Yeah, we watched the Wed. show, with the close of "Shout" and then the singers did it again on Thursday.
We were also surprised, pleasantly. It's a great song, and has a classic chorus and turnaround in it. Darlene Zschech who wrote it, has written some very kick-asz Christian music, in the pop genre. I'm definitely a fan, as is our family.
I was a tad surprised they rewrote the lyric, with "My shepherd", instead of "My Jesus". The second performance Thursday I heard the original lyric "My Jesus", unless my ears put it in, they sang the original.
I like this kind of tune, it typifiies the "praise" hymn or song.
I was left with the question of what inspired the producers to use it. It's clearly a statement of praise and hope to God through Jesus Christ as redeemer and savior of mankind. The vignettes the Tuesday program showed displayed people in the most sorrowful of circumstance. I found the balance of the act of love to help those who need it the most - children - and the statement of joyful praise to God in that song...well, wonderfully refreshing.
We only heard it the night when they removed the "J" word. Also noticed that after it was all over with some guy comes out spouting bleeped out words.
Mr. Garden commented there were about 3 people singing like they actually believed what they were singing.
It was nice they did it at all, even if they did want it to be politically correct, leaving out the name of the politically incorrect Saviour of all mankind.
I don't watch American Idol, but is this song one of those creepy tunes that is on that infomercial for the hand waving, glassy eyed praise & worship CD? Seems like it was...... That thing is scarier than the night of the living dead. They look like zombies from the Thriller Video cleaned up. Why it's more annoying than the Head-On commercials.
Thoughts ? ......... Does anybody think it odd that a group of people who want us to worship them as our next American Idol, are singing a song about someone that had no earthly Idols? I Do.......
Mr. Garden commented there were about 3 people singing like they actually believed what they were singing.
We talked a bit about that - that everyone was singing. Now, A.I. being what it is, or what I've thought it was anyway, they do a lot of that. Singers sing and AI singers are in a popularity competition, with some talent, sometimes a lot of talent, and lots of drama mixed in. Pretty much every season contains some music marriages made in he ll, "Neil Sedaka" nights, metal singers singing country, odd pairings and couplings of all types. Kids singing Beatles songs they've never heard.
Point - while it seemed "odd" for some reason, in reality it isn't based on history. AI does a lot of odd things. This season seems to be one of the first that's gotten it's head on straight. When a contestant is "voted off" they don't sing them off with endless choruses of "so you had a bad day" or some other weepy tune. They play "celebrate me home", Kenny Loggins's tune. I like that. It puts the whole experience in perspective, putting a positive forward thinking motion to it rather than an "aaaaahhhhhhwwwwwwww.....toooo bad!" feel.(especially since some of the early non-winners do as well or better getting their careers going than the actual winners and runner ups).
Then they had the winners of a Band competiton show this summer perform a couple weeks ago, 3 brothers who won it after doing a bluegrass-ish version of "This Little Light of Mine", a children's style gospel style tune from way back. They performed a full rendition of the version on AI,which again, kind of took me by a-ha. That tune was the core of what the 3 brothers played, their energy and "sound" so it was authentic for them to play it, but clearly there was no one forcing them to not do a Christian tune. I dont' actually like their version, it's a little amped up for that style, but hey, it's their thing and they seemed to do it well.
So - it's innerestin'. I assume the singers sang it with at least as much conviction as they mustered for a pack of Dolly Parton songs which they'd probably never sing in a million years, maybe more. Maybe they meant it. Maybe it was right up their alley, maybe some figured hey, I sang a Dolly Parton song I'd never heard before and liked it. I'm smiling, I'm two-steppin'. Waddya want?
Speaking of who, closed the show that featured her songs as choices with - a "gospel" message tune.
So we are kinda wondering whaasssup with AI. I like the tone, don't feel it's unnatural, and that it's a good tone to take. Does seem like a switch. That song seemed to wrap up the vibe, the message, the call to help and hope that their charitable efforts addressed.
Ignoring the Christian music market cuts out a huge piece of the listening audience, methinks. The fact that "Shout" is in the pop music mold is typical of what a lot of people listen to these days. If you like it, it's great. Some don't, prefer other styles, some think it's all wrong to begin with. So even in this field of music everyone won't be pleased, some will be insulted, some outraged, and many more left out. Some will love it for various reasons including diggin' the sound.
By the by - thanks for bringing this online here ex10.
Well, I was a bit surprised that "Shout to the Lord," would be a choice to be performed not once, but twice during "Inspirational" week. To me, since the words of the song are taken from Psalms, and the melody is nice and so easy to sing along with, and is usally preformed at church venues with the congregation singing along, it surprised me.
Since they changed the first words to "My shepherd", instead of "My Jesus" the first night, but sang the song as written the second night, I wondered why the words weren't changed again the second time around. I love the song though, as a simple expression of worship to the only one deserving of such. It was just a little bit of a surprise, and a delight, to hear the song "out of context."
I can't imagine what anyone would find "creepy" about it Whitedove. But that's just me. Like Excathedra, the song sometimes brings tears to my eyes because of the heartful praise expressed.
well... i didn't see the show (but thanks to shell) i did get to see it on youtube... :)
ex10,
i am not surprised at all by american idol's use of this "christian" song... (especially since they censored the name of Jesus in the first show)...
in fact, i would predict that you will see more of this kind of thing as time goes on... the reason i say that is because there is currently a huge move to merge all religions together... the ecumenical movement is pushing to unite all religions (under the banner of interfaith cooperation)in order to solve the problems of the world... (it's the 3rd legged stool of rick warren's p.e.a.c.e. plan)... there is a focus on co-existence, and the "one-ness" of all religions... there is a push for a universal "faith" where all religious belief systems are accepted, and tolerance among all ideologies is promoted... except... except for exclusive ideologies that state such things as "Jesus is the Only Way to God"... that will NOT be tolerated!
the current church is the laodicean church (and they are asleep at the wheel)... they do not even recognize that they are laodicean (they need eye salve acc. to rev. 3:18)... they are lukewarm for Jesus, and they are joining together with the world religions on the way to babylon (that's babylon, mystery religion, the mother of all harlots)... yep, the lukewarm laodicean church is merging with all the religions of the world to form a global religion (that is spoken about in the book of rev.)
and along the way, they will need to redefine "christianity" and reinvent Jesus Christ... which thing they are currently in the midst of... this "new christianity" has a form of godliness, but denies the power of the cross of Jesus Christ... (and the secular world doesn't want to talk about Jesus too much)... however, the deception is now taking on christian overtones by using christian terms - like "christ-consciousness"... so although this new "global religion" will be borrowing terms from christianity, those terms will NOT have the same meaning as they do biblically... they will be using christian terms, but with different meanings and different definitions... (oprah is real good at doing this while promoting new agers who offer dramatically different meanings for biblical terms)
anyway, a great deception is covering the earth (as Jesus warned would happen in the last days)... and a one-world religious system is currently being formed while the laodicean church sleeps (or worse, sometimes takes an active role in this)
well... you asked for "any thoughts?"
so, no, i am not surprised by american idol's use of this song - either with or without the name of Jesus...
peace,
jen-o
p.s. i do like the original song with its original intent and focus on Jesus! (and i don't know how anyone can think that is creepy)
I can't imagine what anyone would find "creepy" about it Whitedove. But that's just me. Like Excathedra, the song sometimes brings tears to my eyes because of the heartfelt praise expressed.
Ok, I'm calling agents Mulder and Scully cause there has been an alien abduction somewhere in Texas. the X-10 is now
an X - File..... I know your an imposter cause the X I know has much better sense and taste in music.
My Jesus, My Savior
Lord there is none like You
All of my days, I want to praise
The wonders of Your mighty love
My Comfort, My Shelter
Tower of refuge and strength
Let every breath, all that I am
Never cease to worship You
Are you kidding me?
Jesus did not even allow himself to be called good, much less ask people to worship him.
Matthew 19:16,17 (King James Version)
16And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
Jesus continuously pointed to the Father as the one to worship
Luke 4:8
Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' "
Scripture is pretty clear on who the true worshipers that the Father desires are.
John 4:23
Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
Creepy? You bet! That's putting it nicely. Zombies for Jesus is more like it. Eyes fixed in a blank stare, hands waving while chanting repetitive chorus's, lost in some Jesus Nirvana State.
Sounds like you are describing the PFAL 1972 film.
I'm sure the words to this song are not in alignment and harmony with PFAL and the doctrine of VP Wierwille.
Except for a few sects and cults, most Christians today believe that Jesus is God the Son, which is reflected in the words of their songs of praise and worship.
Just an explanation. You don't have to like the song. You may even believe that those who wrote and those who sing it are aliens or possessed or something.
I didn't even know Jesus while I was TWI. It was all about TWI and the MOGFODAT. So I find the song refreshing.
For what it's worth, I thought it was nicely staged.
No goose bumps but nicely done.
Nice arrangement.----beautiful individual vocal performances.-----lighting and costuming had a very soothing effect.
Only thing I did not care for was the side to side movement.
I found that a bit contrived and distracting.
They might have been able to "wash" individuals with light or have them take a step or two downstage(or both) when they were featured, instead.
But that's just a matter of my personal taste.
Regarding the changing of the lyrics:
What's the big deal?
It's not like these lyrics are engraved on a Holy Tablet or something.
It's just a song.
What if it had been written that way to start with?
Would there be a big push to change it to Jesus to make it "right on"?
One thing that I really, really don't miss about TWI is having to always worry about whether this or that is "right on" according to TWI standards of the only true(cough) right dividing of The Word.
Everything became focused on the mission of promoting TWI.
No room for artistic license.
Ever wonder why that early Way music knocked your socks off?
It's because it came from what the artists themselves felt compelled to express.
Once TWI stepped in and started dictating what needed to happen to make it "right on" it started to lose the emotional steam that drove it.
Except for a few sects and cults, most Christians today believe that Jesus is God the Son, which is reflected in the words of their songs of praise and worship.
That may be but scripture seems to point out that Jesus knew the differance, he clearly pointed out that we need not worship him, but our worship was to the Father, God. It wouldn't be the first time church's got it wrong.
Church ?... Scripture? Gee what to do? I think I'll pick scripture......
I seemed to have missed the church translation of John 4:23 in the scripture.
John 4:23
Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father ( worship Me Jesus, God the Son,) in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
Just an explanation. You don't have to like the song. You may even believe that those who wrote and those who sing it are aliens or possessed or something.
I didn't even know Jesus while I was TWI. It was all about TWI and the MOGFODAT. So I find the song refreshing.
To each his own.
Indeed and I don't! If scripture is right it does not appear that Jesus would like it either.
there is plenty of sciptural evidence to support that Jesus is God, the Son...
you have misinterpreted matthew 19:16-17
Jesus did not even allow himself to be called good, much less ask people to worship him.
Matthew 19:16,17 (King James Version)
16And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
in the context, this passage is about a rich young ruler who recognized there was something far above the ordinary about Jesus, because he knelt before Jesus and asked Him what he could do to obtain eternal life (obviously, the rich ruler recognized that Jesus had the answer to this)... we know also that "money" was the rich ruler's "god", because he refused to part with it in order to follow Jesus (v.22)... Jesus asked him a question (to get the guy to think) i.e. "why are you calling me "good"?... Jesus did NOT say, "I am not good" or "don't call me good"... Jesus simply asked a question...
why did Jesus ask the man this question?... Jesus asked this to get the man to think and realize that what he had seen and recognized in Jesus WAS God!... (he who hath seen Me hath seen the Father)... just like peter recognized it when he said "thou art the Christ"... this man recognized it, too, but did not want to give up his money to follow Christ...
there can only be 2 ways to interpret this scripture...
Jesus is either saying: I am NOT good...
OR
Jesus is saying: I am God...
Jesus cannot possibly be saying "I am not good" because Jesus calls Himself good twice in the book of john... (john 10:11 and john 10:14)
so i conclude that Jesus is asking a rhetorical question... and is, indeed, saying "I am God" in this passage...
there is plenty of sciptural evidence to support that Jesus is God, the Son...
Really? show me God the son in scripture......
you have misinterpreted matthew 19:16-17
in the context, this passage is about a rich young ruler who recognized there was something far above the ordinary about Jesus, because he knelt before Jesus and asked Him what he could do to obtain eternal life (obviously, the rich ruler recognized that Jesus had the answer to this)... we know also that "money" was the rich ruler's "god", because he refused to part with it in order to follow Jesus (v.22)... Jesus asked him a question (to get the guy to think) i.e. "why are you calling me "good"?... Jesus did NOT say, "I am not good" or "don't call me good"... Jesus simply asked a question...
why did Jesus ask the man this question?... Jesus asked this to get the man to think and realize that what he had seen and recognized in Jesus WAS God!... (he who hath seen Me hath seen the Father)... just like peter recognized it when he said "thou art the Christ"... this man recognized it, too, but did not want to give up his money to follow Christ...
there can only be 2 ways to interpret this scripture...
Jesus is either saying: I am NOT good...
OR
Jesus is saying: I am God...
Jesus cannot possibly be saying "I am not good" because Jesus calls Himself good twice in the book of john... (john 10:11 and john 10:14)
so i conclude that Jesus is asking a rhetorical question... and is, indeed, saying "I am God" in this passage...
shalom,
jen-o
No the third way is that he does not want to be called good or worshiped..... knelt in front of like the man in the story and prayed to.
This parable spake Jesus unto them......... John 10:6
It is a parable
Parable is used of a story with a hidden meaning, without pressing in every detail. This likeness is generally only in some special point. Parables are used from the resemblance of the one thing to another.
The thing may be true or imaginary but the events must be possible or likely to have happened
At any rate those that hear must believe that they are possible events, though it is not necessary that the speaker should believe them..
Parables often have a misconception that they are to make things clear or plain ,but in truth they are some of the most difficult sections of scripture often to understand.
We have seen from Parables the following:
*it is a story with a hidden meaning
*It is not pressing in every detail
*The likeness is true in one point
*It can be imaginary but the events must be possible
*The speaker does not have to believe them, but the hearer must believe that they are possible.
No he asked the question because he wanted him to undestand that his worship was to be directed to the Father just as Jesus's was.
36Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
Read vs 36 of John 10 it says son of God not God the son.... So I guess Jesus was confused according to your theory?
We're talking about a Christian worship song being performed on American Idol. That is the topic of this thread.
And some of you are debating whether or not the song is Christian? Am I getting this right?
And Whitedove, you are disputing the validity of exalting Jesus as Lord? I thought we had this conversation like 10 or 15 years ago? no?
And Jen o, you think singing the song is some kind of conspiracy against Christianity? Excuse my simplemindedness, but, I just thought it was cool a neat praise and worship song made American Idol.
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
You should know better ex10. Now ya gone and done it. It's gonna get messy. Ain' no goin' back now.
This horse got sorely whacked on GS a year or so ago, under similar conditions. At that time I posted my daughter had visited Hillsong Church Music Ministry in Australia with some friends of hers, a few years ago. They attended a Music Conference there, and hung out for two weeks with many of the Glassy Eyes right there at Zombie Central. She had a wonderful time, learned a lot and had a blast. Unfortunately she came back with PPS (Post Praise Syndrome) and everytime she heard the word "Jesus" she immediately wanted to pop in a Delirious CD and start waving her arms around. It took several days straight of forcing her to do word studies in our old tattered Young's Concordance and making teeny tiny font size= - 6 notes in a new Wide Margin bible to snap her back to her senses.
Actually she found them to be friendly, honest and down-to-earth people and she enjoyed the time there and got a lot out of it. I've written the Hillsong folks and had some exchanges about music in general and theirs and mine specifically. They're great folks, far as I can see.
As you would expect if you've listened to their music and know anything about music, they've got some very talented and knowledgable people there, some serious players too. Australia has a history of producing some very talented and successful musicians, singers and songwriters and Darlene Zschech is right down that alley. When it comes to modern Pop music they know how to do it.
I'm glad American Idol had the song performed. Even more, I'm glad they recognized Jesus as Shepherd, and in their second performance recognized Him by name. "They", whoever "they" are, insulted some people while thrilling others. Good. Good. Everyone I've spoken to knew the song was about Jesus Christ, including those who've never heard the song before. :)
just for the record...i LIKE this song, and i like hillsong's music, in general...
whitedove, you used a lot of words to explain what a parable is... but none of that changes the fact that Jesus referred to Himself as "good"... if anything, a parable is used to EMPHASIZE, not NEGATE this fact...
and what do you do with the fact that EVERY knee will BOW to Jesus...
oops... ex10, am i hijacking the thread again?... i'm a little confused myself about this hijacking thing... cuz afterall the song is entitled: shout to the... Lord... and i guess we are just trying to discuss who the Lord is... :~)
Recommended Posts
Top Posters In This Topic
6
12
7
8
Popular Days
Apr 14
20
Apr 13
13
Apr 20
9
Apr 15
7
Top Posters In This Topic
Dot Matrix 6 posts
socks 12 posts
jen-o 7 posts
waysider 8 posts
Popular Days
Apr 14 2008
20 posts
Apr 13 2008
13 posts
Apr 20 2008
9 posts
Apr 15 2008
7 posts
Shellon
Link to comment
Share on other sites
GeorgeStGeorge
I see that they've got the "Singing Ladies of the Way" choreography down pat. :)
George
Link to comment
Share on other sites
socks
Yeah, we watched the Wed. show, with the close of "Shout" and then the singers did it again on Thursday.
We were also surprised, pleasantly. It's a great song, and has a classic chorus and turnaround in it. Darlene Zschech who wrote it, has written some very kick-asz Christian music, in the pop genre. I'm definitely a fan, as is our family.
I was a tad surprised they rewrote the lyric, with "My shepherd", instead of "My Jesus". The second performance Thursday I heard the original lyric "My Jesus", unless my ears put it in, they sang the original.
I like this kind of tune, it typifiies the "praise" hymn or song.
I was left with the question of what inspired the producers to use it. It's clearly a statement of praise and hope to God through Jesus Christ as redeemer and savior of mankind. The vignettes the Tuesday program showed displayed people in the most sorrowful of circumstance. I found the balance of the act of love to help those who need it the most - children - and the statement of joyful praise to God in that song...well, wonderfully refreshing.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
cheranne
That is great!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
brought tears to me eyes
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Watered Garden
We only heard it the night when they removed the "J" word. Also noticed that after it was all over with some guy comes out spouting bleeped out words.
Mr. Garden commented there were about 3 people singing like they actually believed what they were singing.
It was nice they did it at all, even if they did want it to be politically correct, leaving out the name of the politically incorrect Saviour of all mankind.
Some of us were singing "My Jesus" in our hearts.
WG
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WhiteDove
I don't watch American Idol, but is this song one of those creepy tunes that is on that infomercial for the hand waving, glassy eyed praise & worship CD? Seems like it was...... That thing is scarier than the night of the living dead. They look like zombies from the Thriller Video cleaned up. Why it's more annoying than the Head-On commercials.
Thoughts ? ......... Does anybody think it odd that a group of people who want us to worship them as our next American Idol, are singing a song about someone that had no earthly Idols? I Do.......
Link to comment
Share on other sites
socks
We talked a bit about that - that everyone was singing. Now, A.I. being what it is, or what I've thought it was anyway, they do a lot of that. Singers sing and AI singers are in a popularity competition, with some talent, sometimes a lot of talent, and lots of drama mixed in. Pretty much every season contains some music marriages made in he ll, "Neil Sedaka" nights, metal singers singing country, odd pairings and couplings of all types. Kids singing Beatles songs they've never heard.
Point - while it seemed "odd" for some reason, in reality it isn't based on history. AI does a lot of odd things. This season seems to be one of the first that's gotten it's head on straight. When a contestant is "voted off" they don't sing them off with endless choruses of "so you had a bad day" or some other weepy tune. They play "celebrate me home", Kenny Loggins's tune. I like that. It puts the whole experience in perspective, putting a positive forward thinking motion to it rather than an "aaaaahhhhhhwwwwwwww.....toooo bad!" feel.(especially since some of the early non-winners do as well or better getting their careers going than the actual winners and runner ups).
Then they had the winners of a Band competiton show this summer perform a couple weeks ago, 3 brothers who won it after doing a bluegrass-ish version of "This Little Light of Mine", a children's style gospel style tune from way back. They performed a full rendition of the version on AI,which again, kind of took me by a-ha. That tune was the core of what the 3 brothers played, their energy and "sound" so it was authentic for them to play it, but clearly there was no one forcing them to not do a Christian tune. I dont' actually like their version, it's a little amped up for that style, but hey, it's their thing and they seemed to do it well.
So - it's innerestin'. I assume the singers sang it with at least as much conviction as they mustered for a pack of Dolly Parton songs which they'd probably never sing in a million years, maybe more. Maybe they meant it. Maybe it was right up their alley, maybe some figured hey, I sang a Dolly Parton song I'd never heard before and liked it. I'm smiling, I'm two-steppin'. Waddya want?
Speaking of who, closed the show that featured her songs as choices with - a "gospel" message tune.
So we are kinda wondering whaasssup with AI. I like the tone, don't feel it's unnatural, and that it's a good tone to take. Does seem like a switch. That song seemed to wrap up the vibe, the message, the call to help and hope that their charitable efforts addressed.
Ignoring the Christian music market cuts out a huge piece of the listening audience, methinks. The fact that "Shout" is in the pop music mold is typical of what a lot of people listen to these days. If you like it, it's great. Some don't, prefer other styles, some think it's all wrong to begin with. So even in this field of music everyone won't be pleased, some will be insulted, some outraged, and many more left out. Some will love it for various reasons including diggin' the sound.
By the by - thanks for bringing this online here ex10.
Edited by socksLink to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
Well, I was a bit surprised that "Shout to the Lord," would be a choice to be performed not once, but twice during "Inspirational" week. To me, since the words of the song are taken from Psalms, and the melody is nice and so easy to sing along with, and is usally preformed at church venues with the congregation singing along, it surprised me.
Since they changed the first words to "My shepherd", instead of "My Jesus" the first night, but sang the song as written the second night, I wondered why the words weren't changed again the second time around. I love the song though, as a simple expression of worship to the only one deserving of such. It was just a little bit of a surprise, and a delight, to hear the song "out of context."
I can't imagine what anyone would find "creepy" about it Whitedove. But that's just me. Like Excathedra, the song sometimes brings tears to my eyes because of the heartful praise expressed.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jen-o
well... i didn't see the show (but thanks to shell) i did get to see it on youtube... :)
ex10,
i am not surprised at all by american idol's use of this "christian" song... (especially since they censored the name of Jesus in the first show)...
in fact, i would predict that you will see more of this kind of thing as time goes on... the reason i say that is because there is currently a huge move to merge all religions together... the ecumenical movement is pushing to unite all religions (under the banner of interfaith cooperation)in order to solve the problems of the world... (it's the 3rd legged stool of rick warren's p.e.a.c.e. plan)... there is a focus on co-existence, and the "one-ness" of all religions... there is a push for a universal "faith" where all religious belief systems are accepted, and tolerance among all ideologies is promoted... except... except for exclusive ideologies that state such things as "Jesus is the Only Way to God"... that will NOT be tolerated!
the current church is the laodicean church (and they are asleep at the wheel)... they do not even recognize that they are laodicean (they need eye salve acc. to rev. 3:18)... they are lukewarm for Jesus, and they are joining together with the world religions on the way to babylon (that's babylon, mystery religion, the mother of all harlots)... yep, the lukewarm laodicean church is merging with all the religions of the world to form a global religion (that is spoken about in the book of rev.)
and along the way, they will need to redefine "christianity" and reinvent Jesus Christ... which thing they are currently in the midst of... this "new christianity" has a form of godliness, but denies the power of the cross of Jesus Christ... (and the secular world doesn't want to talk about Jesus too much)... however, the deception is now taking on christian overtones by using christian terms - like "christ-consciousness"... so although this new "global religion" will be borrowing terms from christianity, those terms will NOT have the same meaning as they do biblically... they will be using christian terms, but with different meanings and different definitions... (oprah is real good at doing this while promoting new agers who offer dramatically different meanings for biblical terms)
anyway, a great deception is covering the earth (as Jesus warned would happen in the last days)... and a one-world religious system is currently being formed while the laodicean church sleeps (or worse, sometimes takes an active role in this)
well... you asked for "any thoughts?"
so, no, i am not surprised by american idol's use of this song - either with or without the name of Jesus...
peace,
jen-o
p.s. i do like the original song with its original intent and focus on Jesus! (and i don't know how anyone can think that is creepy)
(edited to add my p.s.)
Edited by jen-oLink to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
Hey!!!
Itsn't that what WE did??
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WhiteDove
Ok, I'm calling agents Mulder and Scully cause there has been an alien abduction somewhere in Texas. the X-10 is now
an X - File..... I know your an imposter cause the X I know has much better sense and taste in music.
My Jesus, My Savior
Lord there is none like You
All of my days, I want to praise
The wonders of Your mighty love
My Comfort, My Shelter
Tower of refuge and strength
Let every breath, all that I am
Never cease to worship You
Are you kidding me?
Jesus did not even allow himself to be called good, much less ask people to worship him.
Matthew 19:16,17 (King James Version)
16And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
Jesus continuously pointed to the Father as the one to worship
Luke 4:8
Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' "
Scripture is pretty clear on who the true worshipers that the Father desires are.
John 4:23
Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
Creepy? You bet! That's putting it nicely. Zombies for Jesus is more like it. Eyes fixed in a blank stare, hands waving while chanting repetitive chorus's, lost in some Jesus Nirvana State.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Watered Garden
Sounds like you are describing the PFAL 1972 film.
I'm sure the words to this song are not in alignment and harmony with PFAL and the doctrine of VP Wierwille.
Except for a few sects and cults, most Christians today believe that Jesus is God the Son, which is reflected in the words of their songs of praise and worship.
Just an explanation. You don't have to like the song. You may even believe that those who wrote and those who sing it are aliens or possessed or something.
I didn't even know Jesus while I was TWI. It was all about TWI and the MOGFODAT. So I find the song refreshing.
To each his own.
WG
Link to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
I just watched this on youtube.
(the bigger of the two productions)
For what it's worth, I thought it was nicely staged.
No goose bumps but nicely done.
Nice arrangement.----beautiful individual vocal performances.-----lighting and costuming had a very soothing effect.
Only thing I did not care for was the side to side movement.
I found that a bit contrived and distracting.
They might have been able to "wash" individuals with light or have them take a step or two downstage(or both) when they were featured, instead.
But that's just a matter of my personal taste.
Regarding the changing of the lyrics:
What's the big deal?
It's not like these lyrics are engraved on a Holy Tablet or something.
It's just a song.
What if it had been written that way to start with?
Would there be a big push to change it to Jesus to make it "right on"?
One thing that I really, really don't miss about TWI is having to always worry about whether this or that is "right on" according to TWI standards of the only true(cough) right dividing of The Word.
Everything became focused on the mission of promoting TWI.
No room for artistic license.
Ever wonder why that early Way music knocked your socks off?
It's because it came from what the artists themselves felt compelled to express.
Once TWI stepped in and started dictating what needed to happen to make it "right on" it started to lose the emotional steam that drove it.
That's my 2 cents.
Edited by waysiderLink to comment
Share on other sites
WhiteDove
Link to comment
Share on other sites
kimberly
Philippians 1:15-18
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jen-o
whitedove,
there is plenty of sciptural evidence to support that Jesus is God, the Son...
you have misinterpreted matthew 19:16-17
in the context, this passage is about a rich young ruler who recognized there was something far above the ordinary about Jesus, because he knelt before Jesus and asked Him what he could do to obtain eternal life (obviously, the rich ruler recognized that Jesus had the answer to this)... we know also that "money" was the rich ruler's "god", because he refused to part with it in order to follow Jesus (v.22)... Jesus asked him a question (to get the guy to think) i.e. "why are you calling me "good"?... Jesus did NOT say, "I am not good" or "don't call me good"... Jesus simply asked a question...
why did Jesus ask the man this question?... Jesus asked this to get the man to think and realize that what he had seen and recognized in Jesus WAS God!... (he who hath seen Me hath seen the Father)... just like peter recognized it when he said "thou art the Christ"... this man recognized it, too, but did not want to give up his money to follow Christ...
there can only be 2 ways to interpret this scripture...
Jesus is either saying: I am NOT good...
OR
Jesus is saying: I am God...
Jesus cannot possibly be saying "I am not good" because Jesus calls Himself good twice in the book of john... (john 10:11 and john 10:14)
so i conclude that Jesus is asking a rhetorical question... and is, indeed, saying "I am God" in this passage...
shalom,
jen-o
Edited by jen-oLink to comment
Share on other sites
wrdsandwrks
I don't have much to add except that it was very thrilling to hear Jesus being worshipped on mainstream national TV. It brought tears to my eyes too.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jen-o
that's all well and good, as long as it is JESUS that is being preached... and not another Jesus of another gospel... (2 Cor. 11:4, Gal. 1:6-7)
peace,
jen-o
waysider,
good point!
twi did have a habit of inventing its own definitions...
maybe that's why i won't get fooled again... :D
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WhiteDove
No the third way is that he does not want to be called good or worshiped..... knelt in front of like the man in the story and prayed to.
This parable spake Jesus unto them......... John 10:6
It is a parable
Parable is used of a story with a hidden meaning, without pressing in every detail. This likeness is generally only in some special point. Parables are used from the resemblance of the one thing to another.
The thing may be true or imaginary but the events must be possible or likely to have happened
At any rate those that hear must believe that they are possible events, though it is not necessary that the speaker should believe them..
Parables often have a misconception that they are to make things clear or plain ,but in truth they are some of the most difficult sections of scripture often to understand.
We have seen from Parables the following:
*it is a story with a hidden meaning
*It is not pressing in every detail
*The likeness is true in one point
*It can be imaginary but the events must be possible
*The speaker does not have to believe them, but the hearer must believe that they are possible.
No he asked the question because he wanted him to undestand that his worship was to be directed to the Father just as Jesus's was.
Read vs 36 of John 10 it says son of God not God the son.... So I guess Jesus was confused according to your theory?
Edited by WhiteDoveLink to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
Ok, wait, I'm confused.
We're talking about a Christian worship song being performed on American Idol. That is the topic of this thread.
And some of you are debating whether or not the song is Christian? Am I getting this right?
And Whitedove, you are disputing the validity of exalting Jesus as Lord? I thought we had this conversation like 10 or 15 years ago? no?
And Jen o, you think singing the song is some kind of conspiracy against Christianity? Excuse my simplemindedness, but, I just thought it was cool a neat praise and worship song made American Idol.
Egads, I guess I should I know better. Sigh.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jen-o
ex10,
i didn't say it was a conspiracy... i said it was a sign of the times...
and i apologize for hijacking your thread by getting involved in the "Jesus is/is not God" debate...
whitedove, i suppose you will have to meet me over in the doctrinal section to continue this conversation...
peace,
jen-o
Link to comment
Share on other sites
socks
Philip. 2:9-11
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
You should know better ex10.
Now ya gone and done it. It's gonna get messy. Ain' no goin' back now.
This horse got sorely whacked on GS a year or so ago, under similar conditions. At that time I posted my daughter had visited Hillsong Church Music Ministry in Australia with some friends of hers, a few years ago. They attended a Music Conference there, and hung out for two weeks with many of the Glassy Eyes right there at Zombie Central. She had a wonderful time, learned a lot and had a blast. Unfortunately she came back with PPS (Post Praise Syndrome) and everytime she heard the word "Jesus" she immediately wanted to pop in a Delirious CD and start waving her arms around. It took several days straight of forcing her to do word studies in our old tattered Young's Concordance and making teeny tiny font size= - 6 notes in a new Wide Margin bible to snap her back to her senses.
Actually she found them to be friendly, honest and down-to-earth people and she enjoyed the time there and got a lot out of it. I've written the Hillsong folks and had some exchanges about music in general and theirs and mine specifically. They're great folks, far as I can see.
As you would expect if you've listened to their music and know anything about music, they've got some very talented and knowledgable people there, some serious players too. Australia has a history of producing some very talented and successful musicians, singers and songwriters and Darlene Zschech is right down that alley. When it comes to modern Pop music they know how to do it.
I'm glad American Idol had the song performed. Even more, I'm glad they recognized Jesus as Shepherd, and in their second performance recognized Him by name. "They", whoever "they" are, insulted some people while thrilling others. Good. Good. Everyone I've spoken to knew the song was about Jesus Christ, including those who've never heard the song before. :)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jen-o
socks,
you is funny!
:~)
i hope your poor daughter recovered... LOL
just for the record...i LIKE this song, and i like hillsong's music, in general...
whitedove, you used a lot of words to explain what a parable is... but none of that changes the fact that Jesus referred to Himself as "good"... if anything, a parable is used to EMPHASIZE, not NEGATE this fact...
and what do you do with the fact that EVERY knee will BOW to Jesus...
oops... ex10, am i hijacking the thread again?... i'm a little confused myself about this hijacking thing... cuz afterall the song is entitled: shout to the... Lord... and i guess we are just trying to discuss who the Lord is... :~)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.