Looking for a church/religion after twi

[JavaJane]

Hubby and I are looking for a church... for the second time since we left twi.

First time seemed like it was going ok.

Until they started casting out devils and getting revelations about people's problems (too close to twi for me!!)

And when the pastor kept trying to get me to come forward in front of the congregation and give my heart to Jesus...

And when he stared at us and said that he could sense UNFORGIVENESS in some people in the room... that we needed to forgive all the people who hurt us.

(not that that's a terrible idea, but I am no where near ready for that yet.)

Just gave me the creeps.

Anyway, we've decided to look again, although I think we may have a difficult time of it. Especially with anyone who has a title like Reverend, or Pastor, or Father, or Elder.

See, I was involved in this cult, and it kinda gave me a complex about authority figures, you know?

[penguin]

JavaJane,

Hey! I hope you can find one. I kept driving by the one I ended up at--the last few months I was in twi I kept having this thought that I should go to that church as I drove by while going to work. It took me 3-4 months of having that nagging thought every day--with me usually answering, "Why in the world should I go to a church for?" Finally I went to prove to myself that there was something out there besides twi and that God was bigger than twi and what twi made Him to be.

I haven't regretted it--I haven't been told what to do--there's no power plays going on---I have grown tons in the couple of years I have attended.

[Twinky]

Jane, find another church. You have to feel comfortable there, otherwise no point. You've done the spiritual bullying bit, you don't need to do that again. The right place (for the time being) might not be within the "denomination" you are expecting it to be.

[penguin]

Jane, find another church. You have to feel comfortable there, otherwise no point. You've done the spiritual bullying bit, you don't need to do that again. The right place (for the time being) might not be within the "denomination" you are expecting it to be.

Yes! Find a church that knows about Cloud/Townsend's book on Boundaries!! You have to find safe people to be around who don't want to run your life.

My pastor knew of the way---some people who were already members had left twi themselves. He was encouraging but never told me what to do. Thats what the whole congregation is like so far. They have a principle that everyone has to agree on--advice requires permission. No one is allowed to give you any advice unless you tell them you want some first.

[Watered Garden]

I would visit a LOT of churches. Make sure you know every jot and tittle of their doctrine before you commit.

[Ham]

I dunno.. I just can't commit to any one given belief anymore..

[hampshire73]

I didn't go to church right away after leaving TWI, but I still read the Bible on my own and tried to instill basic Christian values in my children. We visited a couple of churches with non-TWI friends, but I didn't start really looking for a church to join until 1991, about 5 years after leaving TWI. I had a list of churches that I wanted to check out, and I started with the one across the street. I immediately felt at home. It was not the same denomination I was raised in but the service was very similar, and the people were friendly. Some of them reminded me of people I'd known in my childhood church.

What really got me to go there the second time, though, was that the minister came to visit me after my first visit. We talked about doctrine, including the trinity. I was so used to being berated by non-TWI Christians about that issue, but he didn't do that. He told me that he believed in the trinity, but he knew it wasn't spelled out in the Bible, and therefore I was not required to accept it. I still intended to check out the other churches on my list, but around that time, I met my second husband who just happened to be planning to visit that church because a friend of his had told him about it. The rest is history.

After a few years, we moved to another state and stayed with the same denomination, although I worked for a couple of years at a non-denominational church in the area. I have felt welcome and respected at both places, but the non-denominational church is more into requiring members to adhere to the pastor's interpretation of the scriptures. Most of the time I agree with him, but sometimes I don't. I find that I'm more comfortable with being a member of the denominational church and visiting the non-denominational one occasionally.

Also, I agree with what Watered Garden said. Although I didn't end up visiting a LOT of churches before deciding on one, I did read all the information about the denomination's doctrine and I talked with the minister about all kinds of issues before becoming a member.

[JavaJane]

This is very interesting to me... One thing I have thought of is that I might feel more comfortable with a large denominational church than a small non-denominational church. Reason being - I can more easily blend into the background in a large congregation, and I don't think they will have a whole lot of interest in trying to run my life for me.

Never thought in my twi days I would ever say something like that!

[Mark Clarke]

Have you tried studying the Bible on your own? There are many resources available online that we never had in TWI. You can examine various viewpoints and make up your own mind what you believe, in the comfort of your own home. And you can interact with others online as well, not only here at GSC but elsewhere too.

[JavaJane]

Have you tried studying the Bible on your own? There are many resources available online that we never had in TWI. You can examine various viewpoints and make up your own mind what you believe, in the comfort of your own home. And you can interact with others online as well, not only here at GSC but elsewhere too.

Yes, I do read and study the Bible on my own. This is not the reason why we are considering finding a church in the area... Our reasons are more about finding a group of people who we can spend time with in person who also love God and ascribe to the same basic belief system that we do.

Also, we are looking forward to starting a family one day. Since both of us were involved in some sort of religious upbringing we would like to have our child be a part of a church growing up as well. Some of my best memories as a small child were when we would visit my grandmother and I would get to go to Sunday School at her church (I was raised in twi for the most part... but before my family got involved, we went to a normal church.)

So, the whole studying the Bible part doesn't really fit for me personally... I know that is why a lot of people go to church, (and it was the reason why I stayed with twi as long as I did) but it is not the reason I am looking now.... Hope that makes sense...

[socks]

What kind of church was that? What was the name, if you don't mind me asking. Casting out devils? Collaring newbies? Sensing unforgiveness??? Wow. That's quite a church service.

A lot of ministers riff off facial expression and body language. If you don't look right to them, they start poking around. They don't know what they're looking for but given the time, they'll find something, one way or the other. They gonna make yew right, alright.

I'd look for a church that just has a basic, inspirational service with some order to it like song, music maybe, and a biblical message taught. Look for someone pastoring who seems in touch with reality and speaks to the group like he or she cares about how people are doing. Look at the people, are they happy? Downers? Churches always have a few people that are off-the-chart-so-happy-to-see-you they want to squeeze your head off. But overall, how's the group look? Smell? Hygiene can be important, although not a deal breaker.

Or maybe just a church with a service you like - where you're not fingered as the Newbie and pestered. It can be meaningful to participate in an actual service, like Catholic or Episcopalean, too. There's others, maybe you could ask a friend, neighbor or co-worker where they go.

Trouble is, brand name shopping is still a grab bag of chances. One Brand Name in one city can be loads of fun, few miles away a big drag. If you feel the draw though I'd keep at it, not in a pressured way but in a happy way. :)

Edited June 20, 2008 by socks

[waysider]

Rattlesnakes!!

Ask if they have a burlap sack of them stashed in the back room.

(It's important to get little trivia like that out of the way as early as possible.)

[Mark Clarke]

I posted some info about a church in Peculiar, in the Church Shopping thread over in the Open section.

[Watered Garden]

As I mentioned on another thread we joined a church that was a church plant from another church we had attended for a couple years. We never joined that church. There wasn't any particular pressure to do so, and the only difference was you got to go to business meetings and vote for stuff. Big whoop. We attended a small group and sang in the choir.

I did NOT want to join this new church, but all the other charter members had and at the weekly meeting that served as an elder board, they started bugging my husband, who was a member (I was not; the minister said they only wanted "people with talent who could bring something positive" to the group, when I asked him why the e-mail he sent to MY address was only addressed to my husband). Anyway they wanted this membership packet filled out. After two weeks I did so and I have regretted it ever since.

Oh, and about the deliberate and somewhat rude exclusion from the task force?

I am a somewhat outspoken female individual. It is only recently I found out that this domination believes women are inferior to men and should remain silent for the most part (cooking and cleaning, looking after kiddies, serving God by serving their husbands are acceptable activities, but keep your mouth shut otherwise). I was crushed and disappointed by the nasty reply I got to my e-mail. There are other men who serve on this committee minus their wives, I learned only recently; I had thought I was the only exclusion. But I do think the former pastor was making a point.

I still faithfully attend this church, participate in VBS etc. But I feel hoodwinked; had I know this particular outfit put women down like that I would have smiled sweetly and promised to serve with joy and thanksgiving, but not with that kind of commitment.

The associate pastor who took over the church is young and kind but firm and blunt. He has done wonderful things for my son and his fiancee/wife and I see real change there. But by now I'm just not interested in giving too much of myself. It's all I can do to hang onto my belief in God.

I'm just telling you this to say "Be cautiously optimistic. Know what you are getting into. As others have suggested on this thread, have some in-depth conversations with the pastor. If they have small groups, which are now all the rage in many churches, attend a couple of meetings and get to know people. God will tell you if things are a bit "off."

Good luck.

WG

[bowtwi]

JJ - I'm about an hour north of you. If I were closer I'd check out that church Mark Clarke told you about. Sounds interesting. Besides, we got our puppy in Peculiar - I like that general area...

I attend a First Christian Church (Disciples of Christ). I've checked out our local Baptist, Methodist, am ex-way "Indian fellowship" that meets in a home, and a nondenominational church. The only one I haven't visited in town here is the Assembly of God.

The church I attend have 2 services Sunday mornings - they call the first one 'contemporary' and sing the modern worship songs. Everyone that takes communion, which is offered weekly (I really like that), goes up the aisle to the front to receive communion, then stands in a circle around the church, holding hands while they share their prayers and praises of prayers answered. That's a bit much for me personally. The second service, which I attend, is called the 'traditional' service - they sing the old hymms (which I love) and the communion stuff is passed around the pews. I really enjoy communion offered so often. The Sunday School class joins together at the end for hand-holding in a circle while they pray together. I'm not too uncomfortable with that, altho I could do just as well without the hand-holding part.

I haven't joined and there's never been any pressure to join. I don't tithe there and there's never been any pressure to tithe there. Nobody gives me any guff whatsoever. If I don't go nobody bothers me about it. When I do go they seem glad to see me. I've been attending their Sunday School class and getting a lot out of it.

My daughter's choir director is a member of this church and last week she told my daughter she'd really like to see her sing a song for the congregation. We're working on picking one out this week.

It used to be that whenever I went to church I would actually sob until they got to the teaching. It's been months now since I've even cried much there. I used to get panic attacks in churches and would have to leave immediately. I'm feeling at ease there every time I go.

They don't tell people what to believe. They welcome everyone. They really do welcome everyone. The organ player is gay and doesn't pretend he's not. When he and his partner came to town it was a bit uncomfortable for some, but the preacher is awesome and helped those with issues about it to understand how Jesus would welcome them. When someone in the Sunday School class has a need, the rest work it out together to be sure the one in need has what they can't do for themselves. It's great fun to watch in action. ..

I can't wait to hear what you decide and how it goes. I'm confident that there's a church that'll be a great fit for you.

Edited June 20, 2008 by bowtwi

[JavaJane]

You are all so wonderful...

Socks - I think the place was called Family Worship Center or something like that... Your mention of the body language thing makes sense - because, like bow, I pretty much want to cry when I go to church - I'm pretty good at holding it back, but I'm sure I make some pretty horrible faces in the process. My husband was raised RC, and I actually like the services I have attended - the focus on doing good for people is wonderful... and I like that they acknowledge a female side to God. But there are a lot of other doctrinal stuff I would have to work through before I could consider the Catholic church as a place I would feel comfortable.

Waysider - I think they may have had snakes in the back... We were in the right part of the country for that!

Mark - thanks for the info on that church!

WG - That pastor probably wouldn't like me, either. I'm an outspoken female, too. I liked how you called it a "domination" and not denomination - Freudian slip?? I think you are right, God will let us know if we find the right place or the wrong one. I never felt comfortable in that church we went to with the casting out of devils, and all that even though it seemed like a nice place on the surface.

Bow I totall get the panic attacks and the crying. I do the same thing when I get into a church... I noticed it first when I was still in twi and I went to a Catholic Christmas Mass... I cried through the whole thing... Tearing up now as I think about it.

Why does that happen?? I just don't really understand that yet... I hate crying... probably left over from the old days of not showing or having any emotions.

[hampshire73]

Yes, I do read and study the Bible on my own. This is not the reason why we are considering finding a church in the area... Our reasons are more about finding a group of people who we can spend time with in person who also love God and ascribe to the same basic belief system that we do.

Also, we are looking forward to starting a family one day. Since both of us were involved in some sort of religious upbringing we would like to have our child be a part of a church growing up as well. Some of my best memories as a small child were when we would visit my grandmother and I would get to go to Sunday School at her church (I was raised in twi for the most part... but before my family got involved, we went to a normal church.)

So, the whole studying the Bible part doesn't really fit for me personally... I know that is why a lot of people go to church, (and it was the reason why I stayed with twi as long as I did) but it is not the reason I am looking now.... Hope that makes sense...

JJ, those were the reasons I started looking for a church back then, so it makes perfect sense to me. At that time, I already had children and I wanted them to experience being part of a fellowship of believers (aka, church) when they were growing up. Besides, I needed other Christians to interact with.

The denomination I joined is the Episcopal Church. (I've mentioned it in the other thread.) I've found it to be diverse and welcoming, and there are no doors closed to me as a woman. That is not the case in the non-denominational church I mentioned in an earlier post. Watered Garden, I know what you mean!

[bowtwi]

I don't really know exactly what the sobbing is all about. I know it took me over 3 years to get past it, but I didn't attend church every week for that 3 years.

Everyone has an opinion. I've been told it's cause my heart is SO MEEK. I've been told it's GUILT. I've been told it's SIMPLY MY STYLE OF WORSHIP. I've probably forgotten a few things I'd been told by well-meaning people who set out to fix what's broken in me. Whatever it really is, I'm about done with it.

If you'd like to see if we can get together some time we could probably meet in the middle and it'd only ba a half-hour drive for each of us. You're certainly welcome to come check this church out if you'd like. The first service starts at 8:30. The Sunday School class begins at 9:45 and the second church service begins at 10:50. They have donuts and coffee in a fellowship room in between...

They pray to Jesus. Some of them believe the trinity. I like it cause to me it's simply a matter of being with other Christians to worship God (and maybe Jesus some too) and get fed spiritually.

I have a couple personal stories I'd share with you if you're interested - don't want to post them on a public board, but I believe this preacher is the real deal because of several experiences I've had myself.

The nondenominational church I attended was called New Life Worship Center. I quit going there after an uncomfortable incident regarding speaking in tongues. They were very much "their way or the highway" in their dealing with people. I chose the highway.

[coolchef]

gosh, crying when you go to church?

i don't understand that and i feel sorry for you

i don't mean this in a bad way i just don't understand

keep going though

i enjoy the rcc once or twice a month and father angilo has a royal crown with us once in a while

not in church but at my home or our club

Edited June 20, 2008 by coolchef

[Shellon]

Box, there is not ONE SINGLE thing wrong with you, nothing is broken.

Many people cry in church for as many reasons. Why do people cry at weddings? Cuz they do, that's why.

Maybe you're touched, maybe you're moved by what is being said, maybe you ..........whatever, it's normal.

Hell, I cry at grocery store openings or when I see a newborn baby or hear the pomp and circumstance of a graduation.

Nothing is broken in you.

I'd be concerned with the person who never gets moved or touched or emotional about something touching, moving or emotional.

Maybe you're just you.

Some people cry when their favorite sports team wins, others cry when they just hear the beautiful music played at a church service, some cry cuz they're happy.

Thankfully you can express!

[JavaJane]

Sometimes I think I cry during church because it reminds me of being in twi.

Sometimes I think I cry during church because of all the time I feel like I wasted in twi.

Sometimes I think I cry because I am mad at God (but I don't want to be).

Sometimes I think I cry because I am thankful.

Sometimes I think I cry because I think of all the crap I did while I was in twi that God probably thought wasn't all that great.

Sometimes it's because I don't think I belong anywhere when it comes to a church.

Sometimes it's all of this stuff... And I know most of it is not really right, but its stuff I have to work through.

I think I may be a little broken - but I'm getting better.

[Bramble]

We did try churches after we tried the exway group in our area. I was comfortable in a litugical service, probably because I went to paraochial school and mass throughout my childhood and really had no horribl memories associated with those. Hubby found it boring plus he wasn't sure where he stood on doctrinal stuff, though we eventually went to United Methodist church like he had been raised in.

In many ways I felt like I was playing a role, similar to how I felt those last years in TWI. Plus, quite honestly, I was a full time working mom and it seemed the demands on my time to be more involved kept increasing, even though I was not even well versed in the church's history or doctrine details. And as far as making friends I found I had little in common with the women I was getting to know in interests etc.

Eventually I took a Wicca 101 little seminar in my area because I was curious and had been reading Wicca books, and met a couple women who I had much more in common with. I didn't feel I had to playact a church persona and could be myself. It wasn't a family activity, but for our family, neither was church unless I forced the issue--and that was unpleasant and made me weary. I eased out of church and moved on.

[Twinky]

I would cry quite a lot when I first attended my church too. But I knew what it was. I was just so thankful to God for loving me. A little sad that I hadn't seen it before (when laboring under the condemnation TWI dumped on me) but so thankful that God still loved me and had taken care of my needs. Paul (the vicar) would start preaching (and it was nothing like TWI stuff) - and tears would start pouring from my eyes. In the end I gave up holding back. Tears of joy and thankfulness.

The church also runs a Newcomers group to introduce different facets of the church's work and outreach, and the people responsible for various church activities. There is a Q&A session where questions could be written on paper and put in a box (anonymously if desired) and Paul would answer them very thoughtfully and consideredly. I watched most carefully how he handled everything and how he dealt with people and situations. Very gentle, very calm, very quiet, very compassionate.

He has been a don [lecturer] at Oxford (or is it Cambridge?) Uni so obviously has HUGE intellectual ability which he NEVER flaunts, and he has such a tender heart. Nonetheless he is still a sold-out trinitarian.

Take the best from any church you attend. You don't need to be force-fed or strong-armed into believing or doing anything. Simply allow your heart to be healed.

[bowtwi]

I just spent the last 3 hours going through hymms of worship with my daughter to help her select one that she's going to sing for the church congregation. She was asked last week if she'd like to do this by her school choir diirector who also attends the church we do; she even offered to accompany her on guitar.

While I was playing youtube songs to show Annie what songs I had in mind I started crying and it was tear after tear down my face all during this time. My daughter kept handing me tissues and hugging me as if I needed consoling, but I felt just fine. I was simply crying. I don't feel guilty, I don't feel unworthy (anymore), I don't think these tears are a negative thing at all. I was surprised by them, as I had thought I was all done with that sort of crying, but apparently not.

Maybe it is simply a tender heart. I cry at the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag, when I see people I love receive awards, all sorts of things like that.

I'm not worried about the why of it anymore. If I'm just a tenderheart, that's not the worst thing I could be. I just have learned to keep tissues around. No big deal.

She's chosen In The Garden. I sure hope I can get this on video.

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

Java, hope you find a church you can feeel comfortable with. BTW, my church has 2 different worship services(I am Lutheran). The 9 am service is contemporary using powerpoint on large TV screens using Casting Crowns, Hillsongs, Newsboys, etc. The 11am is traditional liturgy and uses 4 hardback hymnals-1958 Service Book and Hymnal, 1978 Lutheran Book of Worship, 1999 This Far By Faith(African American), 2006 Evangelical Lutheran Worship(700 hymns), and 2 paperback supplements-Hymnal supplement 1991, and 1995 With One Voice(both are thin having only 200-300 hymns/songs). The later service includes European, North American, African, Asian, and Latino/Carribean= blended styles. My congregation tries to show hospitality to both members and visitors, and invites to them to small group "cells" for video classes like ALPHA and Beginings for new people(first is from Great Britain and 2nd is from Methodist), with follow-up video classes(free food, free childcare, free books- unlike Pilaf by VD Wierdwolf). We now return your Television sets/computers to you until the next episode of the Outer Limits(or was that the TWIlite Zoning)