Why the purges?

[Ham]

And I think I got the answer.. or maybe part of it.

Liability.

an organization can be responsible for the actions of volunteers. And we were volunteers.

I think it was a PURELY corporate decision..

most volunteer organizations around here perform a background check of sorts.. whether one is criminal, has a history of drug or sex offenses, etc.

I think because of decades of loose, slip -shod work, to get a hold on accountability, it would have been an administrative nightmare.. the solution? Send the volunteers off for a myriad of "spiritual" reasons..

what do you think?

[waysider]

Honestly?

I don't think it was anything quite as logical as that.

It's sort of an exercise in futility to look for a logical explanation for illogical lunacy.

It's like when you see some news report of someone doing something particularly heinous and you ask yourself, "Why"?

Some things in TWI simply can't be explained other than to say that they were a bunch of wackos who made decisions based on delusion and fantasy.

[Ham]

Perhaps that explains it..

but really.. the only group they seem to lreally isten to is court and lawyers..

if there were no liability, the loyster would still be busy in the twi oval office of sorts..

lack of liability appears to be the path of least resistance..

maybe there's nothing to this.. but who knows..

[excathedra]

what the hell are we talking about now ?

[Ham]

maybe its just me..

but why did they purge people who seemed (to them) just a little "funny"?

I really think.. it wasn't "personal".. it was just business..

[Bramble]

Ninties: For a mini mog wannabe, finding fault was godly--it showed how very sharp they were. To be the first to hop on a person with fault--illness, marital problems, money problems--whatever--gave you mog points with your higher uppers. it made your underlings and peers cautious around you--power.

Bullies were rewarded. Weakness was anything they could ferrit out, and it was with the blessings of the heirachy. Weakness brings down strength.

All those people who were kicked out or fled were somebodies coup.

[Ham]

Right.. I agree. But I am considering that the motives for the "directives" from upper "leadership" to do so, were purely administrational.. purely "business"..

they'd already had at least one (or more) *ministers" on charges for various nasty acts..

you'd think they would have known before it even happened.. so much for "discerning of spirits" or something..

[Bolshevik]

If it were planned, which i don't believe at this point, they'd be ridding themselves of those who know too much and lightening the load. Maybe to change demographics and stories.

but I doubt it

leadership is just as deluded as the rank and file I think.

Edited June 4, 2009 by Bolshevik

[Ham]

I was looking at a FEMA course.. actually several the last couple of weeks.

one of the statements stood out to me. It was in a course about developing a volunteer organization. "How to avoid litigation?" The answer was.. "train your volunteers WELL.."

that's about the only chance a volunteer organization has..

[Ham]

twi has followed the austerity cries of the rest of corporate america.. and it is PURELY "senses knowledge"..

now I think they have followed the path of volunteer organizations..

I BET they perform background checks of possible marks (ahem, volunteers) nowadays..

to do so, with an existing organization of thousands of marks (ahem.. volunteers) would prove to be an administrative nightmare..

just a few thoughts..

[polar bear]

It had a lot do to with getting rid of the so called "weak" to get to a so called "healthy state" where the body would again start to grow. It was one of many "last ditch" efforts of a sinking ship.

[Ham]

Yes.. I agree entirely.. that was the reason given.. but I think the motive was far more "secular"..

or at least I am exploring that explanation.. it makes far more sense to me at the moment..

[Ham]

so.. what is the financial cost of a background check? I think it starts at fifty bucks.. and it only works for the most part if the volunteer isn't giving you an alias..

figure.. maybe at the most. five to ten thousand volunteers in the organization.. how else can they describe twiggies and such? It's a non profit organization.. supposed to provide some kind of service..and there are no members.. just "volunteers"..

I really don't think they felt they were obligated to pay the bill..

maybe there were insurance requirements..

who knows.. that's why I started this thread.. somebody knows more than me I'm sure..

[Ham]

at the best.. I feel *they* built an organization on the backs of individuals whom they could not REALLY trust..

that includes me.

[frank123lol]

Mr.Forehead,I think went off the deep end,extreme paranoia,ruled the day,there was a devil spirit around every corner.

The perfect ministry was falling apart.Someone must be blamed.They(twi)lost too much money to be any thing else.

We were not a liability,we were their cash cow.

[TheHighWay]

In my experience LCM functioned on whims he called "revelation". I really don't believe there was any "formal thought" or plan behind any of the purges, with the one exception of eliminating a large portion of way corps right after they declared 'full time' status for all... they very quickly realized they were in too deep and started cleaning house wherever they could. But all the rest of the purges: I genuinely think these were completely the result of Craig's paranoia after the fallout of POP.

He was so egotistical that he thought 'everyone' was backing him as prez, and when the truth hit him in the face he felt terribly betrayed. I don't think he ever got over it. After that, the attitude was "root 'em out before they can cause real problems within the household'.

[Bramble]

In my experience LCM functioned on whims he called "revelation". I really don't believe there was any "formal thought" or plan behind any of the purges, with the one exception of eliminating a large portion of way corps right after they declared 'full time' status for all... they very quickly realized they were in too deep and started cleaning house wherever they could. But all the rest of the purges: I genuinely think these were completely the result of Craig's paranoia after the fallout of POP.

He was so egotistical that he thought 'everyone' was backing him as prez, and when the truth hit him in the face he felt terribly betrayed. I don't think he ever got over it. After that, the attitude was "root 'em out before they can cause real problems within the household'.

That's how I see it, too. LCM was not a rational man, he worked by 'revelation'--whatever wild hair tickled him was straight from Gawg Almighty. He wanted the outward appearance of prosperity(abundance=money in TWI). He wanted good looks. Perfection was important, but it was outward perfection--any underlying crap didn't matter as long as it was hidden. Those people were valuable for marketing. The old, troubled or poor folk had no place in the one true household.

As far as background checks etc...for rank and file, would they have access to fingerprints and social security numbers? Jobs that require background checks require those.

[WordWolf]

There was more than one type of purge, so there was more than one type of reason.

In the "wonderland" threads, we found that vpw had occasionally (twice we know of) taken a Corps group,

and kicked them out. In the case of the "Zero Corps", he let some of them re-apply for the "First Corps".

(We don't know how many were offered this, nor how many, IF any, accepted.)

In the case of a later Corps, vpw told them they'd be re-accepted if they wrote out this big loyalty letter

and swore loyalty. "Most" of them did so.

That was a loyalty thing, for the corps, which affected a relatively small number of people.

The person it affected the MOST, however, was lcm who watched it happen.

In 1988-1989, lcm rose from his fog, and the first thing he did was demand an oath of loyalty to

him PERSONALLY. We know that's what he intended-PERSONALLY- because one of our posters phoned

him and asked him directly.

(Out There):"When I received the Loyalty letter in the mail I immediately called LCM and by some miracle

after leaving a message he actually called me back.

When I asked if this letter

was a call to blindly follow him

he said I had been doing this all along.

I then told him that's what he thinks he could 'kiss my @$$'.

I think I was dropped from the rolls of the Way Corps that next morning."

As I see it, lcm learned from vpw that you could demand an oath of loyalty of people, and that most of them

would fall in line if you did so.

lcm learned this incorrectly, since this wasn't UNIVERSAL- vpw demanded it of people who were already

personally loyal to HIM- they were in the Corps AND convinced (deceived) vpw was a godly minister doing

what God wanted. They were a pre-screened group most likely to swear an oath of loyalty to him.

In the case of lcm, he did it with a much LARGER group, not pre-screened. They were NOT convinced

he was a godly minister doing what God wanted- not necessarily, and certainly not to the degree they

thought that of vpw. My God, some people still think God would say of vpw (conman, rapist, pervert)

"This is my beloved son, in whom I am well-pleased."

(Something ONLY said of Jesus Christ HIMSELF.)

lcm got many responses carefully qualified, saying, approximately,

"I will stand with you as long as you stand on The Word."

Those people were fired. Everybody who didn't swear an oath of loyalty to lcm PERSONALLY and

WITHOUT QUALIFIER was fired. We know lcm thought people were supposed to

"BLINDLY FOLLOW HIM" and that was SUPPOSED TO BE THE STATUS QUO.

lcm didn't want leaders, he wanted mindless drones.

lcm actually expected the majority of twi leadership- the people he initially directed this towards-

to swear blind loyalty to him. But the people at the top, and thus all points coming downwards from

there- all knew at least a LITTLE about there being problems, being reasons to be hesitant to invest

blind loyalty in lcm in particular, even if they were likely to give blind loyalty in general.

(GSC has had recaps of what was known more recently, for the forgetful and the new arrivals.)

What happened? A lot of the top leadership- Regional, Limb/State, Territory, Branch, Corps,

WOW vets, Advanced grads- all refused to swear blind loyalty to lcm, so he fired them.

They all stayed in contact, since he fired nearly the entire twi framework, which largely remained

intact and did their thing without lcm raving at them. About 80% of the people who were in twi

before lcm drew his "line in the sand" left- 4 of every 5 people. The fastest way to see that was

to see that the attendance at the next ROA was 20% of the previous year, and many of those

people who DID attend were resolved this would be their LAST ROA.

================

After 1990 came more purges. The people who weren't blind followers had already left-

except for the people who served UNDER the blind followers who were actively deceived by them

as to what was going on. So the later purges were NOT about loyalty.

"Witnessing" was to be focused on people who had "all their teeth" and their own cars and so

on- effectively, people who had no needs, leaving only people who could be USED by twi and

not be expected to need things in return. So, new arrivals were being SCREENED before they

joined- which meant new arrivals arrived in MUCH smaller numbers.

As to purging the people who were still around, and purging the new arrivals, I think there

were lots of reasons, and the posts on this thread state them better than I could.

[Twinky]

Think WW says it all.

The purges were of those who wouldn't lockstep into whatever direction he was going. They questioned, or retained some shred of independence.

Reasons given for dismissing people were that

• they were "not meek to the Word" (= questioned leadership)
  
• they "did not believe" the word (inadequate believing, that's why they were sick/had debts/had "problem children")
  

Real reason is that their heads weren't (as The Forehead would put it) "stuck up some place the sun don't shine."

[Bolshevik]

could rosie's uber-boredom rituals be seen as a purge?

Edited June 4, 2009 by Bolshevik

[outintexas]

They didn't want to (or know how to) help people with significant problems. It was just easier to kick them out.

[Ham]

That's the kind of thing I'm talking about..

it was more than that I believe.. around here, I know people who were kicked out.. not because they HAD said problems, but simply because they had the potential of developing them..

they were as loyal as the winter is long in Michigan..

did the "trustees" really BELIEVE loy's madness? And staff. especially rosie, did she sincerely believe the insane mandates, or did she go along for corporate reasons?

No matter how one looks at it.. it was systematic..

1. Remove any high end staff who would not knee jerk at loy's request..

2. remove those who would not completely comply..

3. and when it came to the local scene.. a duplication of 1 and 2, but remove those who:

a. presented a possible threat

b. were a liability (sick, nuts, etc)

c. those who could POSSIBLY turn into said liability or threat..

d. those who they.. just could not figure out..

at least that's my perception..

[WordWolf]

Martin Niemoeller said:

"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out-

because I was not a communist.

Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out-

because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out-

because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out-

because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me-

and there was no one left to speak out for me."

[Bolshevik]

they came for me.

but not for purging

woulda been nice.

[frank123lol]

Those that they...could not figure out...

I feel that is where I fell into...

When I started to question door to door..They tried to turn it into an attack on

the fellowshgips wife..No I cried it aint her its your system its old wineskins..

Well.as my favorite fictional friend is fond of saying Its all I can stands I cant stands no more.

Good ole popeye smarter than your average cultist.....