categories of devil spirits taught and recorded in the syllabi called "homosexual spirits". Also, TWI has it's "Believer's Family Class" that teaches God designed sexual relationships to be between one couple - man and woman. That teaching is pretty much a reflection of fundamentalist Christianity.
Modern psychology tends to point to evidence that males determine their sexual preference early on and typically do not change. Females can change sexual preference more often. Those aren't absolute rules, but seem to be general trends. Those not in a "traditional" based sexual orientation hide or are persecuted.
I'm not sure I want to demonize all those holding Fundamentalist views. By the same token I don't want to contribute towards the persecution of those with non-traditional sexual preferences.
However, I do want to highlight that the current leadership of TWI is leading a double-standard life - saying one thing with their rules they impose on everyone else, and yet quite another in their personal lifestyle. This is hypocrisy, and is wrong.
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Pax
NOR DO I!!!
I'm sorry if any of my rants against bad religion
implied that the practitioners were evil.
No, only the hypocrisy and crimes and mumbo jumbo teachings
of some leaders.
Those who say one thing and do another re: public and private sexuality
are to be most pitied.
Often their financial, psychological, and familial well-being
drive them to these falsehoods.
Fundamentalism is a powerful counterfeit of good religion...
but alack, we're surrounded by it in different flavors...
Muslim & Christian, among others.
It's sad because progressive Christianity
with, an enlightened view of scripture,
has the lasting power that biblicism,
with its house-of-cards-faith,
doesn't
and it does provide a firm basis for a healthy sexuality
and guidance for living joyfully and faithfully,
in times that demand good guidance
instead of retrenchment into some idealized,
false history of an easier time
with paint-by-number morality
that works well for
older, white, straight, European-extracted males
(like me).
For those who want to take a peek at progressive Christianity
I recommend this book ...
THE HEART OF CHRISTIANITY by Marcus Borg...
"The heart cannot easily accept what the mind rejects." Marcus Borg
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ClayJay
It's a giant sunflower still on the stalk, fwiw...
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ClayJay
I caught two queer dudes in their room in Uncle Harry dorm once. They'd just commenced, but were not "flagrante' dilicto" just yet, but they were gettin after it. I was deliverin' the mail. Custom was, when delivering the mail, you knocked on the dorm door and waited. If no one answered, you knocked again and then waited again. So, that's what happened. And finally after waiting the polite amount of time after the second knock to then go in and put the mail on the dresser, I did so. And when I walked in, they were all en twined. Shocked the livin crapola outa me! It was rough for this cave man to be seein something like that! I dumped the mail on the dresser and got the hell out! I was thinkin; "These guys are in the Corps?!" I reported them, but they were not kicked out. They were talked to by JAL and the Red Dragon though. I liked one of them, the other one was an azz hole. The good guy went on to marry a friend of mine and they had a happy marriage for awhile. They are broke up now though. The other one's dead.
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ClayJay
Hey Chockfull, how did you pick your name? Chockfull of nuts? Remember that coffee commercial? "Chockfull of nuts is that heavenly coffee...."
Click here to learn about your history...
http://www.chockfullonuts.com/history.aspx#/history
We used to sing this tune in Junior High School and sing it like this: "Jock full of nuts...." But you know how seventh and eighth graders are. Sounds kinda gay, if you swing that way. "Jock full O nuts?" Get it? Hah hawww!
But the history of this particular coffee really is quite interesting, and, the music and vocals are most excellent! Enjoy Chockfull!!
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chockfull
You got me pegged, bro!
And cool link. I loved the vocals.
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ClayJay
That really is a cool link isn't it. And so, I didn't know they still made that coffee. I think I'll check and see if they sell it here in Juneau, Alaska and buy some. I mean, the "official coffee of the NY Yankees"? It may not be "grind yer own", but it must be pretty decent if it earned that motto. Oh, and the gay thing. My time in The Way and in The Way Corps was about the same time frame of Sunesis. And, I was under the impression that any and all gay activity was taboo. The Scriptures are/were clear to me that it's a definite "no no", and since "It Is Written" was supposed to be our motto, I figured that anyone caught at it would be out on their azz. But, now that I think of it, I remember two other incidents. One, a Corps bro went home for some family emergency, and while there got drunk and had a gay liason with an old friend. He actually fessed up to it when he came back to Emporia, and was told that he couldn't graduate, and that he would have to go through his entire final year all over again without incident. And that's what he did. And, he's married with children and is a fine fellow. So, I was happy to see the element of forgiveness.
The other guy, a really good friend of mine turned out to be gay, and after his first year on the field after we graduated, went back to his old lifestyle and never was involved in The Way ever again. It was funny, because I never once thought of him as a one time gay guy. Yet, after I learned that he'd gone back to it, I saw then that there lots and lots of things that he'd said to me that were really quite provocative in a homosexual way. But, I never thought a thing of it. Once, when a bunch of us guys were staying in the "Waytels" (plywood shacks with bunks in the Way Woods), we were "panty raided" by the girls in the Waytel next to us. Yeah, they took us by surprise and came in and threw toilet paper all around and screamed and then ran out giggling. We were like; "What???" Shoot, we began to say, they were all wearing their bathrobes or house coats or whatever the hell wimmin call those things. Not even a teddy or a nightie amongst 'em. "We'll get 'em back and give 'em a real show"! So, we planned to get them back the next night. So, here is what we did. We practiced the song "Oh we love you love you love you" (that birthdays song), and when we practiced it, we were all naked, in a line, with our arms over our shoulders, like the Rockettes with our willies wavin'. And as we sang, we kicked our legs like the Rockettes, all though obviously not as high as the Rockettes, but in time with the song. We even did pelvic thrusts in between the verses. You know; "And we'll sing it once again-ugh ugh!" It really was pretty funny. And there was this guy, my pal, in there naked with the rest of us buff young studs, and, little did I know how much he may have been enjoying himself! I mean, if when I was in The Corps, and since my sexual preference is definitely Women, I am sure I would have completely loved it if I found myself in a dance line, naked with a bunch of pretty naked women! He must have really loved that practice session that we had that hot summer night. And so, naked (about eight of us), we all trooped out the door, went to the girls's Waytel, and tried to go in their front door. But, it wouldn't open and they were yellin at us to "go away". Turns out they were ready for us and had barricaded the door with something, and if we forced it, we would have broken something and gotten into trouble. And so, we didn't get to do our little Performance. Too bad you missed it girls! But my friend didn't...
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Watered Garden
Wasn't there some guy who wrote a book about being gay and the lifestyle and getting delivered by PFAL and being in the WC and all? I believe this person even was married. From his book, fictionalized as it was and truly weird as it was, it was apparent he idolized VPW and yet I think he eventually divorced his wife and went back to the lifestyle of a gay man.
Just a fleeting memory.
WG
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ClayJay
The book is called "The Hope Of Glory (In Search Of The Light)" by David Charles Craley I still have a copy. I just went to my bookshelf to read the title so I could give it to you correctly. I only read it once. I have thought about re-reading it, but I remember it as a really weird story. At the end of the book, after his "homo spirits" were cast out (in graphic detail), he went on to seriously idolize Dr. Wierwille in a fictitious and very strange way. I remember as a Corps guy seriously wondering about Craley and how he idolized VP, and "why was it that VPW allowed this type of ending to the book"? Granted it was Craley's book and he could say what he wanted to say. But Craley also regarded the MOG's opinion very highly, so, I guess that type of "idol fiction" had VP's blessing or Craley would have changed it...
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sirguessalot
i vote for #5...confused.
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