ChasUFarley, i hate to do this to you, but we need a laugh in this thread......
i am afraid I cannot abide your being in a forum for Mac users, it's against the law...somewhere......I am a Mac opposer. and I think Mac's whould be outlawed. I think they are.
(watch some numbnut is going to read this and start a gossip thread that Mac's have been outlawed....just watch)
Lighten up people. We survived right.
Lucy
Alright Lucy, now you are just too damned funny and we CANNOT have funny people posting at the cafe!! It simply derails the threads and lightens the tension, and that is NOT ALLOWED!
p.s. Forgot to add - I totally agree with you 100% about men peeing sitting down. They simply cannot aim that thing well enough to pee standing up. Hell, in a house with two boys, there are many days when I think MY aim would be better standing than theirs is!!!!!!!!!!
Now, on a more serious note. WhiteDove, when you return I hope you will read what Rascal wrote and pause before you hit they keyboard to defend yourself.
I ask this not because I am judging you as guilty as charged (to use your terminology :D), but because I want you to consider how she feels, how she perceives your responses to her posts.
I would ask that before you turn the table and accuse her of doing the same, again, consider how she feels and how she perceives your responses to her posts.
When someone shares a personal experience, and another person comes along and indicates they doubt the accuracy, truth, etc. of that person's experience - when they say "prove it" - it is internalized as a personal attack. Now, you would be correct, in thinking that perceptions are subjective, not objective. That memories can sometimes blur things a bit. Nonetheless, how an individual perceives an experience is a very real thing to the individual doing the perceiving. In other words, the person is telling the story as they experienced it.
It is one thing to question second and third hand stories of "so and so told me that this happened to someone else", etc. But when someone says "this is what happned to me" sometimes it is better to bite your tongue (or your finger nails :D). No one is saying you have to read the story and believe it is the whole truth and nothing but the truth. No one is saying you can't wonder if there is more to the story, or if the person's perception is inaccurate, but wondering it in your head does not necessarily mean you have to say it out loud.
Sometimes, it is probably perfectly okay to say it out loud, to question, to ask for more information. But when (for instance) a woman is sharing about a traumatic and painful experience like rape or abortion, perhaps the most loving thing to do is hold your tongue and just not say anything, because to do so deepens the wound, tears it apart and makes it worse. It inflicts more pain, even if it isn't intended to.
I understand your desire to have the "truth" known here. But truth is a tricky thing when it comes to experiences and perceptions. Nevertheless, the experience as perceived is truth to the one who perceived it.
I am not permitted to call you a liar, but this statement is simply inacurate when it comes to your conduct here.
You have harassed, stalked, insulted, denigrated me, my ideas, denied my experiences and called into question my veracity for years. Before it was cracked down upon, you called me viscious names, accused me of lying, called into question my mental stability, my qualifications as a parent, etc.
Your treatment of others is at times cruel and vindictive as well.
It is sad to me, that you feel that anybody who doesn`t support your version of twi is considered worthy of such a lack of kindness, compassion, or just plain decency.
Adherence to Twi doctrine appears to have made you hard. This is not the behavior one would expect of a fellow Christian :(
Groucho, I don't know who teed teed in your Cheerios and really I don't care, you have offended me with each of your posts, do I go and tattle on you? NO, I ignore you, until you insulted me and the other people that saw the point of what I said. You don't have the power or authority to tell people how to think. In my opinion you just started another argument by starting this thread, and I am not a guest.
When you forget your constitutional rights and the rights of others to speak, have opinions and say how they feel you may as well be in Iran. you want to go live in Iran. I will pack your bags. I know someone who will get you in, you can stay with them. When they (the Muslims in charge) shoot you in the back for being a subvertor, I will come back and get your body. You have no idea how good you have it, and all you care about is someone who has an opinion different from yours.
Are you for real? Constitutional rights?...What in the world are you talking about?...We all signed up when we registered here...we all agreed to follow the rules of the website...the only rights that anyone has here is what Pawtucket allows...He owns the place.
...and you're ready to send me to Iran to be shot in the back?...holy cow! get a grip!... You can think anyway you want to...I really have no interest in how you think. Started an argument?...Maybe so...but I felt that it was time to state my opinion.
I've never harassed anyone . I have pointed out that that which some seem to take as fact has not been established as so. I have not made claim as to if it is true or untrue only that there is not adequate documentation to establish either, as such one can not be passed off as fact. That may bother those who would like it to be so that I say so is enough to establish fact ,it does not work that way in cases where crimes are accused.
I got the term wrong.
"Your Honor, I object! Counselor is badgering the witness!"
That's when a question is asked, answered, asked again and answered again, and asked and ....
You get the picture.
I don't care the if you and WTH and Lucy and Mike decide to all hold hands and sing, "Skip to my Lu" around the fountain while you trade green cards.
I don't care if you wax nostalgic here in the threads. Have at it!
But please - PLEASE - stop badgering those who tell their stories here.
The point is NOT that you LUV the good ole waydaze... The POINT is that you tend to derail threads with your pleas for evidence and proof, and suggesting victim mentality.
That's my beef!...they go after people who are telling their experiences, pouring out their hearts, sharing what was a terrible experience...right here on the internet, making themselves vulnerable...and these guys go after them like vultures...STOP IT.
But what makes a great site is extreme fairness to all views, which sometimes is even "extra fairness" to the "opposition".
Bill...Fair enough...I just want the specified attacks to cease.
Sounds a little kinky to me...You aren't friends with Karen Greaser are you?
Who? Oh you mean the lady from CES that likes to channel fubars? Nope, don't know her. Heard of her though.
I am just saying, you can say what you want, and I know you are defending the people that have come forward with their stories, and that is sweet, not everybody has to believe it. That's their choice. They don't have the right to attack anyone for speaking up, those folks need to be mature enough to let it go and not fight every battle.
Gee whiz, if half of you folks had stood up with me against the BS that I saw (and I am not the lone ranger) we could have stopped all this mess before it got as bad as it did.
I stood up, I said my peace, I got blown off, I walked away. Anyone that was stupid enough to stay after 1988 deserves whatever they got. The signs were all there. People were screaming their heads off for years. No one listened. Fine, don't listen, you get what you get.
How's that for a hard line way of thinking?
Alright Lucy, now you are just too damned funny and we CANNOT have funny people posting at the cafe!! It simply derails the threads and lightens the tension, and that is NOT ALLOWED!
p.s. Forgot to add - I totally agree with you 100% about men peeing sitting down. They simply cannot aim that thing well enough to pee standing up. Hell, in a house with two boys, there are many days when I think MY aim would be better standing than theirs is!!!!!!!!!!
Yes maam sir maam, Miss Abigail maam, I will try to keep the humor down. SHAME........... Tension makes me uncomfortable. My family laughs at funerals. The more macbre, the funnier it gets. We are truly sick people.
We wouldn't have to work so hard to clean the bathroom if they would aim. Okay I got, toss in a Cheerio for them to aim at, keep a bowlful on the tank, they have something to do, and we don't get our feet stuck to the floor because they were watching a fly go up the wall.
When someone tells their story - whether in a thread or a podcast, those with opposing views start another thread. That way the original thread isn't derailed and even if there is a disagreement and ensuing food fight, the person telling the story doesn't have to feel directly challenged. He or she can choose to read the "comment thread" but doesn't have to wade through post after post about proof and getting over it or the kind of food fight that ensues.
It would require manners, compassion, and adult behavior... you think we can handle it?
Are you for real? Constitutional rights?...What in the world are you talking about?...We all signed up when we registered here...we all agreed to follow the rules of the website...the only rights that anyone has here is what Pawtucket allows...He owns the place.
...and you're ready to send me to Iran to be shot in the back?...holy cow! get a grip!... You can think anyway you want to...I really have no interest in how you think. Started an argument?...Maybe so...but I felt that it was time to state my opinion.
If I sent you to Iran with my friends, they would hide you and protect you, it would be the Muslims that would take pot shots at you. THE POINT Grouchy is yes there are rules in place here, and hopefully will protect those that oppose your views as well as yours.
That is just that, your opinion, so instead of involving everyone in this issue, why didn't you simply go to the moderators with your idea.
If you like to argue that's your bag, I am for common sense and allowing that to prevail.
BTW: Did you happen to read the rules posted for this site? You may want to take a refresher course. The answer to your query is right there.
I don't want any harm to come to you, the point was when you have all your freedoms stripped away you see how valuable they are, not only to You, but to all your countrymen.
I stood up, I said my peace, I got blown off, I walked away. Anyone that was stupid enough to stay after 1988 deserves whatever they got. The signs were all there. People were screaming their heads off for years. No one listened. Fine, don't listen, you get what you get.
ahhh, Lucy, Lucy, Lucy...... some of us didn't get involved until well after 1988. By the early 1990's, in some areas at least, the signs were down and long destroyed. Some of us didn't see what was coming until we were in for a penny in for a pound - leave the ministry, lose your family.
{Yep, it’s us, we knew you would tear each other apart when you left or when we cast you out}
groan…
{yep, look at dem debil spirits ripping you all apart and causing division}
NO…..It cant be true….
{you claim that we Mark and Avoid people for having different views and shun anything that goes against our way of thought and belief… look at this thread promoting that which you detest in us.. oh, ye hypocrites}
That is just that, your opinion, so instead of involving everyone in this issue, why didn't you simply go to the moderators with your idea.
That's a valid question...I wanted to air this out in public...In my opinion, this crap has been going on for too long and I was looking to make this an issue that the posters here were aware of...This has been a persistant problem for some time.
...and why shouldn't I make this public? This is an anti twi website that has been infiltrated by pro twi people...that's not worthy of mentioning publically?
(doojable @ Jul 9 2008, 08:06 PM) How's about this...
When someone tells their story - whether in a thread or a podcast, those with opposing views start another thread. That way the original thread isn't derailed and even if there is a disagreement and ensuing food fight, the person telling the story doesn't have to feel directly challenged. He or she can choose to read the "comment thread" but doesn't have to wade through post after post about proof and getting over it or the kind of food fight that ensues.
It would require manners, compassion, and adult behavior... you think we can handle it?
The answer is NO.
It's a great idea. It's a lofty ideal. It's NOT possible.
That's a valid question...I wanted to air this out in public...In my opinion, this crap has been going on for too long and I was looking to make this an issue that the posters here were aware of...This has been a persistant problem for some time.
...and why shouldn't I make this public? This is an anti twi website that has been infiltrated by pro twi people...that's not worthy of mentioning publically?
Looking to make an issue? Hoping for a mass cry against the "apologists"? hoping to use peer pressure to push Paw into giving you your way? Pretty stinky if ya ask me - - which I guess you pretty much did by airing it out in public.
BTW, I don't recall reading that this was an ANTI twi website, I thought it was an EX twi website. There is a distinct difference.
BTW, I don't recall reading that this was an ANTI twi website, I thought it was an EX twi website. There is a distinct difference.
About Us
Welcome to the GreaseSpot Cafe!
GreaseSpot Cafe is a gathering place, bringing together people and information. We welcome all who have an interest in The Way International, including former followers, current followers, and those who may have friends or family members who are involved. Our mission is to provide information that tells the other side of the story about The Way International and its trustees. Our hope is that GreaseSpot Cafe serves as a place where those who have been impacted by The Way can make connections with people and information which will support their particular process of recovery.
We want people to be able to make informed decisions regarding their past, present, and future affiliations with The Way International (TWI). Whether you are standing with TWI, thinking about leaving, trying to help someone else get out, or looking for support from others who have left, we believe the information here is highly relevant and well worth considering.
Look at our WayDale Documents section and see for yourself what information has come to light as a result of lawsuits against TWI, resignations of various limb and branch coordinators, letters from Martindale to the Way Corps regarding controversial issues and policies, notes from actual Way Corps meetings, and much more. Consider the longstanding patterns of conspiracy at the trustee level, questionable doctrines and practices, ongoing cover-ups, and sexual abuse of numerous women at the hands of certain TWI leaders. It's no wonder that TWI is desperately trying to shield their followers from this information by warning them off the Internet. We think that if you give this information an honest reading, you'll see that you haven't been told the whole story.
Browse through our forums and read what people are saying about their experiences in TWI. Find old friends or make new ones. Elicit support or offer an insight. Share information or simply read and consider. The opinions expressed here are often passionate and while disagreements are not uncommon, the online Ex-Way community is a great arena for conversing and connecting with others. You may get caught in a food fight now and then, but unlike TWI, GreaseSpot Cafe is a place where questions are encouraged and people make up their own minds.
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Last Updated ( Thursday, 08 June 2006 )
Our mission is to provide information that tells the other side of the story about The Way International and its trustees.
Actually that statement implies adverse, opposite or Anti even though it's quoted as an EX-Way community.
You may get caught in a food fight now and then...Dang-we must be at a feast!
Our mission is to provide information that tells the other side of the story about The Way International and its trustees.
Actually that statement implies adverse, opposite or Anti even though it's quoted as an EX-Way community.
I would think there is more than just one "other side" of the story. There are hundreds, thousands even, of "other sides."
And yes, I can see how one can perceive this as ANTI and not EX way - but I suspect if Paw wanted it to be strictly limited to ANTI and not open to ALL EX way people, he could have said so. He could have done something about those who post of fond memories, or less vehemently anti opinions a long time ago.
And I suppose he is free to do so. I am not an "apologist" btw and those who have used that term to label others would tell you the same about me. But I do think it would be a great harm to this place if people were banned because they didn't perceive VPW the same way others here do. And as I said before, I have left other ex-way communities because of such policies, I would leave this one as well.
There was a time, when I was newly out of TWI that I could probably have fallen into the "apologist camp." I still believed what was taught in PFAL, I wasn't convinced the stories about VPW were true. It took several years for me to rework what I was taught in PFAL and come to my own conclusions. It took me several years to become convinced the stories about VPW were true.
"yes" you may say "but these guys have been here for many many years."
So what? Who decides the timetable for another? You? Me? I don't want that job. Even if they never change their minds about VPW, they are still members of the ex-way community and in my opinion, they still need a place to go. I guess, if they didn't, they wouldn't be here anyway.
I would think there is more than just one "other side" of the story. There are hundreds, thousands even, of "other sides."
And yes, I can see how one can perceive this as ANTI and not EX way - but I suspect if Paw wanted it to be strictly limited to ANTI and not open to ALL EX way people, he could have said so. He could have done something about those who post of fond memories, or less vehemently anti opinions a long time ago.
And I suppose he is free to do so. I am not an "apologist" btw and those who have used that term to label others would tell you the same about me. But I do think it would be a great harm to this place if people were banned because they didn't perceive VPW the same way others here do. And as I said before, I have left other ex-way communities because of such policies, I would leave this one as well.
There was a time, when I was newly out of TWI that I could probably have fallen into the "apologist camp." I still believed what was taught in PFAL, I wasn't convinced the stories about VPW were true. It took several years for me to rework what I was taught in PFAL and come to my own conclusions. It took me several years to become convinced the stories about VPW were true.
"yes" you may say "but these guys have been here for many many years."
So what? Who decides the timetable for another? You? Me? I don't want that job. Even if they never change their minds about VPW, they are still members of the ex-way community and in my opinion, they still need a place to go. I guess, if they didn't, they wouldn't be here anyway.
No arguement from me, I'm not really in all the "this side", "that side", I'm just noticing certain tendencies like my second to last post and commenting on certain comments with what has been written by Paw.
I honestly take the outside looking in and noticing that there are some very bitter people here regardless of their views on Both sides. And that they will never be convinced of anything other than what they want to believe, right or wrong.
I don't think this thread and Groucho's remarks were to direct Paw to do anything. I think Groucho knows that that would not work anyway.
I do believe it was to get input from more people then his own thinking. So that it would help him to figure a problem out that does not set right with many people that come to this site.
vp got me on the coach and did things against my will
reply
this has never been proven in a court of law, it's just opinion
See, that is cruel what is said and it makes everything an argument and does leave the victim like a fish without water - as it takes a REAL thing that happened to them and pushes it into a realm they need not be pushed into.
It is heartless, cold and unbecoming of any human being let alone a Christian -especially one who entertains the thought that they are defending "Christendom" by constant defense of the criminal. And it is not a now and then response. It is continual and cripples the victims all over again.
That being said, it also shows their calloused hearts, insanity, and "brainwashed of all normal human emotions" condition - it exposes the pitiful state they have been left in and exposes their pharacitical nature which enhances OUR SIDE of the argument.
They expose the disease, and the exposure is in their responses, anyone who is seeking help can see there is something wrong with them. However, anyone crawling in pain, does not need to be beaten and clobbered by the insane at the door. That is why there are restraints (straight jackets as it were) and there are threads where the clobbering insane attacker needs to be halted. I think most of us rush in to try and "stop" the lunatic from beating the victim down again. But when it repeatedly becames "verbally gang raping" the victim - well, I can see why Groucho posted this.
I don't think this thread and Groucho's remarks were to direct Paw to do anything. I think Groucho knows that that would not work anyway.
I do believe it was to get input from more people then his own thinking. So that it would help him to figure a problem out that does not set right with many people that come to this site.
But given the emtional state of both sides even if a decssion was made on an approppriate action it would still involve Pawtucket implimenting said action.
AND personally speaking I dont believe this issue has anything to do with whether someone agrees with VPW, Craig, The Way, PFAL, an experience or whatever. That is just were the point of division is being seen most.
It comes down to how people are treating each other, their communtication, care, concern and RESPECT for each other or lack there of. Being a website it is very easy to be desensitized to people and their experiences.
Many have been here for so long and heard the same story told so many times in so many ways that it gets old(not to take away from the seriousness of it)and people tend to start getting short with each other. Since information coming out of The Way has been drying up more so in the last couple years, people tend to rehash old topics and they start to microscopically rip things apart for lack of new information. So old disagreements that have been repeated 100 times now are like an insect bite that has been scratched till it bleeds. It's painfull to even think about it let alone listen to someone repeat it again.
It's a vicious circle and with no new info coming out, the old stuff is going to get rehashed again and again and the bitterness is only gonna get worst. not meaning any disrespect toward anyone, but those that have been here the longest AND in the middle of everything are least likely to see their own desensitzation and harshness. I hate to use it as an example but we talk about how can the Way Corp not see the world around them and be so out of touch with reality, well what about those that have made this place their sanctuary, their comfort zone, their purpose in life for so many years? Again, not judging, just making an observation.
This place has done wonders for many people that needed information to help them leave, help others, etc. and then they moved on. Others have moved in and made this place their home, not saying that it's wrong. I guess what I'm saying is the more crap you know about people the harder it is to respect their opinions. And some have poured their hearts out for years here.
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geisha779
Hi, Revictimizing the victims of abuse is itself abusive. It speaks volumes about the one doing it. What they still adhere to shapes their perspective and ability to inflict cruelty on those so horr
Abigail
Alright Lucy, now you are just too damned funny and we CANNOT have funny people posting at the cafe!! It simply derails the threads and lightens the tension, and that is NOT ALLOWED!
p.s. Forgot to add - I totally agree with you 100% about men peeing sitting down. They simply cannot aim that thing well enough to pee standing up. Hell, in a house with two boys, there are many days when I think MY aim would be better standing than theirs is!!!!!!!!!!
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Abigail
Now, on a more serious note. WhiteDove, when you return I hope you will read what Rascal wrote and pause before you hit they keyboard to defend yourself.
I ask this not because I am judging you as guilty as charged (to use your terminology :D), but because I want you to consider how she feels, how she perceives your responses to her posts.
I would ask that before you turn the table and accuse her of doing the same, again, consider how she feels and how she perceives your responses to her posts.
When someone shares a personal experience, and another person comes along and indicates they doubt the accuracy, truth, etc. of that person's experience - when they say "prove it" - it is internalized as a personal attack. Now, you would be correct, in thinking that perceptions are subjective, not objective. That memories can sometimes blur things a bit. Nonetheless, how an individual perceives an experience is a very real thing to the individual doing the perceiving. In other words, the person is telling the story as they experienced it.
It is one thing to question second and third hand stories of "so and so told me that this happened to someone else", etc. But when someone says "this is what happned to me" sometimes it is better to bite your tongue (or your finger nails :D). No one is saying you have to read the story and believe it is the whole truth and nothing but the truth. No one is saying you can't wonder if there is more to the story, or if the person's perception is inaccurate, but wondering it in your head does not necessarily mean you have to say it out loud.
Sometimes, it is probably perfectly okay to say it out loud, to question, to ask for more information. But when (for instance) a woman is sharing about a traumatic and painful experience like rape or abortion, perhaps the most loving thing to do is hold your tongue and just not say anything, because to do so deepens the wound, tears it apart and makes it worse. It inflicts more pain, even if it isn't intended to.
I understand your desire to have the "truth" known here. But truth is a tricky thing when it comes to experiences and perceptions. Nevertheless, the experience as perceived is truth to the one who perceived it.
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GrouchoMarxJr
Are you for real? Constitutional rights?...What in the world are you talking about?...We all signed up when we registered here...we all agreed to follow the rules of the website...the only rights that anyone has here is what Pawtucket allows...He owns the place.
...and you're ready to send me to Iran to be shot in the back?...holy cow! get a grip!... You can think anyway you want to...I really have no interest in how you think. Started an argument?...Maybe so...but I felt that it was time to state my opinion.
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doojable
I got the term wrong.
"Your Honor, I object! Counselor is badgering the witness!"
That's when a question is asked, answered, asked again and answered again, and asked and ....
You get the picture.
I don't care the if you and WTH and Lucy and Mike decide to all hold hands and sing, "Skip to my Lu" around the fountain while you trade green cards.
I don't care if you wax nostalgic here in the threads. Have at it!
But please - PLEASE - stop badgering those who tell their stories here.
The point is NOT that you LUV the good ole waydaze... The POINT is that you tend to derail threads with your pleas for evidence and proof, and suggesting victim mentality.
Free speech is not the issue here.
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rhino
But what makes a great site is extreme fairness to all views, which sometimes is even "extra fairness" to the "opposition".
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GrouchoMarxJr
Thank you dooj...
That's my beef!...they go after people who are telling their experiences, pouring out their hearts, sharing what was a terrible experience...right here on the internet, making themselves vulnerable...and these guys go after them like vultures...STOP IT.
Bill...Fair enough...I just want the specified attacks to cease.
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rhino
yup ... and that stuff has gone on too long ... as I see it ... I was just bleeding in from another thread :)
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lucyvanpelt
Who? Oh you mean the lady from CES that likes to channel fubars? Nope, don't know her. Heard of her though.
I am just saying, you can say what you want, and I know you are defending the people that have come forward with their stories, and that is sweet, not everybody has to believe it. That's their choice. They don't have the right to attack anyone for speaking up, those folks need to be mature enough to let it go and not fight every battle.
Gee whiz, if half of you folks had stood up with me against the BS that I saw (and I am not the lone ranger) we could have stopped all this mess before it got as bad as it did.
I stood up, I said my peace, I got blown off, I walked away. Anyone that was stupid enough to stay after 1988 deserves whatever they got. The signs were all there. People were screaming their heads off for years. No one listened. Fine, don't listen, you get what you get.
How's that for a hard line way of thinking?
Yes maam sir maam, Miss Abigail maam, I will try to keep the humor down. SHAME...........
Tension makes me uncomfortable. My family laughs at funerals. The more macbre, the funnier it gets. We are truly sick people.
We wouldn't have to work so hard to clean the bathroom if they would aim. Okay I got, toss in a Cheerio for them to aim at, keep a bowlful on the tank, they have something to do, and we don't get our feet stuck to the floor because they were watching a fly go up the wall.
Just a thought.
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doojable
I just posted this on another thread...
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lucyvanpelt
If I sent you to Iran with my friends, they would hide you and protect you, it would be the Muslims that would take pot shots at you. THE POINT Grouchy is yes there are rules in place here, and hopefully will protect those that oppose your views as well as yours.
That is just that, your opinion, so instead of involving everyone in this issue, why didn't you simply go to the moderators with your idea.
If you like to argue that's your bag, I am for common sense and allowing that to prevail.
BTW: Did you happen to read the rules posted for this site? You may want to take a refresher course. The answer to your query is right there.
I don't want any harm to come to you, the point was when you have all your freedoms stripped away you see how valuable they are, not only to You, but to all your countrymen.
I am going someplace else, this thread is a drag.
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Abigail
ahhh, Lucy, Lucy, Lucy...... some of us didn't get involved until well after 1988. By the early 1990's, in some areas at least, the signs were down and long destroyed. Some of us didn't see what was coming until we were in for a penny in for a pound - leave the ministry, lose your family.
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JustSayNO
I can see it now!
What’s that I hear in the distance….
{laughter from afar}
Who dareth laugh…
{chuckling, laughing and weezing}
Who is that laughing…
{really, cant you tell… more laughter}
Ok, give me a hint…
{cornfields… ha ha ha}
O God, not them…
{Yep, it’s us, we knew you would tear each other apart when you left or when we cast you out}
groan…
{yep, look at dem debil spirits ripping you all apart and causing division}
NO…..It cant be true….
{you claim that we Mark and Avoid people for having different views and shun anything that goes against our way of thought and belief… look at this thread promoting that which you detest in us.. oh, ye hypocrites}
cry…
{Welcome Back...}
Runs and hides from the flames about to hit
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GrouchoMarxJr
That's a valid question...I wanted to air this out in public...In my opinion, this crap has been going on for too long and I was looking to make this an issue that the posters here were aware of...This has been a persistant problem for some time.
...and why shouldn't I make this public? This is an anti twi website that has been infiltrated by pro twi people...that's not worthy of mentioning publically?
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Rocky
The answer is NO.
It's a great idea. It's a lofty ideal. It's NOT possible.
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Abigail
Looking to make an issue? Hoping for a mass cry against the "apologists"? hoping to use peer pressure to push Paw into giving you your way? Pretty stinky if ya ask me - - which I guess you pretty much did by airing it out in public.
BTW, I don't recall reading that this was an ANTI twi website, I thought it was an EX twi website. There is a distinct difference.
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doojable
Awwww common Rocky- have some... ummmm... where's your... errrr...
Most of us here are in our forties and fifties. I think we can act our respective ages.
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Rocky
Am I being too pessimistic?
What's that song from Peter Pan?
"I won't..."
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doojable
"Never smile at a crocodile..."
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JustSayNO
About Us
Welcome to the GreaseSpot Cafe!
GreaseSpot Cafe is a gathering place, bringing together people and information. We welcome all who have an interest in The Way International, including former followers, current followers, and those who may have friends or family members who are involved. Our mission is to provide information that tells the other side of the story about The Way International and its trustees. Our hope is that GreaseSpot Cafe serves as a place where those who have been impacted by The Way can make connections with people and information which will support their particular process of recovery.
We want people to be able to make informed decisions regarding their past, present, and future affiliations with The Way International (TWI). Whether you are standing with TWI, thinking about leaving, trying to help someone else get out, or looking for support from others who have left, we believe the information here is highly relevant and well worth considering.
Look at our WayDale Documents section and see for yourself what information has come to light as a result of lawsuits against TWI, resignations of various limb and branch coordinators, letters from Martindale to the Way Corps regarding controversial issues and policies, notes from actual Way Corps meetings, and much more. Consider the longstanding patterns of conspiracy at the trustee level, questionable doctrines and practices, ongoing cover-ups, and sexual abuse of numerous women at the hands of certain TWI leaders. It's no wonder that TWI is desperately trying to shield their followers from this information by warning them off the Internet. We think that if you give this information an honest reading, you'll see that you haven't been told the whole story.
Browse through our forums and read what people are saying about their experiences in TWI. Find old friends or make new ones. Elicit support or offer an insight. Share information or simply read and consider. The opinions expressed here are often passionate and while disagreements are not uncommon, the online Ex-Way community is a great arena for conversing and connecting with others. You may get caught in a food fight now and then, but unlike TWI, GreaseSpot Cafe is a place where questions are encouraged and people make up their own minds.
No Shirt, No Shoes... No Problem!
Last Updated ( Thursday, 08 June 2006 )
Our mission is to provide information that tells the other side of the story about The Way International and its trustees.
Actually that statement implies adverse, opposite or Anti even though it's quoted as an EX-Way community.
You may get caught in a food fight now and then...Dang-we must be at a feast!
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Abigail
I would think there is more than just one "other side" of the story. There are hundreds, thousands even, of "other sides."
And yes, I can see how one can perceive this as ANTI and not EX way - but I suspect if Paw wanted it to be strictly limited to ANTI and not open to ALL EX way people, he could have said so. He could have done something about those who post of fond memories, or less vehemently anti opinions a long time ago.
And I suppose he is free to do so. I am not an "apologist" btw and those who have used that term to label others would tell you the same about me. But I do think it would be a great harm to this place if people were banned because they didn't perceive VPW the same way others here do. And as I said before, I have left other ex-way communities because of such policies, I would leave this one as well.
There was a time, when I was newly out of TWI that I could probably have fallen into the "apologist camp." I still believed what was taught in PFAL, I wasn't convinced the stories about VPW were true. It took several years for me to rework what I was taught in PFAL and come to my own conclusions. It took me several years to become convinced the stories about VPW were true.
"yes" you may say "but these guys have been here for many many years."
So what? Who decides the timetable for another? You? Me? I don't want that job. Even if they never change their minds about VPW, they are still members of the ex-way community and in my opinion, they still need a place to go. I guess, if they didn't, they wouldn't be here anyway.
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JustSayNO
No arguement from me, I'm not really in all the "this side", "that side", I'm just noticing certain tendencies like my second to last post and commenting on certain comments with what has been written by Paw.
I honestly take the outside looking in and noticing that there are some very bitter people here regardless of their views on Both sides. And that they will never be convinced of anything other than what they want to believe, right or wrong.
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cman
I don't think this thread and Groucho's remarks were to direct Paw to do anything. I think Groucho knows that that would not work anyway.
I do believe it was to get input from more people then his own thinking. So that it would help him to figure a problem out that does not set right with many people that come to this site.
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Dot Matrix
See, that is cruel what is said and it makes everything an argument and does leave the victim like a fish without water - as it takes a REAL thing that happened to them and pushes it into a realm they need not be pushed into.
It is heartless, cold and unbecoming of any human being let alone a Christian -especially one who entertains the thought that they are defending "Christendom" by constant defense of the criminal. And it is not a now and then response. It is continual and cripples the victims all over again.
That being said, it also shows their calloused hearts, insanity, and "brainwashed of all normal human emotions" condition - it exposes the pitiful state they have been left in and exposes their pharacitical nature which enhances OUR SIDE of the argument.
They expose the disease, and the exposure is in their responses, anyone who is seeking help can see there is something wrong with them. However, anyone crawling in pain, does not need to be beaten and clobbered by the insane at the door. That is why there are restraints (straight jackets as it were) and there are threads where the clobbering insane attacker needs to be halted. I think most of us rush in to try and "stop" the lunatic from beating the victim down again. But when it repeatedly becames "verbally gang raping" the victim - well, I can see why Groucho posted this.
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JustSayNO
But given the emtional state of both sides even if a decssion was made on an approppriate action it would still involve Pawtucket implimenting said action.
AND personally speaking I dont believe this issue has anything to do with whether someone agrees with VPW, Craig, The Way, PFAL, an experience or whatever. That is just were the point of division is being seen most.
It comes down to how people are treating each other, their communtication, care, concern and RESPECT for each other or lack there of. Being a website it is very easy to be desensitized to people and their experiences.
Many have been here for so long and heard the same story told so many times in so many ways that it gets old(not to take away from the seriousness of it)and people tend to start getting short with each other. Since information coming out of The Way has been drying up more so in the last couple years, people tend to rehash old topics and they start to microscopically rip things apart for lack of new information. So old disagreements that have been repeated 100 times now are like an insect bite that has been scratched till it bleeds. It's painfull to even think about it let alone listen to someone repeat it again.
It's a vicious circle and with no new info coming out, the old stuff is going to get rehashed again and again and the bitterness is only gonna get worst. not meaning any disrespect toward anyone, but those that have been here the longest AND in the middle of everything are least likely to see their own desensitzation and harshness. I hate to use it as an example but we talk about how can the Way Corp not see the world around them and be so out of touch with reality, well what about those that have made this place their sanctuary, their comfort zone, their purpose in life for so many years? Again, not judging, just making an observation.
This place has done wonders for many people that needed information to help them leave, help others, etc. and then they moved on. Others have moved in and made this place their home, not saying that it's wrong. I guess what I'm saying is the more crap you know about people the harder it is to respect their opinions. And some have poured their hearts out for years here.
No wonder there is a foodfight.
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