Another Way Ministry Splinter Group

[ClayJay]

I have stumbled upon another Way International "splinter group". There are many out there for sure. There's the Geerites, Stiffy, CFF, small groups in cities across America who used to be in The Way but only fellowship with their old Branch, and no doubt many more. I guess there are some in South America. And most of these splinter groups hold on to one , many, or all aspects of the teachings we received when we were in The Way. Some utilize the original PFAL class, while others do teachings that are offshoots of PFAL. But most are a positive bunch, happy with the things they teach each other, and have their fellowship around the teachings that they have in common and embrace.

I remember my high school years as a dope smoker and the "fellowship" that came with being on that common ground with my stoner friends. Shoot, the "new conversation" was endless! We could talk about the various strains of reefer, the difference between bamboo bongs and Plexiglass bongs, how nice it was to buy a pound for $150.00, sell ten lids, get the money back and have two free ounces for private consumption, what it was like "last night when we got the munchies and raided so and so's refrigerator and ate an entire half of a left over prime rib, etc. We could talk about the Chinese fire drills we all had with three cars abreast at a stop light with everyone getting back into a different car. Lots of funniness, lots of heavy laughing, and good common ground fellowship. Of course, we didn't call it "fellowsip" but in essence, that's what it was. When we were in class and were stoned, when we saw a pal and recognized that they were stoned too, we would give each other the look that said "we knew". We knew man, we knew!

Like when we were in The Way. We knew that we had the one and only "true version" of God's Word, and fellow shipped around the myriad differences between the "true Word of God" and the "counterfeits" that were out there masquerading as God's Word. As wrong as it was to think that way, it was our "fellowship". And even though we were wrong to have our egotistical attitudes about our new found Truth, we were mostly positive and mostly happy. I mean, God forbid that you shown any signs of negativity, for, you get confronted, reproved! "C'mon man! Where's your believing! renew your mind!"

And so, I have found yet another TWI splinter group. But this group doesn't fellowship around the positives of their new religion. This group fellowships around the shared negatives that they once experienced when they were involved with The Way International some twenty and even as long ago as thirty years! Oh man, and do they have lots to talk about! Their shared experiences seem to buoy them up almost constantly! And, even though they have shared the same negatives for what seems to be years and years now, they just keep on bringing it up over and over and over. Some of them have been OUT of The Way for many more years than they were actually In The Way! And that to me is sad. Because, the years that they spent In have not been allowed to slip away into the past.

It's almost like they are, because of the daily "renewed pictures in their minds" still in the situations they were once in so very long ago. Those negative situations must be as fresh to them today as they were the day it happened-twenty five years ago. But, this is a nation where Liberty still rings, and we all have the right to choose. But as for me, I am beginning to wonder: Just how healthy it is to hang around with this particular splinter group?

Obviously, I am talking about the Grease Spot Cafe, and obviously there are those here who will resent this observation, and naturally, disagree with it. But maybe there are some of you "Newbies" here who ought to reconsider your involvement with this splinter group, for that's all it is, just another Way International splinter group.

[Shellon]

Remind me to keep my balloons away from you

Cool that we each get to choose where we spend our time eh?

[Oakspear]

I am so thankful that ClayJay is here to warn us and set us straight. <_<

[bowtwi]

So are you calling paw an anticult cult leader?

I personally cruise through the twi forum some, but mostly I'd say I come here to hang out with people I like that come here and discuss music, current events, our families, recipes, gardening, even chat in "real time" in the chat room.

I get your point, CJ, but it seems a bit of a stretch. It smells to me like you're poopin' where you eat with your opening post. I'm not sure what you're goin' for there, bud. Sounds pretty much like you're intention is to offend as many of us as you can in one post.

[JeffSjo]

Yep, lets warn the newbies.

Let's warn them how exhilerating it is to poke holes in once solidly held beliefs that were only smokescreens to keep abusive leadership in power.

Let's warn them how exilerating it is to stack up the things they believe with others that have entirely different world views. And then find that it is ok to mutually disagree instead of all that puffed up, virtually slanderous, and a little dense TWI stance.

Let's warn them how refreshing it is to learn what was really going on behind the scenes.

Let's warn them about the ones who for the sake of the newbies stick around to make sure the truth about TWI is still heard, especially for those more freshly out of the splinters or TWI proper.

(added in editing)

Let's warn them that for a little while they may go just a bit overboard in the face of all this honest and often profitable exchange of information and ideas until they find themselves with a very different world view than the TWI iron rod.

And just for me, personally, I can't help but gaze in wonder until the Lord Jesus christ himself shows them what His iron rod is really like. But I don't hold anything against any of us who patiently tolerate my biblical perspective.

Edited November 5, 2009 by JeffSjo

[ClayJay]

Actually, I really do believe that this place has it's purpose. The light shed on the shenannigans and the deception once perpetrated by Way MOGs is needed. But it seems as if many-and not all-seem to hash, hash, and rehash the negatives over and over and over, and I mean for years! And that seems to me as if it would in fact have a deleterious effect on said hashers here at this TWI splinter group.

Edited November 5, 2009 by ClayJay

[JeffSjo]

Some peoples wounds run very deep.

Combat and domestic abuse PTSD can last for decades too.

But there isn't any of us except those who I happen to know the very, very best who I'd trust to tell me that this place was actually hurting me.

And it wasn't that long ago, Clay Jay, when the ones who repeatedly bring up your very point and throw it in victims faces only seemed interested in shutting down this exchange of ideas and potential for help to TWI victims at GSC.

Because of that and my not wanting to doubt your intentions, I hope you'd understand that I am being patient.

Edited November 5, 2009 by JeffSjo

[Shellon]

What strikes me, clayjay, in your words is how often you say it seems to you, which is your right, of course, but consider......

The best part of being free to choose is in the choosing and not feeling like we have to any further allow someone else to tell us our choice is wrong, why it's wrong and what will happen to us in our foolish wrong.

I hate raisins, I mean detest them. Doesn't mean you shouldn't enjoy them and reap whatever it is you need; nutrution, health benefits or simple enjoyment. Heck, if you were a guest in our home, I'd even serve them to you if they were a fave of yours. I just wouldn't partake.

Same with Greasespot Cafe.

Edited November 5, 2009 by Shellon

[grand-daughter]

Well I guess I can add my two cents here since I do have free will, right? Yes, ok yeah thats what I was taught. So anyway, I happened to come here for help a few years back which I so thankfully received. You see I was in a position of possibly going back to my little splinter group but once I was finally privy to the whole story I decided against it. Now to my point... why am I back do you ask? Well you see this same junk that started way back is still going on and on and on so it only serves to continue to keep up with the truth being rehashed as you say. I can totally appreciate your point, honestly I can and if you choose not to come here more power to you but I'll tell you this...my baby is still in the junk pile as are many of my dear friends so if I can come here in search of a little more information that may help them I will. To all of you who have so lovingly or even angrily shared your experiences I say thank you and share on!

[T-Bone]

I have stumbled upon another Way International "splinter group". There are many out there for sure. There's the Geerites, Stiffy, CFF, small groups in cities across America who used to be in The Way but only fellowship with their old Branch, and no doubt many more. I guess there are some in South America. And most of these splinter groups hold on to one , many, or all aspects of the teachings we received when we were in The Way. Some utilize the original PFAL class, while others do teachings that are offshoots of PFAL. But most are a positive bunch, happy with the things they teach each other, and have their fellowship around the teachings that they have in common and embrace. .. .

>snip<

.. .And so, I have found yet another TWI splinter group. But this group doesn't fellowship around the positives of their new religion. This group fellowships around the shared negatives that they once experienced when they were involved with The Way International some twenty and even as long ago as thirty years! Oh man, and do they have lots to talk about! Their shared experiences seem to buoy them up almost constantly! And, even though they have shared the same negatives for what seems to be years and years now, they just keep on bringing it up over and over and over. Some of them have been OUT of The Way for many more years than they were actually In The Way! And that to me is sad. Because, the years that they spent In have not been allowed to slip away into the past.

It's almost like they are, because of the daily "renewed pictures in their minds" still in the situations they were once in so very long ago. Those negative situations must be as fresh to them today as they were the day it happened-twenty five years ago. But, this is a nation where Liberty still rings, and we all have the right to choose. But as for me, I am beginning to wonder: Just how healthy it is to hang around with this particular splinter group?

Obviously, I am talking about the Grease Spot Cafe, and obviously there are those here who will resent this observation, and naturally, disagree with it. But maybe there are some of you "Newbies" here who ought to reconsider your involvement with this splinter group, for that's all it is, just another Way International splinter group.

Something about the sentiment in this post makes me think of the parable of the good Samaritan in Luke 10:25-37. And for some reason also makes me recall what I said on another thread – a person may be out of TWI but TWI may not be out of the person.

Perhaps the relevancy of my two statements above will become more apparent at some point on this thread. I think the average person with any sense of compassion and human decency - - not poisoned by the pervasive toxicity of TWI's doctrines would also see there's a lot more in common with these two statements than the pairing of Grease Spot Café and Splinter Groups. But that is an interesting juxtaposition – I will address in a little bit.

Anyway, I'm sure many are familiar with the parable Jesus used in response to a man's question of "who is my neighbor?" It seems like a fair enough question in regards to the written Law's command to "love your neighbor as yourself." As the story goes a guy is leaving Jerusalem heading toward Jericho when he is attacked by robbers – they strip him of his clothes and beat him, leaving him half dead. A priest and a Levite come up on this poor soul since they were traveling the same road – probably leaving or returning to the holy city of Jerusalem – but when they get a load of this guy's predicament they go out of their way to avoid him. Not so the Samaritan – he renders aid and goes the extra mile in checking up on the guy while he recuperates – on the Samaritan's expense as well!

Interesting casting on Jesus' part – Samaritans were hated by the majority of Jesus' audience – the Jews. The Samaritans also hated the Jews. The enmity was mostly over religious issues and how they each interpreted the law. There's some pagan influences in the religious pedigree of the Samaritans – and with them being thought of as having a defective form of Judaism – it's no wonder they were despised by the average Jew – looked down upon as rank unbelievers for the most part.

While it's tempting to craft a check-out-the-various-splinter-groups-reaction-to-a-hard-luck story for prime time TV [but I will explore this later] – I'm going with just pointing out the obvious. Neither the experts in theology nor those recognized to serve as religious ministers showed even the slightest bit of compassion compared to the generous outpouring of compassion & support by good ol' Joe Unbeliever. I'd fellowship with his splinter group any day!

Ever notice how callous the TWI mindset makes people. I see it here every once and awhile.. . Now for a quick commercial break "You can take Salem out of the country – but you can't take the country out of Salem."

3, 2, 1, and we're back.. .

Many of the goads that firmed up my decision to leave TWI in 1986 were trends that I became increasingly aware of among upper leadership and trickling down into the ranks – hardheartedness, legalism, elitism, an ungodly reverence for anything related to victor paul wierwille, hypocrisy, pride, favoritism, and mindless decision-making. Well, it wasn't actually a one-time-fully-aware-of-what-I'm-doing type of decision to leave.

These "goads" .. . I dunno - - made me step back a little further from the fold and to try and assess the problem(s). A little more back, a little more back.. . write letters to my superiors with tons of questions and concerns - - await their response - - and wait - - and wait. Write fellow Corps – some respond back – heated dialogs – step back a little more; finally get a canned response from superiors - a few more steps back.. . etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. Lo and behold I'm way over here at Grease Spot in 2006. Just like Bill Murray in "What about Bob?" .. ."baby steps, baby steps.. .look at me – I'm being human!"

~~

As promised earlier - let's look at a few definitions of splinter group from the Internet I cut and pasted below:

a faction or sect that has broken away from its parent organization

A group of members of a political party or of a similar organization who have decided to create their own organization

Government, Politics & Diplomacy) a number of members of an organization, political party, etc., who split from the main body and form an independent association, usually as the result of dissension

a small organization that becomes separated from or acts apart from an original larger group or a number of other small groups, with which it would normally be united, as because of disagreement.

~~

End of definitions

~~

Ok – I see it. Grease Spot could be considered a splinter group – dissenters unite out of disagreement with the "parent organization" – yeah, I can still hear old vp crank out the charm, "you're my kids!" . I must say, step-dad sure had a lot of issues – I should have run away from home a long time ago.

Are religious differences with TWI the reason for Grease Spot? Hmmm – nope! We've got Jews, Christians, Atheists, Agnostics, Republicans, Democrats, Librarians, Trekkies – throw me a bone here folks – I guess Wiccans, Buddhists, closet Grease Spotters who still reside in WayWorld, and the guy who still sends me Corps sponsorship every month - bless you my child, god will continue to spit in your direction - - – I dunno – I don't keep track of this stuff – you all just feel free to jump in and state your belief system. "Ok, I do believe I've gotten this rant out of my system."

What does unite us? I'd like to think it's the spirit of the good Samaritan, providing help and a "fellowship" for those who have been robbed in one way or another by a supposedly religious organization.

Edited November 6, 2009 by T-Bone

[cheranne]

Like Roaches/or to be blunt spiritual bacteria that causes Poison to live in the blood stream of the "believer"

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[mstar1]

But it seems as if many-and not all-seem to hash, hash, and rehash the negatives over and over and over, and I mean for years! And that seems to me as if it would in fact have a deleterious effect on said hashers here at this TWI splinter group.

Nah not in the slightest for me----Ive been here for close to ten years. I just like the people here. I have some memories from my TWI days --once in awhile I post them-- so some of them suck They dont hold any sway over me now but I wont hide them like I did for years.

To me its no different than if I were to find a reunion site with my elementary school friends. Those days are over --we reminisce (that teacher sure was a frikkin d-bag..),we sort stuff out, we call a spade a spade , we remain friends, we've moved on. Life is good now--but that doesnt mean that I wasnt taken in the past or want to hide it. In fact in a way its part of my 'wholeness' now to be honest about my life

[Bramble]

Amazing how many times someone comes along wanting GSC posters to shut the heck up. For our own good, of course.

[WordWolf]

Amazing how many people show up here, spend a lot of time in the "About the Way" forum

to the exclusion of the other forums,

then have the nerve to be surprised the discussions are "ABOUT THE WAY".

In this PARTICULAR case, the poster's been around and has posted extensively in the

Political forum.

That means he's either CLUELESS about there being other forums-even when he's

POSTED IN THEM-

or he's DELIBERATELY LYING in an attempt to get people to NOT check things out for

themselves.

Me, I like to play the games, but some people prefer to "dwell on negatives"

while complaining about "those who dwell on negatives."

[Bolshevik]

. . .

It's almost like they are, because of the daily "renewed pictures in their minds" still in the situations they were once in so very long ago. Those negative situations must be as fresh to them today as they were the day it happened-twenty five years ago. But, this is a nation where Liberty still rings, and we all have the right to choose. But as for me, I am beginning to wonder: Just how healthy it is to hang around with this particular splinter group?

. . .

odd . . .

you seem angry

well I'm angry too.

Have you ever fired a potato cannon?

25 years ago, man, that's almost an entire life.

[ClayJay]

Obviously there are other forums here that are a sidetrack from the main subject at hand. And these other forums, although entertaining and somewhat fun to be sure, are not the main focus at this place. The main thrust of this whole place is The Way International and it's effect on those involved and those whose involvement was in the past. And I contend that dwelling on the negs of the past is less than healthy, that's all. Sure, learn of the negs that were behind the scenes that you didn't know about when In, but for your own sakes, move on!

And so, you know, that's just little ol me's opinion. Anyone here may do as they wish.

Clay Johnson

[Bramble]

What do you really know, Clay Jay, about the actual real lives of the posters on this board? How can you be so positive they haven't 'moved on?' And why do they have to 'move on' Sounds like they make you uncomfortable. Should never speak a negative, the boogey man will gitcha.

Yeah, we all remember that Way doctrine. Very helpful to keep info down about abusive situations and leaders! Lest the ministry be blamed.

Let's all pretend everything was perfect!!!

Do you really think posters here have whole lives that revolve around posts on GSC??? Live their entire lives in the PFAL past, alone and feeble because of all the evil their negatives have brought down on their heads?

Fooey. That's VPW induced fantasy.

Too many times poster with the agenda of shushing negatives about TWI/VPW come on here and pretend they are just 'Speaking the truth in love' when what they really have is a desire to stop seeing their beloved doctrine and Man o God disrespected. So far you look like one of those.

[Bolshevik]

Obviously there are other forums here that are a sidetrack from the main subject at hand. And these other forums, although entertaining and somewhat fun to be sure, are not the main focus at this place. The main thrust of this whole place is The Way International and it's effect on those involved and those whose involvement was in the past. And I contend that dwelling on the negs of the past is less than healthy, that's all. Sure, learn of the negs that were behind the scenes that you didn't know about when In, but for your own sakes, move on!

And so, you know, that's just little ol me's opinion. Anyone here may do as they wish.

Clay Johnson

there's a poster here with some quote about irony in their signature.

[GarthP2000]

But it seems as if many-and not all-seem to hash, hash, and rehash the negatives over and over and over, and I mean for years! And that seems to me as if it would in fact have a deleterious effect on said hashers here at this TWI splinter group.

Ahem! Speaking of 'hash, hash, and rehash' over and over and over, ... you "gotta get over it" guys, who _seem_ to have the getting-it-over stuff _down pat_, ...

... seem to be not 'getting-over-it' quite a bit yourselves. What gives?

Ohh, and spare us the "but we just have the love of Jeebus in our fart--errr, hearts, for you all" excuse, ok? ... We all know better than that.

<_<

So please pick up your Blue Song Books (you know, the old ones before the Brown Song Books came out), and go back home, ... m-m-kay?

Edited November 6, 2009 by GarthP2000

[waysider]

Sure, learn of the negs that were behind the scenes that you didn't know about when In, but for your own sakes, move on!

So, when you movin' on, Clay?

[krys]

ClayJay aka Clay Johnson.....here I am, I'm holding the door open for you! C'mon now and get with it.....go on...skedaddle outta here and take your attitude with you. Hurry up....it's cold outside and we're gonna freeze our middle fingers off as we salute you out the door. Can't you here us singing....."Happy trails to you....hope we never meet again........"

[rascal]

Clay, I think that your post said an awful lot about how far you yourself need to go in your post twi recovery.

Forgive me, but you seem stalled fella, unable to examine, analyze learn and grow, forever spinning your wheels in an attempt to live within the parameters of the prison constructed from the faulty doctrines of some very disturbed men.

It takes much examination and consideration to recognize and come to grips with the fallacies of what we were taught.

I am truly sad for you being stuck, forever unable to move beyond the boundaries of your religion :(

Edited November 6, 2009 by rascal

[Oakspear]

Umm...we have moved on. All you see is a small part of our lives....a really small part.

So, is GS a splinter group? I would define a splinter group as a group of ex-wayfers dedicated to advancing the perceived original ideals of TWI due to the belief that TWI itself no longer embodied those ideals, whether those ideals are fellowship, research or WOW burgers.

GS doesn't do that. We "tell the other side of the story" with no other unifying principle.

[Twinky]

I posted something ages ago, and this quote (posted by another Cafe denizen) made it into Grease Spot Gems in September 2006:

Posted by Twinky on the splinter groups thread as a response about all the splinter groups that exist...

"... those who hang out in the Grease Spot Cafe, which is a very special sort of splinter group. One with a sharp point."

Touché!!

No doubt if you search the threads, you'll find the original... LOL.

[Shellon]

I don't really get the "move on" thing. Nor do I understand that "just get over it" one too either.

Worse, I don't ever understand someone telling another when it's time to do either.

How the he!! would I know if you're ready to do something and why should I get to choose?

Oh yeah, and the resentments that will be festering into an ooozy pus when someone stops taking care of something they still need to just for another person.

I don't wanna be nearby when that one blows.