The Way's "Good Old Days" -> Deluded Nostalgia

[penworks]

I agree . . . . It wasn't until the later corp people started to rule that TWI became completely nuts . . . . I think there was a lot of value in the whole thing before this points. I think there is a lot of value in many of the offshoots who went back to the good old days too.

I disagree. Here's why.

I understand how some people may think The Way was good “in the old days” and somehow “got off track” in later years. But I take issue with this line of thinking. I call it deluded nostalgia: a wistful or excessively sentimental yearning for return to or of some past period or irrecoverable condition. What exactly is that condition people are craving? I was involved from 1971-1987 and I don’t crave any of it. But I figure I’d pitch in my two cents here.

Frankly, I think it appears to be nostalgia for small fellowships with rock music or old hymns “corrected to be accurate” with Way doctrine, simple teachings (I guess), and camaraderie with others who thought like we did, and learning “what the Bible says.” On the surface, these things seem fairly harmless. But when I really think about the “old TWI days,” and these activities, I come up with some concerns:

1. The simplistic idealism that we could save the world with cut and dry Bible answers

2. The lack of mature dealings in the world. I was addressed as a child and kept from growing up while in the Corps and afterwards,

3. The gross neglect of my critical thinking faculty

4. The fact we were supposed to sell the PFAL class to people in order for VP to approve of our lives

5. The issue of whether we were “helping people” by using tools belonging to VP’s brand of fundamentalism

6. As far as I know, some still think they helped people with “the Word.” But what exactly is “The Word?” It’s very vague to me. My understanding is that when a phrase is used, there’s a definition for it somewhere. I don’t know of one for “The Word.” It is a phrase thrown around as if we all know what it means. This reminds me of the fairytale about the Emperor’s new clothes. The fact was: Emperor was not wearing any clothes. I don’t think anyone knows what The Word is.

7. Suffice it to say here, the usual explanation by TWI people and former TWI people for what “The Word” is goes something like this: you have to “use certain keys to research to discover what the original Word was.” Whose keys to research? How come we so readily accepted VP’s which he took from various other people who were fundamentalists? If it were so simple to know “The Word,” how come so many diverse interpretations persist?

But back to the good old days. Let’s say the “good old Way days” were good after all, although this is hard for me to fathom. What exactly is being referred to by this claim? IMO, VP created some sense of community with some people for awhile, but what was that based upon? The way I see it, it was based on an agreement that VP’s teachings were God’s Word, on the commitment to the common cause of VP’s delusion of “moving The Word over the World,” and on a simple love for other people - as long as they obeyed what VP said was The Word. If they didn’t, at the very least they were not as spiritual as we were; at the very worst they were “born of the seed of the devil.”

Let’s not forget, however, that this conditional camaraderie came at a price: It was held together by a patriarchal system fraught with deception and power struggles, not to mention rampant sexual, fiscal, and emotional abuse.

In my view, wishing for “the good old days of The Way” denies the nature of the group itself – a fundamentalist, narrow-minded, anti-Christian movement. Why do I say it is anti-Christian? Because people were used as a means to an end. What was the end? Believe that what VP taught was the truth. Evangelize. Sell PFAL classes. Behave according to what The Way leadership dictated.

Nostalgia for the old days also seems to deny the fact that from its inception, the cult was engineered by V.P. Wierwille, who claimed, like Paul in the New Testament, that he heard an audible voice from a monotheistic God adopted from another culture from thousands of years ago (or the voice of Jesus, as in Paul’s case) that no one else heard. This raises all sorts of issues too complex to get into here I think.

While I met many good people whose kindness made me feel loved, during my TWI years, VP’s teachings, such as telling me I was “more than a conqueror” did not help me resolve problems I brought into The Way with me. For awhile, it engendered a positive attitude in me but it did not produce a healthy self image or tolerance, understanding and compassion for others who might not agree with what I believed. I think the doctrines in many instances only instilled a good deal of denial about myself, the good in the world, other cultures, and denial about what it means to be human.

When I first took PFAL, at 18 years old, I certainly was gullible to The Way’s “answers” but the human brain is not even fully developed until 23 or 24 years old so that’s part of this scenario, too. But I also readily admit that I consciously turned a deaf ear to people who warned me not to get involved.

Not only did I make grave errors in judgment when getting involved with TWI, but I was seduced by big fat claims about the nature of the system I was in. It claimed to be a biblical research ministry but it is extreme fundamentalism. I suggest more of us get informed not only about how cults function but what fundamentalism is and the history of its development. It’s not only a way of interpreting the bible but a way of existing in the world.

[waterbuffalo]

I disagree. Here's why.

I understand how some people may think The Way was good “in the old days” and somehow “got off track” in later years. But I take issue with this line of thinking. I call it deluded nostalgia: a wistful or excessively sentimental yearning for return to or of some past period or irrecoverable condition. What exactly is that condition people are craving? I was involved from 1971-1987 and I don’t crave any of it. But I figure I’d pitch in my two cents here.

Frankly, I think it appears to be nostalgia for small fellowships with rock music or old hymns “corrected to be accurate” with Way doctrine, simple teachings (I guess), and camaraderie with others who thought like we did, and learning “what the Bible says.” On the surface, these things seem fairly harmless. But when I really think about the “old TWI days,” and these activities, I come up with some concerns:

1. The simplistic idealism that we could save the world with cut and dry Bible answers

2. The lack of mature dealings in the world. I was addressed as a child and kept from growing up while in the Corps and afterwards,

3. The gross neglect of my critical thinking faculty

4. The fact we were supposed to sell the PFAL class to people in order for VP to approve of our lives

5. The issue of whether we were “helping people” by using tools belonging to VP’s brand of fundamentalism

6. As far as I know, some still think they helped people with “the Word.” But what exactly is “The Word?” It’s very vague to me. My understanding is that when a phrase is used, there’s a definition for it somewhere. I don’t know of one for “The Word.” It is a phrase thrown around as if we all know what it means. This reminds me of the fairytale about the Emperor’s new clothes. The fact was: Emperor was not wearing any clothes. I don’t think anyone knows what The Word is.

7. Suffice it to say here, the usual explanation by TWI people and former TWI people for what “The Word” is goes something like this: you have to “use certain keys to research to discover what the original Word was.” Whose keys to research? How come we so readily accepted VP’s which he took from various other people who were fundamentalists? If it were so simple to know “The Word,” how come so many diverse interpretations persist?

But back to the good old days. Let’s say the “good old Way days” were good after all, although this is hard for me to fathom. What exactly is being referred to by this claim? IMO, VP created some sense of community with some people for awhile, but what was that based upon? The way I see it, it was based on an agreement that VP’s teachings were God’s Word, on the commitment to the common cause of VP’s delusion of “moving The Word over the World,” and on a simple love for other people - as long as they obeyed what VP said was The Word. If they didn’t, at the very least they were not as spiritual as we were; at the very worst they were “born of the seed of the devil.”

Let’s not forget, however, that this conditional camaraderie came at a price: It was held together by a patriarchal system fraught with deception and power struggles, not to mention rampant sexual, fiscal, and emotional abuse.

In my view, wishing for “the good old days of The Way” denies the nature of the group itself – a fundamentalist, narrow-minded, anti-Christian movement. Why do I say it is anti-Christian? Because people were used as a means to an end. What was the end? Believe that what VP taught was the truth. Evangelize. Sell PFAL classes. Behave according to what The Way leadership dictated.

Nostalgia for the old days also seems to deny the fact that from its inception, the cult was engineered by V.P. Wierwille, who claimed, like Paul in the New Testament, that he heard an audible voice from a monotheistic God adopted from another culture from thousands of years ago (or the voice of Jesus, as in Paul’s case) that no one else heard. This raises all sorts of issues too complex to get into here I think.

While I met many good people whose kindness made me feel loved, during my TWI years, VP’s teachings, such as telling me I was “more than a conqueror” did not help me resolve problems I brought into The Way with me. For awhile, it engendered a positive attitude in me but it did not produce a healthy self image or tolerance, understanding and compassion for others who might not agree with what I believed. I think the doctrines in many instances only instilled a good deal of denial about myself, the good in the world, other cultures, and denial about what it means to be human.

When I first took PFAL, at 18 years old, I certainly was gullible to The Way’s “answers” but the human brain is not even fully developed until 23 or 24 years old so that’s part of this scenario, too. But I also readily admit that I consciously turned a deaf ear to people who warned me not to get involved.

Not only did I make grave errors in judgment when getting involved with TWI, but I was seduced by big fat claims about the nature of the system I was in. It claimed to be a biblical research ministry but it is extreme fundamentalism. I suggest more of us get informed not only about how cults function but what fundamentalism is and the history of its development. It’s not only a way of interpreting the bible but a way of existing in the world.

Nice!

[Oakspear]

Very well stated penworks.

In my observation, nostalgia for the "good ol' Way days" is similar to many people who look back at their childhood Christmases with such delight and wonder and are angry that they turned into so much 'work' and stress, when in reality dad (and especially) mom always had the stress and work, we kids just didn't see it and got to bask in the glow of family and Santa Claus.

The "good ol' Way days" are similar in that we, as new people, didn't know what was going on behind the scenes, weren't aware of the problems, we just got to enjoy a bible fellowship with people who appeared to know what they were talking about and bible classes that seemed to make more sense that what we'd heard before. In some respects we were the kids.

I've always thought it interesting how the good ol' days and 'when it all went wrong' are defined differently by people depending on who they are, where they were, who their leadership was and when they were involved: I got involved in 1978 and the good ol' days for me were the late 70's and early 80's; the 90's were a nightmare. There have been posters who were already on the way out in '72 or '73 because things were changing for the worse even then; there are still posters around who got involved in the 90's who might define the good ol' days as sometime before 1999. And don't forget the posters who were raised by TWI parents, sometimes during Corps training, who don't think 'good ol' days' ever existed, or the people who bolted before even 'the hippies' showed up, who most of us would never have heard of.

What does this tell us? That there was no objective "good ol' Way days".

[Tzaia]

As far as my kids are concerned, there were no good old days in TWI. I was not aware of how much they disliked what little time we did subject them to it until recently. My "good old days" honeymoon era ended pretty much after ROA 1979, right after I took the class. It was OK until people were talking about who should be moving into my townhouse (I wasn't looking for a roommate) and telling me who not to marry.

[chockfull]

"Good 'ole days" - people looking for a "feeling" they had they experienced in their youth.

This feeling is not an accurate representation of reality.

[taxicab]

I disagree. Here's why.

I understand how some people may think The Way was good “in the old days” and somehow “got off track” in later years. But I take issue with this line of thinking. I call it deluded nostalgia: a wistful or excessively sentimental yearning for return to or of some past period or irrecoverable condition. What exactly is that condition people are craving? I was involved from 1971-1987 and I don’t crave any of it. But I figure I’d pitch in my two cents here.

Frankly, I think it appears to be nostalgia for small fellowships with rock music or old hymns “corrected to be accurate” with Way doctrine, simple teachings (I guess), and camaraderie with others who thought like we did, and learning “what the Bible says.” On the surface, these things seem fairly harmless. But when I really think about the “old TWI days,” and these activities, I come up with some concerns:

1. The simplistic idealism that we could save the world with cut and dry Bible answers

2. The lack of mature dealings in the world. I was addressed as a child and kept from growing up while in the Corps and afterwards,

3. The gross neglect of my critical thinking faculty

4. The fact we were supposed to sell the PFAL class to people in order for VP to approve of our lives

5. The issue of whether we were “helping people” by using tools belonging to VP’s brand of fundamentalism

6. As far as I know, some still think they helped people with “the Word.” But what exactly is “The Word?” It’s very vague to me. My understanding is that when a phrase is used, there’s a definition for it somewhere. I don’t know of one for “The Word.” It is a phrase thrown around as if we all know what it means. This reminds me of the fairytale about the Emperor’s new clothes. The fact was: Emperor was not wearing any clothes. I don’t think anyone knows what The Word is.

7. Suffice it to say here, the usual explanation by TWI people and former TWI people for what “The Word” is goes something like this: you have to “use certain keys to research to discover what the original Word was.” Whose keys to research? How come we so readily accepted VP’s which he took from various other people who were fundamentalists? If it were so simple to know “The Word,” how come so many diverse interpretations persist?

But back to the good old days. Let’s say the “good old Way days” were good after all, although this is hard for me to fathom. What exactly is being referred to by this claim? IMO, VP created some sense of community with some people for awhile, but what was that based upon? The way I see it, it was based on an agreement that VP’s teachings were God’s Word, on the commitment to the common cause of VP’s delusion of “moving The Word over the World,” and on a simple love for other people - as long as they obeyed what VP said was The Word. If they didn’t, at the very least they were not as spiritual as we were; at the very worst they were “born of the seed of the devil.”

Let’s not forget, however, that this conditional camaraderie came at a price: It was held together by a patriarchal system fraught with deception and power struggles, not to mention rampant sexual, fiscal, and emotional abuse.

In my view, wishing for “the good old days of The Way” denies the nature of the group itself – a fundamentalist, narrow-minded, anti-Christian movement. Why do I say it is anti-Christian? Because people were used as a means to an end. What was the end? Believe that what VP taught was the truth. Evangelize. Sell PFAL classes. Behave according to what The Way leadership dictated.

Nostalgia for the old days also seems to deny the fact that from its inception, the cult was engineered by V.P. Wierwille, who claimed, like Paul in the New Testament, that he heard an audible voice from a monotheistic God adopted from another culture from thousands of years ago (or the voice of Jesus, as in Paul’s case) that no one else heard. This raises all sorts of issues too complex to get into here I think.

While I met many good people whose kindness made me feel loved, during my TWI years, VP’s teachings, such as telling me I was “more than a conqueror” did not help me resolve problems I brought into The Way with me. For awhile, it engendered a positive attitude in me but it did not produce a healthy self image or tolerance, understanding and compassion for others who might not agree with what I believed. I think the doctrines in many instances only instilled a good deal of denial about myself, the good in the world, other cultures, and denial about what it means to be human.

When I first took PFAL, at 18 years old, I certainly was gullible to The Way’s “answers” but the human brain is not even fully developed until 23 or 24 years old so that’s part of this scenario, too. But I also readily admit that I consciously turned a deaf ear to people who warned me not to get involved.

Not only did I make grave errors in judgment when getting involved with TWI, but I was seduced by big fat claims about the nature of the system I was in. It claimed to be a biblical research ministry but it is extreme fundamentalism. I suggest more of us get informed not only about how cults function but what fundamentalism is and the history of its development. It’s not only a way of interpreting the bible but a way of existing in the world.

Penworks, Thanks so much for posting this. I read it on another web site as well. I would like to copy and paste this if it's okay with you. I know a young 26 year old man who seems to think the adversary has just recently infiltrated TWI (his words not mine) and he's involved with a splinter group that celebrates Wierwille's life, teachings, message.

[Rocky]

YET....I could easily make the arguement that wierwille was a narcissistic tyrant, plagairist, a sex predator, and devised the corps program for self-gain and exploitation.

The corps program was a bait-n-switch......and wierwille knew it.

By 1980, lots of good corps.....and plenty of wonderful faithful followers....were onto wierwille's trickery ONLY TO BE HAMMERED BY TWI'S BUREACRATIC FIST ONCE AGAIN.

As valid as those reflections are, I think Penworks' analysis is the very best I've ever seen or read.

The bottom line was that it was always about Wierwille's bottom line... but in terms of describing the organization and the experience for the follower, Penworks summarized, capsulized and put it in a nutshell brilliantly.

[skyrider]

As valid as those reflections are, I think Penworks' analysis is the very best I've ever seen or read.

The bottom line was that it was always about Wierwille's bottom line... but in terms of describing the organization and the experience for the follower, Penworks summarized, capsulized and put it in a nutshell brilliantly.

Rocky.....I couldn't agree more and said the very same thing to penworks this morning in a pm.

:)

[HAPe4me]

Nicely said Penworks. thanks for all you do.

[chockfull]

But back to the good old days. Let’s say the “good old Way days” were good after all, although this is hard for me to fathom. What exactly is being referred to by this claim? IMO, VP created some sense of community with some people for awhile, but what was that based upon? The way I see it, it was based on an agreement that VP’s teachings were God’s Word, on the commitment to the common cause of VP’s delusion of “moving The Word over the World,” and on a simple love for other people - as long as they obeyed what VP said was The Word. If they didn’t, at the very least they were not as spiritual as we were; at the very worst they were “born of the seed of the devil.”

...

While I met many good people whose kindness made me feel loved, during my TWI years, VP’s teachings, such as telling me I was “more than a conqueror” did not help me resolve problems I brought into The Way with me. For awhile, it engendered a positive attitude in me but it did not produce a healthy self image or tolerance, understanding and compassion for others who might not agree with what I believed. I think the doctrines in many instances only instilled a good deal of denial about myself, the good in the world, other cultures, and denial about what it means to be human.

While I very much respect all of penworks post and analysis, these 2 paragraphs of it are what hits home most to me.

I do believe that the geniune element we experienced in TWI was due to a Christian mindset by those involved, a desire to delve into scriptures more in depth, a desire to "commit" oneself to God more fully, and a sense of community established by at least the outward appearance of those elements.

Yes at the top it was based upon deception, but I believe God is bigger than the character flaws of man and rewarded us for our genuine hearts and involvement.

I also believe that the "Law of Believing" elements taught and promoted by TWI contain elements of delusional avoidance that promote a positive attidude but do nothing towards genuinely solving real life problems. Positive confession is generally a good practice to maintain the proper perspective of thinking to succeed in life and overcome problems. Yet too often that mindset gravitates towards a Christian Scientist viewpoint of thinking your broken arm is healed because you see it and confess it. Keep a practical evaluation on all of your spiritual beliefs. It will add to you overall quality of life.

[Rocky]

Btw, harking back to this editorial thread on TWI, and my previous "advocacy" for the WC social website, I wanted to now tell folks here that my view of that experience has changed.

The founder of that social website had quite a falling out with people on this site shortly after he started his site. While I still believe his intent was benign and noble, it is now nearly two years (and more than 1300 members) later and as things have evolved, it is clear to me that the founder of that site has gotten himself in over his head.

The rules and intent stated at the start was to keep that site's forums on subjects of a general nature, applicable to the community of members therein. His stated intent was to allow members to express themselves (more or less) freely on blogs that each member could post to his/her profile page and be responsible for, and control whether or not they wanted to allow feedback (comments in response).

At first, it was more freely. Now, for some it is more, and for some it is MUCH less.

For example, Penworks' outstanding analysis, which Penworks posted on that site, drew some responses... actually thoughtful responses.

However, the founder of that site, as soon as he caught wind of this brilliant analysis and those thoughtful responses -- SHUT IT DOWN.

This he has done a couple of times to me also.

If this topic is of interest, I can expand on it in it's own thread. But i think this much, since it involves a comment posted directly to this thread, which goes directly to the point of this thread, I hope I do not offend anyone by posting this here.

Needless to say, I have already gotten the "spiritual cold-shoulder" from the founder of that site.

Live goes on.

[Rocky]

btw, the persons who are allowed free reign on that site are particularly the fundamentalists, both christian fundamentist (read, extremist) AND political fundamentalists (read, extremists).

And the founder of that site has essentially adopted a practice of APPEASEMENT to wierwille apologists while denying that he is one himself... at the same time as he quickly and harshly shuts down anyone who criticizes TWI... AND anyone who dares to challenge the kind of political hate speech that we've been seeing in America, and which has, indeed been expressed on that WC social site, even to the end of encouraging and/or condoning illegal and violent acts against the government of the United States.

[Tzaia]

Btw, harking back to this editorial thread on TWI, and my previous "advocacy" for the WC social website, I wanted to now tell folks here that my view of that experience has changed.

Are you surprised?

Yeah, I'd like to see a separate thread on your experience.

[penworks]

Good morning everyone. Just checking in with my morning cup of coffee in hand and was shocked to read what's been going on while I snoozed away here in sunny Florida.

A quick update from my chair: Everything I write or say I take responsibility for, as we all do. My intent is to speak my mind on things which may be useful to others and do it not with the intention to harm. Then let the chips fall where they may. After reading all these recent posts, I signed into the other site and read those as well.

After much thought, I deleted this pesky post from the other site and sent a polite message to the owner. I did that out of respect for the owner's rules which before this incident were not so clear to me. Otherwise I wouldn't have posted this material there to begin with.

Anyway, it's wonderful to read such thoughtful replies both here and from people there who left comments. In both places there are some insightful and informative things said about the topics in the post. Believe me, I've put a lot of thought into these matters for more than 20 years and feel compelled to share what I've learned. About our lives, no one can speak for us other than our own voices. I'll leave you with my favorite quote on this theme:

"If we refuse to do the work of creating this personal version of the past, someone else will do it for us. That is the scary political fact. 'The struggle of man against power,' Milan Kundera's hero in The Book of Laughter and Forgetting says, 'is the struggle of memory against forgetting.' He refers to willful political forgetting, the habit of nations and those in power to deny the truth of memory in order to disarm moral and ethical power. It is an efficient way of controlling masses of people." From the book, I Could Tell You Stories by Patricia Hampl, pg.32.

Cheers! Enjoy your day!

Penworks

[Rocky]

Are you surprised?

Yeah, I'd like to see a separate thread on your experience.

Surprise? Well, that's relative. Compared to what I thought in 2007, yes. However, compared to how I saw it develop over the last six months, no. I'll expound later. :)

[Bolshevik]

In my "experience", I can't remember a time when twi, it's followers, it's leaders, it children, where not trying to go back to the "good ole' days". Even people who weren't there, and didn't exist at the time, remember them. Some sort of Shangri La.

All was very good in Wayville, till the serpent tempted Eve, or somebody. Jesus is coming back to restore the grounds at HQ, so that no grass blade be uneven.

Damned those "good ole' dayz"

Edited September 23, 2009 by Bolshevik

[taxicab]

But I also readily admit that I consciously turned a deaf ear to people who warned me not to get involved.

That is so true. In the 70's my parents were very concerned with my involvement in TWI. They told me things and showed me things that I just refused to believe, didn't want to believe, including sexual escapades by the leadership. Eighteen years later I finally admitted that they were right.

While I was in-residence in the 8th. Corps my father wrote Craig a letter. Craig had me write the response and he read and approved it and signed his name to it. Perhaps he wanted to see my response. I wish I still had my dad's letter but I would be embarrased now to read my response.

[Ham]

Surprise? Well, that's relative. Compared to what I thought in 2007, yes. However, compared to how I saw it develop over the last six months, no. I'll expound later. :)

No, I won't say you "nya, nya, toldya so.."

but doesn't the "exclusiveism" kinda stink now?

not that I care.. like I said then, anybody who doesn't want unwashed squirrels in their ranks.. well.. to whatever with them..

[Ham]

its their "opportunity" (hack.. sowie) ..

I mean.. they've missed their little slice of "heaven", haven't they..

[waysider]

"Boy the Way Productions played,

songs that missed the hit parade,

guys like us we had it made,

those were the days,

and you know where you were then,

girls were girls and men were men,

mister we could use a man like VP Wierdwille again,

didn't need no welfare states

everybody lost some weight,

gee our WOWMOBILE ran great, those were the days!"

Edited September 23, 2009 by waysider

[HAPe4me]

Penworks,

thanks again for posting this. I too get tired of hearing people laud those times as so fun filled, ever forgetting the errors on which it was based. The sad thing to me is they continue in those errors, refusing to correct them in their own lives. Nothing has changed for them, nothing has imnproved, and they live forever in Egypt (De- Nile). Your words were (there) and are (here) a refreshing inspiration.

[taxicab]

I disagree. Here's why.

I understand how some people may think The Way was good “in the old days” and somehow “got off track” in later years. But I take issue with this line of thinking. I call it deluded nostalgia: a wistful or excessively sentimental yearning for return to or of some past period or irrecoverable condition. What exactly is that condition people are craving? I was involved from 1971-1987 and I don’t crave any of it. But I figure I’d pitch in my two cents here.

Frankly, I think it appears to be nostalgia for small fellowships with rock music or old hymns “corrected to be accurate” with Way doctrine, simple teachings (I guess), and camaraderie with others who thought like we did, and learning “what the Bible says.” On the surface, these things seem fairly harmless. But when I really think about the “old TWI days,” and these activities, I come up with some concerns:

1. The simplistic idealism that we could save the world with cut and dry Bible answers

2. The lack of mature dealings in the world. I was addressed as a child and kept from growing up while in the Corps and afterwards,

3. The gross neglect of my critical thinking faculty

4. The fact we were supposed to sell the PFAL class to people in order for VP to approve of our lives

5. The issue of whether we were “helping people” by using tools belonging to VP’s brand of fundamentalism

6. As far as I know, some still think they helped people with “the Word.” But what exactly is “The Word?” It’s very vague to me. My understanding is that when a phrase is used, there’s a definition for it somewhere. I don’t know of one for “The Word.” It is a phrase thrown around as if we all know what it means. This reminds me of the fairytale about the Emperor’s new clothes. The fact was: Emperor was not wearing any clothes. I don’t think anyone knows what The Word is.

7. Suffice it to say here, the usual explanation by TWI people and former TWI people for what “The Word” is goes something like this: you have to “use certain keys to research to discover what the original Word was.” Whose keys to research? How come we so readily accepted VP’s which he took from various other people who were fundamentalists? If it were so simple to know “The Word,” how come so many diverse interpretations persist?

But back to the good old days. Let’s say the “good old Way days” were good after all, although this is hard for me to fathom. What exactly is being referred to by this claim? IMO, VP created some sense of community with some people for awhile, but what was that based upon? The way I see it, it was based on an agreement that VP’s teachings were God’s Word, on the commitment to the common cause of VP’s delusion of “moving The Word over the World,” and on a simple love for other people - as long as they obeyed what VP said was The Word. If they didn’t, at the very least they were not as spiritual as we were; at the very worst they were “born of the seed of the devil.”

Let’s not forget, however, that this conditional camaraderie came at a price: It was held together by a patriarchal system fraught with deception and power struggles, not to mention rampant sexual, fiscal, and emotional abuse.

In my view, wishing for “the good old days of The Way” denies the nature of the group itself – a fundamentalist, narrow-minded, anti-Christian movement. Why do I say it is anti-Christian? Because people were used as a means to an end. What was the end? Believe that what VP taught was the truth. Evangelize. Sell PFAL classes. Behave according to what The Way leadership dictated.

Nostalgia for the old days also seems to deny the fact that from its inception, the cult was engineered by V.P. Wierwille, who claimed, like Paul in the New Testament, that he heard an audible voice from a monotheistic God adopted from another culture from thousands of years ago (or the voice of Jesus, as in Paul’s case) that no one else heard. This raises all sorts of issues too complex to get into here I think.

While I met many good people whose kindness made me feel loved, during my TWI years, VP’s teachings, such as telling me I was “more than a conqueror” did not help me resolve problems I brought into The Way with me. For awhile, it engendered a positive attitude in me but it did not produce a healthy self image or tolerance, understanding and compassion for others who might not agree with what I believed. I think the doctrines in many instances only instilled a good deal of denial about myself, the good in the world, other cultures, and denial about what it means to be human.

When I first took PFAL, at 18 years old, I certainly was gullible to The Way’s “answers” but the human brain is not even fully developed until 23 or 24 years old so that’s part of this scenario, too. But I also readily admit that I consciously turned a deaf ear to people who warned me not to get involved.

Not only did I make grave errors in judgment when getting involved with TWI, but I was seduced by big fat claims about the nature of the system I was in. It claimed to be a biblical research ministry but it is extreme fundamentalism. I suggest more of us get informed not only about how cults function but what fundamentalism is and the history of its development. It’s not only a way of interpreting the bible but a way of existing in the world.

I'm not sure people's comments are showing up on the blog.

[George Aar]

I've said it before (many times), ad nauseum, but the "Good 'ol days" mindset really does ignore lotsa issues. I.E. - abandoned educations, careers derailed, alienated family members (who did NOTHING to deserve such treatment), friendships destroyed, and purloined life in general.

And all of that in exchange for adoption of - when viewed in retrospect - really childish, trivial, even downright silly superstitions. For all the pomp and circumstance of V.P. and Co., their belief system had no depth whatsoever. "Believing will make it so" is pretty tepid gruel to base one's life on.

There was a real reason why there were so few mature adults that bought into WayWorld dogma. A modicum of wisdom was all that was needed to decern the B.S. It really was pretty obvious to most anyone but inexperienced kids.

And, gee, the "WayCorps Only, Super-Exclusive, Blessed Cream-o-the-crop" Website is experiencing a bit of dissention within it's ranks? SHOCKED! SHOCKED I say!

[Rocky]

No, I won't say you "nya, nya, toldya so.."

but doesn't the "exclusiveism" kinda stink now?

not that I care.. like I said then, anybody who doesn't want unwashed squirrels in their ranks.. well.. to whatever with them..

NO... this is significantly different from what those who wanted in but weren't allowed in either experienced or didn't experience.

Your "I told you so" (yes, you did communicate that) completely misses the point. But I don't care one way or the other.

I've said it before (many times), ad nauseum, but the "Good 'ol days" mindset really does ignore lotsa issues. I.E. - abandoned educations, careers derailed, alienated family members (who did NOTHING to deserve such treatment), friendships destroyed, and purloined life in general.

And all of that in exchange for adoption of - when viewed in retrospect - really childish, trivial, even downright silly superstitions. For all the pomp and circumstance of V.P. and Co., their belief system had no depth whatsoever. "Believing will make it so" is pretty tepid gruel to base one's life on.

There was a real reason why there were so few mature adults that bought into WayWorld dogma. A modicum of wisdom was all that was needed to decern the B.S. It really was pretty obvious to most anyone but inexperienced kids.

And, gee, the "WayCorps Only, Super-Exclusive, Blessed Cream-o-the-crop" Website is experiencing a bit of dissention within it's ranks? SHOCKED! SHOCKED I say!

Of course, most of US were those inexperienced kids when we first became followers of wierwille...

[penworks]

There was a real reason why there were so few mature adults that bought into WayWorld dogma. A modicum of wisdom was all that was needed to decern the B.S. It really was pretty obvious to most anyone but inexperienced kids.

Well I suspect it might be more complicated than that. I don't think the human mind is as strong as we'd like to believe. There was some pretty intense indoctrination going on even with adults.

Over the years I've thought about those adults (over 35 yrs. old :-) who got involved while I was in. That was 1970-1987. There were several entire families in together; some of the parents ended up in the Corps. Because of their presence, I've hesitated to say it would be easier to spot falacies in logic, etc. if we'd been older. Older doesn't seem to matter. There were highly skilled professionals active in the ministry: i.e. a surgeon, teachers, etc. and even in the second Corps someone over 30 had a PhD in Literature!

In my view, whatever deep needs people had in their hearts, no matter what their age (and there were plenty of old timers around by the time I left) drew them to TWI and kept them there. Most of us have heard this before: the need for belonging, for simple answers from the Bible which was held to be the Word of God, etc. People's particular needs combined with the certainty of answers given spells committment to the one handing out the answers, it seems...

I'm not sure people's comments are showing up on the blog.

If you think comments made here are missing, I guess you need to contact the administrators.

Penworks, Thanks so much for posting this. I read it on another web site as well. I would like to copy and paste this if it's okay with you. I know a young 26 year old man who seems to think the adversary has just recently infiltrated TWI (his words not mine) and he's involved with a splinter group that celebrates Wierwille's life, teachings, message.

It's okay with me if you want to send the post to someone to help them out.