Boot the Wierwille apologists

[Dot Matrix]

Idios.

huh?

[lucyvanpelt]

Isn't dot precious at how she doesn't get all uptight and judgemental and uses your weaknesses against you? Isn't she loving, kind, considerate, putting herself in someones elses shoes before she grabs the butcher knife and starts hacking.

I was only asking questions, I still stand by my post, I just didn't feel searchin all through here for the thousands of posts to answer my question. I figure they are big girls, I will just ask.

You are truly paranoid Dot.

Psst....so you know, there are lots of bipolar people. Here's a list. So not to hurt your feelings, but I would rather be locked up in a pen with them, then to be in Tiffany's with a million dollars with you. Capice?

Ned Beatty

Maurice Bernard, soap opera

Jeremy Brett

Jim Carey

Lisa Nicole Carson

Rosemary Clooney, singer

Lindsay Crosby

Eric Douglas

Robert Downey Jr.

Patty Duke

Carrie Fisher

Connie Francis, singer and actress

Shecky Greene, comedian

Linda Hamilton

Moss Hart, actor, director, playright

Mariette Hartley

Margot Kidder

Vivien Leigh

Kevin McDonald, comedian

Kristy McNichols

Burgess Meredith, actor, director

Spike Milligan, actor, writer

Spike Mulligan, comic actor and writer

Nicola Pagett

Ben Stiller, actor, director, writer

David Strickland

Lili Taylor

Tracy Ullman

Jean-Claude Van Damme

Robin Williams

Jonathon Winters, comedian

Artists

Alvin Alley, dancer, choreogapher

Ludwig Von Beethoven

Tim Burton, artist, director

Francis Ford Coppola, director

George Fredrick Handel, composer

Bill Lichtenstein, producer

Joshua Logan, broadway director, producer

Vincent Van Gogh, painter

Gustav Mahier, composer

Francesco Scavullo, artist, photographer

Robert Schumann, composer

Don Simpson, movie producer

Norman Wexler, screenwriter, playwright

Entrepreneurs

Robert Campeau

Pierre Peladeau

Heinz C. Prechter

Ted Turner, media giant

Financiers

John Mulheren

Murray Pezim

Miscellaneous

Buzz Aldrin, astronaut

Clifford Beers, humanitarian

Garnet Coleman, legislator (Texas)

Larry Flynt, publisher and activist

Kit Gingrich, Newt's mom

Phil Graham, owner of Washington Post

Peter Gregg, team owner and manager, race car driver

Susan Panico (Susan Dime-Meenan), business executive

Sol Wachtier, former New York State Chief Judge

Musicians

Ludwig van Beethoven, composer

Alohe Jean Burke, musician, vocalist

Rosemary Clooney, singer

DMX Earl Simmons, rapper and actor

Ray Davies

Lenny Dee

Gaetano Donizetti, opera singer

Peter Gabriel

Jimi Hendrix

Kristen Hersh (Throwing Muses)

Phyllis Hyman

Jack Irons

Daniel Johnston

Otto Klemperer, musician, conductor

Oscar Levant, pianist, composer, television

Phil Ochs, musician, political activist, poet

John Ogden, composer, musician

Jaco Pastorius

Charley Pride

Mac Rebennack (Dr. John)

Jeannie C. Riley

Alys Robi, vocalist in Canada

Axl Rose

Nick Traina

Del Shannon

Phil Spector, musician and producer

Sting, Gordon Sumner, musician, composer

Tom Waits, musician, composer

Brian Wilson, musician, composer, arranger

Townes Van Zandt, musician, composer

Poets

John Berryman

C.E. Chaffin, writer, poet

Hart Crane

Randall Jarrell

Jane Kenyon

Robert Lowell

Sylvia Plath

Robert Schumann

Delmore Schwartz

Political

Robert Boorstin, special assistant to President Clinton

L. Brent Bozell, political scientist, attorney, writer

Bob Bullock, ex secretary of state, state comptroller and lieutenant governer

Winston Churchill

Kitty Dukasis, former First Lady of Massachusetts

Thomas Eagleton, lawyer, former U.S. Senator

Lynne Rivers, U.S. Congress

Theodore Roosevelt, President of the United States

Scholars

John Strugnell, biblical scholar

Scientists

Karl Paul Link, chemist

Dimitri Mihalas

Sports

Shelley Beattie, bodybuilding, sailing

John Daly, golf

Muffin Spencer-Devlin, pro golf

Ilie Nastase, tennis

Jimmy Piersail, baseball player, Boston Red Sox, sports announcer

Barret Robbins, football

Wyatt Sexton, football

Alonzo Spellman, football

Darryl Strawberry, baseball

Dimitrius Underwood, football

Luther Wright, basketball

Bert Yancey, athlete

TV & Radio

Dick Cavett

Jay Marvin, radio, writer

Jane Pauley

Writers

Louis Althusser, philosopher, writer

Honors de Balzac

Art Buchwald, writer, humorist

Neal Cassady

Patricia Cornwell

Margot Early

Kaye Gibbons

Johann Goethe

Graham Greene

Abbie Hoffman, writer, political activist

Kay Redfield Jamison, writer, psychologist

Peter Nolan Lawrence

Frances Lear, writer, editor, women's rights activist

Rika Lesser, writer, translator

Kate Millet

Robert Munsch

Margo Orum

Edgar Allen Poe

Theodore Roethke

Lori Schiller, writer, educator

Frances Sherwood

Scott Simmie, writer, journalist

August Strindberg

Mark Twain

Joseph Vasquez, writer, movie director

Mark Vonnegut, doctor, writer

Sol Wachtler, writer, judge

Mary Jane Ward

Virginia Woolf

So, the ability to overcome is this illness is there. You aren't anybody to me, you are a made up name in a cyber community of disgruntled people.

huh?

I just made my point.

[waysider]

Don't beat yourself up too badly, Lucy.

I, myself, didn't know much about the sordid details until I stumbled in here about two years ago.

Believe it or not, I found this place while searching for a replacement for my PFAL book which had gone "missing in action".

I was still lending out my collaterals and "witnessing" to people.( though I rarely sent anyone to a twig again after my rather unpleasant experiences in Fellow Laborers.)

[cman]

sheesh....get a grip

I know these people, including Dot.

Quit labeling them bipolar, you don't know what you are speaking of.

Even the experts miss diagnose.

Here these folks are helping you.

Though it may sound harsh, it isn't.

They are just trying to break through to YOU.

Not only to face what occured but to get healed.

You'll never forget, but you will beat twi/vpw.

If you want to.

[WhiteDove]

WD said:

QUOTE(WhiteDove @ Jul 12 2008, 12:18 PM)

Exactly Jeff you spoke your opinion I'm fine with that. On the other hand had you said Dr. Wierwille was a scumbag that would be a statement of fact and I would expect you to offer some proof for your claim or admission that it was simply a misstated opinion.

I said:

QUOTE(doojable @ Jul 12 2008, 12:42 PM)

Another logical glitch. You're taking a statement of opinion and then trying to say it's a statement of guilt, then you're working on that statement of guilt being wrong and treating real life like it's on long legal battle. (That I believe is a strawman argument - somebody correct me if I"m wrong.)

Let's take Tricky vic out of the example.

Let's say I'm talkng to A (fictional person) and I say, "B is a real scumbag. He tried to kiss me when my boyfriend wasn't looking. I turned my face and just walked out. I'll never be in the same room with him again."

Now - that's my first hand "testimony" if you will. There is no physical evidence, because I didn't say that I slapped his face or tried to knee him in the.... If you go and ask B about the incident, there's no guarantee that he will be honest.

In my statement, B is a real scumbag..." I stated my opinion of B based on my experience with him. He wasn't accused of a crime. What kind of proof would you want? A is free to accept what I say or not - but to say that I'd have to get a court finding to state my opinion is absolutely not right - I can't even see how it would work in the real world.

Then WD said:

QUOTE(WhiteDove @ Jul 12 2008, 01:35 PM)

Accusation of a serious crime is different than a insult like scumbag

You got a little mixed up there. Lost your place in your thought processes, didn't you? It seems you can't even get YOU to agree with YOU. I think that's what happens when you keep running in the same rut over and over without ever considering any other POV or any other solution.

Not at all Jeffs statement was an opinion he did not state it as a fact he qualified it with I think not he was he stated his opinion ,Fine with me he did not try to pass his opinion off as a fact.

Your example involved calling some one a name as well it offered no clue that it was an opinion in fact it reads as a statement of fact B is a real scumbag.

My reply Accusation of a serious crime is different than a insult like scumbag. You offered your example to somehow justify your argument of several pages prior that people were expressing their opinions. People misspeak all the time when that happens most of the time we tend to overlook that. No harm no foul so to speak so they called me a name So What? accusation of of crime however is a different level as I indicated. Another Words calling someone a dweeb, and calling someone a molester ,a rapist, a murderer would not produce the same response there for the example is lacking in comparison.

[Dot Matrix]

Lucy said

find it suspect at best that all the accusations of VP and others only come out after they are dead. I think that is what most opposers have a problem with, if it happened, and I can't say it didn't, I wasn't there, why in the hell did you not speak up???????????? To me, it makes you just as responsible as the molester. You allowed it.

Yet you said if I read you as being curt it was something I was reading into it -

Sure. You are really being sweet... For some other planet where Jeffrey Dahmer's eating habits are acceptable -maybe.

You wrote idios that is what I asked about as you used my huh? against me. You must mean adios which means "good bye" as idios is not a word. Unless, of course, you were calling yourself and idiot because the spelling of adios escaped you.

I know there are plenty of bi-polars - so what? It still does not excuse YOU from blaming Ex and I for the continued abuse - and that eventually affected you - as if it is our fault BTW the list of great people without bi-polar is very long as well. Your list still does not excuse what you accused me and Ex of, it is another diversion - to say "look over here" so you can appear right.

You forgot Adolf Hitler was bi-polar - BTW

You are grasping at straws, still trying to be right.

Interesting that you ASSume me to be paranoid - when again that would be a triat with which you struggle. Do not transpose your illness, and bad behavior on others just to win an arguement.

I suspect you will just become more and more angry. Feel free Lucy, you are fighting with yourself. Defending a position that was uncalled for and then tried to morph it into - well feel sorry for me cause I was abused...

Half the people VP abused were already abused. Scream all you want. You made Ex and I into being responsible for VP actions. Your screaming and twisting is just a dance designed so you never have to admit you were wrong.

Dance away Lucy.

I do not care.

edited to move a paragraph up.

Edited July 14, 2008 by Dot Matrix

[Abigail]

Lucy,

Dot, ExCathedra, and whoever else was in the room the night VPW talked about his daughters are not responsible for whatever you went through in TWI. Your anger is misdirected. You are blowing up all over the board.

Do yourself a favor, take a walk, find something light and fun to do. Or go to a gym and hit a punching bag, go for a run, whatever helps you vent your steam.

You have a right to be angry, but you are blaming the wrong people.

[Dot Matrix]

Lucy

There is a screaming child inside you which still needs to be heard - she is misdirected and trying to scream at Ex and me because perhaps your mother did not help you...

Go ahead... let it out...

We are not responsible for your childhood pain. Go ahead yell at your mother... Yell at God if you want. You need to get the pain out in order to heal. But I will not let you blame me. Blame the people who did nothing in your situation.

The truth will set you free.

Edited July 14, 2008 by Dot Matrix

[lucyvanpelt]

Don't beat yourself up too badly, Lucy.

I, myself, didn't know much about the sordid details until I stumbled in here about two years ago.

Believe it or not, I found this place while searching for a replacement for my PFAL book which had gone "missing in action".

I was still lending out my collaterals and "witnessing" to people.( though I rarely sent anyone to a twig again after my rather unpleasant experiences in Fellow Laborers.)

I ain't beating myself up at all, I didn't do anything wrong. I am a direct person, I don't put dresses on dogs, I say it like I think it, It's the way I am. I just had questions.

Believe it or not, I found this place when after 16 years I was looking to find a teacher of God's Word. I googled Dr. Wierwille out of pure boredom, and this popped up. Frankly, it made me sick so i clicked on the links and found Michael Cortright's family page, started clicking away and got inspired by one name and emailed him. And four years later, I am a whole woman. I asked this guy a million questions, praise God he is from New York and don't get all goopy when you ask a direct question, I asked him about the Way, VP, and PFAL, and he just taught God's Word, never belittled anyone, never insulted anyonw, respected what was, moves on with what is and the guy is a rock on God's Word. He calls me faithful and a Berean. Two things I never associated with myself. I was too busy in Waydom condemnation. Can I get a Witness? I think I got a good handle of God's Word now.

All my collaterals got given away, same as you. i don't need them. All I need is my Bible, and a heart with no preconceived ideas that hungers for truth. That got me far.

I got to go feed my honey bunny.....

Lucy,

Dot, ExCathedra, and whoever else was in the room the night VPW talked about his daughters are not responsible for whatever you went through in TWI. Your anger is misdirected. You are blowing up all over the board.

Do yourself a favor, take a walk, find something light and fun to do. Or go to a gym and hit a punching bag, go for a run, whatever helps you vent your steam.

You have a right to be angry, but you are blaming the wrong people.

I am not angry. Want to call my house and talk to me. Trust me, I am not ....ed.

I blew up at Dot after she attacked me. I didn't hit first, I hit her back. Fights' over. I am not mad.

[Belle]

Lucy, print this thread out and give it to your doctor on your next visit. You may need to have the level of your meds or therapy increased.

I am through. You need more help than we can provide here.

[WhiteDove]

sheesh....get a grip

I know these people, including Dot.

Quit labeling them bipolar, you don't know what you are speaking of.

Even the experts miss diagnose.

Again I wonder do you ever read before you post your responses

She never labeled them as Bi-polar

You might reread the posts............

[Dot Matrix]

Lucy is J@niZ L@n9 remember her? She just pm'd me and threatened me

Remember all the trouble she caused awhile back?

Here we go again.

Edited July 14, 2008 by Dot Matrix

[lucyvanpelt]

Lucy, print this thread out and give it to your doctor on your next visit. You may need to have the level of your meds or therapy increased.

I am through. You need more help than we can provide here.

Do you make this stuff up or do you have a writer on the payroll?

Lucy is Janice Lang remember her? She just pm'd me and threatened me

I saved a copy of it sweetie, do you want to call your lawyer? I told you to shut up. Because you just like to dig until you tick somebody off.

I'm still prettier than you.

[cman]

sheesh....get a grip

I know these people, including Dot.

Quit labeling them bipolar, you don't know what you are speaking of.

Even the experts miss diagnose.

Here these folks are helping you.

Though it may sound harsh, it isn't.

They are just trying to break through to YOU.

Not only to face what occured but to get healed.

You'll never forget, but you will beat twi/vpw.

If you want to.

This is what I said white dove.

Quit your lies and adding to my posts.

[Abigail]

Janis,

I had hoped you were truly doing better. Obviously you are not well. The people here at Greasespot are not equipped to help you. Not a one of us is a professional. Please, before you hurt someone else, or hurt yourself, log off. Do whatever it is you need to do to help yourself.

[Belle]

Do you make this stuff up or do you have a writer on the payroll?

No, but I'm flattered you think so. It was a serious observation, Hon.

I'm still prettier than you.

Seriously doubt it. Definitely not when looking on the inside.

[Dot Matrix]

Do you make this stuff up or do you have a writer on the payroll?

I saved a copy of it sweetie, do you want to call your lawyer? I told you to shut up. Because you just like to dig until you tick somebody off.

I'm still prettier than you.

you need help honey, yes you are much prettier than I am

[lucyvanpelt]

you need help honey, yes you are much prettier than I am

You don't even have the guts to state you real name and you think I have problems. Honestly...........

How silly is that?

I gave a copy of that PM to an administrator so that it's on the record.

Now back to the topic at hand....

I think everyone has the right to speak their mind, if they have one.

I am perfectly healthy. But thanks everybody for all your concern, take a look in the mirror every so often and don't be so quick to judge next time and give people a little credit. Look, let's face facts, there is no delicate way to say you were abused? Why is it, that it's ok for people to say Dr. so and so raped me, or Craig did this to me, but it's a problem when I share what happened to me. Let's face another thing, it happened over 30 years ago, I got past it, why can't any of you? How much worse can it be? Rape is rape. I am past it.

You think you are so clever and above it all and aren't you smart for cutting people down? that aint' right............

[cman]

Some of the people listed here are celebrities who have talked openly about having bipolar disorder; others have been judged by history to have suffered from manic depression. At least one is being called bipolar because of what may be a misinterpretation.

More then one I'm very sure.

[WhiteDove]

This is what I said white dove.

Quit your lies and adding to my posts.

I read what you said

I know these people, including Dot.

Quit labeling them bipolar, you don't know what you are speaking of.

She never labled these people including Dot as bi-Polar she presented a list of people she felt for whatever reason were Bi-polar, I don't know if that list is right or wrong but I do know that Dot was not on the list she presented as you implied.

Edited July 14, 2008 by WhiteDove

[rascal]

Gosh Lucy, you are swinging at everyone. You threw the first punch by blaming ex and Dot for not speaking up in twi.

I think you ought to get to know these folks and what they actually did, and what were the consequences of their efforts before being so harsh in your criticism.

It just isn`t fair.

Edited July 14, 2008 by rascal

[Belle]

Hey Janis,

Besides posting as Lucy and Just p155ing Through, who else do you post as?

Edited July 14, 2008 by Belle

[Belle]

Also posted as Janis.

Who else? How many other personalities do you have out there?

[cman]

She never labled these people including Dot as bi-Polar she presented a list of people she felt for whatever reason were Bi-polar, I don't know if that list is right or wrong but I do know that Dot was not on the list she presented as you implied.

I implied? lolololololol.

You are having difficulties are you not?

Interpreting Lucy's post now wd?

As well as mine.

You are not good at it.

[dmiller]

I'm still prettier than you.

Pretty is as pretty does.