Bob Stanley wasn't in TWI in the nineties. I thought he left in the late eighties. Most of IL left with Joe Guarini, didn't they?
Nope he is still quite involved. He has been in Georgia since 1995/6 and was (is?) a BC there. When he first went there people said he would very seldom play or sing except at big functions. After craigster left I hear that he started playing a lot more and seemed to enjoy it again.
Nope he is still quite involved. He has been in Georgia since 1995/6 and was (is?) a BC there. When he first went there people said he would very seldom play or sing except at big functions. After craigster left I hear that he started playing a lot more and seemed to enjoy it again.
Rather odd that he has so many ex twis on his myspace then, what with TWIs M&A against those who left the household.
Rather odd that he has so many ex twis on his myspace then, what with TWIs M&A against those who left the household.
Odd as it may be, I have it from a very reliable source that he is still in. Whether he is still full time Way Corp or not is unsure. If he is not paid staff any more then this actually would make alot of sense.
Yep! Before Bob was in Georgia he was doing a branch in Pensacola Fl which at the time he left that branch was counted as part of the AL limb. They were there for several years before going to Atlanta.
I think LCM trotted him out to sing one song at an ROA in '92 or '93 my memory is hazy.
Seth
Seth,
I seem to remember the same thing. There were a few folks like Dave Lutz who were still in but packed up and moved out of the cornfield. Dave was given the great honor of performing once while I was at HQ visiting.
Not sure if Bob's circumstances were. I ran into him at a ROA while he was in FL and had a brief nice chat. Seems like a very nice guy. Approachable, without the 1990s "bow down, I'm WAY CORPS" attitude.
Re:"The music he has playing at his web site is VERY good!"
If you like that sort of thing, I guess. I could post a Beethoven sonata that wouldn't get high marks with this crowd you do know. But it just so happens that I have tune most everyone here will like.. I'll just make you go to another thread or ask for it here. Hereeeee's the link HERE!!! Anyone want some more of it?
Re:"The music he has playing at his web site is VERY good!"
If you like that sort of thing, I guess. I could post a Beethoven sonata that wouldn't get high marks with this crowd you do know. But it just so happens that I have tune most everyone here will like.. I'll just make you go to another thread or ask for it here. Hereeeee's the link HERE!!! Anyone want some more of it?
Although he hasn't left TWI, it looks like he is branching out and doing his own thing. According to his myspace page he just released an album.
(probably his first secular music since before joining TWI)
I will have to say(ducks head quickly to avoid flying objects) it's nice to see that some of these TWI lifers are starting to feel comfortable enough to stretch out and pursue there own ambitions.
He ain't that comfortable honey. Like any recording artist, he just wants to make sales. He and I were very close friends way back when, and when he saw me trying to get in touch with him he was really happy, until he learned I excused myself from hanging with TWI. Cold shoulder, terse, vague, not the Bob I knew at all. It broke my heart. And this just happened today, about 10amPDT. The album is great, he said the reason he is doing this album is for outreach. That's a quote kids. :( :( :( :( :(
He ain't that comfortable honey. Like any recording artist, he just wants to make sales. He and I were very close friends way back when, and when he saw me trying to get in touch with him he was really happy, until he learned I excused myself from hanging with TWI. Cold shoulder, terse, vague, not the Bob I knew at all. It broke my heart. And this just happened today, about 10amPDT. The album is great, he said the reason he is doing this album is for outreach. That's a quote kids. :( :( :( :( :(
So sad that even in the 'kinder gentler' TWi members still can't maintain friendships with those that left TWi.
Still, for TWI folk this has got to be the most exciting thing since LCM. I wonder if they will do a 250 radius for his concerts? Will the concerts have an overt'go to fellowship with TWI message?
If he does bring in numbers, he could be the next Prez.
True artist. Loved his older Waystuff.... the music was honest and raw, but it did represent the party line, particularly LCM -- at times in some aberrant forms of the Pres' theology. But the music was good.
What I heard at the myspace site was cool.... I too am glad he's still producing.
from his bio:
As he was searching for his true identity, a friend introduced him to the spiritual side of life and Robert found the answers and peace he’d been searching for. He also found that he could actually benefit people by way of his music and he spent years developing his ability to paint word-pictures with his lyrics that would communicate the love, power, and peace he finally had in his life.
So sad that even in the 'kinder gentler' TWi members still can't maintain friendships with those that left TWi.
Still, for TWI folk this has got to be the most exciting thing since LCM. I wonder if they will do a 250 radius for his concerts? Will the concerts have an overt'go to fellowship with TWI message?
If he does bring in numbers, he could be the next Prez.
I got another email from Bob today. He compared me excusing myself from the Way to the betrayal in a marriage. Sez that he stayed, it was rough, Craig is gone, he was a jerk, but once you have worked in a common cause with someone and they leave, the trust is gone.
I am going to sit on this for a day or two and allow God to work in me before I respond. Because whatever I say may be important to bringing some unity back in this situation. heart to heartwise. He did invite me to a Way fellowship, I just don't have the heart to tell him that the people that fellowship with the Way won't allow us in their home.
I don't know about you guys, but I didn't leave because the party got boring or I had to go to work, I decided on my own free will to not hang around a place that spews biblical platitudes and doesn't live what they believe. I mean what were we doing it for, I want rewards. This isn't a contest or a gang war, I want to get the prize. I am going to go God's way, if nobody follows.
In case you haven't noticed, this has turned into a vent. So just take it as that.
I think the most loving thing I can do for him right now, is to show him that I am still his sister, I still support him just like I always did and buy a CD. Money talks .... walks, right?
I did see a great bumper sticker ( I am trying real hard to not cry here, me and him were close. VP had given me a rose bud from the last time I saw him at Gunnison and at the time it meant a great deal, when he died, I took some petals and sent them to Bob.) we were tight.)
the bumper sticker says,
I am not in heat
Get away from my tail.
We shoulda had those around the Way leadership eh?
I got another email from Bob today. He compared me excusing myself from the Way to the betrayal in a marriage. Sez that he stayed, it was rough, Craig is gone, he was a jerk, but once you have worked in a common cause with someone and they leave, the trust is gone.
I am going to sit on this for a day or two and allow God to work in me before I respond. Because whatever I say may be important to bringing some unity back in this situation. heart to heartwise. He did invite me to a Way fellowship, I just don't have the heart to tell him that the people that fellowship with the Way won't allow us in their home.
I don't know about you guys, but I didn't leave because the party got boring or I had to go to work, I decided on my own free will to not hang around a place that spews biblical platitudes and doesn't live what they believe. I mean what were we doing it for, I want rewards. This isn't a contest or a gang war, I want to get the prize. I am going to go God's way, if nobody follows.
In case you haven't noticed, this has turned into a vent. So just take it as that.
I think the most loving thing I can do for him right now, is to show him that I am still his sister, I still support him just like I always did and buy a CD. Money talks .... walks, right?
I did see a great bumper sticker ( I am trying real hard to not cry here, me and him were close. VP had given me a rose bud from the last time I saw him at Gunnison and at the time it meant a great deal, when he died, I took some petals and sent them to Bob.) we were tight.)
the bumper sticker says,
I am not in heat
Get away from my tail.
We shoulda had those around the Way leadership eh?
Thanks for letting me talk,
Lucy
Lucy,
He's brainwashed and can't see the truth. There's an element of truth in his analogy of excusing one's self from TWI being like betrayal in a marriage. It's just on the other side. Most licensed counselors equate spiritual abuse as very similar to emotional and even physical spousal abuse. So the betrayal in the marriage would be the one having the power and authority abusing the weaker like an abusive husband emotionally and physically abusing the wife.
You should tell him that. I hear he refused a request to go to HQ and be the new face of Way Prod. So he's not buying in to drinking all the kool aid even though he's acting like a jerk to you.
I know exactly how you feel. I do still have some friends who are involved in twi - and they don't seem to have that much of a problem with me not wanting to be a part of the organization anymore, so it is possible to maintain a friendship outside of twi... admittedly, it does not have the same closeness that it used to - and there are certain things we just don't talk about because we know where the other stands on thhe issues at hand.
But these people I speak of are very exceptional people - not your typical twi followers. They do think for themselves and know there are problems with their religion. They just don't think there is anything better out there, so they are sticking it out hoping things get better.
In a way, I hope they do get better for them, and in a way, I wish they would wake up.
The hardest thing for them to see is that it hasn't really changed - it just has a nicer veneer than it used to - but at the root, at the heart, the same people are running things. Rosie may not yell like LCM, but she did provide him with women - so she was involved in the offense and just as guilty. A rose by any other name... smells like poopoo. They just can't see it right now. And to tell them that VP did what LCM did and worse is like telling them that Jesus Christ was a drug dealer. They just can't understand.
So, we keep the conversation polite...
Just keep in mind, these are people who have been and are being deceived. They are not in their right minds... They don't know.
Hope you have good fortune in your talk with your friend.
Lucy, my sense is that Bob is not so easy to put in a box. Like you, my "strategy" is to love like Christ loved -- to appreciate and value those he gave his life for. That's pretty easy for me when it comes to Bob Stanley. I too bought the new CD. My kids grew up on God First. They are wonderfully matured Christian women now, each in their own right. I bet they'll get a kick out of Bob's latest rock and roll offering.
Well, I prayed about it, and I thought about it and this is what I wrote.
Dear Bob, Can I call you Bob or do you prefer Robert,
I am so glad you responded with the same honesty, heart and love that I remember you had toward me. That made me happy, and I mean happy like (you have a couple of girls so you will understand what I am about to say) wagging my hands, grinning from ear to ear, jumping around like I gotta pee happy. Although the content was serious and not to negate that, that's how you feel and I appreciate that. I am sorry that you were hurt when people left, I hadn't thought of that. I am really sorry, can you forgive me?
This is how I felt about it, I had had a great WOW year 86-87 and come home to the Rock and all anybody could talk about is Chris Geer, what he wrote, what is Craig gonna do and all that bothered me but it was coming at me so fast I needed to digest what was going on. I went back to Clearwater, and in June of 1988 I had to get back to Atlanta, my dad had died about two weeks before my WOW year was over, I swear Bob my WOW sisters had to practically throw me on a bus and tie me down, I was not gonna leave my assignment but Susan got to me, I kept saying my dad will understand, I know he would, she goes, but your mom won't. So I went home for the funeral and my WOW sisters picked me up, my mom put them up in a hotel for the night and we left for the Rock. Well, in June of 1988 my mom needed me so I went home. It was an honor to be with her and with a lot of help from God I got through her dying in my arms. I thought it was appropriate, that's where we first met, when the nurse put me in her arms, so to say goodbye in my arms was poignant to say the least.
Well, the fellowship in the area at the time was whacked out and I quit going. It didn't bless me anymore. They weren't teaching the Word, I wasn't learning or growing so why stay. Then I heard about all the hullabaloo going on, John Lynn this, Ralph D**y that, Chris Geer this, Craig has turned this, and I said to myself, why do I wanna watch the ministry that I loved dearly crash and burn, there is no Word of God left, its all confusion, paranoia and ..... What I loved died with Dr. Weirwille. What's left is something I do not know. You say things are great, not perfect, but great, that's wonderful for you, is the Word taught, is it rightly divided, is it fitly spoken?
You wrote:
As far as how people treat you, think about this: When someone who has worked for a common cause with someone else decides they don't want to do that anymore, it sends a message that says "I no longer think what you
believe in is worthy." Then to say "but let's just do
everything else we did before" is unrealistic. The trust has been destroyed. Burned bridges are just that. That's why things have to be thought through all the way first. Cause and effect is a fact of life, maybe even a law.
Let me see if I understand you, I am assuming the common cause you refer to is The Word of God. The commitment in my heart has never varied, I love God and His Word above anything or anyone else. He and His Word are my priority so if you think I left because I didn't want to do that anymore, that is just not so. Here is why I excused myself from the matter. And trust me, my beloved brother, it almost drove me insane trying to decide what to do, until I went to God's Word to hear His opinion in the matter.
Who [is] a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom. But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. This wisdom descendeth not from above, but [is] earthly, sensual, devilish. For where envying and strife [is], there [is] confusion and every evil work. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, [and] easy to be in treated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace. (Jam 3:13-18 JV)
I cannot speak for anyone but me but I loved my time with the Way, I saw nothing untoward from Dr. Weirwille, until I started to study the Scriptures daily to see is those things were so, on some points he was mistaken, but that's on him and he is responsible to God for what he taught, to bash him, condemn him or anything else is silly, could I have done any better at the time, no, and even so
I believe he had the love of God in his heart and we all see through a glass darkly. Every conversation I had with him the Word was at the focus, and if I had something I did not understand and for me that was the administrations, church of the bride church of the body and events surrounding the return of Christ I would talk to him about that and he would tell me to keep working on it, and once he said, maybe I need to read it again, you may have a point. I could talk to him, because there was love there and a mutual respect that we were both intelligent God loving Bible believing people and if it is God's Word it will stand, if not, then we change. He said that in the class. We change. Because it isn't a ministry we are loyal to, it's not a board of trustees we admire, it's God.
God admonishes us from jump street to not allow anything to get ahead of our fellowship with Him, nothing.
No other gods, I am loyal to God and only God and to Him only do I answer for my actions.
I have been busy the past fours years, I made God's Word my life, my breath, my heartbeat, I am loyal to Him.
I studied out the things I never understood, and when I got to the True Word on those subjects, and let me tell you, God opened the eyes of my understanding so I can know. Now I do. The entire Word of God made sense. All of it, I understand how it all ties together. And if I had to leave the ministry to get to the point where I am a capable honest workman of God's Word, who goes to the Word with no preconceived ideas and allow God to speak, then I would do it again, in a New York minute. Jesus Christ died so I could fellowship with God and I will be damned if I will let anyone make me feel bad about my decisions, because everything I have done since I was called to my calling in November of 1983 is for my fellowship with God so He can work in me to will and to do His Good Pleasure. I am walking the walk God called me to walk, in the manner in called me and I can teach God's Word and really change people if they so desire. It's the Word that does the changing, I just speak it.
Hbr 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing
even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the
thoughts and intents of the heart.
That's what is important. God's Word.
I love you and like I said on myspace I didn't stop praying for you, thinking about you, and trusting God that you and your family are blessed. All I want for you is God's Best.
he gave us free will honey, it's our lives to choose, no one elses, and to be angry at me for thinking I left you in the trenches to fight alone, that is just not so. God called me for His Purpose, just like He called you to yours. To be angry and hurt and bitter about our choices isn't loving, now is it? I only want God's best for you, Bob. You were there for me at the lowest point in my walk to date, and your love and support helped me many many times. I cherish that.
Can I ask you something? I know you, you had to have a reason and a damn good one to stick around through all the hard times, shall we say? Can you tell me so I can understand? I really want to know.
I suppose you know that I am engaged, don't ya? You know when it happened, when I quit telling God what I
wanted in a husband and asked Him to help me be the kind of woman a man I wanted would want.
I worked on me, and boom that quick. Ain't getting any younger, ya know. I am 48. When you and first met I was
25. I saw the page your brother put up and saw your family. I am so happy for you. You deserve to be happy.
Lovingly,
At Your Service,
J
>^..^<
Well, that's what I said. I tried to be as gentle as possible, tried real hard to not offend, and let hi know my door is always open. It's the goodness of God that leadeth a man to repentence. It's better to be loving than it is to be right. He loves me, we were dear friends. So maybe God can remind him of that.
My only regret about leaving was that I couldn't figure out how to tell people goodbye because I was so afraid that I wouldn't follow through on our decision. I knew we had to leave, that people wouldn't understand why and that I was really going to miss these people because I loved them.
My only regret about leaving was that I couldn't figure out how to tell people goodbye because I was so afraid that I wouldn't follow through on our decision. I knew we had to leave, that people wouldn't understand why and that I was really going to miss these people because I loved them.
I never thought about how to tell people goodbye, obviously, as noted in the hurt Bob feels. If I had to concern myself with how people were going to react it would have clouded my thinking. My only concern was my heart, my sanity, and my walk with God. Over time, as noted above, I have had opportunity to speak with those that meant a great deal. I am glad about the Corps site, although it rankles people feathers, they are the people I spent the most time with and to know most of them are doing ok is a blessing.
I never stopped loving any of God's people, even the ones that started this whole thing. To be anything else defeats the purpose of taking a stand.
It is always right to be loving. I don't have to agree with those that oppose God's Word in any fashion, but I am obligated by The master to love them. What I am trying to figure out is how John the Baptist could say Oh generation of vipers and that be loving. And Jesus in some of the things he said and did. But it had to be loving or he wouldn't have fulfilled the criteria God set before him. That is a ponderable.
Because when I call somebody a blankedy blank blank, love isn't what I am thinking. So that's something for God to teach me. And He does. He has never failed me in all these years. He isn't bound to a church, or ministry or anything except His Word and all He wants is my company.
I haven't heard back from him yet, I think I got right to the heart of the matter so it's gonna take time. He is just his own man enough to give whta I said a lot of thought. Hope so.
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Bramble
Bob Stanley wasn't in TWI in the nineties. I thought he left in the late eighties. Most of IL left with Joe Guarini, didn't they?
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JustSayNO
Nope he is still quite involved. He has been in Georgia since 1995/6 and was (is?) a BC there. When he first went there people said he would very seldom play or sing except at big functions. After craigster left I hear that he started playing a lot more and seemed to enjoy it again.
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Bramble
Rather odd that he has so many ex twis on his myspace then, what with TWIs M&A against those who left the household.
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JustSayNO
Odd as it may be, I have it from a very reliable source that he is still in. Whether he is still full time Way Corp or not is unsure. If he is not paid staff any more then this actually would make alot of sense.
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penguin
Yep! Before Bob was in Georgia he was doing a branch in Pensacola Fl which at the time he left that branch was counted as part of the AL limb. They were there for several years before going to Atlanta.
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WordWolf
He was still performing as of ROA '89, but he wasn't putting as much work into it.
I had heard he left in 1990, but that was hearsay and word-of-mouth.
It appears this was wrong.
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Rocky
The music he has playing at his web site is VERY good!
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Seth R.
I think LCM trotted him out to sing one song at an ROA in '92 or '93 my memory is hazy.
Seth
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JustThinking
Seth,
I seem to remember the same thing. There were a few folks like Dave Lutz who were still in but packed up and moved out of the cornfield. Dave was given the great honor of performing once while I was at HQ visiting.
Not sure if Bob's circumstances were. I ran into him at a ROA while he was in FL and had a brief nice chat. Seems like a very nice guy. Approachable, without the 1990s "bow down, I'm WAY CORPS" attitude.
JT
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Sudo
Rocky,
Re:"The music he has playing at his web site is VERY good!"
If you like that sort of thing, I guess. I could post a Beethoven sonata that wouldn't get high marks with this crowd you do know. But it just so happens that I have tune most everyone here will like.. I'll just make you go to another thread or ask for it here.
Hereeeee's the link HERE!!! Anyone want some more of it?
sudo
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cheranne
Oh man sudo! That kinda scared me a little(I use to really like that song)
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Rocky
No thank you.
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seaspray
Yeah Sudo, I can dig it. Sorta sounds like Ozzy Osborne (lite) meets the guys on the road to Emmaus before the Lord.
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lucyvanpelt
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Bramble
So sad that even in the 'kinder gentler' TWi members still can't maintain friendships with those that left TWi.
Still, for TWI folk this has got to be the most exciting thing since LCM. I wonder if they will do a 250 radius for his concerts? Will the concerts have an overt'go to fellowship with TWI message?
If he does bring in numbers, he could be the next Prez.
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anotherDan
True artist. Loved his older Waystuff.... the music was honest and raw, but it did represent the party line, particularly LCM -- at times in some aberrant forms of the Pres' theology. But the music was good.
What I heard at the myspace site was cool.... I too am glad he's still producing.
from his bio:
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lucyvanpelt
I got another email from Bob today. He compared me excusing myself from the Way to the betrayal in a marriage. Sez that he stayed, it was rough, Craig is gone, he was a jerk, but once you have worked in a common cause with someone and they leave, the trust is gone.
I am going to sit on this for a day or two and allow God to work in me before I respond. Because whatever I say may be important to bringing some unity back in this situation. heart to heartwise. He did invite me to a Way fellowship, I just don't have the heart to tell him that the people that fellowship with the Way won't allow us in their home.
I don't know about you guys, but I didn't leave because the party got boring or I had to go to work, I decided on my own free will to not hang around a place that spews biblical platitudes and doesn't live what they believe. I mean what were we doing it for, I want rewards. This isn't a contest or a gang war, I want to get the prize. I am going to go God's way, if nobody follows.
In case you haven't noticed, this has turned into a vent. So just take it as that.
I think the most loving thing I can do for him right now, is to show him that I am still his sister, I still support him just like I always did and buy a CD. Money talks .... walks, right?
I did see a great bumper sticker ( I am trying real hard to not cry here, me and him were close. VP had given me a rose bud from the last time I saw him at Gunnison and at the time it meant a great deal, when he died, I took some petals and sent them to Bob.) we were tight.)
the bumper sticker says,
I am not in heat
Get away from my tail.
We shoulda had those around the Way leadership eh?
Thanks for letting me talk,
Lucy
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chockfull
Lucy,
He's brainwashed and can't see the truth. There's an element of truth in his analogy of excusing one's self from TWI being like betrayal in a marriage. It's just on the other side. Most licensed counselors equate spiritual abuse as very similar to emotional and even physical spousal abuse. So the betrayal in the marriage would be the one having the power and authority abusing the weaker like an abusive husband emotionally and physically abusing the wife.
You should tell him that. I hear he refused a request to go to HQ and be the new face of Way Prod. So he's not buying in to drinking all the kool aid even though he's acting like a jerk to you.
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JavaJane
Lucy,
I know exactly how you feel. I do still have some friends who are involved in twi - and they don't seem to have that much of a problem with me not wanting to be a part of the organization anymore, so it is possible to maintain a friendship outside of twi... admittedly, it does not have the same closeness that it used to - and there are certain things we just don't talk about because we know where the other stands on thhe issues at hand.
But these people I speak of are very exceptional people - not your typical twi followers. They do think for themselves and know there are problems with their religion. They just don't think there is anything better out there, so they are sticking it out hoping things get better.
In a way, I hope they do get better for them, and in a way, I wish they would wake up.
The hardest thing for them to see is that it hasn't really changed - it just has a nicer veneer than it used to - but at the root, at the heart, the same people are running things. Rosie may not yell like LCM, but she did provide him with women - so she was involved in the offense and just as guilty. A rose by any other name... smells like poopoo. They just can't see it right now. And to tell them that VP did what LCM did and worse is like telling them that Jesus Christ was a drug dealer. They just can't understand.
So, we keep the conversation polite...
Just keep in mind, these are people who have been and are being deceived. They are not in their right minds... They don't know.
Hope you have good fortune in your talk with your friend.
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frank123lol
Gotta add my two cents,Shifting the blame is twis game,he shifted blame to you,that way?Tada ministry is not blamed
How they get around dumping on lcm is beyond me,since he could blow them out of the water.
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anotherDan
Lucy, my sense is that Bob is not so easy to put in a box. Like you, my "strategy" is to love like Christ loved -- to appreciate and value those he gave his life for. That's pretty easy for me when it comes to Bob Stanley. I too bought the new CD. My kids grew up on God First. They are wonderfully matured Christian women now, each in their own right. I bet they'll get a kick out of Bob's latest rock and roll offering.
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lucyvanpelt
Well, I prayed about it, and I thought about it and this is what I wrote.
Dear Bob, Can I call you Bob or do you prefer Robert,
I am so glad you responded with the same honesty, heart and love that I remember you had toward me. That made me happy, and I mean happy like (you have a couple of girls so you will understand what I am about to say) wagging my hands, grinning from ear to ear, jumping around like I gotta pee happy. Although the content was serious and not to negate that, that's how you feel and I appreciate that. I am sorry that you were hurt when people left, I hadn't thought of that. I am really sorry, can you forgive me?
This is how I felt about it, I had had a great WOW year 86-87 and come home to the Rock and all anybody could talk about is Chris Geer, what he wrote, what is Craig gonna do and all that bothered me but it was coming at me so fast I needed to digest what was going on. I went back to Clearwater, and in June of 1988 I had to get back to Atlanta, my dad had died about two weeks before my WOW year was over, I swear Bob my WOW sisters had to practically throw me on a bus and tie me down, I was not gonna leave my assignment but Susan got to me, I kept saying my dad will understand, I know he would, she goes, but your mom won't. So I went home for the funeral and my WOW sisters picked me up, my mom put them up in a hotel for the night and we left for the Rock. Well, in June of 1988 my mom needed me so I went home. It was an honor to be with her and with a lot of help from God I got through her dying in my arms. I thought it was appropriate, that's where we first met, when the nurse put me in her arms, so to say goodbye in my arms was poignant to say the least.
Well, the fellowship in the area at the time was whacked out and I quit going. It didn't bless me anymore. They weren't teaching the Word, I wasn't learning or growing so why stay. Then I heard about all the hullabaloo going on, John Lynn this, Ralph D**y that, Chris Geer this, Craig has turned this, and I said to myself, why do I wanna watch the ministry that I loved dearly crash and burn, there is no Word of God left, its all confusion, paranoia and ..... What I loved died with Dr. Weirwille. What's left is something I do not know. You say things are great, not perfect, but great, that's wonderful for you, is the Word taught, is it rightly divided, is it fitly spoken?
You wrote:
As far as how people treat you, think about this: When someone who has worked for a common cause with someone else decides they don't want to do that anymore, it sends a message that says "I no longer think what you
believe in is worthy." Then to say "but let's just do
everything else we did before" is unrealistic. The trust has been destroyed. Burned bridges are just that. That's why things have to be thought through all the way first. Cause and effect is a fact of life, maybe even a law.
Let me see if I understand you, I am assuming the common cause you refer to is The Word of God. The commitment in my heart has never varied, I love God and His Word above anything or anyone else. He and His Word are my priority so if you think I left because I didn't want to do that anymore, that is just not so. Here is why I excused myself from the matter. And trust me, my beloved brother, it almost drove me insane trying to decide what to do, until I went to God's Word to hear His opinion in the matter.
Who [is] a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom. But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. This wisdom descendeth not from above, but [is] earthly, sensual, devilish. For where envying and strife [is], there [is] confusion and every evil work. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, [and] easy to be in treated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace. (Jam 3:13-18 JV)
I cannot speak for anyone but me but I loved my time with the Way, I saw nothing untoward from Dr. Weirwille, until I started to study the Scriptures daily to see is those things were so, on some points he was mistaken, but that's on him and he is responsible to God for what he taught, to bash him, condemn him or anything else is silly, could I have done any better at the time, no, and even so
I believe he had the love of God in his heart and we all see through a glass darkly. Every conversation I had with him the Word was at the focus, and if I had something I did not understand and for me that was the administrations, church of the bride church of the body and events surrounding the return of Christ I would talk to him about that and he would tell me to keep working on it, and once he said, maybe I need to read it again, you may have a point. I could talk to him, because there was love there and a mutual respect that we were both intelligent God loving Bible believing people and if it is God's Word it will stand, if not, then we change. He said that in the class. We change. Because it isn't a ministry we are loyal to, it's not a board of trustees we admire, it's God.
God admonishes us from jump street to not allow anything to get ahead of our fellowship with Him, nothing.
No other gods, I am loyal to God and only God and to Him only do I answer for my actions.
I have been busy the past fours years, I made God's Word my life, my breath, my heartbeat, I am loyal to Him.
I studied out the things I never understood, and when I got to the True Word on those subjects, and let me tell you, God opened the eyes of my understanding so I can know. Now I do. The entire Word of God made sense. All of it, I understand how it all ties together. And if I had to leave the ministry to get to the point where I am a capable honest workman of God's Word, who goes to the Word with no preconceived ideas and allow God to speak, then I would do it again, in a New York minute. Jesus Christ died so I could fellowship with God and I will be damned if I will let anyone make me feel bad about my decisions, because everything I have done since I was called to my calling in November of 1983 is for my fellowship with God so He can work in me to will and to do His Good Pleasure. I am walking the walk God called me to walk, in the manner in called me and I can teach God's Word and really change people if they so desire. It's the Word that does the changing, I just speak it.
Hbr 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing
even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the
thoughts and intents of the heart.
That's what is important. God's Word.
I love you and like I said on myspace I didn't stop praying for you, thinking about you, and trusting God that you and your family are blessed. All I want for you is God's Best.
he gave us free will honey, it's our lives to choose, no one elses, and to be angry at me for thinking I left you in the trenches to fight alone, that is just not so. God called me for His Purpose, just like He called you to yours. To be angry and hurt and bitter about our choices isn't loving, now is it? I only want God's best for you, Bob. You were there for me at the lowest point in my walk to date, and your love and support helped me many many times. I cherish that.
Can I ask you something? I know you, you had to have a reason and a damn good one to stick around through all the hard times, shall we say? Can you tell me so I can understand? I really want to know.
I suppose you know that I am engaged, don't ya? You know when it happened, when I quit telling God what I
wanted in a husband and asked Him to help me be the kind of woman a man I wanted would want.
I worked on me, and boom that quick. Ain't getting any younger, ya know. I am 48. When you and first met I was
25. I saw the page your brother put up and saw your family. I am so happy for you. You deserve to be happy.
Lovingly,
At Your Service,
J
>^..^<
Well, that's what I said. I tried to be as gentle as possible, tried real hard to not offend, and let hi know my door is always open. It's the goodness of God that leadeth a man to repentence. It's better to be loving than it is to be right. He loves me, we were dear friends. So maybe God can remind him of that.
Lucy
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penguin
Awesome letter lucy.
My only regret about leaving was that I couldn't figure out how to tell people goodbye because I was so afraid that I wouldn't follow through on our decision. I knew we had to leave, that people wouldn't understand why and that I was really going to miss these people because I loved them.
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lucyvanpelt
I never thought about how to tell people goodbye, obviously, as noted in the hurt Bob feels. If I had to concern myself with how people were going to react it would have clouded my thinking. My only concern was my heart, my sanity, and my walk with God. Over time, as noted above, I have had opportunity to speak with those that meant a great deal. I am glad about the Corps site, although it rankles people feathers, they are the people I spent the most time with and to know most of them are doing ok is a blessing.
I never stopped loving any of God's people, even the ones that started this whole thing. To be anything else defeats the purpose of taking a stand.
It is always right to be loving. I don't have to agree with those that oppose God's Word in any fashion, but I am obligated by The master to love them. What I am trying to figure out is how John the Baptist could say Oh generation of vipers and that be loving. And Jesus in some of the things he said and did. But it had to be loving or he wouldn't have fulfilled the criteria God set before him. That is a ponderable.
Because when I call somebody a blankedy blank blank, love isn't what I am thinking. So that's something for God to teach me. And He does. He has never failed me in all these years. He isn't bound to a church, or ministry or anything except His Word and all He wants is my company.
I haven't heard back from him yet, I think I got right to the heart of the matter so it's gonna take time. He is just his own man enough to give whta I said a lot of thought. Hope so.
me
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