John Lynn and STFI

[Watered Garden]

Lost money on a house because we had to have a believer for a real estate agent, we did.

WG

[pond]

Every single person is a "believer" of some sort in my life.

I do not care if they think the bible is a good book anymore doesnt make one bit of difference to me, If I need info on buying a house or medical concern I pray and educate myself as best as possible and go for it.

yes I like bible verses, yes I believe Jesus christ is King of King what that has to do with other folks is seldom an issue or a perk of my life.

It is for me a personal relationship, do I think the body of Christ works together? Yeah by His direction not a mans and I know Im not privy to that working of the Lord thank God no one is because we would all just destroy it before any miricle happened I think.

christians tend to forget God LOVES people loves his creation loves us all and wants us all saved, Some of my dearest friends and buddies believe the fat guy on the throne buddah I do not even know how to spell his name anywyas it makes no difference to us we care and take care of one another because we can love ya know?

Sure I like christians but not enough to fight over doctrine nah not worth it in my life, I offer what I believe if they want to know if not well life and love has so much to offer I still enjoy folks alot and try to love all.

I do not lie or cover up what I believe as truth to people please , I figure if somone choses to love me it is a part of me so deep I can share it, but I am not in sales as I believe God gives the increase not man.

yeah I never bought into the mini Jesus routine twi instilled into so many , Im not a bully I do not really care if a person decides to become a christian or not, I do not consider it my job to save the world love people yes easy life loving the lord. not much stress to it. I think that is why I can by-pass much of the bitterness and angry attitudes so many christians battle.

My position is one of celebration ! So much evil in the world I find no reason to fight the very flesh and blood Jesus commands we love.

Edited October 10, 2009 by pond

[Tzaia]

Lost money on a house because we had to have a believer for a real estate agent, we did.

WG

Bet you won't make that mistake again...

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

Pond, you never answered Tzaia's question, Are you saying that John Schoenheit's grandchildren are living with him and his wife(Sam's children)? or is it John Lynn's grandchildren? If the former because of Sam's wounds and not being able to support his wife and children with a job, that would be news. If that is the case, why didn't JS say so? or is it other ST&F employees/staff with extended families, maybe because of hard economic times? Oh excuse me, that's is negative believing/ trust issues with God. right?

[pond]

Pond, you never answered Tzaia's question, Are you saying that John Schoenheit's grandchildren are living with him and his wife(Sam's children)? or is it John Lynn's grandchildren? If the former because of Sam's wounds and not being able to support his wife and children with a job, that would be news. If that is the case, why didn't JS say so? or is it other ST&F employees/staff with extended families, maybe because of hard economic times? Oh excuse me, that's is negative believing/ trust issues with God. right?

I did answer her question as much as she answered mine. excuse me.

what is the rule for that? I must but the other guy doesnt? a black mark for my character maybe? lol

I replied that if anyone has need to know details of who is living with who etc, I got the information from their free teaching downloads.

I said I find them to be quite open with their life, I donot need to know if anyone is telling the truth I see no reason they would lie about their families. But I do not really keep track of their life and relationships it makes little difference to me.

[Tzaia]

How do you know that they are being open about anything? Does what they say line up with your PERSONAL experience, as in you live here in Indy and spend time with them on a regular basis? I would have said the same thing until I actually did spend time with them - lots of time. Once I did that, my perspective changed significantly.

Thomas - my take is that the comment about the grandkids was speculation - like the speculation about JAL's exit being a business decision. After all, how hard is it to simply answer the question if you know the answer?

Edited October 11, 2009 by Tzaia

[pond]

I know you have strong hate feelings towards people tzaia.

I just do not.

I do not live there I do not ask them for food or money and I do not have bitter feelings towards anyone.

Do i know people I dislike or have done me wrong in life? yeah I have but it isnt my mission in life to warn others about my own feelings I wouldnt get upset about not being offered food , I would just ask them to move their car so I could get my own.

We are different people, again that is why we each make our own choices in life.

They are people who love God and teach the bible in my book that is not evil, I can think of much worse .

I hate it when good people beat up good people. IM out of the game. it isnt worth anything . Do you feel better making their personal life your business?

they are having a meeting open to everyone who wants a say in their turn of events you can go and find out for yourself . or go on line and tell the world how your world has hurt you. choices is all it is.

[Ham]

Do you feel better making their personal life your business?

somehow I thought they were a church or some kind of public entity. *They* really can't have a personal life, now, can they?

and all this nonsense, about how their "operation" of the "gifts of the spirit" can't be "corrupted" as they say with "character faults".. ?

to which I would say.. "wanna bet sucker?"

like some have said, one can't have your cake and eat it too..

so.. the way I read all of this..

*they* are a public entity, as long as the cash keeps rolling in..

but DARE touch their "private" lives, and lines are drawn..

friggin MORONS. They will never "get it"..

Edited October 11, 2009 by Ham

[Ham]

somehow it all seems "insane"..

they claim to live their lives "transparently".. in da lovagawd and all..

but somehow, one is not supposed to look behind the transparent undies and all..

it just doesn't add up to me.. maybe you could explain it in less "biblical" terms..

[Ham]

what about the concept of "full sharing".. even by their terms?

just seems to me.. in that respect, they are sorely lacking..

I don't see how a "need to know" qualifies as "full sharing".

damage control.. enough information to keep the following from haemorrhaging.. doesn't exactly qualify does it?

[Ham]

I dunno.. just looking at it.. doesn't the organization itself appear for lack of better words.. "schizophrenic"?

I'm not saying *they* aren't "nice people" or anything..

and the *organization*.. "firing" or having a "mutual parting of ways" with jl..

isn't that not unlike the Frankenstein monster strangling its own creator?

[Ham]

*they* are a public entity, as long as the cash keeps rolling in..

but DARE touch their "private" lives, and lines are drawn..

I've seen all of this before.. again and again, on an individual as well as organizational level..

I dunno.. isn't that kind of living in a "worthless" manner? I mean.. one wants the connection.. the love, the benefits, and no or little personal sacrifice or cost?

kinda "selfish" if one would ask me..

"full sharing"?

Bah.. .

[Ham]

and j.l. scouring the countryside for sustenance.. going to one "twig" after another for donations..

Maybe I've said enough..

[GarthP2000]

Now Hammy, don't be such a hater.

;)

[Tzaia]

Oh Hammie, it is f'ed up. It's pretty much playing out the way I told them it would. I could say I hate being right, but that's not true.

[pond]

God is still on the throne I get no thrill from folks fighting and finding issues with those they have loved and worked closely for a life time.

Yet in perspective reality is real life.

Many are changing jobs and many are unemployed in USA why is this drama any different than alot of other people fate at this time?

it is dirty laudry people feed off. Kind of sick. Companies split and divide and agrue all the time leaders and politcal people have at it with personal differences all the time and it is news.

I never thought for a minute after MG was fired this would end I wonder if he has a job yet and what his outcome was as well.

famous people put their life in the spot light and want others to pay for it. It is how we do things in the USA.

They made a movie everyone liked and the stars feed off the press.

it is how they become famous, maybe some talent is involved but hey the news is what gets the word of who is who out.

I think it takes alot of courage and love to live in such a manner it isnt like they are making the billions other famous people make to live worthy of the stress and fodder.

So I do not pity them I enjoy their work and wish the Lord would return quickly .

[Ham]

"famous people".. hmm.

No, I don't think jl is "famous". Maybe he could have been..

but his claim to "fame" is being a "leader(?)" in a little itty bitty second rate organization..

da way, it was..

if anything, I think people here are holding out an offer or NORMALCY to him..

you know.. a place where his laundry does not smell any better than anyone elses..

well, its a thought..

Personally.. I think he was damaged worse than a lot of us in the old organization. Why? He will never admit it..

but that brings us back to the "full sharing" issue. I usually don't claim absolutes, but I don't think it will ever happen..

[Ham]

Oh Hammie, it is f'ed up. It's pretty much playing out the way I told them it would. I could say I hate being right, but that's not true.

I dunno.. maybe we were sent just to observe this.. any intervention I've tried has had rather minimal effect..

[Ham]

at least on the large scheme of things..

[Tzaia]

JAL famous? Depends on what you define as "famous". People pre 1987 who were involved in a particular religious cult know who he is, but outside of that particular context no one knows him - or cares. Furthermore, due to some really bad decisions over the years, the sphere of influence over those who knew him or about him has diminished. In other words, he blew it.

And yes Hammie, normalcy was rebuffed. I think there's a certain addictive quality to being at that level in a cult, and it's hard to give it up for the obscurity of normalcy.

[pond]

"famous people".. hmm.

No, I don't think jl is "famous". Maybe he could have been..

but his claim to "fame" is being a "leader(?)" in a little itty bitty second rate organization..

da way, it was..

if anything, I think people here are holding out an offer or NORMALCY to him..

you know.. a place where his laundry does not smell any better than anyone elses..

well, its a thought..

Personally.. I think he was damaged worse than a lot of us in the old organization. Why? He will never admit it..

but that brings us back to the "full sharing" issue. I usually don't claim absolutes, but I don't think it will ever happen..

I do not have an internet web site talking about me and my life and what my job is.

granted it isnt as fancy as the way and glamor is all in a perspective but they have had a bit of microphone in their face for years.... it is funny you should bring up the N word normal My boss asked me wanted I wanted as I was having amelt down at work I said I want "normal" he looked at my team leader who was laughing his azz off.

I was serious. lol so what is normal exactly? I know I kind of feel sorry for them. but I do not want to know their money situation I might have some envy or something . lol

[Tzaia]

pond - I believe that he continues to put himself out there, so he must like the attention. I know from personal experience that you can walk away and disappear from the limelight.

But then again, he hasn't distinguished himself in a good way in a very long time - maybe since college.

[pond]

He wanted to help those leaving twi, not because he thought it was a (gosh only GS people would possibly get this) bad place as in what they were teaching and even doing probably, He was fired. in other words cuaght up in enough to have to be told to leave.

but he never left none of them have it is harder than you may think. Look at the folks who come to this web site they think they do not feel for the outfit yet here they are writing about it. stil

tzaia you think your were famous see and they do too well in the least very very important at least to the Lord.

it is part of the messed up gift ministry stuff they taught and people rode on for so long .

they are "serious" on a mission from God. no one can stop them. till they shoot out an eye oops should not have said that maybe lol but really.

I have a normal life with a fringe of cult influence . that is why I really do feel sorry for them, I have to wonder if they ever wonder what a regular just normal american life would have been like. I do think it is to late for them tho,

to be honest if it is true and we all stand before the Lord and they get more gold stars or something I still do not care Im blassed and I pray they are as well.

doesnt sound like it tho.

I got fired from a job once and I could not go back and ask those I worked with for money. Some are still my friends even. But see how can we explain what normal is to them? I had to write a resume dress up shave my legs all this stuff and prove to other people I can work hard and make them look good .

I had to find another job with strangers and prove myself all over again after being told I was not good enough.

that is real life. that is the Lord helping me live.

sometimes I think they have a co-dependent welfare mind set that is enabled by those who want others to tell them they are worthy and good because God told them to tell them so. so give me money.

regardless of what they did or didnt do in life.

my life is so far removed from that fantasy at times I do wonder how and what they are doing.

to them it is normal. nice gig if you can get it. I guess.

I know the Lord really I do and no one gives me money for it. hmmm

i do not know who is wrong or right. it is just choices.

poor John L, seriously he poured his life and marriage and everything he had to bring John S and Mark G to the point that they too could livee of other people and write books and preach etc and travel and this would be the second freaking time they decided yeah bro thanks for the ride but we do not like you leave now they took him off for a year once before that poor guy.

but im kind of laughing my azz off at this sorry brothers. lol lol ok not funny not funny lol make it stop . oh dear God middle age will kill us all lolol

Edited October 12, 2009 by pond

[Ham]

On a mission from God..

Don't get me wrong.. but JL doesn't resemble either of these characters..

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