Can't address what was happening at HQ, but as far as "out on the field" I'd bet that they thought that to a certain extent that they were decentralizing with more and more power in the hands of the region guys and the five "root locales" where corps training took place.
What was a head-scratcher in my opinion was for how long the structure remained in place, even after 80%+ of the people left. In the early 80's, at the peak of membership there were seven or eight regions. Just before Martindale was ousted there were twelve regions most with only 2 or 3 states, and one, Ohio, that was a one-state region. Combine that with the definition of a "branch" being 'more than one twig' and you have almost more chiefs than Indians.
No offense, but I think expecting TWI to re-focus on Christian principles is like waiting for the tobacco industry to make healthier cigarettes.
Since the basis for its bureaucracy was a hierarchy focused on the top dog - it was inevitable that it would cave in when the dirty dog’s utter hypocrisies came to light.
Back in 1979-1984, the way ministry was growing exponentially.
In 1979.....twi moved its offices and "command center" from the EOB to the OSC. Many believe, and I largely agree, that twi changed dramatically that year. At this juncture, twi lost its "intimate flavor" of meals in the BRC basement, Sunday morning sharings on the wierwille lawn under the apple trees, the BRC Sunday night services, the hamburgers served on the front courtyard of the wierwille home, etc. etc.
In 1980.....more and more corporate policies were infiltrating into twi's framework. Outside vendors were coming to the OSC to get a piece of this growing enterprise.....Sysco food distributors, IBM salesmen, Materials Handling guys were stopping at shipping, receiving and warehousing offices, etc. etc.
In 1981.....Ambassador One flights were commissioned to get hq staff to the field and bring "field people" to hq for an extended weekend. Twi was attempting to bring that "come and see" feel to those who started to see a distancing and bureacracy forming. Other major pushes were underway to get Way Prod. out to the people.
In 1982.....with president-elect martindale on board for the October Anniversary mantle-exchange, the massive Living Victoriously event was a super-charged event wherein International Summer School attendees were invited to stay throughout the 10 weeks (?)...culminating with the 1982 Living Victoriously. Major prep all year.....more levels of bureacracy. If I remember correctly, F1nnegan was given a title above Bo Rxxhard's International Outreach Coord. position. F1nnegan was entitled with WORLDWIDE Outreach Coordinator. Also, noted.....cgeer was sent to Europe and designated the European Trunk Coordinator and European Corps Coordinator.
In 1983.....in the states, limbs were getting bigger and bigger. Several limbs were huge and needed staffed and volunteer staff. The Area coord. position was needful to oversee several Branches in a state. The levels of leadership one needed to address....like three levels just to address the limb...twig guy, branch guy, area guy... was abit too much.
In 1984.....many believe that this was the apex of twi's growth and notoriety. At roa, there were some 24,000 attendees and the compexities of it all were staggering.....the long lines, the pregnant mothers, the children's area, the youth groups in the west woods, the emcees juggling all sorts of rallying meetings, "third" aid, safety issues, camping issues, and corps working endlessly behind the scenes, etc. etc.
Does there come a point where this should have been de-centralized?
Does there come a point when the pyramid structure of twi....and its ever-growing wierwille adulation....need to be re-focused back towards christian principles and not this annual pilgrimage?
Did twi's bureacracy collapse upon itself?
Are you asking what the decent, right thing to do was? or just what would have helped build the Way?
I think if it would have been left decenteralized and more relaxed, Wierwille wouldn't have been able to push people as far into crazy-land. They would have either left or he'd have had to become more moderate. The hyper-structure that developed was designed to lock people in. From an organizational stand-point i think it was a brilliant idea.
Can't address what was happening at HQ, but as far as "out on the field" I'd bet that they thought that to a certain extent that they were decentralizing with more and more power in the hands of the region guys and the five "root locales" where corps training took place.
What was a head-scratcher in my opinion was for how long the structure remained in place, even after 80%+ of the people left. In the early 80's, at the peak of membership there were seven or eight regions. Just before Martindale was ousted there were twelve regions most with only 2 or 3 states, and one, Ohio, that was a one-state region. Combine that with the definition of a "branch" being 'more than one twig' and you have almost more chiefs than Indians.
Oakspear......"more chiefs than Indians" INDEED.
In retrospect, I see how wierwille devised a corps program to be a manufacturing, indoctrinational process to build an army of wierwille-soldiers. The corps followed the commands of wierwille....overreaching and overriding the twigs, branches, areas, and limbs....to the point where this indoctrination was injected into every twig. Add the weekly tapes and monthly mag to this toxic recipe as well.
In 1980......there was a juncture point where "word in culture" was......(imo)......starting to break away from the wierwille idolatry. Artists, writers, cartoonists, musicians, financial freedom speakers, etc. were rising up.....BRANCHING OUT AND AWAY FROM THE WIERWILLE INDOCTRINATION. I know there are many who could easily argue that the whole thing was a con and messed up from the get-go.....but there was a short time when, imo, it looked like many were embracing individual freedoms in Christ.
But soon thereafter.....that "word in culture tent" at roa was closed down and people could NO LONGER sell their wares and promote their individuality. Individual expression and freedom was MOUNTING and became unmanageable by twi's bureacracy of control.
At one time, there was talk of REGIONAL rock of ages. And, Word in Business conferences, under the direction of Don Wierwille, was geared toward business/professionals and College Division students.
In retrospect, I see how wierwille devised a corps program to be a manufacturing, indoctrinational process to build an army of wierwille-soldiers. The corps followed the commands of wierwille....overreaching and overriding the twigs, branches, areas, and limbs....to the point where this indoctrination was injected into every twig. Add the weekly tapes and monthly mag to this toxic recipe as well.
In 1980......there was a juncture point where "word in culture" was......(imo)......starting to break away from the wierwille idolatry. Artists, writers, cartoonists, musicians, financial freedom speakers, etc. were rising up.....BRANCHING OUT AND AWAY FROM THE WIERWILLE INDOCTRINATION. I know there are many who could easily argue that the whole thing was a con and messed up from the get-go.....but there was a short time when, imo, it looked like many were embracing individual freedoms in Christ.
But soon thereafter.....that "word in culture tent" at roa was closed down and people could NO LONGER sell their wares and promote their individuality. Individual expression and freedom was MOUNTING and became unmanageable by twi's bureacracy of control.
At one time, there was talk of REGIONAL rock of ages. And, Word in Business conferences, under the direction of Don Wierwille, was geared toward business/professionals and College Division students.
I agree . . . . It wasn't until the later corp people started to rule that TWI became completely nuts . . . . I think there was a lot of value in the whole thing before this points. I think there is a lot of value in many of the offshoots who went back to the good old days too.
I agree . . . . It wasn't until the later corp people started to rule that TWI became completely nuts . . . . I think there was a lot of value in the whole thing before this points. I think there is a lot of value in many of the offshoots who went back to the good old days too.
YET....I could easily make the arguement that wierwille was a narcissistic tyrant, plagairist, a sex predator, and devised the corps program for self-gain and exploitation.
The corps program was a bait-n-switch......and wierwille knew it.
By 1980, lots of good corps.....and plenty of wonderful faithful followers....were onto wierwille's trickery ONLY TO BE HAMMERED BY TWI'S BUREACRATIC FIST ONCE AGAIN.
I agree . . . . It wasn't until the later corp people started to rule that TWI became completely nuts . . . . I think there was a lot of value in the whole thing before this points. I think there is a lot of value in many of the offshoots who went back to the good old days too.
I don't see much difference between the rank and file followers, and vpw, if that's what you're saying. All is fantasy. People wanted fantasy, vpw spoke of it, people wanted to hear of it, things didn't work as planned, people went back to just talking about it.
I don't see much difference between the rank and file followers, and vpw, if that's what you're saying. All is fantasy. People wanted fantasy, vpw spoke of it, people wanted to hear of it, things didn't work as planned, people went back to just talking about it.
Fellow Laborers was bait-and-switch---promised us one thing and gave us something else.
I think maybe Wierwille envisioned it to be a way of developing Way Corps "franchises" around the country. Like the satellite locations that have become popular with colleges. Away from the main campus but under his authority. Thought he could control us remotely. Well, we were controlled alright, but it wasn't by him personally. When it didn't work the way he thought it should, he abandoned us like a ship wreck. Left us stranded on some deserted island. In all the time I was there, he never visited us once. In retrospect, I can see it had already started to crumble.
Can't address what was happening at HQ, but as far as "out on the field" I'd bet that they thought that to a certain extent that they were decentralizing with more and more power in the hands of the region guys and the five "root locales" where corps training took place.
. . .
Whoa, FIVE root locales?
I remember when it went from two (Gunnison and HQ) to one (just HQ)
Try not to laugh too loud...but assuming TWI was a good, wholesome, Christian, organization. it should have acted as a support organization for teaching and training only. People who wanted to would come for a couple of years for biblical instruction and perhaps some training on how to establish a new area, or developing a personal vision. The student would graduate and that would be it. Like I said, try not to laugh too hard. The graduate would go home, or do whatever it was they wanted to do. If the graduate started a work somewhere, The ministry could have supported them with teaching, music, counsel, accountability etc. and take a small percentage (say 3%) of the collection. Each work would stand on its own with the Ministry acting solely in a support function. Can you imagine that actually happening?
The problem is, TWI never was a good wholesome organization and probably had no idea on how to open up new areas and their teachings were weak at best if not heretical. IMO TWI never went "off track" because it was never "on track" to begin with. Wierwille was not interested in "moving the Word" he was interested in W.O.W. That is, "Wierwille Over the Word". People should have been allowed to "fly on their own" with the Holy Spirit and not TWI as their guide and if they made mistakes, well, big deal.
Try not to laugh too loud...but assuming TWI was a good, wholesome, Christian, organization. it should have acted as a support organization for teaching and training only. People who wanted to would come for a couple of years for biblical instruction and perhaps some training on how to establish a new area, or developing a personal vision. The student would graduate and that would be it. Like I said, try not to laugh too hard. The graduate would go home, or do whatever it was they wanted to do. If the graduate started a work somewhere, The ministry could have supported them with teaching, music, counsel, accountability etc. and take a small percentage (say 3%) of the collection. Each work would stand on its own with the Ministry acting solely in a support function. Can you imagine that actually happening?
I'm sure there a lots of people who thought that's what they were doing when they signed up for The Corps.
That's how Fellow Laborers was supposed to be.
We were going to study ACTS for two years and then go back to our hometowns.
Try not to laugh too loud...but assuming TWI was a good, wholesome, Christian, organization. it should have acted as a support organization for teaching and training only. People who wanted to would come for a couple of years for biblical instruction and perhaps some training on how to establish a new area, or developing a personal vision. The student would graduate and that would be it. Like I said, try not to laugh too hard. The graduate would go home, or do whatever it was they wanted to do. If the graduate started a work somewhere, The ministry could have supported them with teaching, music, counsel, accountability etc. and take a small percentage (say 3%) of the collection. Each work would stand on its own with the Ministry acting solely in a support function. Can you imagine that actually happening?
The problem is, TWI never was a good wholesome organization and probably had no idea on how to open up new areas and their teachings were weak at best if not heretical. IMO TWI never went "off track" because it was never "on track" to begin with. Wierwille was not interested in "moving the Word" he was interested in W.O.W. That is, "Wierwille Over the Word". People should have been allowed to "fly on their own" with the Holy Spirit and not TWI as their guide and if they made mistakes, well, big deal.
erkjohn......well said.
Wierwille, and later martindale, subscribed to "we have ALL the answers and we know the best way to run your life and family." i.e. -- bigger twi bureacracy is better.....reaching and teaching all aspect of "the word's way."
In 1995.....after martindale's twi went thru those post-"fog years"......martindale got "revelation" to put ALL WAY CORPS ON TWI'S PAYROLL. The result? Disastrous!!! Within two months, the trunk office had to triple its personnel as it scrambled to keep up with martindale's weekly mandates, policies and financial controls. Then, as lcm launched his "present truth" edict.....week after week, the changes in policy and terminology were crazy.
Yes, martindale was pulling the same bait-n-switch that wierwille did. Once corps signed onto this full-time assignment for twi, they OWNED us in every imaginable way. Remember: Twi has always lived by the slogan that those on staff live on a "needs basis"....and twi defines "need." In attempts to meet this ballooning payroll, martindale set mandates to the corps: No serious pets, No pregnancies w/o trustee approval, No interstate traveling to family w/o approval, No attending WIB unless trustee-invite, No teeth-braces for your kids w/o approval, No karate or dance or voice lessons for kids, No cable (unless you have other income to pay for it)......
While I totally agree that some corps (ok, many corps) took advantage of "the system"......the whole bureacratic process was faulty from the get-go. Like everything, those with greedy, elitist motives will always attempt to scam the system as bureacracy blurs into anonymity.....and to scale back on this corruption, these types of corps were martindale's examples on corps phone hook-up meetings to bring costs under control and MANDATE LIFE CHOICES.
I've posted all this information.....some four or five years ago.
Again.......twi's bureacracy collaped upon itself. There simply wasn't enough abs or classes or anything....to sustain martindale's "revelation" for all corps to be on twi's payroll. Don and Howard were bullied into this faulty premise as well and, just like when wierwille got his way, martindale did TOO.
And, Word in Business conferences, under the direction of Don Wierwille, was geared toward business/professionals and College Division students.
Even the WIB turned into just another "class". The first few WIB's that I went to had separate teachings/fellowships for people in like professions, by the time of the last few WIB's, they were little difference between them and the Advanced Class Specials. It was at a WIB that Martindale first announced his 'no debt' policy to those not in the Way Corps.
Even the WIB turned into just another "class". The first few WIB's that I went to had separate teachings/fellowships for people in like professions, by the time of the last few WIB's, they were little difference between them and the Advanced Class Specials. It was at a WIB that Martindale first announced his 'no debt' policy to those not in the Way Corps.
Oakspear......I totally agree.
Those first few WIB conferences had a main over-all teaching theme.....and then, TEN or TWELVE workshops ("word-shops") where REAL businessmen and REAL professionals shared aspects of REAL LIFE situations. For many, these workshops were NOT corps-led or wayspeak mumbo-jumbo.......these break-out conferences were filled with aspects to encourage and inspire small business owners, etc. etc.
The whole concept of those early WIB conferences (1979-1982??).....was freedom in the making.
BUT NO.......twi pulled the plug on it and it soon morphed into corps-led indoctrination. Only the corps (cough, cough) could lead these business and professional men and women. My respect for Don Wierwille......hit bottom. The guy just fell into the same bucket as his dad.
By early 1990s......WIB conferences had morphed into Advanced CLass Specials.
The irony of the bureaucracy of TWI was that TWI was supposed to be "different". It was different alright. It was a hybrid of other religious legalistic structures which created a unique legalistic structure.
It wasn't that TWI was striving for a level of consistency throughout the organization. It wanted everything the same. Kinda like McDonald's, only for different reasons.
The irony of the bureaucracy of TWI was that TWI was supposed to be "different". It was different alright. It was a hybrid of other religious legalistic structures which created a unique legalistic structure.
It wasn't that TWI was striving for a level of consistency throughout the organization. It wanted everything the same. Kinda like McDonald's, only for different reasons.
Consistent with whatever the view was AT THAT TIME, perhaps. Otherwise, the emotional swings of the MOG seemed to be most important. And they were certainly not always consistent.
The irony of the bureaucracy of TWI was that TWI was supposed to be "different". It was different alright. It was a hybrid of other religious legalistic structures which created a unique legalistic structure.
It wasn't that TWI was striving for a level of consistency throughout the organization. It wanted everything the same. Kinda like McDonald's, only for different reasons.
Yeah....the twi bureacracy had us eating mcdonald's burgers all week long, year after year.
And.....cgeer franchised the outfit to spice it with posthumous bread.
I remember in the posthumous "Turn Your eyes Upon Jesus" when Wierwille shared his disdain for a woman (Bathshebah) complaining of being raped is when a big light bulb went on over my head.
How hidden to me was his wicked leaven, but that particular one helped me lay it all at Wierwille's feet, not the mythical bad guys that the supposed good splinter leaders had many of us blaming.
Yeah....the twi bureacracy had us eating mcdonald's burgers all week long, year after year.
And.....cgeer franchised the outfit to spice it with posthumous bread.
As in you can walk into any given McDonald's and see the same menu prepared and served by different people, who are all basically alike. The "beauty" of McDonald's is in its adherence to things being done a certain way using pretty much the same ingredients all across the country, and to a large extent, the world.
Now I get where VP got the idea that McDonald's was actually his idea.
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waysider
It should have never been "centralized" to begin with.
It began to collapse the moment VPW denuded Way West and Way East.
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Oakspear
Can't address what was happening at HQ, but as far as "out on the field" I'd bet that they thought that to a certain extent that they were decentralizing with more and more power in the hands of the region guys and the five "root locales" where corps training took place.
What was a head-scratcher in my opinion was for how long the structure remained in place, even after 80%+ of the people left. In the early 80's, at the peak of membership there were seven or eight regions. Just before Martindale was ousted there were twelve regions most with only 2 or 3 states, and one, Ohio, that was a one-state region. Combine that with the definition of a "branch" being 'more than one twig' and you have almost more chiefs than Indians.
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T-Bone
No offense, but I think expecting TWI to re-focus on Christian principles is like waiting for the tobacco industry to make healthier cigarettes.
Since the basis for its bureaucracy was a hierarchy focused on the top dog - it was inevitable that it would cave in when the dirty dog’s utter hypocrisies came to light.
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Bishop
Are you asking what the decent, right thing to do was? or just what would have helped build the Way?
I think if it would have been left decenteralized and more relaxed, Wierwille wouldn't have been able to push people as far into crazy-land. They would have either left or he'd have had to become more moderate. The hyper-structure that developed was designed to lock people in. From an organizational stand-point i think it was a brilliant idea.
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skyrider
Oakspear......"more chiefs than Indians" INDEED.
In retrospect, I see how wierwille devised a corps program to be a manufacturing, indoctrinational process to build an army of wierwille-soldiers. The corps followed the commands of wierwille....overreaching and overriding the twigs, branches, areas, and limbs....to the point where this indoctrination was injected into every twig. Add the weekly tapes and monthly mag to this toxic recipe as well.
In 1980......there was a juncture point where "word in culture" was......(imo)......starting to break away from the wierwille idolatry. Artists, writers, cartoonists, musicians, financial freedom speakers, etc. were rising up.....BRANCHING OUT AND AWAY FROM THE WIERWILLE INDOCTRINATION. I know there are many who could easily argue that the whole thing was a con and messed up from the get-go.....but there was a short time when, imo, it looked like many were embracing individual freedoms in Christ.
But soon thereafter.....that "word in culture tent" at roa was closed down and people could NO LONGER sell their wares and promote their individuality. Individual expression and freedom was MOUNTING and became unmanageable by twi's bureacracy of control.
At one time, there was talk of REGIONAL rock of ages. And, Word in Business conferences, under the direction of Don Wierwille, was geared toward business/professionals and College Division students.
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Bishop
I agree . . . . It wasn't until the later corp people started to rule that TWI became completely nuts . . . . I think there was a lot of value in the whole thing before this points. I think there is a lot of value in many of the offshoots who went back to the good old days too.
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skyrider
YET....I could easily make the arguement that wierwille was a narcissistic tyrant, plagairist, a sex predator, and devised the corps program for self-gain and exploitation.
The corps program was a bait-n-switch......and wierwille knew it.
By 1980, lots of good corps.....and plenty of wonderful faithful followers....were onto wierwille's trickery ONLY TO BE HAMMERED BY TWI'S BUREACRATIC FIST ONCE AGAIN.
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Bolshevik
I don't see much difference between the rank and file followers, and vpw, if that's what you're saying. All is fantasy. People wanted fantasy, vpw spoke of it, people wanted to hear of it, things didn't work as planned, people went back to just talking about it.
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Bishop
Did you read the book i recommended, bolshevik?
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waysider
Fellow Laborers was bait-and-switch---promised us one thing and gave us something else.
I think maybe Wierwille envisioned it to be a way of developing Way Corps "franchises" around the country. Like the satellite locations that have become popular with colleges. Away from the main campus but under his authority. Thought he could control us remotely. Well, we were controlled alright, but it wasn't by him personally. When it didn't work the way he thought it should, he abandoned us like a ship wreck. Left us stranded on some deserted island. In all the time I was there, he never visited us once. In retrospect, I can see it had already started to crumble.
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Bolshevik
Whoa, FIVE root locales?
I remember when it went from two (Gunnison and HQ) to one (just HQ)
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Broken Arrow
FIVE...HQ, Rome City, Emporia, Tinney, Gunnison. Then there was The Way of Europe (I think).
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Broken Arrow
Try not to laugh too loud...but assuming TWI was a good, wholesome, Christian, organization. it should have acted as a support organization for teaching and training only. People who wanted to would come for a couple of years for biblical instruction and perhaps some training on how to establish a new area, or developing a personal vision. The student would graduate and that would be it. Like I said, try not to laugh too hard. The graduate would go home, or do whatever it was they wanted to do. If the graduate started a work somewhere, The ministry could have supported them with teaching, music, counsel, accountability etc. and take a small percentage (say 3%) of the collection. Each work would stand on its own with the Ministry acting solely in a support function. Can you imagine that actually happening?
The problem is, TWI never was a good wholesome organization and probably had no idea on how to open up new areas and their teachings were weak at best if not heretical. IMO TWI never went "off track" because it was never "on track" to begin with. Wierwille was not interested in "moving the Word" he was interested in W.O.W. That is, "Wierwille Over the Word". People should have been allowed to "fly on their own" with the Holy Spirit and not TWI as their guide and if they made mistakes, well, big deal.
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waysider
I'm sure there a lots of people who thought that's what they were doing when they signed up for The Corps.
That's how Fellow Laborers was supposed to be.
We were going to study ACTS for two years and then go back to our hometowns.
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skyrider
erkjohn......well said.
Wierwille, and later martindale, subscribed to "we have ALL the answers and we know the best way to run your life and family." i.e. -- bigger twi bureacracy is better.....reaching and teaching all aspect of "the word's way."
In 1995.....after martindale's twi went thru those post-"fog years"......martindale got "revelation" to put ALL WAY CORPS ON TWI'S PAYROLL. The result? Disastrous!!! Within two months, the trunk office had to triple its personnel as it scrambled to keep up with martindale's weekly mandates, policies and financial controls. Then, as lcm launched his "present truth" edict.....week after week, the changes in policy and terminology were crazy.
Yes, martindale was pulling the same bait-n-switch that wierwille did. Once corps signed onto this full-time assignment for twi, they OWNED us in every imaginable way. Remember: Twi has always lived by the slogan that those on staff live on a "needs basis"....and twi defines "need." In attempts to meet this ballooning payroll, martindale set mandates to the corps: No serious pets, No pregnancies w/o trustee approval, No interstate traveling to family w/o approval, No attending WIB unless trustee-invite, No teeth-braces for your kids w/o approval, No karate or dance or voice lessons for kids, No cable (unless you have other income to pay for it)......
While I totally agree that some corps (ok, many corps) took advantage of "the system"......the whole bureacratic process was faulty from the get-go. Like everything, those with greedy, elitist motives will always attempt to scam the system as bureacracy blurs into anonymity.....and to scale back on this corruption, these types of corps were martindale's examples on corps phone hook-up meetings to bring costs under control and MANDATE LIFE CHOICES.
I've posted all this information.....some four or five years ago.
Again.......twi's bureacracy collaped upon itself. There simply wasn't enough abs or classes or anything....to sustain martindale's "revelation" for all corps to be on twi's payroll. Don and Howard were bullied into this faulty premise as well and, just like when wierwille got his way, martindale did TOO.
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Oakspear
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skyrider
Oakspear......I totally agree.
Those first few WIB conferences had a main over-all teaching theme.....and then, TEN or TWELVE workshops ("word-shops") where REAL businessmen and REAL professionals shared aspects of REAL LIFE situations. For many, these workshops were NOT corps-led or wayspeak mumbo-jumbo.......these break-out conferences were filled with aspects to encourage and inspire small business owners, etc. etc.
The whole concept of those early WIB conferences (1979-1982??).....was freedom in the making.
BUT NO.......twi pulled the plug on it and it soon morphed into corps-led indoctrination. Only the corps (cough, cough) could lead these business and professional men and women. My respect for Don Wierwille......hit bottom. The guy just fell into the same bucket as his dad.
By early 1990s......WIB conferences had morphed into Advanced CLass Specials.
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Tzaia
The irony of the bureaucracy of TWI was that TWI was supposed to be "different". It was different alright. It was a hybrid of other religious legalistic structures which created a unique legalistic structure.
It wasn't that TWI was striving for a level of consistency throughout the organization. It wanted everything the same. Kinda like McDonald's, only for different reasons.
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GT
Penwork's analysis of The Way's "good old days" and all subsequent replies were moved to it's own thread - which it definitely deserves.
You can find it here: The Way's "Good Old Days" -> Deluded Nostalgia
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JustThinking
Consistent with whatever the view was AT THAT TIME, perhaps. Otherwise, the emotional swings of the MOG seemed to be most important. And they were certainly not always consistent.
JT
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skyrider
Yeah....the twi bureacracy had us eating mcdonald's burgers all week long, year after year.
And.....cgeer franchised the outfit to spice it with posthumous bread.
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JeffSjo
I remember in the posthumous "Turn Your eyes Upon Jesus" when Wierwille shared his disdain for a woman (Bathshebah) complaining of being raped is when a big light bulb went on over my head.
How hidden to me was his wicked leaven, but that particular one helped me lay it all at Wierwille's feet, not the mythical bad guys that the supposed good splinter leaders had many of us blaming.
"Posthumous bread" with wicked leaven.
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Tzaia
As in you can walk into any given McDonald's and see the same menu prepared and served by different people, who are all basically alike. The "beauty" of McDonald's is in its adherence to things being done a certain way using pretty much the same ingredients all across the country, and to a large extent, the world.
Now I get where VP got the idea that McDonald's was actually his idea.
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waysider
Yeah---except that he couldn't tolerate franchises. All company stores or nothing.
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