I think it comes down to.. they simply don't know how to do anything else.
They will acknowledge, when it's convenient.. the abuse, the doctrinal error.. the practical error they were a part of in twi.. then turn around, and try to sell one the same set of stained goods, i.e. "da word, like it hasn't been known since the earth cooled"..
just don't have any other occupation they are good at I guess..
Yet in scripture they are saying to Jesus (paraphrased) I worked hard for you - let me in. Like they believe it. Unless, their last con is to try and con them. Some are wolves in sheeps clothing - I think they know they are a wolf. But these verses seemed to challange that.
15 "The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me [Moses] from among your own brothers. You must listen to him.
16 This is what you requested from the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly when you said, 'Let us not continue to hear the voice of the Lord our God or see this great fire any longer, so that we will not die! '
17 Then the Lord said to me, 'They have spoken well. 18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. I will put My words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. 19 I will hold accountable whoever does not listen to My words that he speaks in My name.
20 But the prophet who dares to speak in My name a message I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods-that prophet must die.'
21 You may say to yourself, 'How can we recognize a message the Lord has not spoken?' 22 When a prophet speaks in the Lord's name, and the message does not come true or is not fulfilled, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. The prophet has spoken it presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him.
Two responsibilities here:
A.The people are responsible to listen (and do) the words that the true prophet speaks. They will know this by whether the prophecy comes true (or not). So there is a objective, qualitative, standard.
B.The prophet must speak truly, at risk of his own life - and the scorn of the people.
So anyone who speaks for God must, sooner or later, see some of his prophecies come to pass - actual prophecies, not being "tuned in" to world events and being able to see what's coming in worldly terms. God gave us five senses to use, so that we could gain knowledge that way. Moses himself, for example, sent out spies into the Promised Land - he didn't just rely on "revelation" from God. But a long time before, in Exodus 7, there is the prediction of hornets driving out the occupants of the Promised Land, and the record of that fulfilment in Joshua 24. Weaknesses in an enemy' defences or structural buildings might be observable through the five senses - but the arrival of hornets?
If the "prophet" never sees anything coming to pass, he must wonder about the quality of his prophecies. And know that the people also wonder about the quality of the so-called prophecies. Unless, of course, the prophecy is so vague as to be meaningless (more along the "forthtelling" line than a prediction that the world will end in 1914 or that Christ will return in 2109 or whenever).
(Of course, VPW gave himself an "out" on that by saying that it was true whether or not it came to pass in his lifetime.)
And there are scores of prophets who spoke of the coming of the Messiah, but the child Jesus was not born for centuries or even millennia afterwards.
If the "prophet" never sees anything coming to pass, he must wonder about the quality of his prophecies. And know that the people also wonder about the quality of the so-called prophecies. Unless, of course, the prophecy is so vague as to be meaningless (more along the "forthtelling" line than a prediction that the world will end in 1914 or that Christ will return in 2109 or whenever).
Exactly.
That's why some of them become masters of ambiguity.
That requires deliberate effort, demonstrating their cognizance of the fraud.
More to the point, one wonders if "Prophet's" followers ever realize the awful truth.
Of course I believe it's all a shellgame. Finding a "true" prophet is akin to finding a leprechaun, faith healer, Feng Shui consultant, or honest hedge-fund manager. In other words, not likely...
15 "The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me [Moses] from among your own brothers. You must listen to him.
16 This is what you requested from the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly when you said, 'Let us not continue to hear the voice of the Lord our God or see this great fire any longer, so that we will not die! '
17 Then the Lord said to me, 'They have spoken well. 18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. I will put My words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. 19 I will hold accountable whoever does not listen to My words that he speaks in My name.
20 But the prophet who dares to speak in My name a message I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods-that prophet must die.'
21 You may say to yourself, 'How can we recognize a message the Lord has not spoken?' 22 When a prophet speaks in the Lord's name, and the message does not come true or is not fulfilled, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. The prophet has spoken it presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him.
Two responsibilities here:
A.The people are responsible to listen (and do) the words that the true prophet speaks. They will know this by whether the prophecy comes true (or not). So there is a objective, qualitative, standard.
B.The prophet must speak truly, at risk of his own life - and the scorn of the people.
So anyone who speaks for God must, sooner or later, see some of his prophecies come to pass - actual prophecies, not being "tuned in" to world events and being able to see what's coming in worldly terms. God gave us five senses to use, so that we could gain knowledge that way. Moses himself, for example, sent out spies into the Promised Land - he didn't just rely on "revelation" from God. But a long time before, in Exodus 7, there is the prediction of hornets driving out the occupants of the Promised Land, and the record of that fulfilment in Joshua 24. Weaknesses in an enemy' defences or structural buildings might be observable through the five senses - but the arrival of hornets?
If the "prophet" never sees anything coming to pass, he must wonder about the quality of his prophecies. And know that the people also wonder about the quality of the so-called prophecies. Unless, of course, the prophecy is so vague as to be meaningless (more along the "forthtelling" line than a prediction that the world will end in 1914 or that Christ will return in 2109 or whenever).
(Of course, VPW gave himself an "out" on that by saying that it was true whether or not it came to pass in his lifetime.)
And there are scores of prophets who spoke of the coming of the Messiah, but the child Jesus was not born for centuries or even millennia afterwards.
At least you covered both sides. True it is, sometimes a prophet might only be used one time by the Lord God to give a particular revelation, but it isn't scheduled to be brought into existence until 400 more years. So what's a prophet to do? They might very well be considered laughable and derided because year after year goes by and nothing is happening at all. This alone doesn't decree the falseness of a prophet. Their lifestyles should be exemplary as well. For example, in Elijah's day, was the prophet a junior student under Elijah or running amok on his own?
More to the point, one wonders if "Prophet's" followers ever realize the awful truth.
Of course I believe it's all a shellgame. Finding a "true" prophet is akin to finding a leprechaun, faith healer, Feng Shui consultant, or honest hedge-fund manager. In other words, not likely...
The thing that struck me when I started looking at this topic in light of my time with TWI was that false teachers bring in damnable heresies. That is something to truly consider given our shared history.
Sorry if this is a bit off topic of prophets?? The last bolded paragraph deals with the why. . . but money is also the issue of why. For gain.
They are actually enemies of God.
Just a few things from the article.
"Warnings run throughout the Old and New Testaments because God knows His people can be led astray by false teaching if they aren't properly prepared for it. Also false teaching victimizes those who have never embraced the truth because they come under the illusion that they have found it. We are thus reminded of the danger of false teaching.
They teach otherwise. . .
The Greek word translated "teach otherwise" is heteros didaskalia, a heterodox teaching rather than an orthodox teaching."
False teachers are marked by an attitude of pride. The Greek word translated "proud" (tuphoomai--also used in 1 Tim. 3:6) speaks of being engulfed in smoke. Here the perfect passive form is used, which means they're in a settled state of being engulfed in their own smoke.
False teachers are invariably arrogant. . . . . An arrogant person is inflated with his own sense of self-importance. Peter says false teachers are so arrogant, "they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties" (2 Peter 2:10). Rather, they speak "out arrogant words of vanity". Jude says they reject authority (v. 8) and speak arrogantly (v. 16).. . . .
"Knowing nothing."
It doesn't matter how many Ph.D.'s or how much training such people have; they still don't know anything (1 Tim. 1:7). But they are inflated over what they think they know. They parade their imagined intelligence, scholarship, superior understanding, deeper insights, and religious acumen, but the truth is they are ignorant.
"Doting about questions and disputes of words."
The Greek text could be translated this way: "Having a sick craving for questions and word battles." They have a disease--a morbid preoccupation with useless questions and word battles. They make a fuss about terminology. The Greek word translated "questions" (z[ma]et[ma]esis, means "idle speculations." It is nothing more than pseudo-intellectual theorizing.
They also get into "disputes of words" (Gk., logomachia, "word battles"). They battle each other over terminology. Their minds know nothing, so they engage themselves in battles over semantics that won't get anywhere.
"Men of corrupt minds."
False teachers have unregenerate minds--minds that have never been transformed. In Romans 8:7 Paul says their "carnal mind is enmity against God." It's filled with earthly wisdom that fights against God (James 3:15; 4:4). In Romans 1:28 Paul says, "God gave them over to a reprobate mind." Their mental faculties don't function in the moral or spiritual realm. They do not react positively to truth. In 1 Corinthians 2:14 Paul calls them natural men who "receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God." The pathological source of their disease is a corrupt mind. The deadly virus of ignorant, damning words comes out of an evil mind. They don't understand God and they can't understand truth. Ephesians 4:18 says their understanding is darkened, and is alienated from God. Colossians 1:21 says they are "alienated and enemies in [their] mind by wicked works."
False teachers possess alienated, wicked, darkened, and corrupt minds. They've never been transformed. They have not received the mind of Christ (1 Cor. 2:16). They may have many theological degrees, and may be involved in religious activities, but their minds are corrupt."
Yet in scripture they are saying to Jesus (paraphrased) I worked hard for you - let me in. Like they believe it. Unless, their last con is to try and con them. Some are wolves in sheeps clothing - I think they know they are a wolf. But these verses seemed to challange that.
I believe also that they know they are wolves. Do they see their own clothing they are wearing? Did they dress themselves? It appears to me they intentionally and knowingly made themselves to look like sheep with the intent on fooling people. (reminds me of Goldilocks, looking like grandma!)
And when they appear to give an answer for themselves, I don't think they are doing anything but trying to TEMPT, just as Satan did before God Himself (in Job). He knew better also!
However, there are still those who have nothing and just think they do. They are just plain ignorant and don't truly realize what the hell they are really doing. (fools) I'm just glad I am not the judge! They will be sorely disappointed when they are told, "I never knew you."!!
Powerful stuff here, all -- What an enormous responsibility have the prophets, whoever they are! Sometimes I wonder if there is mercy and grace available for them in the event they "blow it" and speak the wrong thing at times, as we all do.
To be very honest, I am not sure about all that. Sounds like LAW to me...and the verses quoted in this post about the "strictness" of these OT prophets' sayings ARE IN THE OT, under law. Do you suppose NT prophets have some "leeway" at times?
How about a "sub-thread" here, on "Do the prophets KNOW they are TRUE PROPHETS?" (Ha!)
I would love to hear others' "opinions" in this matter. Otherwise, who the hell would even desire such a "gift" these days? It would be akin to walking a greased tightrope without a net!
Kind of reminds me of the elder son in the parable of the prodigal son. you all know the parable: Younger son gets his inheritance, goes off and blows it all, is destitute and comes home wanting to just be a servant. He is repentant and knows he doesn't deserve spit. Father welcomes him home and throws a party. Elderly son, however, has stayed home, done all the right things, worked hard, and never got so much as one small party for himself and his friends. He is outraged. He won't come to the party, even though Dad begs him to join in the fun. "Look at all I've done for you that gives ME the right to what you've given this young wastral! I've EARNED it by WHAT I'VE DONE FOR YOU!
If you read in Luke 15 the son never does come in. He figures he's manipulated Dad into owing him.
So too these false prophets: They said all the right things, wore the right clothes, were seen in the right place at the right times, and looked and sounded and acted VERY religious. But they don't get to come to the party, either, because their words are false AND their hearts are in the wrong place!
The thing that struck me when I started looking at this topic in light of my time with TWI was that false teachers bring in damnable heresies. That is something to truly consider given our shared history.
Sorry if this is a bit off topic of prophets?? The last bolded paragraph deals with the why. . . but money is also the issue of why. For gain.
They are actually enemies of God.
Just a few things from the article.
"Warnings run throughout the Old and New Testaments because God knows His people can be led astray by false teaching if they aren't properly prepared for it. Also false teaching victimizes those who have never embraced the truth because they come under the illusion that they have found it. We are thus reminded of the danger of false teaching.
They teach otherwise. . .
The Greek word translated "teach otherwise" is heteros didaskalia, a heterodox teaching rather than an orthodox teaching."
False teachers are marked by an attitude of pride. The Greek word translated "proud" (tuphoomai--also used in 1 Tim. 3:6) speaks of being engulfed in smoke. Here the perfect passive form is used, which means they're in a settled state of being engulfed in their own smoke.
False teachers are invariably arrogant. . . . . An arrogant person is inflated with his own sense of self-importance. Peter says false teachers are so arrogant, "they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties" (2 Peter 2:10). Rather, they speak "out arrogant words of vanity". Jude says they reject authority (v. 8) and speak arrogantly (v. 16).. . . .
"Knowing nothing."
It doesn't matter how many Ph.D.'s or how much training such people have; they still don't know anything (1 Tim. 1:7). But they are inflated over what they think they know. They parade their imagined intelligence, scholarship, superior understanding, deeper insights, and religious acumen, but the truth is they are ignorant.
"Doting about questions and disputes of words."
The Greek text could be translated this way: "Having a sick craving for questions and word battles." They have a disease--a morbid preoccupation with useless questions and word battles. They make a fuss about terminology. The Greek word translated "questions" (z[ma]et[ma]esis, means "idle speculations." It is nothing more than pseudo-intellectual theorizing.
They also get into "disputes of words" (Gk., logomachia, "word battles"). They battle each other over terminology. Their minds know nothing, so they engage themselves in battles over semantics that won't get anywhere.
"Men of corrupt minds."
False teachers have unregenerate minds--minds that have never been transformed. In Romans 8:7 Paul says their "carnal mind is enmity against God." It's filled with earthly wisdom that fights against God (James 3:15; 4:4). In Romans 1:28 Paul says, "God gave them over to a reprobate mind." Their mental faculties don't function in the moral or spiritual realm. They do not react positively to truth. In 1 Corinthians 2:14 Paul calls them natural men who "receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God." The pathological source of their disease is a corrupt mind. The deadly virus of ignorant, damning words comes out of an evil mind. They don't understand God and they can't understand truth. Ephesians 4:18 says their understanding is darkened, and is alienated from God. Colossians 1:21 says they are "alienated and enemies in [their] mind by wicked works."
False teachers possess alienated, wicked, darkened, and corrupt minds. They've never been transformed. They have not received the mind of Christ (1 Cor. 2:16). They may have many theological degrees, and may be involved in religious activities, but their minds are corrupt."
Yet humbly speaking, you can have someone who brings a correction into a church, but yet it appears to be heresy.
Yet humbly speaking, you can have someone who brings a correction into a church, but yet it appears to be heresy.
Hi Bride,
Not quite sure how that fits within the context of false teachers/prophets? It actually does say they bring in damnable heresies. . . . which is very strong language. I take it to mean. . . . heresies which damn. In other words. . . being lead astray.
I think someone or a movement that is to correct error in the church would be something else entirely.
The Reformation. . . . for instance.
And yes. . . that was called heresy. At some point, we have to be familar enough with the genuine not to keep falling for the counterfeit. I hope!
...What are the results? A spiritual hybrid spider is released. This spider hatches viper eggs. The snake that is released from the egg leads to death with the implication that this death is a premature death. The evil words that are released from one’s mouth have a cascade affect that leads to the destruction of one’s life and other’s lives. Until the point of death, there are physical, mental and spiritual consequences that unravel a healthy life into a life of disorder, pain, and suffering. The roots of all of this can be generational. This evil permeates society. Deception is provoked to such an extent that those who are convicted of their sin and want to turn towards righteousness, become a victim to the verbal attacks of others....
HE says...I approached the woman and placed my hand over the Isle of Langerhans which is located on the top portion of the pancreas. As I suspected, I could feel the spider with its fangs inserted into the Isle of Langerhans. We agreed to pray against the spider....
And how many would actually answer the Lord with "We..."?
Ya know I never noticed "we" like that before. Is it a "legion" thing or are they all standing in a group to the right of heavens gate together or something...
So they have devised this prayer. Do they tell us what the words of this prayer are? No. But if you follow the links, you will find it takes you to a page where they will sell you a book of prayers.
What happened to "freely receive, freely give"?
They are teaching works, not heart; not the power of God, but the supposed power of words. Did you see the way he starts getting into the Hebrew and Greek meanings of words, just like the word-battles mentioned earlier in this thread, the things false prophets get into?
Did I miss the bit where he talks about the healing power of the Lord Jesus and the accomplishments of his death and resurrection?
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waysider
Personal opinion disclaimer
I think they know.
They are con men at heart.
Just like that guy who tries to sell you a car he knows was in Hurricane Katrina but conveniently neglects to mention it to you.
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Ham
I think it comes down to.. they simply don't know how to do anything else.
They will acknowledge, when it's convenient.. the abuse, the doctrinal error.. the practical error they were a part of in twi.. then turn around, and try to sell one the same set of stained goods, i.e. "da word, like it hasn't been known since the earth cooled"..
just don't have any other occupation they are good at I guess..
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Dot Matrix
Yet in scripture they are saying to Jesus (paraphrased) I worked hard for you - let me in. Like they believe it. Unless, their last con is to try and con them. Some are wolves in sheeps clothing - I think they know they are a wolf. But these verses seemed to challange that.
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Ham
I think you're on to something.. it's a con to the end..
on the other hand.. I loathe every single dispicible action or word that I can remember I rendered..
I hope the lord doesn't have the same words for me..
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cman
what's a prophet?
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TheInvisibleDan
My sentiment as well. But then, I don't have "prophet" in my resume, nor the desire to pull rabbits out of a hat.
My music is pretty grungy though. That might lose me a few flier miles.
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TheInvisibleDan
And how many would actually answer the Lord with "We..."?
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Twinky
Deuteronomy 18:
15 "The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me [Moses] from among your own brothers. You must listen to him.
16 This is what you requested from the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly when you said, 'Let us not continue to hear the voice of the Lord our God or see this great fire any longer, so that we will not die! '
17 Then the Lord said to me, 'They have spoken well. 18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. I will put My words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. 19 I will hold accountable whoever does not listen to My words that he speaks in My name.
20 But the prophet who dares to speak in My name a message I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods-that prophet must die.'
21 You may say to yourself, 'How can we recognize a message the Lord has not spoken?' 22 When a prophet speaks in the Lord's name, and the message does not come true or is not fulfilled, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. The prophet has spoken it presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him.
Two responsibilities here:
A.The people are responsible to listen (and do) the words that the true prophet speaks. They will know this by whether the prophecy comes true (or not). So there is a objective, qualitative, standard.
B.The prophet must speak truly, at risk of his own life - and the scorn of the people.
So anyone who speaks for God must, sooner or later, see some of his prophecies come to pass - actual prophecies, not being "tuned in" to world events and being able to see what's coming in worldly terms. God gave us five senses to use, so that we could gain knowledge that way. Moses himself, for example, sent out spies into the Promised Land - he didn't just rely on "revelation" from God. But a long time before, in Exodus 7, there is the prediction of hornets driving out the occupants of the Promised Land, and the record of that fulfilment in Joshua 24. Weaknesses in an enemy' defences or structural buildings might be observable through the five senses - but the arrival of hornets?
If the "prophet" never sees anything coming to pass, he must wonder about the quality of his prophecies. And know that the people also wonder about the quality of the so-called prophecies. Unless, of course, the prophecy is so vague as to be meaningless (more along the "forthtelling" line than a prediction that the world will end in 1914 or that Christ will return in 2109 or whenever).
(Of course, VPW gave himself an "out" on that by saying that it was true whether or not it came to pass in his lifetime.)
And there are scores of prophets who spoke of the coming of the Messiah, but the child Jesus was not born for centuries or even millennia afterwards.
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waysider
Exactly.
That's why some of them become masters of ambiguity.
That requires deliberate effort, demonstrating their cognizance of the fraud.
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George Aar
More to the point, one wonders if "Prophet's" followers ever realize the awful truth.
Of course I believe it's all a shellgame. Finding a "true" prophet is akin to finding a leprechaun, faith healer, Feng Shui consultant, or honest hedge-fund manager. In other words, not likely...
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cman
I don't believe it's about foretelling.
Nor do I think it exists as in stating some future event.
A prophet is more then I once thought.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophet
That's just part of it I think.
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brideofjc
At least you covered both sides. True it is, sometimes a prophet might only be used one time by the Lord God to give a particular revelation, but it isn't scheduled to be brought into existence until 400 more years. So what's a prophet to do? They might very well be considered laughable and derided because year after year goes by and nothing is happening at all. This alone doesn't decree the falseness of a prophet. Their lifestyles should be exemplary as well. For example, in Elijah's day, was the prophet a junior student under Elijah or running amok on his own?
I DID!
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cman
i think it just says listen
not obey
no more blind obedience for me
though i could see in part or enough to 'do'
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geisha779
Here is a breakdown on the pathology of false teachers/prophets if anyone is interested.
http://www.biblebb.com/files/MAC/sg54-45.htm
The thing that struck me when I started looking at this topic in light of my time with TWI was that false teachers bring in damnable heresies. That is something to truly consider given our shared history.
Sorry if this is a bit off topic of prophets?? The last bolded paragraph deals with the why. . . but money is also the issue of why. For gain.
They are actually enemies of God.
Just a few things from the article.
"Warnings run throughout the Old and New Testaments because God knows His people can be led astray by false teaching if they aren't properly prepared for it. Also false teaching victimizes those who have never embraced the truth because they come under the illusion that they have found it. We are thus reminded of the danger of false teaching.
They teach otherwise. . .
The Greek word translated "teach otherwise" is heteros didaskalia, a heterodox teaching rather than an orthodox teaching."
False teachers are marked by an attitude of pride. The Greek word translated "proud" (tuphoomai--also used in 1 Tim. 3:6) speaks of being engulfed in smoke. Here the perfect passive form is used, which means they're in a settled state of being engulfed in their own smoke.
False teachers are invariably arrogant. . . . . An arrogant person is inflated with his own sense of self-importance. Peter says false teachers are so arrogant, "they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties" (2 Peter 2:10). Rather, they speak "out arrogant words of vanity". Jude says they reject authority (v. 8) and speak arrogantly (v. 16).. . . .
"Knowing nothing."
It doesn't matter how many Ph.D.'s or how much training such people have; they still don't know anything (1 Tim. 1:7). But they are inflated over what they think they know. They parade their imagined intelligence, scholarship, superior understanding, deeper insights, and religious acumen, but the truth is they are ignorant.
"Doting about questions and disputes of words."
The Greek text could be translated this way: "Having a sick craving for questions and word battles." They have a disease--a morbid preoccupation with useless questions and word battles. They make a fuss about terminology. The Greek word translated "questions" (z[ma]et[ma]esis, means "idle speculations." It is nothing more than pseudo-intellectual theorizing.
They also get into "disputes of words" (Gk., logomachia, "word battles"). They battle each other over terminology. Their minds know nothing, so they engage themselves in battles over semantics that won't get anywhere.
"Men of corrupt minds."
False teachers have unregenerate minds--minds that have never been transformed. In Romans 8:7 Paul says their "carnal mind is enmity against God." It's filled with earthly wisdom that fights against God (James 3:15; 4:4). In Romans 1:28 Paul says, "God gave them over to a reprobate mind." Their mental faculties don't function in the moral or spiritual realm. They do not react positively to truth. In 1 Corinthians 2:14 Paul calls them natural men who "receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God." The pathological source of their disease is a corrupt mind. The deadly virus of ignorant, damning words comes out of an evil mind. They don't understand God and they can't understand truth. Ephesians 4:18 says their understanding is darkened, and is alienated from God. Colossians 1:21 says they are "alienated and enemies in [their] mind by wicked works."
False teachers possess alienated, wicked, darkened, and corrupt minds. They've never been transformed. They have not received the mind of Christ (1 Cor. 2:16). They may have many theological degrees, and may be involved in religious activities, but their minds are corrupt."
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spectrum49
Dot said...
Yet in scripture they are saying to Jesus (paraphrased) I worked hard for you - let me in. Like they believe it. Unless, their last con is to try and con them. Some are wolves in sheeps clothing - I think they know they are a wolf. But these verses seemed to challange that.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I believe also that they know they are wolves. Do they see their own clothing they are wearing? Did they dress themselves? It appears to me they intentionally and knowingly made themselves to look like sheep with the intent on fooling people. (reminds me of Goldilocks, looking like grandma!)
And when they appear to give an answer for themselves, I don't think they are doing anything but trying to TEMPT, just as Satan did before God Himself (in Job). He knew better also!
However, there are still those who have nothing and just think they do. They are just plain ignorant and don't truly realize what the hell they are really doing. (fools) I'm just glad I am not the judge! They will be sorely disappointed when they are told, "I never knew you."!!
=================================================================
Powerful stuff here, all -- What an enormous responsibility have the prophets, whoever they are! Sometimes I wonder if there is mercy and grace available for them in the event they "blow it" and speak the wrong thing at times, as we all do.
To be very honest, I am not sure about all that. Sounds like LAW to me...and the verses quoted in this post about the "strictness" of these OT prophets' sayings ARE IN THE OT, under law. Do you suppose NT prophets have some "leeway" at times?
How about a "sub-thread" here, on "Do the prophets KNOW they are TRUE PROPHETS?" (Ha!)
I would love to hear others' "opinions" in this matter. Otherwise, who the hell would even desire such a "gift" these days? It would be akin to walking a greased tightrope without a net!
SPEC
:)
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Watered Garden
Kind of reminds me of the elder son in the parable of the prodigal son. you all know the parable: Younger son gets his inheritance, goes off and blows it all, is destitute and comes home wanting to just be a servant. He is repentant and knows he doesn't deserve spit. Father welcomes him home and throws a party. Elderly son, however, has stayed home, done all the right things, worked hard, and never got so much as one small party for himself and his friends. He is outraged. He won't come to the party, even though Dad begs him to join in the fun. "Look at all I've done for you that gives ME the right to what you've given this young wastral! I've EARNED it by WHAT I'VE DONE FOR YOU!
If you read in Luke 15 the son never does come in. He figures he's manipulated Dad into owing him.
So too these false prophets: They said all the right things, wore the right clothes, were seen in the right place at the right times, and looked and sounded and acted VERY religious. But they don't get to come to the party, either, because their words are false AND their hearts are in the wrong place!
WG
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brideofjc
Yet humbly speaking, you can have someone who brings a correction into a church, but yet it appears to be heresy.
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cman
yeah, funny ain't it
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geisha779
Hi Bride,
Not quite sure how that fits within the context of false teachers/prophets? It actually does say they bring in damnable heresies. . . . which is very strong language. I take it to mean. . . . heresies which damn. In other words. . . being lead astray.
I think someone or a movement that is to correct error in the church would be something else entirely.
The Reformation. . . . for instance.
And yes. . . that was called heresy. At some point, we have to be familar enough with the genuine not to keep falling for the counterfeit. I hope!
Kind of a big topic given our history. :)
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Dot Matrix
Well what do you think about this?
The spiritual spider? I think it is a figure of speech perhaps, and instead, these people FEEL his fangs?
Literally?
What do you think? I wrote the person who sent me this because I feel as a watchman it needed to be addressed
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Dot Matrix
http://aslansplace.com/articles/?0000000048
...What are the results? A spiritual hybrid spider is released. This spider hatches viper eggs. The snake that is released from the egg leads to death with the implication that this death is a premature death. The evil words that are released from one’s mouth have a cascade affect that leads to the destruction of one’s life and other’s lives. Until the point of death, there are physical, mental and spiritual consequences that unravel a healthy life into a life of disorder, pain, and suffering. The roots of all of this can be generational. This evil permeates society. Deception is provoked to such an extent that those who are convicted of their sin and want to turn towards righteousness, become a victim to the verbal attacks of others....
HE says...I approached the woman and placed my hand over the Isle of Langerhans which is located on the top portion of the pancreas. As I suspected, I could feel the spider with its fangs inserted into the Isle of Langerhans. We agreed to pray against the spider....
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Dot Matrix
Not a false prophet stuff but odd maybe belongs on a new thread
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Dot Matrix
Ya know I never noticed "we" like that before. Is it a "legion" thing or are they all standing in a group to the right of heavens gate together or something...
Boy, that grabs me
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Twinky
A strange article, Dot...
So they have devised this prayer. Do they tell us what the words of this prayer are? No. But if you follow the links, you will find it takes you to a page where they will sell you a book of prayers.
What happened to "freely receive, freely give"?
They are teaching works, not heart; not the power of God, but the supposed power of words. Did you see the way he starts getting into the Hebrew and Greek meanings of words, just like the word-battles mentioned earlier in this thread, the things false prophets get into?
Did I miss the bit where he talks about the healing power of the Lord Jesus and the accomplishments of his death and resurrection?
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