One of the things I got from PFAL was TWI's disdain of oral tradition - namely the Catholic church's traditions that had nothing to do with anything that was ever contained in the Bible - only to discover that there was a whole undercurrent of belief that was handed down (so to speak) verbally.
One that I can think of was needs-based living and the formula used to determine needs.
I'm sure there's a lot more, but that's all I can think of off the top of my head.
The whole concept of vpw as the MOGFOT- or there BEING one at all-
was an oral tradition. He was never fool enough to put it in writing.
Bad Chas... :blush: -of course that is the one that will live on--and rightly so
I agree with WW about VP being THE MOG and that he had a direct revelatory pipeline to God that far superceded everyones elses since the first century. In my day (late 70's and 80's) TWI was replete with fantastical, almost comic book superhero type stories and anecdotes of VP things that "really happened" that were spread fairly regularly--especially to the new who were questioning their involvement
I havent got time right now, but things that went way beyond snow on the gaspumps
When people would sit around and talk after fellowship it seemed like that's what they talked about, "spiritual gossip". Anything to do with leadership or spurts.
There is a poster who frequents this site who calls them TVT's (TWI Verbal Traditions). He insists that any adverse effects of TVT's must be our own fault because we listened to them. Another twist of "blame the victim".
There is a poster who frequents this site who calls them TVT's (TWI Verbal Traditions). He insists that any adverse effects of TVT's must be our own fault because we listened to them. Another twist of "blame the victim".
*careful not to spew his beer*
"Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man . . . "
careful study shows that "not that" is one word that really means "Absolutely completely completely complete is that"
mouth is a mistranslation, the Trinitarians changed all the letters around to change "ears" to "mouth"
There is a poster who frequents this site who calls them TVT's (TWI Verbal Traditions). He insists that any adverse effects of TVT's must be our own fault because we listened to them. Another twist of "blame the victim".
I see his point to a certain extent. For an organization that was so hung up (boy that dates me) on the word and nothing but the word, a lot of stuff that had nothing to do with the word crept in and was regarded like the gospel itself. Therein lies the irony. While there is a disdain for oral tradition, TWI is steeped in it and apparently doesn't recognize it for what it is.
I know people didn't see that when I was a part. Back then, I took the "it is written" pretty seriously and determined what I would do based on "it is written" vs "what we say." There were times when it was harder to deflect the "what we say" things. However, it was not impossible if you didn't care what people thought and what people said and did in return. There were only a couple of times I became openly confrontational - like when I found out that corp was taught that the end justified the means (date and switch) when it came to tricking people into taking the class. Even though I was assured by R0b3rt B3lt that this was not "taught," there was no denying that individuals in the wc were doing "whatever it takes" to get people into the class and that had to come from somewhere higher up (as I pointed out to him). After that conversation, I pretty much stuck to 'it is written' and deflected the oral traditions that were attached.
The person you are referring to doesn't (to the best of my knowledge) hang out with TWI people. He sticks strictly to what was actually written down and published. Except for the claim that the mother killed her child by worrying, most of what was put to paper is not overtly harmful (except that it makes its point at the expense of other religious traditions). It was the stuff that wasn't written down and wasn't available to the general public or even the lower-level followers (but treated like the word and kept in secret) that caused the problems, which again is ironic given the disdain for groups like the Masons.
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WordWolf
The whole concept of vpw as the MOGFOT- or there BEING one at all-
was an oral tradition. He was never fool enough to put it in writing.
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ChasUFarley
I thought this was going to be a thread about the motorcoach or the Green Room....
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mstar1
Bad Chas... :blush: -of course that is the one that will live on--and rightly so
I agree with WW about VP being THE MOG and that he had a direct revelatory pipeline to God that far superceded everyones elses since the first century. In my day (late 70's and 80's) TWI was replete with fantastical, almost comic book superhero type stories and anecdotes of VP things that "really happened" that were spread fairly regularly--especially to the new who were questioning their involvement
I havent got time right now, but things that went way beyond snow on the gaspumps
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JustThinking
Uhh...I actually thought the same thing. Maybe I've been here too long?
JT
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Bolshevik
When people would sit around and talk after fellowship it seemed like that's what they talked about, "spiritual gossip". Anything to do with leadership or spurts.
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waysider
There is a poster who frequents this site who calls them TVT's (TWI Verbal Traditions). He insists that any adverse effects of TVT's must be our own fault because we listened to them. Another twist of "blame the victim".
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Bolshevik
*careful not to spew his beer*
"Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man . . . "
careful study shows that "not that" is one word that really means "Absolutely completely completely complete is that"
mouth is a mistranslation, the Trinitarians changed all the letters around to change "ears" to "mouth"
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Tzaia
I see his point to a certain extent. For an organization that was so hung up (boy that dates me) on the word and nothing but the word, a lot of stuff that had nothing to do with the word crept in and was regarded like the gospel itself. Therein lies the irony. While there is a disdain for oral tradition, TWI is steeped in it and apparently doesn't recognize it for what it is.
I know people didn't see that when I was a part. Back then, I took the "it is written" pretty seriously and determined what I would do based on "it is written" vs "what we say." There were times when it was harder to deflect the "what we say" things. However, it was not impossible if you didn't care what people thought and what people said and did in return. There were only a couple of times I became openly confrontational - like when I found out that corp was taught that the end justified the means (date and switch) when it came to tricking people into taking the class. Even though I was assured by R0b3rt B3lt that this was not "taught," there was no denying that individuals in the wc were doing "whatever it takes" to get people into the class and that had to come from somewhere higher up (as I pointed out to him). After that conversation, I pretty much stuck to 'it is written' and deflected the oral traditions that were attached.
The person you are referring to doesn't (to the best of my knowledge) hang out with TWI people. He sticks strictly to what was actually written down and published. Except for the claim that the mother killed her child by worrying, most of what was put to paper is not overtly harmful (except that it makes its point at the expense of other religious traditions). It was the stuff that wasn't written down and wasn't available to the general public or even the lower-level followers (but treated like the word and kept in secret) that caused the problems, which again is ironic given the disdain for groups like the Masons.
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