These guys are all charletons. If they could really divine secrets, why don't they go to the racetrack and make a fortune? Or really tell the police who killed who, or who stole what, or who's planning on doing such things?
The truth is, no "psychic" or "fortune teller", or "sensitive" has ever proven that they can divine anything, though they ALWAYS claim they have.
With gimps like the one you talked to, they use well-worked methods of "cold" reading, or sometimes "hot" reading, or maybe a combination of the two. You can read about how these methods are used here:
http://www.ianrowland.com/ from a guy who makes a living doing readings (and then explaining how he did what he did).
Basically John Edward and other such geeks utilized a mildly sophisticated variation of the game of "twenty question" to do their "readings". They offer up banal, content-free "information" to elicit responses from their marks. (I'm getting a "B", does that mean anything to you?) And in return their "clients" respond with often more information than they're even aware. The responses are incorporated into the "readings" and fed back to the marks, often to amazed shreiks.
By working with people who are usually already emotionally distraught, and by firing NUMEROUS questions and reading both verbal and bodily responses VERY closely, the moderately talented "psychic" can usually muster up a passable "reading", especially if his mark is already predisposed to believing in the schtick.
I think the vast majority of them are hucksters. If there were any "psychics" utilizing real spiritual power of some sort which they perceive as a gift, they probably would not be doing it in a show business environment, such as radio. There may be the odd "real" spiritual mediums in remote places, but the famous ones are usually phony. If you are seeking guidance, why not go to the source - the true God?
I dunno. I wouldn't chalk it up to a hundred percent hucksterism.. maybe somebody's got "something".. but once they slap a greasy price tag on it, I think it practically immediately turns into snake oil..
Talented magicians amaze too sometimes, but they aren't really doing what they appear to be doing. They just get your mind to believe they are doing it. Same can of worms.
There's got to be "some truth" to what they do or people wouldn't go back.
My sister had a very eerie reading the one and only time she went: "You have two women: 'K' and 'B' in your life. One has left and one will be back."
She interpreted 'K' as our mother - who's name is Kay. (My mother had my sisters when she was teenager and gave them up for adoption.) My sister hadn't yet connected with our mother at the time of the reading. She met up with her about 6 months or so later...
Her adoptive mother's name was Bea - and she interpreted that as the 'B' in the reading. Bea had just died a month or so before the reading.
What's the chances of that? You could say that the chances of two family names being in the 26-letters of the alphabet are pretty good but what's the chances that those names are phonetically the same as those letters? (Bea = B, Kay = K)
So there's some truth to it; there has to be. Just like with a religion or anything else you're expected to buy into....
Keep in mind we're here now because we once put our belief in something/someone who claimed to have a stranglehold on the Truth.
There's got to be "some truth" to what they do or people wouldn't go back.
No there doesn't. There just needs to be a modicum of credulity on the part of the "marks". Conmen DEPEND on that to make a living.
My sister had a very eerie reading the one and only time she went: "You have two women: 'K' and 'B' in your life. One has left and one will be back."
O.K. two "women". WHICH women? If the psychic had specified that these women were her mother and stepmother, I'd be somewhat more impressed. But what if she had a cousin named "Kay" and a bestfriend named "Bea", that would've still convinced you there was a "hit" wouldn't it? Maybe a neighbor, or a babysitter, or the checker at the grocery store she frequents. There's a LOT of people in our lives. And there's only 26 letters in the alphbet. Ever wonder why the psychics never throw out letters like "X" or "O" or "Z"? Usually it's letters like your sister got, or "M" or "J". Or they'll even throw out rather common names like "Mary", "Steven", "Kathy" and such. Who couldn't come up with a connection to someone with a name like that. Especially if they WANT to.
She interpreted 'K' as our mother - who's name is Kay. (My mother had my sisters when she was teenager and gave them up for adoption.) My sister hadn't yet connected with our mother at the time of the reading. She met up with her about 6 months or so later...
Her adoptive mother's name was Bea - and she interpreted that as the 'B' in the reading. Bea had just died a month or so before the reading.
What's the chances of that? You could say that the chances of two family names being in the 26-letters of the alphabet are pretty good but what's the chances that those names are phonetically the same as those letters? (Bea = B, Kay = K)
But if she knew their names, why didn't she SAY so? Isn't it more likely that you and your sister are doing the psychic's work for her by ascribing meaning to random letters she's throwing out?
So there's some truth to it; there has to be. Just like with a religion or anything else you're expected to buy into....
NO, there doesn't HAVE to be. Just like with a magician's tricks, the whole appeal is that the untrained observer CAN be fooled. How many women do you 'spose have been cut in half during magic acts and died a horrible death? Not many, I'd bet. Why? Because there's no truth in it. It's an ACT.
Keep in mind we're here now because we once put our belief in something/someone who claimed to have a stranglehold on the Truth.
AMEN! My point exactly. We should be even MORE cautious about accepting unverifiable nonsense as we've already shown a capability for being overly credulous.
I think the personal prophecy that CES spirit and truth ministy was doing in the 90's sound exactly like what you describe.
i never believed in it myself.
they used to "practice" have sessions where one would guess at predicting what the others life would be like in the future.
sometimes people would say but I do not know anyone by that name and I never wanted to go to africa and they would insist they were right and it is the reciever feeble mind unabe to understand the words from God given to them !
George - I really hope you enjoyed that argument with yourself...
By the way, the words "there has to be some truth to it" comes from the Advanced Class, for cryin' out loud. It doesn't mean that I agree with it - good grief - I can't imagine having the energy you put into your "rebuttal" of my post.
George - I really hope you enjoyed that argument with yourself...
By the way, the words "there has to be some truth to it" comes from the Advanced Class, for cryin' out loud. It doesn't mean that I agree with it - good grief - I can't imagine having the energy you put into your "rebuttal" of my post.
I really wasn't trying to be argumentative (though, I have been known to be). Sorry you took it that way.
Mostly I'm just so disgusted by the whole "talk with the dead" scammers, that I feel the need to expose the (what I feel to be) immoral, predatory, snakeoil for what it is. I find it almost unbelieveable that there are people who are so conscienceless as to take advantage of others when they're at their most vulnerable.
Watching John Edward or Sylvia Browne work one of their marks with their flimsy "Oh, I'm getting a 'b'" blather, and ultimately telling them nothing they didn't know already - while making serious inroads on their bank accounts - just makes my blood boil.
Yeah, they perform an act that some (usually distraught and unguarded) folks find compelling. But when you see how the act is done, the "magic" disappears and their real intentions become obvious...
Oh, and just for sport, Google the Criss Angel "walk through glass" trick to see how it's done. A really amazing illusion like that (and not unlike "talking with the dead"), though really compelling, becomes ever so flakey once you see how it's done.
Again I'd recommend Ian Rowland's act to anyone who still has some confidence that the necromancers among us have any credibility whatsoever...
f you don't want to google here is a excellent expose/tutorial on the trick
Window trick revealed
Im a glass guy, I have tapped thousands of windows and pieces of glass to check how they are set in their openings.
In the first video at the very beginning when Angel is tapping the glass there is a telltale "rattle" to the sound of the glass. Its a very subtle sound but any glassman would pick it up, The glass is notsolid in its opening.
Its hard to explain but if you tap your window and it is solidly set it will more of a "ping" sound.
It sounds like the glass was set in runners which need at least a little space on for the glass to be movable ( at least 1/32" on each side), When the glass is tapped thats the sound you hear, it is vibrating against those runners.
The only giveaway to the average Joe (besides the shutting the door :blink: ) would be the reflections on the window shimmering very very slightly as the glass moves, but he kept all the spectators 15 feet away and they were misdirected anyway
Very clever but easily doable.
If anyone wants one of these trick storefronts built I'll be glad to build it for you.
Geo. do you want to take up amazing people with your superpowers?
Recommended Posts
George Aar
These guys are all charletons. If they could really divine secrets, why don't they go to the racetrack and make a fortune? Or really tell the police who killed who, or who stole what, or who's planning on doing such things?
The truth is, no "psychic" or "fortune teller", or "sensitive" has ever proven that they can divine anything, though they ALWAYS claim they have.
With gimps like the one you talked to, they use well-worked methods of "cold" reading, or sometimes "hot" reading, or maybe a combination of the two. You can read about how these methods are used here:
http://www.ianrowland.com/ from a guy who makes a living doing readings (and then explaining how he did what he did).
Basically John Edward and other such geeks utilized a mildly sophisticated variation of the game of "twenty question" to do their "readings". They offer up banal, content-free "information" to elicit responses from their marks. (I'm getting a "B", does that mean anything to you?) And in return their "clients" respond with often more information than they're even aware. The responses are incorporated into the "readings" and fed back to the marks, often to amazed shreiks.
By working with people who are usually already emotionally distraught, and by firing NUMEROUS questions and reading both verbal and bodily responses VERY closely, the moderately talented "psychic" can usually muster up a passable "reading", especially if his mark is already predisposed to believing in the schtick.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
RumRunner
Right up there with drunk Vic's "snow on the gas pumps" story. Once you buy in - well you joint a cult
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mark Clarke
I think the vast majority of them are hucksters. If there were any "psychics" utilizing real spiritual power of some sort which they perceive as a gift, they probably would not be doing it in a show business environment, such as radio. There may be the odd "real" spiritual mediums in remote places, but the famous ones are usually phony. If you are seeking guidance, why not go to the source - the true God?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
CBS has a popular show called The Mentalist.
The lead character is someone who once made his living pretending to have special powers.
http://www.cbs.com/primetime/the_mentalist/about/
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
I dunno. I wouldn't chalk it up to a hundred percent hucksterism.. maybe somebody's got "something".. but once they slap a greasy price tag on it, I think it practically immediately turns into snake oil..
Link to comment
Share on other sites
OperaBuff
Talented magicians amaze too sometimes, but they aren't really doing what they appear to be doing. They just get your mind to believe they are doing it. Same can of worms.
Wherever you go Hopefull, be where you are.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
Talk about theatrics----
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ChasUFarley
There's got to be "some truth" to what they do or people wouldn't go back.
My sister had a very eerie reading the one and only time she went: "You have two women: 'K' and 'B' in your life. One has left and one will be back."
She interpreted 'K' as our mother - who's name is Kay. (My mother had my sisters when she was teenager and gave them up for adoption.) My sister hadn't yet connected with our mother at the time of the reading. She met up with her about 6 months or so later...
Her adoptive mother's name was Bea - and she interpreted that as the 'B' in the reading. Bea had just died a month or so before the reading.
What's the chances of that? You could say that the chances of two family names being in the 26-letters of the alphabet are pretty good but what's the chances that those names are phonetically the same as those letters? (Bea = B, Kay = K)
So there's some truth to it; there has to be. Just like with a religion or anything else you're expected to buy into....
Keep in mind we're here now because we once put our belief in something/someone who claimed to have a stranglehold on the Truth.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
George Aar
Link to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
More Criss Angel--
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oilfieldmedic
Quoting Mark here... "If you are seeking guidance, why not go to the source - the true God?"
Brilliant Mark...What a concept!!!!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
pond
I think the personal prophecy that CES spirit and truth ministy was doing in the 90's sound exactly like what you describe.
i never believed in it myself.
they used to "practice" have sessions where one would guess at predicting what the others life would be like in the future.
sometimes people would say but I do not know anyone by that name and I never wanted to go to africa and they would insist they were right and it is the reciever feeble mind unabe to understand the words from God given to them !
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ron G.
I watched John Edwards on the Sci Fi channel until they replaced him with pro wrestling.
I think that, in and of itself, says it all.
Maybe Edwards or some other psychic can tell us what wrestling has to do with Science fiction...I know I'm baffled by it.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
Of all things, I think both the problem of cold-reading, as well as how it works,
was illustrated quite well in South Park's episode about John Edwards.
You can see it here:
http://www.allsp.com/
It's season 6, episode 15, "The Biggest Douche in the Universe."
(The episode was named after John Edwards.)
Penn and Teller also exposed this.
I don't have a link for them. However, they agreed John Edwards
is the biggest douche in the universe.
(Here's another link for the same episode:)
http://www.southparkzone.com/episodes/615/...e-Universe.html
Link to comment
Share on other sites
doojable
Hopeful - here's what a good friend of mine said to a "witch" when we were in college:
"Either it's all a lie and you're wasting your time; or it's all true and you're talking with the dead. Either way, there's no good choice."
IMHO - there are much better ways to make a decision.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Hopefull
Thanks for your responses- I renewed my mind!! (not really, but now I have perspective).
That South Park episode was soooo good!!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mark Clarke
Well, said, Dooj!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ChasUFarley
George - I really hope you enjoyed that argument with yourself...
By the way, the words "there has to be some truth to it" comes from the Advanced Class, for cryin' out loud. It doesn't mean that I agree with it - good grief - I can't imagine having the energy you put into your "rebuttal" of my post.
Edited by ChasUFarleyLink to comment
Share on other sites
George Aar
I really wasn't trying to be argumentative (though, I have been known to be). Sorry you took it that way.
Mostly I'm just so disgusted by the whole "talk with the dead" scammers, that I feel the need to expose the (what I feel to be) immoral, predatory, snakeoil for what it is. I find it almost unbelieveable that there are people who are so conscienceless as to take advantage of others when they're at their most vulnerable.
Watching John Edward or Sylvia Browne work one of their marks with their flimsy "Oh, I'm getting a 'b'" blather, and ultimately telling them nothing they didn't know already - while making serious inroads on their bank accounts - just makes my blood boil.
Yeah, they perform an act that some (usually distraught and unguarded) folks find compelling. But when you see how the act is done, the "magic" disappears and their real intentions become obvious...
Link to comment
Share on other sites
George Aar
Oh, and just for sport, Google the Criss Angel "walk through glass" trick to see how it's done. A really amazing illusion like that (and not unlike "talking with the dead"), though really compelling, becomes ever so flakey once you see how it's done.
Again I'd recommend Ian Rowland's act to anyone who still has some confidence that the necromancers among us have any credibility whatsoever...
Link to comment
Share on other sites
leafytwiglet
If you don't want to google here is a excellent expose/tutorial on the trick
Window trick revealed
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
For those who arrived late, we discussed what happens when Christians do this sort of thing.
We had a chance to step right up and get our own personal prophecies.
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/ipb/index.ph...=12632&st=0
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
For those curious about cold-reading, here's more information than you'll want to read on the subject:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading
http://skepdic.com/coldread.html
http://www.randi.org/library/coldreading/
http://www.skeptics.com.au/articles/coldread.htm
http://www.wikihow.com/Cold-Read
http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/skep...q_skep_cold.htm
http://www.denisdutton.com/cold_reading.htm
http://skeptico.blogs.com/skeptico/2007/11...edward-jam.html
http://www.gladwell.com/2007/2007_11_12_a_profile.html
http://www.skepticreport.com/psychicpowers/confessions.htm
http://www.csicop.org/si/2003-07/rorschach.html
http://www.skepticfriends.org/forum/showqu...amp;fldAuto=198
http://www.skepticism.net/articles/2001/jo...ld-reading-gig/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forer_effect
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subjective_validation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias
Link to comment
Share on other sites
mstar1
Im a glass guy, I have tapped thousands of windows and pieces of glass to check how they are set in their openings.
In the first video at the very beginning when Angel is tapping the glass there is a telltale "rattle" to the sound of the glass. Its a very subtle sound but any glassman would pick it up, The glass is not solid in its opening.
Its hard to explain but if you tap your window and it is solidly set it will more of a "ping" sound.
It sounds like the glass was set in runners which need at least a little space on for the glass to be movable ( at least 1/32" on each side), When the glass is tapped thats the sound you hear, it is vibrating against those runners.
The only giveaway to the average Joe (besides the shutting the door :blink: ) would be the reflections on the window shimmering very very slightly as the glass moves, but he kept all the spectators 15 feet away and they were misdirected anyway
Very clever but easily doable.
If anyone wants one of these trick storefronts built I'll be glad to build it for you.
Geo. do you want to take up amazing people with your superpowers?
Edited by mstar1Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.