Bondage: Tithing

[Horsecalledwar]

Hey all:

My name is Kody Kelchner: I am long past caring about what people think of me in Ohio or anyone who ever met me while OPERATING UNDER THE INFLUENCE of the WAY. To those I offended - ALL apologies, including the original and one and only Dave Josephs of New Orleans and later Austin TX, peace man - I say again peace. Give me a call if you feel the need or want.

Did time in the Way International from 12 years old and on: went WOW at 17 in 91 - 92 ish - tutored under Nate and Nancy P*(%&*upp limb coordinator, M#$%alli - limb coordinator, Walter R*w$n twig and limb coordinator, Perry P$%ce - still love you man and thank God for you every time you come to mind, and other persons not mentioned such as Jeff and Sherry B%^ney of the Way Corps who were my WOW family... and Rhonda - still think of you all.

Been a long time lurker sometimes poster on the old site since 2000.

I feel absolutely compelled to type the following:

On Tithing:

Tithing! Tithing. Tithing?

This is the process of thought of may sane people who come to eventually wish a reasoned foundation to their giving in support of what they feel is the Word of God.

I confine my comments to the sentiment that you CANNOT be spiritual unless you give more than 10% of your income to the WAY INTL.

Many is the time I watched, listened, and endured the mighty thumping on the podium when it came to tithing. The Way INTL. said you had to, MUST, give more than 10% of your net income to the ministry to "BE SPIRITUAL" and expect the spiritual aspects of your life to flourish.

I don't care that at one point they said it was gross, net, and back to gross, net again when it came to the percentage. I want to focus on the CLAIM, THE ARGUMENT, THE PROPOSITION, THE DEMAND, THE PROCLAMATION, THE SUGGESTION, THE IMPLICATION that you were not a "spiritual" person if you did not EXCEED 10%.

Let's reestablish the basis of the tithe and other key points:

1) The Levites were not ALLOWED to own land. Therefore, they could not GROW crops or HERD animals that lived of said land. If they were to devote their lives to GOD they needed to be fed.

2) The command to tithe was that every 10th animal that passed under the ROD was to be TITHED to the temple/levites.

3) The corners of the farm areas were left to the Widows and Orphans/poor.

4) When the children of Israel left the bondage of Nebuchednezzar many of them learned the shopkeeping trade.

5) Many of them learned the fishing trade.

6) There were special offerings of Firstfruits, and heart offerings in the O.T..

What's the point?

Well, I didn't claim it, but L.C.M. slammed his fist down on the podium and told me I could not be a spiritual man unless I gave well over 10% of my income to the Way. Maybe their ways have changed... I doubt it. They loved to coerce people. PLEASE look up the definition of coerce for a fun and eye opening moment.

Let us ask ourselves some hard questions:

A) Please locate the verse that stipulates shopkeepers need to TITHE 10% of the income from their shops.

B) Please locate the verse that stipulates that 10% must be tithed of things that come from the sea.

1) Surely the people knew how to salt fish and store it - this was not the issue

Points of Argument:

1) If you cannot be a spiritual man unless you tithe at least 10% of your income (net/gross?) then please explain to me why CHRIST's HAND CHOSEN 12 APOSTLES WERE FISHERMAN that were not required to tithe???

2)Surely, someone may argue that plurality giving out of abundance should be MORE than tithing.

3)Someone else, may argue that Abraham's offering to Melchisidec set the standard of all "bounties" from God.

"For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings and blessed him, to whom also Abraham gave the tenth part of all, being by interpretation, king of righteousness, after that also king of Salem, which means king of peace, without father, without mother, having neither beginning of days nor end of life; but made like unto the son of God abideth a priest continually." (Heb.7:1-3)

To which I would at least postulate:

1 a) Paul never collected from those he was preaching to - he relied on support from those already living the freedom of the new gospel for support so that he would not "be chargeable unto any."

2 a) Abraham gave a 10% bounty to the King of Salem. The king of Salem blessed him. Is it possible that both of them were concerned about each other? Was the King of Salem concerned with Abraham's army and Abraham concerned with the secular authority? If so, that is a bribe - whether or not it was consensual. If it truly is as stated, then what can we say against it, except that it was VOLUNTARY.

So what is my point or "take-away" argument or point? I hold that the claim that you MUST give 10%, at least, to the WAY INTL. to be a "spiritual" person to be a gross mistatement at the very least.

For those still in the WAY: THINK. For those out: RETHINK.

Please comment.

Edited March 15, 2010 by Modgellan

[waysider]

Very well thought out post, Horse.

Welcome to GSC.

The first slice of cheesecake is complimentary.

[Ham]

Welcome, Horse..

I have of yet still haven't found any way or ex-way *ministry* worth their salt.. at least with respect to financial support..

[OldSkool]

Welcome to the Cafe.

You make some really good points that are obviously ignored by the way international. The thing that used to get me was clear scripture in the Church epistles that simply stated that as a person purposed in his heart so let him give. Cheerful giver comes to mind in the same context. But instead of teaching what was in the New Testament they turn to the Old Testament to suit their own ends. Then turn around and lay the burden on cash strapped people to give no matter what. Furthermore, the context I quoted from the bible never says to only give money. It just says to give. I'm reminded of Tabitha (Dorcas) who sewed garments for people, Peter raised her from the dead. Yet they esteem themselves "accurate" in their teachings on the topic. So much so that it is beyond question and is relegated to the untouchable status of law and the doctrine considered proven ministry research.

To make matters worse this law's interpretation was twisted for staffers when they were living on a need basis before the system changed. My first year on staff was still need basis and changed mid-way. I was told that I did not need to tithe as a staffer because I was giving so much. Let me translate that into plain English: We are paying you so little that you honestly cannot afford to tithe and still afford toiletries and other basic needs.

Edited March 14, 2010 by OldSkool