Wow Excie, I think you hit the nail on the head, that summation could be the exact way the cornfield huckster took to the road less traveled. Amazing, he had to have made a conscious decision to go the way he did. His whole life amounted to using the Lord's Name in vain. What a scumbucket!!
to serve your belly and worship yourself, and tell everyone "I worship YHWH and serve the Lord Jesus Christ!
I will teach you to worship YHWH and serve Jesus Christ!"
One thing a person could say for crowley.. he probably didn't have some kind of multi-personality disorder.
Claimed to be evil, wicked.. and he lived it.
The interesting thing is he STILL managed to have a few friends.. without covering up all of his blackness.
I think he was more "well adjusted" than vic, or even loy..
other than a little bit of sensationalism, I don't think crowley left very many curtains to be pulled back in his life..
he just appealed to a different kind of audience.
Some of the "religious" types I've confronted.. give the sheep's clothing a little poke.. they've growled and hissed..one of them, "DON'T YOU DARE TOUCH MY RIGHTEOUSNESS... growwwl, hisssss.. grrrrrrr.."
it's one of those distant memories, burned in my consciousness forever..
The terrible thing about a religious conman/woman is what they rip from the soul of the vulnerable person who humbly seeks the Lord.
There are many conmen/woman and I am sure most of us have seen "America’s Most Wanted" when they have shown a sweetheart swindler and felt for those poor “bewitched” people. And at the same time perhaps thought how you could NEVER be that stupid.
I guess it just depends how desperately you need something. Or how long you have wanted it and how long you have lived without it.
I had a man tell me that heart bandits usually hit on women who are a little over-weight. Maybe newly divorced and who have not had a compliment in years. They are still off kilter and so vulnerable. All you have to do is tell them they are pretty, make them feel loved and important and before you know it they are in “love”. They will believe anything, give generously, and put up with all kinds of crap for small verbal tokens of feigned affection.
“Good morning gorgeous.” “Let’s look at some houses on line and see where we would like to live.” “What do you want for your birthday?” “Oh, I am sorry, I forgot.” “Listen, I am a little short this month…” Then, if they tire of you they just cut and run - to the next mark.
Now add God to that.
“I was praying last night and I know you are the woman for me. God showed me a plan for our lives.” “God wants me to teach you about love” “God showed me, if we are going to be together you have to learn to submit to my voice.” and the like. Then, if and when one might tire of you -- "God told me to break up with you!" "God showed me you are not THE one." "You are not spiritual enough to support my ministry" and things of that ilk.
Or if your child is sick and you need divine healing, as the Doctors shake their heads and say there is no hope, and someone seeks you out as a target for money. It is all horrible. "God showed me I would be the one to heal your child. Did you tithe off the money you got from the land you sold to pay the hospital bill?"
But what is the worst, IMO, is it takes beautiful people who have tender hearts for a wonderful God and attacks the trust and the sweet childlike innocence of people who truly need help. And our wonderful God-- who CAN truly help them-- and REAL people --who truly do reach out their hand in loving faith-- get scoffed, mocked or discounted in the pile with the frauds.
We miss so much of the genuine because of the pain these counterfeits cause --it is nutty. It seems like we should rise up and say I do not care if 100 of you imbeciles send your snake oil, I still believe that there is a Jesus who loves me who has the genuine love and if I spend my whole life looking and still do not find “a group” I still know HE loves me. But somehow these snake oil salesman eat our internal organs when we are maimed and we forget to fight our way back up. Or we are too weary. And if we do not fight our way back up then all the Elmer Gantry’s, sweetheart swindlers and creeps everywhere win.
I don’t want them to win. Jesus not only died to give you a NEW life but he died for the pain that someday you would feel as a result of this stupid cult we were in. And all these Elmer’s win each time someone decides to fall and is too weak to stand again, or too hurt to try God’s love again because the fraud’s have convinced them it does not exist. This is what breaks my heart. When the Elmers convince people God is a mean God who is only interested in sex or money and is self serving. God is a God of love.
GOD LOVES YOU!!!! HE WOULD NEVER HURT ANY OF US!!!
Remember:
Let all things be tested; keep to what is good; Bible in Basic English
1 Thessalonians 5:21
The Christian test:
Mathew7:22-23
21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me,you evil doers!'
(What proves you are a Christian? hmmmmm not great prophesy, or casting out of spirits, or even miracles)
Remember what Jesus said.
John 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.
(Not if you prophesy or have great revelations.)
So what is the proof of Christianity? It is love
1 Corinthians 13:
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
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GrouchoMarxJr
My biggest grievance against Wierwille and twi has always been that they lied in God's name...
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now I see
Wow Excie, I think you hit the nail on the head, that summation could be the exact way the cornfield huckster took to the road less traveled. Amazing, he had to have made a conscious decision to go the way he did. His whole life amounted to using the Lord's Name in vain. What a scumbucket!!
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Ham
One thing a person could say for crowley.. he probably didn't have some kind of multi-personality disorder.
Claimed to be evil, wicked.. and he lived it.
The interesting thing is he STILL managed to have a few friends.. without covering up all of his blackness.
I think he was more "well adjusted" than vic, or even loy..
other than a little bit of sensationalism, I don't think crowley left very many curtains to be pulled back in his life..
he just appealed to a different kind of audience.
Some of the "religious" types I've confronted.. give the sheep's clothing a little poke.. they've growled and hissed..one of them, "DON'T YOU DARE TOUCH MY RIGHTEOUSNESS... growwwl, hisssss.. grrrrrrr.."
it's one of those distant memories, burned in my consciousness forever..
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Ham
I think the "sewers" kid and paps are pretty much the same. Poke the skin a little, and arrogance just runs live a river..
"how dares ya question *my* motves and *the* doctrine.."
and it probably really hurts..
other than that, I imagine they can be really nice people, pleasant, charming..
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Dot Matrix
Sorry, this whole thing struck a nerve
The terrible thing about a religious conman/woman is what they rip from the soul of the vulnerable person who humbly seeks the Lord.
There are many conmen/woman and I am sure most of us have seen "America’s Most Wanted" when they have shown a sweetheart swindler and felt for those poor “bewitched” people. And at the same time perhaps thought how you could NEVER be that stupid.
I guess it just depends how desperately you need something. Or how long you have wanted it and how long you have lived without it.
I had a man tell me that heart bandits usually hit on women who are a little over-weight. Maybe newly divorced and who have not had a compliment in years. They are still off kilter and so vulnerable. All you have to do is tell them they are pretty, make them feel loved and important and before you know it they are in “love”. They will believe anything, give generously, and put up with all kinds of crap for small verbal tokens of feigned affection.
“Good morning gorgeous.” “Let’s look at some houses on line and see where we would like to live.” “What do you want for your birthday?” “Oh, I am sorry, I forgot.” “Listen, I am a little short this month…” Then, if they tire of you they just cut and run - to the next mark.
Now add God to that.
“I was praying last night and I know you are the woman for me. God showed me a plan for our lives.” “God wants me to teach you about love” “God showed me, if we are going to be together you have to learn to submit to my voice.” and the like. Then, if and when one might tire of you -- "God told me to break up with you!" "God showed me you are not THE one." "You are not spiritual enough to support my ministry" and things of that ilk.
http://www.bookrags.com/wiki/Elmer_Gantry
Or if your child is sick and you need divine healing, as the Doctors shake their heads and say there is no hope, and someone seeks you out as a target for money. It is all horrible. "God showed me I would be the one to heal your child. Did you tithe off the money you got from the land you sold to pay the hospital bill?"
But what is the worst, IMO, is it takes beautiful people who have tender hearts for a wonderful God and attacks the trust and the sweet childlike innocence of people who truly need help. And our wonderful God-- who CAN truly help them-- and REAL people --who truly do reach out their hand in loving faith-- get scoffed, mocked or discounted in the pile with the frauds.
We miss so much of the genuine because of the pain these counterfeits cause --it is nutty. It seems like we should rise up and say I do not care if 100 of you imbeciles send your snake oil, I still believe that there is a Jesus who loves me who has the genuine love and if I spend my whole life looking and still do not find “a group” I still know HE loves me. But somehow these snake oil salesman eat our internal organs when we are maimed and we forget to fight our way back up. Or we are too weary. And if we do not fight our way back up then all the Elmer Gantry’s, sweetheart swindlers and creeps everywhere win.
I don’t want them to win. Jesus not only died to give you a NEW life but he died for the pain that someday you would feel as a result of this stupid cult we were in. And all these Elmer’s win each time someone decides to fall and is too weak to stand again, or too hurt to try God’s love again because the fraud’s have convinced them it does not exist. This is what breaks my heart. When the Elmers convince people God is a mean God who is only interested in sex or money and is self serving. God is a God of love.
GOD LOVES YOU!!!! HE WOULD NEVER HURT ANY OF US!!!
Remember:
Let all things be tested; keep to what is good; Bible in Basic English
1 Thessalonians 5:21
The Christian test:
Mathew7:22-23
21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me,you evil doers!'
(What proves you are a Christian? hmmmmm not great prophesy, or casting out of spirits, or even miracles)
Remember what Jesus said.
John 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.
(Not if you prophesy or have great revelations.)
So what is the proof of Christianity? It is love
1 Corinthians 13:
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8 Charity never faileth...
(Sorry for the loquacious post.)
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waysider
Don't be sorry.
You made some excellent points.
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