(if you brush your teeth really good it will get rid of the puke taste.)
See, this is kind of a butt head thing to say. And I saw the first reference earlier on and let it go. You don't bother me at all. I have moved on from the way international into greener pastures. My dealings on grease spot are to leave a witness of the things I saw.
Probably worked with each other. HQ? What top leadership graduated under B&olck$l%?
Well, if you were at HQ, you should be able to do the math. Other than that I maintain a reasonable level of privacy.
Anyways. I don't know what book of acts you read. I just read in Acts where the disciples prayed to go out and speak with more boldness. I also read where Paul got the right hand of fellowship from the leadership to go speak, i.e. to Witness!!!!
You see. I never refuted preaching, speaking, teaching, signs, miracles, wonders, healing the sick, raising the dead, etc. I did refute that there was a man made organization that these men pledged allegiance to, such as the way international. Also, there was no "selling" scheme in place. Paul was speaking without their right hand for some time before he actually met those you call "leadership." And no where can you substantiate that they were a corporation that required a lifetime of Christian service of it's ministers. You can read the way international into the records, but once you take off the glasses you will see that the way international is not there.
I also read where Paul got the right hand of fellowship from the leadership to go speak, i.e. to Witness!!!
He got the right hand of fellowship from the leadership to go speak? What's that mean? So were they not permitted to speak without "leadership" giving them this right hand?
Sure doesn't match the record I read in Acts..
"While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, "Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them." So after they had fasted and prayed, they placed their hands on them and sent them off. The two of them, sent on their way by the Holy Spirit, went down to Seleucia and sailed from there to Cyprus."
So you assume that "they placed their hands on them and sent them off" only refers to "leadership" and their magical "right" hand? How does one derive that these were the "leadership"? Is there a verse missing that says this?
I don't know that you could compare what Paul or the first century did to anything the Way Corps or anyone in the Way does.. I mean, where do we read that Paul waited for people to donate money before he would teach them "da werd"? Where do they gather together in the Bible, but before they get into da werd, they hear advertisements for the new Way poster or music CDs for sale! Where do they make God's house a house of merchandise and sell things there because it was the right thing to do instead of being thrown out because it isn't of God?
Ok, I'll limit to just those simple questions. Clearly The Way is in tune with what scriptures say at least on some basic premises of loving and helping people.. You know, sharing the Word out of love instead of requiring money before they can hear classes that supposedly help them?
Thanks for the open ears. Sorry I'm gonna keep the positive "high road" as you called it and assume the best. Nobody can know for sure except them and God what the heart's intention is.
There are other ways to know:
1) The fruit of their lives and what is produced
2) Personal experience
3) The testimony of witnesses
They're Way Corps to the core and I love them for it!!!! (Did that just make you throw up in your mouth a little? hahahaha)
You assume we're evil and we hate the Way Corps. You assume they are the best. Maybe some of these other people are good people. And yet the longer they have been around the greater the likelihood they have had to compromise themselves to maintain their positions.
The ideals behind the Way Corps are good. The tenets involved are good. What is evil is how the leadership of TWI uses those ideals in the hearts of good people to accomplish their own political aspirations and motives. How they trade in the flesh of people is evil. How they lie, cheat and steal to accomplish their aims is evil. And when the spotlight gets put on their personal lives which they make gargantuan efforts to ensure that it is not, the evil comes out somewhere. Why do you think Rosalie is such an obsessively private person? Why is lesbianism widespread and accepted at HQ? Why is there a huge problems with alcoholism among teens at HQ? It's not that way elsewhere.
I love the basic tenets of the Way Corps. I just have to live them elsewhere because the Way doesn't deserve my life. I voted with my feet.
And I do agree with you, they probably have been "counselled" to drop a few through the years and I personally don't think there is anything wrong with that but that's my opinion:)
The ideal of cp3 is throughout the program including diet and exercise. It's basically healthy. And many people like your acquaintance in CA do both those things and have for years, just genetics aren't conducive. She wouldn't make it back through the program though as it is now.
What's the product they're pitching? Any examples?
There are many honest and naive people being used to perpetuate something that is evil. You can't put new wine into an old wineskin.
I don't know what book of acts you read. I just read in Acts where the disciples prayed to go out and speak with more boldness. I also read where Paul got the right hand of fellowship from the leadership to go speak, i.e. to Witness!!!! love it. Makes me want to go witness right now!!!
What do you witness? The Lord Jesus Christ? Or the Way? Or is there no difference in your mind?
You know, maybe if you just ignore all the evil in the Way, your life can make a difference. You can spend the next 20 or 30 years making it better. After all, it's your calling, right? You have this fantastic, beautiful new wine skin that will make all the difference in the world.
(if you brush your teeth really good it will get rid of the puke taste.)
The taste that is there left from RR, JR, etc. can't be brushed out.
What do you witness? The Lord Jesus Christ? Or the Way? Or is there no difference in your mind?
You know, maybe if you just ignore all the evil in the Way, your life can make a difference. You can spend the next 20 or 30 years making it better. After all, it's your calling, right? You have this fantastic, beautiful new wine skin that will make all the difference in the world.
The taste that is there left from RR, JR, etc. can't be brushed out.
I think his wording is revealing. The taste would be bitterness from bile no? So, he is basically saying he thinks we are bitter. Personally, I am not.
I think his wording is revealing. The taste would be bitterness from bile no? So, he is basically saying he thinks we are bitter. Personally, I am not.
Actually the word bitter is an intriguing study. It occurs throughout the Bible including Isaiah, Jeremiah, and Revelation.
Can there be that which is bitter in the belly yet tastes sweet in the mouth? I'll leave that to the Biblical scholars.
But with the way collective blindness works in TWI, the word bitter's only worth is to discount the truth of someone telling them what they don't want to hear. You know, kind of like someone telling you when reproving them that what you said was true, but because you didn't say it "in love" it wasn't true.
But let the blind be blind and those that want to see see.
Things seem to keep coming back to me. I have known several obese followers of the way international who wanted to get into the Way Corpse. They were not allowed. I've heard low whispers from those in the know that Rosie doesn't like obese people to be in the way corps and would do whatever she could to discourage overweight folks from joining the ranks.
Now I'm ....ed all over again. We were falsely accused of being homosexuals and kicked out of the family corps in the mid-90s when lcm was still president. The family corps coordinator threw a hellatious temper tantrum, cussing and yelling at me, declaring me this and that untrue bunch of something and even demanded that I not respond at all. It's been a long time of not knowing why. I never believed they thought we were really homosexual and even if we were, the godly thing to do would not have been mark and avoid us.
What really has my blood boiling right now is that for about a week now, since I first read this first post on this thread, I've been mulling over in my mind yet another outrageous offense twi pulled on me. They accepted me into the corps program even after I requested that I wait a year, among other reasons, to lose weight before entering residence. A cabinet member whose initials are BG convinced me that God wanted me in THAT corps and my concerns were just the adversary throwing darts at me.
So now it appears that they took all my money and just sat by watching me move my son and myself into the campus after taking on all the expense of moving and gathering all the picky detailed items they demanded we bring with us, knowing all the while that I was being set up for failure from the start of my apprentice year. I weighed less when I actually went into residence than I did a year earlier when I applied and was welcomed into the program. Those arrogant so-and-so's! How devious can people be?
By the way, I had a physical exam and the doc gave me a clean bill of health and signed his name indicating his belief that I could physically handle the way corps program.
So they took my money, my heart and almost my soul - all the while knowing they were gonna kick me out anyway.
2018When they arrived, he said to them: "You know how I lived the whole time I was with you, from the first day I came into the province of Asia. 19I served the Lord with great humility and with tears, although I was severely tested by the plots of the Jews. 20You know that I have not hesitated to preach anything that would be helpful to you but have taught you publicly and from house to house. 21I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus. 22"And now, compelled by the Spirit, I am going to Jerusalem, not knowing what will happen to me there. 23I only know that in every city the Holy Spirit warns me that prison and hardships are facing me. 24However, I consider my life worth nothing to me, if only I may finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me—the task of testifying to the gospel of God's grace.
25"Now I know that none of you among whom I have gone about preaching the kingdom will ever see me again. 26Therefore, I declare to you today that I am innocent of the blood of all men. 27For I have not hesitated to proclaim to you the whole will of God. 28Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers.[a] Be shepherds of the church of God,which he bought with his own blood. 29I know that after I leave, savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock. 30Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them. 31So be on your guard! Remember that for three years I never stopped warning each of you night and day with tears.
I would be taking a closer look at that passage in relation to TWI instead of comparing their conduct to that of the Apostles when praying for boldness....TWI was a cult not a nice little Church....and there are enough warnings in scripture to be without excuse. IMHO
Looks like Cap'n DriveBy had to go back underground so the WayGB wouldn't find out he'd been posting on GS.
I know, right. Funny how an occasional innie will swing by, try and debate some points, get all worked up because they can't really make a logical defense using the way international's illogic and then leave. God forbid they would actually consider some of the points that were made and even get back to the scripture for comparison. No, considering is the first step "down." Glad I started considering long ago as it led to my eventual freedom. Considering isn't the first step down - it's the first of many hurried steps towards the metaphorical door.
Cap'n Drive-By has been a member for less than a year. It takes some time to disentangle. Perhaps just posting here is the "first step" to his eventual escape. It took some of us a long time to begin to shake off Waybrain. And that's when for whatever reason we're already out. For an innie, perhaps it's harder.
Please don't beat on him so hard that he doesn't want to come back to the Cafe ... so hard that in fact belonging to TWI is a nicer place to be . Cos although we know it ain't - but he doesn't know that yet.
Please don't beat on him so hard that he doesn't want to come back to the Cafe ... so hard that in fact belonging to TWI is a nicer place to be . Cos although we know it ain't - but he doesn't know that yet.
I hope I haven't come off like that. As I've said b4, sometimes intent is lost in cyberspace. But either way, he came by here with at least one gun blazing. I have not been nasty to them, nor will I be. I am happy to respectfully debate any position I am able here, or in person. I wish em the best.
I have no desire to convince anyone to leave The Way.
If, on the other hand, they have already made a decision to leave or have recently left or, maybe, left a long time ago and are just now coming to grips with what happened, I am happy to offer what little support I have to give.
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Billy G
in the mountains baby!:)
chockfull
So because someone stated accurately that the Lead duo was done behind Founders and didn't specify that it was only that way for one year in a transition period this is why there is so (many times rep
Billy G
Sorry I've been at work and I don't get on that often. I didn't mean to communicate that the reason people with weight issues aren't accepted isn't because of weight issues. I don't know that and I
Billy G
It helped with harmony in my family!!
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OldSkool
See, this is kind of a butt head thing to say. And I saw the first reference earlier on and let it go. You don't bother me at all. I have moved on from the way international into greener pastures. My dealings on grease spot are to leave a witness of the things I saw.
Well, if you were at HQ, you should be able to do the math. Other than that I maintain a reasonable level of privacy.
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waysider
Good for you!
It didn't have quite the same effect on Tom Mitchell's family.
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/editorial/editorial-items/driven-to-suicide.html
Or Kristen Skedgell's
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/main2/radio/episodes/kristen-skedgell-more-on-losing-the-way.html
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OldSkool
You see. I never refuted preaching, speaking, teaching, signs, miracles, wonders, healing the sick, raising the dead, etc. I did refute that there was a man made organization that these men pledged allegiance to, such as the way international. Also, there was no "selling" scheme in place. Paul was speaking without their right hand for some time before he actually met those you call "leadership." And no where can you substantiate that they were a corporation that required a lifetime of Christian service of it's ministers. You can read the way international into the records, but once you take off the glasses you will see that the way international is not there.
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TrustAndObey
He got the right hand of fellowship from the leadership to go speak? What's that mean? So were they not permitted to speak without "leadership" giving them this right hand?
Sure doesn't match the record I read in Acts..
"While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, "Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them." So after they had fasted and prayed, they placed their hands on them and sent them off. The two of them, sent on their way by the Holy Spirit, went down to Seleucia and sailed from there to Cyprus."
So you assume that "they placed their hands on them and sent them off" only refers to "leadership" and their magical "right" hand? How does one derive that these were the "leadership"? Is there a verse missing that says this?
I don't know that you could compare what Paul or the first century did to anything the Way Corps or anyone in the Way does.. I mean, where do we read that Paul waited for people to donate money before he would teach them "da werd"? Where do they gather together in the Bible, but before they get into da werd, they hear advertisements for the new Way poster or music CDs for sale! Where do they make God's house a house of merchandise and sell things there because it was the right thing to do instead of being thrown out because it isn't of God?
Ok, I'll limit to just those simple questions. Clearly The Way is in tune with what scriptures say at least on some basic premises of loving and helping people.. You know, sharing the Word out of love instead of requiring money before they can hear classes that supposedly help them?
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chockfull
There are other ways to know:
1) The fruit of their lives and what is produced
2) Personal experience
3) The testimony of witnesses
You assume we're evil and we hate the Way Corps. You assume they are the best. Maybe some of these other people are good people. And yet the longer they have been around the greater the likelihood they have had to compromise themselves to maintain their positions.
The ideals behind the Way Corps are good. The tenets involved are good. What is evil is how the leadership of TWI uses those ideals in the hearts of good people to accomplish their own political aspirations and motives. How they trade in the flesh of people is evil. How they lie, cheat and steal to accomplish their aims is evil. And when the spotlight gets put on their personal lives which they make gargantuan efforts to ensure that it is not, the evil comes out somewhere. Why do you think Rosalie is such an obsessively private person? Why is lesbianism widespread and accepted at HQ? Why is there a huge problems with alcoholism among teens at HQ? It's not that way elsewhere.
I love the basic tenets of the Way Corps. I just have to live them elsewhere because the Way doesn't deserve my life. I voted with my feet.
The ideal of cp3 is throughout the program including diet and exercise. It's basically healthy. And many people like your acquaintance in CA do both those things and have for years, just genetics aren't conducive. She wouldn't make it back through the program though as it is now.
There are many honest and naive people being used to perpetuate something that is evil. You can't put new wine into an old wineskin.
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chockfull
What do you witness? The Lord Jesus Christ? Or the Way? Or is there no difference in your mind?
You know, maybe if you just ignore all the evil in the Way, your life can make a difference. You can spend the next 20 or 30 years making it better. After all, it's your calling, right? You have this fantastic, beautiful new wine skin that will make all the difference in the world.
The taste that is there left from RR, JR, etc. can't be brushed out.
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OldSkool
I think his wording is revealing. The taste would be bitterness from bile no? So, he is basically saying he thinks we are bitter. Personally, I am not.
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chockfull
Actually the word bitter is an intriguing study. It occurs throughout the Bible including Isaiah, Jeremiah, and Revelation.
Can there be that which is bitter in the belly yet tastes sweet in the mouth? I'll leave that to the Biblical scholars.
But with the way collective blindness works in TWI, the word bitter's only worth is to discount the truth of someone telling them what they don't want to hear. You know, kind of like someone telling you when reproving them that what you said was true, but because you didn't say it "in love" it wasn't true.
But let the blind be blind and those that want to see see.
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bowtwi
Now I'm ....ed all over again. We were falsely accused of being homosexuals and kicked out of the family corps in the mid-90s when lcm was still president. The family corps coordinator threw a hellatious temper tantrum, cussing and yelling at me, declaring me this and that untrue bunch of something and even demanded that I not respond at all. It's been a long time of not knowing why. I never believed they thought we were really homosexual and even if we were, the godly thing to do would not have been mark and avoid us.
What really has my blood boiling right now is that for about a week now, since I first read this first post on this thread, I've been mulling over in my mind yet another outrageous offense twi pulled on me. They accepted me into the corps program even after I requested that I wait a year, among other reasons, to lose weight before entering residence. A cabinet member whose initials are BG convinced me that God wanted me in THAT corps and my concerns were just the adversary throwing darts at me.
So now it appears that they took all my money and just sat by watching me move my son and myself into the campus after taking on all the expense of moving and gathering all the picky detailed items they demanded we bring with us, knowing all the while that I was being set up for failure from the start of my apprentice year. I weighed less when I actually went into residence than I did a year earlier when I applied and was welcomed into the program. Those arrogant so-and-so's! How devious can people be?
By the way, I had a physical exam and the doc gave me a clean bill of health and signed his name indicating his belief that I could physically handle the way corps program.
So they took my money, my heart and almost my soul - all the while knowing they were gonna kick me out anyway.
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geisha779
Oh for goodness sake....Acts also say this:
------------------------------------------------------------------
2018When they arrived, he said to them: "You know how I lived the whole time I was with you, from the first day I came into the province of Asia. 19I served the Lord with great humility and with tears, although I was severely tested by the plots of the Jews. 20You know that I have not hesitated to preach anything that would be helpful to you but have taught you publicly and from house to house. 21I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus. 22"And now, compelled by the Spirit, I am going to Jerusalem, not knowing what will happen to me there. 23I only know that in every city the Holy Spirit warns me that prison and hardships are facing me. 24However, I consider my life worth nothing to me, if only I may finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me—the task of testifying to the gospel of God's grace.
25"Now I know that none of you among whom I have gone about preaching the kingdom will ever see me again. 26Therefore, I declare to you today that I am innocent of the blood of all men. 27For I have not hesitated to proclaim to you the whole will of God. 28Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers.[a] Be shepherds of the church of God,which he bought with his own blood. 29I know that after I leave, savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock. 30Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them. 31So be on your guard! Remember that for three years I never stopped warning each of you night and day with tears.
---------------------------------------------------------
I would be taking a closer look at that passage in relation to TWI instead of comparing their conduct to that of the Apostles when praying for boldness....TWI was a cult not a nice little Church....and there are enough warnings in scripture to be without excuse. IMHO
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chockfull
Looks like Cap'n DriveBy had to go back underground so the WayGB wouldn't find out he'd been posting on GS.
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OldSkool
I know, right. Funny how an occasional innie will swing by, try and debate some points, get all worked up because they can't really make a logical defense using the way international's illogic and then leave. God forbid they would actually consider some of the points that were made and even get back to the scripture for comparison. No, considering is the first step "down." Glad I started considering long ago as it led to my eventual freedom. Considering isn't the first step down - it's the first of many hurried steps towards the metaphorical door.
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Twinky
Cap'n Drive-By has been a member for less than a year. It takes some time to disentangle. Perhaps just posting here is the "first step" to his eventual escape. It took some of us a long time to begin to shake off Waybrain. And that's when for whatever reason we're already out. For an innie, perhaps it's harder.
Please don't beat on him so hard that he doesn't want to come back to the Cafe ... so hard that in fact belonging to TWI is a nicer place to be
. Cos although we know it ain't - but he doesn't know that yet.
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OldSkool
I hope I haven't come off like that. As I've said b4, sometimes intent is lost in cyberspace. But either way, he came by here with at least one gun blazing. I have not been nasty to them, nor will I be. I am happy to respectfully debate any position I am able here, or in person. I wish em the best.
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waysider
Speaking strictly for myself
I have no desire to convince anyone to leave The Way.
If, on the other hand, they have already made a decision to leave or have recently left or, maybe, left a long time ago and are just now coming to grips with what happened, I am happy to offer what little support I have to give.
Your mileage may vary
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