Great post, Old Skool! There's such an abundance of passages in the Bible that address the art of deception and especially through the twisted use of Scripture. Three that come to mind right off the bat are Romans 16:17-19 where Paul warns of deceivers ensnare folks by their good words & fair speeches cause division & offences contrary to sound doctrine. Another – is the fairly long section of II Peter chapter 2, describing the modus operandi of false teachers . And third a general reference to highlighting the lure deceivers use – handling the word of God deceitfully [iI Cor. 4:2].
The idea of using the Bible as bait for a trap is intriguing to me – and imho after much consideration of this trick, have concluded that Jesus Christ is nothing more than a lure in PFAL. Or to put it another way – Christian symbols & Bible talk in PFAL are like the window dressing of a storefront that has no such genuine items in stock. It's false advertising – in this case "bait & switch".
I get a kick out of your last line
Thankfully I have a new life now. I only hope this can serve as a warning to others.
That's how I feel too.
I find great humor in some of the weirdest things – there's a poster I came across awhile back – loved it so much that I bought a small picture frame version of it and it now sits on a book case. It has a picture of the hull of a sunken boat sticking up out of the water – with these words under it
"It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others"
I have to mention that I've gotten in the habit of mentally adjusting the statement to more accurately reflect how I feel about my present status and even my involvement with this website – so it's: ONE OF the purposes of my life is to serve as a warning for others when it comes to garnering valuable lessons out of the remnants of any bad decisions I've made in life.
It's from a series of demotivator posters at despair.com. My wife turned me onto them – there's some other great ones there too.
At my previous job when it came to my circle of friends at work - I was very open about my former involvement with a cult. I had that demotivator mini-poster on my desk. Most folks got a kick out of it – except for one very religious fella – who indeed always gave me the hardest time over anything with the Bible in the usual spiritual snobbish style of a Bible-know-it-all. I guess it royally threw him for a loop how I could see the humor in something so life-sucking & entangling as spending time in a cult.
At every fellowship, the question was (asked enthusiastically), "Have you taken the class yet?" and if you asked a question, "Oh, you'll understand that, once you've taken the class."
This was from a bunch of WoWs and I believe they were genuinely committed to God and loved Him. They'd learned what they'd learned from TWI and it was the only place they knew to get "fed." So of course it was the only place they could refer others to "get fed."
In setting the hook, however, you overlook another significant aspect. That is the dearth of proper teaching in mainstream churches. Teaching, not rhetoric, not emotion, and not wishy-washy sermons where if a Bible is opened it's a rarity. PFAL (and presumably WAP) got people opening their Bibles and reading, and gave "explanations" of passages that churches didn't.
Was Jesus a lure? Maybe. If your prey is hungry enough, you don't need much of a lure.
How they answered every question I had from the Bible sucked me in. I wanted to speak in tongues for a few years by that time. Hearing manifestations at fellowship was just the mojo I needed to suck me in more. Then they got me to go WOW, and that was it. We ran 7 PFAL classess, and I sat in every single one. I was fully indoctrinated by the end of my WOW year. All of my family had left TWI by that point. That was the same year VPW died. I wish I had been as smart as my family. My dad never really fell hook, line, and sinker. He always said VPW was a con. He was right. I think my dad only took the class to see what the rest of us were fussing over.
It's funny that the manifesations was one of the first things I kicked to the curb when I left. The forced SIT with Interpretation and Prophecy was phoney baloney. There is a thread on here where many people admit their feelings about them. I wish I could find it.
It's funny that the manifesations was one of the first things I kicked to the curb when I left. The forced SIT with Interpretation and Prophecy was phoney baloney. There is a thread on here where many people admit their feelings about them. I wish I could find it.
I believe the manifestations are real because they are in the bible. I think a lot of people faked it though. Seems you would hear the same thing from certain people over and over again. It is same with healings. There are people on GSC who did miracles and healings and others who faked it. It's a pretty subjective experience. John Lynn did some interesting work on SIT/ w int. Apparently, the bible says it's praise from man to God. What TWI does is basically SIT then have a word of prophecy.
I can say that when I first got involved in my first fellowship I went through a lot. So many times certain people in the fellowship would do the manifestation in fellowship and it would hit things on my heart I hadn't told ANYONE about. It happened a lot to me in those days. The closer I got to HQ and the more indoctrinated I became the more I thought so many people were going through the motions. Sometime soon I plan to revisit the subject from a fresh perspective.
I don't think most people who took part in twi (after the fog) were "hooked", but some were.
Some people are naturally narcissistic pricks who don't want to change, but want to be seen as well-meaning, altruistic and rare individuals. twi is a place where people can change their image of themselves, without really doing anything internally. these types of folks weren't hooked, they found what they were looking for.
I don't think most people who took part in twi (after the fog) were "hooked", but some were.
Some people are naturally narcissistic pricks who don't want to change, but want to be seen as well-meaning, altruistic and rare individuals. twi is a place where people can change their image of themselves, without really doing anything internally. these types of folks weren't hooked, they found what they were looking for.
yeah I was married to one of those. as long as he got praise, he was all in. when I decided to divorce him and wasn't around to make him look good in meetings (that was my main job, as he told me many times) his charm started to wear off and he left.
unfortunately it took me a few years to leave. I really care about Truth, Justice, and Human Dignity and I still felt like twi had cared about those things before lcm destroyed it, and I kept waiting for RR to make it right. after I showed up here at GSC and started reading I realized the twi I thought existed never did, and it was only because I initially learned to see it through the WoW's eyes and never stood up over inconsistencies but instead excused them that I ended up stuck in twi, self-delusional and altruistic over a non-existent system.
This one is easy for me...I was searching for "the truth."
The way said they had it or The Bible had it and the class would teach me how to understand it for myself. I wound up meeting someone after praying on my knees the night b4 for God to teach me how to understand The Bible. He said he had taken part of the class and dropped out b/c he said he got all of his questions answered after session six or something. Oddly enough, that was my intention...to take the class to get the knowledge, but not continue an association with the way. Ah, yes, 15 yrs. later...
When I met some of the "standing" believers, the answers that hooked me most were the ones when Herbie or Herbie's brother would say, "I don't know the answer to that question. The class will answer it better than I can." For some reason, I interpreted those answers as a sign of humility.
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T-Bone
Great post, Old Skool! There's such an abundance of passages in the Bible that address the art of deception and especially through the twisted use of Scripture. Three that come to mind right off the bat are Romans 16:17-19 where Paul warns of deceivers ensnare folks by their good words & fair speeches cause division & offences contrary to sound doctrine. Another – is the fairly long section of II Peter chapter 2, describing the modus operandi of false teachers . And third a general reference to highlighting the lure deceivers use – handling the word of God deceitfully [iI Cor. 4:2].
The idea of using the Bible as bait for a trap is intriguing to me – and imho after much consideration of this trick, have concluded that Jesus Christ is nothing more than a lure in PFAL. Or to put it another way – Christian symbols & Bible talk in PFAL are like the window dressing of a storefront that has no such genuine items in stock. It's false advertising – in this case "bait & switch".
I get a kick out of your last line
That's how I feel too.
I find great humor in some of the weirdest things – there's a poster I came across awhile back – loved it so much that I bought a small picture frame version of it and it now sits on a book case. It has a picture of the hull of a sunken boat sticking up out of the water – with these words under it
"It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others"
I have to mention that I've gotten in the habit of mentally adjusting the statement to more accurately reflect how I feel about my present status and even my involvement with this website – so it's: ONE OF the purposes of my life is to serve as a warning for others when it comes to garnering valuable lessons out of the remnants of any bad decisions I've made in life.
It's from a series of demotivator posters at despair.com. My wife turned me onto them – there's some other great ones there too.
At my previous job when it came to my circle of friends at work - I was very open about my former involvement with a cult. I had that demotivator mini-poster on my desk. Most folks got a kick out of it – except for one very religious fella – who indeed always gave me the hardest time over anything with the Bible in the usual spiritual snobbish style of a Bible-know-it-all. I guess it royally threw him for a loop how I could see the humor in something so life-sucking & entangling as spending time in a cult.
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OldSkool
Thanks T-bone. I appreciate the post.
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Twinky
'Twas the same with the old PFAL class.
At every fellowship, the question was (asked enthusiastically), "Have you taken the class yet?" and if you asked a question, "Oh, you'll understand that, once you've taken the class."
This was from a bunch of WoWs and I believe they were genuinely committed to God and loved Him. They'd learned what they'd learned from TWI and it was the only place they knew to get "fed." So of course it was the only place they could refer others to "get fed."
In setting the hook, however, you overlook another significant aspect. That is the dearth of proper teaching in mainstream churches. Teaching, not rhetoric, not emotion, and not wishy-washy sermons where if a Bible is opened it's a rarity. PFAL (and presumably WAP) got people opening their Bibles and reading, and gave "explanations" of passages that churches didn't.
Was Jesus a lure? Maybe. If your prey is hungry enough, you don't need much of a lure.
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Nottawayfer
How they answered every question I had from the Bible sucked me in. I wanted to speak in tongues for a few years by that time. Hearing manifestations at fellowship was just the mojo I needed to suck me in more. Then they got me to go WOW, and that was it. We ran 7 PFAL classess, and I sat in every single one. I was fully indoctrinated by the end of my WOW year. All of my family had left TWI by that point. That was the same year VPW died. I wish I had been as smart as my family. My dad never really fell hook, line, and sinker. He always said VPW was a con. He was right. I think my dad only took the class to see what the rest of us were fussing over.
It's funny that the manifesations was one of the first things I kicked to the curb when I left. The forced SIT with Interpretation and Prophecy was phoney baloney. There is a thread on here where many people admit their feelings about them. I wish I could find it.
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OldSkool
I believe the manifestations are real because they are in the bible. I think a lot of people faked it though. Seems you would hear the same thing from certain people over and over again. It is same with healings. There are people on GSC who did miracles and healings and others who faked it. It's a pretty subjective experience. John Lynn did some interesting work on SIT/ w int. Apparently, the bible says it's praise from man to God. What TWI does is basically SIT then have a word of prophecy.
I can say that when I first got involved in my first fellowship I went through a lot. So many times certain people in the fellowship would do the manifestation in fellowship and it would hit things on my heart I hadn't told ANYONE about. It happened a lot to me in those days. The closer I got to HQ and the more indoctrinated I became the more I thought so many people were going through the motions. Sometime soon I plan to revisit the subject from a fresh perspective.
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Bolshevik
I don't think most people who took part in twi (after the fog) were "hooked", but some were.
Some people are naturally narcissistic pricks who don't want to change, but want to be seen as well-meaning, altruistic and rare individuals. twi is a place where people can change their image of themselves, without really doing anything internally. these types of folks weren't hooked, they found what they were looking for.
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potato
yeah I was married to one of those. as long as he got praise, he was all in. when I decided to divorce him and wasn't around to make him look good in meetings (that was my main job, as he told me many times) his charm started to wear off and he left.
unfortunately it took me a few years to leave. I really care about Truth, Justice, and Human Dignity and I still felt like twi had cared about those things before lcm destroyed it, and I kept waiting for RR to make it right. after I showed up here at GSC and started reading I realized the twi I thought existed never did, and it was only because I initially learned to see it through the WoW's eyes and never stood up over inconsistencies but instead excused them that I ended up stuck in twi, self-delusional and altruistic over a non-existent system.
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waterbuffalo
This one is easy for me...I was searching for "the truth."
The way said they had it or The Bible had it and the class would teach me how to understand it for myself. I wound up meeting someone after praying on my knees the night b4 for God to teach me how to understand The Bible. He said he had taken part of the class and dropped out b/c he said he got all of his questions answered after session six or something. Oddly enough, that was my intention...to take the class to get the knowledge, but not continue an association with the way. Ah, yes, 15 yrs. later...
When I met some of the "standing" believers, the answers that hooked me most were the ones when Herbie or Herbie's brother would say, "I don't know the answer to that question. The class will answer it better than I can." For some reason, I interpreted those answers as a sign of humility.
That was what hooked me.
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