Toughen you up

[Watered Garden]

I guess what was purported to be that which toughened us up in FLO was in reality more mental than physical. The morning run was not much fun in my book, but as Waysider mentioned, it wasn't like Army boot camp or anything.

We did do physical labor in a 1 1/2 acre organic garden. But at least we got to eat some of what we grew (Swiss chard, curly endive, mustard greens).

The "toughen up" part was the mental abuse, the middle of the night meetings, the always being on edge because you didn't know if you were going to blessed or cursed by leadership on a moment by moment basis. You did know that at some point either as an individual or as part of a group, you would be "weighed in the balance and found wanting" no matter how hard you tried. I remember my first year being informed that the coordinator, aka branch leader, would be not only inspecting our rooms, but also pulling open dresser drawers to make sure our undies were properly folded, stacked and stored. I promptly had a bit of a hissy about this; it was none of his business, I barely knew (and didn't like) this guy, and he had no right on earth to be pawing through the drawers in my drawers! I considered a mousetrap buried in the bras, but hesitated; I didn't want to seriously injure the dude, just keep him away. I don't know if he ever did inspect our unmentionables, but I used to smell his pipe tobacco when I went upstairs after work/supper/FLO crap at night.

But did the FLO program toughen me up? Not as much as it weaned me away from trusting God. Because after all, folks, God is at work in your leadership. The exceeding great and mighty men and women of God who run this program are receiving revelation about you and your life and they and God together will decide what is best for you. All you have to do is obey without question and all will be well.

And then you get hit with one ....storm after another about what worthless creatures you are, how you are a stench in the righteous nostrils of God, and the Word isn't moving over the world because you didn't fold your undies!

I spent two years struggling in bewilderment, the second year worse than the first, in unimaginable terror half the time. What did I learn? Keep quiet and do as you are told is the whole sum of the law. What did I get out of it? My husband, best thing that happened in two years and has happened since.

[jen-o]

Hey Jen-o

It is quite obvious that you don't, let me refresh you. I hardly "came out of nowhere", in fact I answered the question at the start of the thread, I think that's called on topic. My response was limited to two questions, (which I believe that I clarified on some page) The one from the start of this thread which was......

The questions asked for advanced notice and for references in promotional literature for which I provided such. It has nothing to do with any other post , which I again clarified on some page. They asked for the information I provided the answer. Don't shoot the messenger when you ask for the message........ These brochures were distributed to interested parties before entering residence ( that's why they call them promotional brochures by the way) It appears to me one could expect some physical toughening up from the wording, if you are developing physical stamina one would conclude that it was not there prior, I'd say they planned to toughen up your physical stamina. Had you read the posts you would see that I made no comment as to whether the program worked, or if I thought it was a good idea. I answered the questions posed only, which were ...Was there advanced notice ? Yes, and show me where it was in the literature, which I did.

hey whitedove!

i really don't need no "refreshing"... i'm aware of what you said, and understand that you are trying to get your point across that you think twi gave advance notice (in promotional literature) about "toughening people up"...

but your post stuck out like a sore thumb to me because of your TIMING... it came right after excie's courageous and vulnerable exposure of her heart (love ya excie)... and other people had posted with compassion... but that all seemed to go right over your head!... you were so h3ll bent on making your point about "promotional literature", that you were oblivious to anything else going on around you... and i just don't get that!

whitedove, i know it's been a while... but i do NOT remember you being like that!

what the heck is going on in this place?... you sound like some kind of apologist for twi... say it isn't so!

i really can't read all of your lengthy posts about "promotional literature"... it just sounds like a whole lotta who shot john to me...

you really think that the goal of twi was to "toughen people up" spiritually, mentally, and physically?!?

because i think that the RESULT of twi practices was to toughen people up EMOTIONALLY!

you can't possible think that abusers are concerned for the welfare of those they abuse...

no, whitedove, i STILL don't get where you are coming from...

and i don't understand how you can ignore excie's post, and rush to the defense of a cultic organization...

btw, the laundry is in the dryer, and i'm making lambchops for dinner! :)

peace,

jen-o

[WhiteDove]

hey whitedove!

i really don't need no "refreshing"... i'm aware of what you said, and understand that you are trying to get your point across that you think twi gave advance notice (in promotional literature) about "toughening people up"...

but your post stuck out like a sore thumb to me because of your TIMING... it came right after excie's courageous and vulnerable exposure of her heart (love ya excie)... and other people had posted with compassion... but that all seemed to go right over your head!... you were so h3ll bent on making your point about "promotional literature", that you were oblivious to anything else going on around you... and i just don't get that!

whitedove, i know it's been a while... but i do NOT remember you being like that!

what the heck is going on in this place?... you sound like some kind of apologist for twi... say it isn't so!

Well Jeno this is a discussion board and I was discussing, as were others . As such depending on how much time one has the posts continue, as it was I had to work for a living, when I returned to answer the conversation I was in, of course life here had progressed , more posts. I don't respond to every post nor do I ignore them either , the posts in between dealt with another subject which was not in the conversation I was involved in . That's often the case here at times a thread within a thread.

As far some kind of apologist for twi... I suppose it depends on how you listen to what I said, a request was made for information. I responded with said information, The fact that the information did not support the requesters point of view or general point of view of the board majority, is not my fault. I just presented the truth, or facts. It either exists or it doesn't, neither necessarily supports TWI or or does not, it is what it is.

i really can't read all of your lengthy posts about "promotional literature"... it just sounds like a whole lotta who shot john to me...

you really think that the goal of twi was to "toughen people up" spiritually, mentally, and physically?!?

because i think that the RESULT of twi practices was to toughen people up EMOTIONALLY!

you can't possible think that abusers are concerned for the welfare of those they abuse...

no, whitedove, i STILL don't get where you are coming from...

and i don't understand how you can ignore excie's post, and rush to the defense of a cultic organization...

Yes I do believe that was the goal, Goals don't always go as planned though ,the result is a different discussion..... again I never ignored any post, I just did not respond as it was not concerning the matter that was in my opinion the discussion. To me it was off topic and I choose not to respond. The question was about literature, I rushed to no defense, again I simply supplied information, If one does not see a criminal holding a gun and testifies as such is he rushing to defend him or simply telling the truth as to what he saw? I think it is a common misconception, or tactic here at times to decry someone an apologist or a supporter when information that they supply does not fit with the general view of the board majority.

Setting the facts straight is not defending or prosecuting it is speaking the facts as they are.

btw, the laundry is in the dryer, and i'm making lamb chops for dinner!

peace,

jen-o

Very good , Lamb chops Again?

Edited March 26, 2008 by WhiteDove

[jen-o]

hey whitedove,

i understand about working and having a life outside of the message boards... :)

heck, i haven't been to the forum here in probably 4 years... (2 years for the chatroom) :P

and i understand how posts can sneak in there when you're not looking even...

sometimes... ;)

i do think that we each have a totally different perspective on what twi was about...

and so we seem to be coming from very different places...

(well, it seems this way to me, anyway)

in any case, it is good to see you again!

now tonight, we will be having the linguini with the clam sauce... :D

peace,

jen-o

[WhiteDove]

hey whitedove,

i understand about working and having a life outside of the message boards... :)

heck, i haven't been to the forum here in probably 4 years... (2 years for the chatroom) :P

and i understand how posts can sneak in there when you're not looking even...

sometimes... ;)

i do think that we each have a totally different perspective on what twi was about...

and so we seem to be coming from very different places...

(well, it seems this way to me, anyway)

in any case, it is good to see you again!

now tonight, we will be having the linguini with the clam sauce... :D

peace,

jen-o

MMM linguini...... Can I bring my laundry along too?

I noticed you have not been around, but you've been over there on that Yahoo group causing trouble I see.