Chris Geer recently published a 2 book set, In the Footsteps of Patriarchs, Prophets, Believers and Kings, Vol 1 and 2. They are part of his Advanced class materials and were released before the class. He was working on a very long student guide and very long recorded class at the same time.
He still periodically publishes "Glimpses of Truth, A Journal of Christian Studies."
If you are wondering what a "Journal of Christian Studies" looks like... the Nov 2008 issue was a four page recounting of Joshua crossing the Jordan river and attacking Jericho. About two-thirds of that were simply quotations of the book of Joshua, so it says very little. If you've ever seen a true "Journal" in any discipline (theology, psychology, etc)... Geer's version is nothing whatsoever like them.
Geer's unquestioning dedication to VP doctrine is astounding...but not so suprising...as is most of the splinter groups' promoters. They show how powerful indoctrination can be. When critics scoff at the idea of mind control being a real issue in extremist groups, I think they're missing out on a good long look at examples like this...
Geer's unquestioning dedication to VP doctrine is astounding...but not so suprising...as is most of the splinter groups' promoters. They show how powerful indoctrination can be. When critics scoff at the idea of mind control being a real issue in extremist groups, I think they're missing out on a good long look at examples like this...
Absolutely!
"A hypocrite in all his might, so wrong in that he thinks he's right."
Yes, they're still running it. Over and over and over . . . . . They do camps in the woods for the young ones and listen to the class every year. It's not even on video. I feel so bad for them.
Yes, they're still running it. Over and over and over . . . . . They do camps in the woods for the young ones and listen to the class every year. It's not even on video. I feel so bad for them.
Really?!!! How creepy is that? How does a teenager invite a friend to sit in the middle of the woods and listen to a dead guy tell corny jokes? Talk about social suicide. Sad, truly sad.
Disclaimer: I never met Chris Geer and do not owe him any money. Also, I am not a MOG (in TWI's view) nor do I play one on TV.
Does anyone know if CG charges for his class and how much?
JT
From what I've gathered here at GSC, he works at the wholesale level. His customers are the retail outlets who market the product. A franchise operation, if you will. A bit like what the big hamburger chains do. That keeps him one step removed and out of the spotlight. I think (personal opinion) that this is a path Wierwille was exploring in the very early days. (Mid 60's to mid 70's) I believe this may have been what his original intention may have been with WOW, Fellow Laborers and early Way Corps. Remember, the W.C. was originally designed to be two straight years of in-residence training, followed by a return to their previous venues. For what ever reason, Wierwille scrapped that plan and redirected his efforts into developing his intense indoctrination program that became the new and improved Way Corps. In fact, as an enticement to WC enrollment, some Fellow Laborers were offered a one year apprenticeship credit for their final year and successful graduation from the F.L. program
Perhaps Wierwille was too impatient or lusted for the control and power that resulted from the centralization of company operations. I don't know. That's purely speculation on my part. On the other hand, maybe those two elements are not as critical to CG as they were to VPW.
that's my 2cents
edit
RE: WOW
This would mean that the actual running of classes was only the secondary goal of participants. The primary goal was to locate and enlist enthusiastic franchisees who would set up shop and perpetuate the business once their WOW year was over.
From what I've gathered here at GSC, he works at the wholesale level. His customers are the retail outlets who market the product. A franchise operation, if you will. A bit like what the big hamburger chains do. That keeps him one step removed and out of the spotlight.
Thanks Waysider. Does that mean he doesn't have his own operation? Only licenses his class to others? As an aside, is gun ownership a requirement for taking his class? ;-)
Thanks Waysider. Does that mean he doesn't have his own operation? Only licenses his class to others? As an aside, is gun ownership a requirement for taking his class? ;-)
JT
It means he still palms himself off as the last true defender of the true VP doctrine...
Thanks Waysider. Does that mean he doesn't have his own operation? Only licenses his class to others? As an aside, is gun ownership a requirement for taking his class? ;-)
JT
Chris just provides the classes and his new advanced class books. Most people who are in those circles haven't seen him at all since the way. Maybe around 2002 our fellowship tried to run one but they required us to start a registered corporation so the checks could be made out to a business checking account. They also have special forms that you have to fill out with a waiver. They give you gold stars in the front of your syllabus every time you do WIGP and you need so many to take their intermediate class. I don't know all the details because we didn't go through the trouble. I heard that for a while the Chicago area couldn't run classes after Rev. Guiarini died because no one was ordained . . . It's clear that he uses the class as a means of keeping all the groups that run it in line. They aren't all the same organization though. Also, the groups that run his classes are into WC's green and black book (which are actually pretty decent if you're into that sort of thing). He's not part of the same group though. In all the WIGP groups there's people who have been kicked out or told they couldn't run a fellowship for some reason or another. There's no shouting or sexual abuse, but they tend to be very persuasive and have a way of keeping everyone on exactly the same page. It doesn't feel like there's anyone in charge when you're in the groups but some how the men of God all agree on everything . . .
Chris just provides the classes and his new advanced class books. Most people who are in those circles haven't seen him at all since the way. Maybe around 2002 our fellowship tried to run one but they required us to start a registered corporation so the checks could be made out to a business checking account. They also have special forms that you have to fill out with a waiver. They give you gold stars in the front of your syllabus every time you do WIGP and you need so many to take their intermediate class. I don't know all the details because we didn't go through the trouble. I heard that for a while the Chicago area couldn't run classes after Rev. Guiarini died because no one was ordained . . . It's clear that he uses the class as a means of keeping all the groups that run it in line. They aren't all the same organization though. Also, the groups that run his classes are into WC's green and black book (which are actually pretty decent if you're into that sort of thing). He's not part of the same group though. In all the WIGP groups there's people who have been kicked out or told they couldn't run a fellowship for some reason or another. There's no shouting or sexual abuse, but they tend to be very persuasive and have a way of keeping everyone on exactly the same page. It doesn't feel like there's anyone in charge when you're in the groups but some how the men of God all agree on everything . . .
I don't know him but that and other descriptions make him sound a bit disturbed. Holes up on Maine and sends out a newsletter? Copies an old class and puts it out as his own? It doesn't seem to fit the description of a minister. It's almost sad. What else does he have in this life?
I don't know him but that and other descriptions make him sound a bit disturbed. Holes up on Maine and sends out a newsletter? Copies an old class and puts it out as his own? It doesn't seem to fit the description of a minister. It's almost sad. What else does he have in this life?
Bishop,
Have you taken his class or in some way familiar?
JT
I never could rationalize taking it since I knew the doctrine and heard the class was very boring. I've had roommates, family members, etc who have though. It's just PFAL except a little more biblical and a lot less exciting.
It's just PFAL except a little more biblical and a lot less exciting.
LESS Exciting?!!! OMG. That's almost impossible to believe. My somewhat morbid curiosity is now taking over. I'd love to see a clip from it just to see what LESS boring that PFAL looks like.
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johnj
Chris Geer recently published a 2 book set, In the Footsteps of Patriarchs, Prophets, Believers and Kings, Vol 1 and 2. They are part of his Advanced class materials and were released before the class. He was working on a very long student guide and very long recorded class at the same time.
He still periodically publishes "Glimpses of Truth, A Journal of Christian Studies."
If you are wondering what a "Journal of Christian Studies" looks like... the Nov 2008 issue was a four page recounting of Joshua crossing the Jordan river and attacking Jericho. About two-thirds of that were simply quotations of the book of Joshua, so it says very little. If you've ever seen a true "Journal" in any discipline (theology, psychology, etc)... Geer's version is nothing whatsoever like them.
He lives in South Casco, Maine.
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Ham
what is "very long"? the vicster's class (36 hours) was more than long enough..
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Zshot
Huh... I am surprised that CG still has a following and hasn't faded off into obsecurity. He is/was more boring than the vpw.
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penworks
Thanks for the updates.
Geer's unquestioning dedication to VP doctrine is astounding...but not so suprising...as is most of the splinter groups' promoters. They show how powerful indoctrination can be. When critics scoff at the idea of mind control being a real issue in extremist groups, I think they're missing out on a good long look at examples like this...
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waysider
Absolutely!
"A hypocrite in all his might, so wrong in that he thinks he's right."
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Bishop
Yes, they're still running it. Over and over and over . . . . . They do camps in the woods for the young ones and listen to the class every year. It's not even on video. I feel so bad for them.
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JustThinking
Really?!!! How creepy is that? How does a teenager invite a friend to sit in the middle of the woods and listen to a dead guy tell corny jokes? Talk about social suicide. Sad, truly sad.
Disclaimer: I never met Chris Geer and do not owe him any money. Also, I am not a MOG (in TWI's view) nor do I play one on TV.
JT
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leafytwiglet
Snicker.
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JustThinking
Does anyone know if CG charges for his class and how much?
JT
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waysider
From what I've gathered here at GSC, he works at the wholesale level. His customers are the retail outlets who market the product. A franchise operation, if you will. A bit like what the big hamburger chains do. That keeps him one step removed and out of the spotlight. I think (personal opinion) that this is a path Wierwille was exploring in the very early days. (Mid 60's to mid 70's) I believe this may have been what his original intention may have been with WOW, Fellow Laborers and early Way Corps. Remember, the W.C. was originally designed to be two straight years of in-residence training, followed by a return to their previous venues. For what ever reason, Wierwille scrapped that plan and redirected his efforts into developing his intense indoctrination program that became the new and improved Way Corps. In fact, as an enticement to WC enrollment, some Fellow Laborers were offered a one year apprenticeship credit for their final year and successful graduation from the F.L. program
Perhaps Wierwille was too impatient or lusted for the control and power that resulted from the centralization of company operations. I don't know. That's purely speculation on my part. On the other hand, maybe those two elements are not as critical to CG as they were to VPW.
that's my 2cents
edit
RE: WOW
This would mean that the actual running of classes was only the secondary goal of participants. The primary goal was to locate and enlist enthusiastic franchisees who would set up shop and perpetuate the business once their WOW year was over.
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waysider
That's why we were encouraged to be selective in our recruitment efforts.
We were supposed to seek out people who would be potential "leadership material" (franchisees).
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JustThinking
Thanks Waysider. Does that mean he doesn't have his own operation? Only licenses his class to others? As an aside, is gun ownership a requirement for taking his class? ;-)
JT
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penworks
It means he still palms himself off as the last true defender of the true VP doctrine...
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Bishop
Chris just provides the classes and his new advanced class books. Most people who are in those circles haven't seen him at all since the way. Maybe around 2002 our fellowship tried to run one but they required us to start a registered corporation so the checks could be made out to a business checking account. They also have special forms that you have to fill out with a waiver. They give you gold stars in the front of your syllabus every time you do WIGP and you need so many to take their intermediate class. I don't know all the details because we didn't go through the trouble. I heard that for a while the Chicago area couldn't run classes after Rev. Guiarini died because no one was ordained . . . It's clear that he uses the class as a means of keeping all the groups that run it in line. They aren't all the same organization though. Also, the groups that run his classes are into WC's green and black book (which are actually pretty decent if you're into that sort of thing). He's not part of the same group though. In all the WIGP groups there's people who have been kicked out or told they couldn't run a fellowship for some reason or another. There's no shouting or sexual abuse, but they tend to be very persuasive and have a way of keeping everyone on exactly the same page. It doesn't feel like there's anyone in charge when you're in the groups but some how the men of God all agree on everything . . .
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JustThinking
I don't know him but that and other descriptions make him sound a bit disturbed. Holes up on Maine and sends out a newsletter? Copies an old class and puts it out as his own? It doesn't seem to fit the description of a minister. It's almost sad. What else does he have in this life?
Bishop,
Have you taken his class or in some way familiar?
JT
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Bishop
I never could rationalize taking it since I knew the doctrine and heard the class was very boring. I've had roommates, family members, etc who have though. It's just PFAL except a little more biblical and a lot less exciting.
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Ham
What I can't understand is why people still throw money of any denominations his way..
call it a "research project" of sorts..
suggestions or real world data others have gathered would be welcome here..
is it because he "rubbed elbows" with herr "holy greatness" or whatever?
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waysider
I wonder if the guy who shared P.T. Barnum's final hours ever got this kind of adulation.
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Bishop
The people in those fellowships need him to believe. The doctrine is propped up by know that men of God did the research. No Chris Geer, No Word.
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pawtucket
I took his class about 12 years ago. And I firmly believe his class to be the greatest cure of insomnia in the world today.
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skyrider
Yeah.....a chasm apart from those in the church epistles who hazarded their lives for the gospels' sake.
Sounds more like a dalai lama type of thing.
Except.......cgeer brought his handgun to the 1986 November clergy meeting.
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Bishop
Ya. I don't even KNOW he's alive. He could have sold his ministry and left the country or something. The money would keep coming in . . . .
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JustThinking
LESS Exciting?!!! OMG. That's almost impossible to believe. My somewhat morbid curiosity is now taking over. I'd love to see a clip from it just to see what LESS boring that PFAL looks like.
JT
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waysider
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