Actually, I've "moved on". I've gotten involved in the community.. higher education, etc..
I think quite a few of us have. But there's one strange place in the world.. a language and vocabulary that practically no one else can understand..
why do I keep coming back..
sheesh.. I don't know..
I think this place sometimes warns those who may enter the "hallowed(?)" doors.. but I think it really is more than that. It's where the evaluations of old leadership gone by, and even perhaps for the "new" guard is being written. It's a luxury that many of us were not allowed in the old ministry.
I never got a form to fill out when the bestest and latest corpses local coordinators would move on.
Here, I can give them an HONEST evaluation. For me, I'm sure it's not entirely anonymous.
What's even more interesting.. I can read the evaluations given by others.
You'd think the old organization would give half a damn about something like this..
I think one poll said most people here (80%?) got out of TWI at least 8 years ago, most more like 15-20 years.
The thing that keeps the place "alive" appears to be a community of folks that were in in the 70's up toward '86, then another group that endured some lcm whackiness and left in the 90's.
Anybody needing help getting out has a ton of stuff to read off the front page. They can drop into any disscussion and get a feel of real people having fun, and that are totally irreverent toward any TWI "mystique". (Can I be ordained as "The very IrReverand Rhino?)
I don't spend much time thinking of recovery, more about various life choices and beliefs. We use TWI as a comparison because it was so much of our early years, and a common knowledge base. For us it is a good case study that can be related to, though it is easy to devolve into minutia of just how that case study should be interpretted.
And there is something cool about this circle that were so commonly bound for so long, then to have this 20 year jump where we dicover how lives turned out. At that corpse site you see some real pictures and real names ... so it is different ... not much discussion though.
I rather think some still hold delusions bout TWI, that it was all well meaning folks that got a little twisted. I tend to believe that view for most, but at the root were some people that were too willing to use and abuse, and that became systematic and involved many people that some would prefer not to "think evil of".
So some don't come here or stay here ... I still like the crowd, and like them better with beer or wine in hand. It is more of a bar for me from 5pm till midnight.
I was one who was in during the nineties. Coming here did help alot. So many things were redefined for us, things were called love that were actually control and using us, not love at all.
We were told we were being helped so we could be strong--but in reality we were just getting weaker and more dependent.
It was confusing. Plus confidence became so shaken because we were always wrong/off the Word etc about so many things.
It was and is good to come here and be able to say--that wasn't love, that was cruel, that was control, we were being used, bullied etc.
It takes time to unravel all the stuff, even to recgonise why you feel/act /think a certain way.
I think the same threads could be a warning or recovery, depending on where the reader is in life.
Ham's right party and to chat with nice folks like you AND not to kick ourselves in the foot for when we were kids and got duped.hopefully others still in will be aware
I think that oftentimes the "warning" IS part of the recovery...the things that are said here mean different things to different people. We are not trained psychologists and there is no professional recovery program here...we are more of a "blue collar" recovery program...people telling their stories, giving their opinions...newcomers can relate and feel at home because there are folks here who understand and went through the same things...that's the real value in the recovery process here. Those of us who have gone through this can say "it's ok, we understand, things will get better"...that means a lot.
and yes, part of the recovery is becoming aware of the "nasty" things that twi did...in other words, it wasn't your fault!
So...to me, this place may be more about warning for those who need to be warned and more about recovery for those who need to recover...it simply depends on where a person is at...and let's not forget that people can search a wide variety of different topics and focus on the ones that they feel are appropriate for them.
I think that oftentimes the "warning" IS part of the recovery...the things that are said here mean different things to different people. We are not trained psychologists and there is no professional recovery program here...we are more of a "blue collar" recovery program...people telling their stories, giving their opinions...newcomers can relate and feel at home because there are folks here who understand and went through the same things...that's the real value in the recovery process here. Those of us who have gone through this can say "it's ok, we understand, things will get better"...that means a lot.
and yes, part of the recovery is becoming aware of the "nasty" things that twi did...in other words, it wasn't your fault!
So...to me, this place may be more about warning for those who need to be warned and more about recovery for those who need to recover...it simply depends on where a person is at...and let's not forget that people can search a wide variety of different topics and focus on the ones that they feel are appropriate for them.
Valid observation Groucho but also consider the good overall success rate of other abuse "programs" be they substance or other. Rarely are there trained psychs - in fact the most successful tend to be peer groups ( which I loosely interpret to mean your blue collar programs ). Perhaps the one distinction is that in a lot of abuse recovery programs there is indeed a program ( don't beat me up on this )...or at least a methodology. Here there is no real methodology - but there is a common thread (generally) - life sucked in TWI for whatever the myriad of reasons - and GSC provides a place for people to express/vent/explain. So I see GSC as a place with valid mechanisms for recovery albeit not codified.
Just a thought...
Somebody robbed the Glendale train this morning at half-past nine....NRPS
All the talk about warning others in the recent forgiveness type threads, got me wondering about this.
Sure it is both, but is it more one than the other? How many people do you think GSC has warned? There has to be quite a few. I knew a couple, including my wife, (when she was just a friend) who mentioned WayDale when I was trying to get them to come to fellowship.
There are a lot of us who have been here a while and all for relatively different reasons. Is it in someway part of the recovery though?
I think for me it has been more about recovery... about moving on and sorting things out. The warning part seems nobel and I think it is a great side note, but this place for me has been more about the recovery.
I always hate when people come on and try to get people to forgive and blanket all negative views with bitterness and hatefulness. It is silly to think that way. It is an unnecessary step IMHO in the literal sense. I heard somewhere that forgiving was not letting the offenders have control over you anymore. Moving on in a sense. That I have done. It was part of the recovery process, but not a critical or specific step along the way...
The PenguinDictionary of Psychology defines "recovery" as generally, the return to or reestablishment of the normal, original state of a person.
IMHO recovery for Ex-TWI folks is a return to being a normal person – with the freedom to THINK, EXPRESS EMOTIONS, and CHOOSE a RESPONSE.
This "silly" way of thinking you mentioned exemplifies the type of mindset prevalent in TWI – which accepts without questionTWI's spin on an issue and what the follower's response should be.
This is a great thread - got me thinking about vp's story in PFAL of the pranksters who set the handlebars crooked on someone's bicycle. Ironically, that's just what happens to PFAL students who absorb vp's viewpoint – they acquire a mindset that has a skewed way of perceiving things…makes me think of Chris G33r saying something like we must not only look at the facts – but the truth behind the facts…Don't think the handlebars are straight with that fella.
Grease Spot…it's about recovery…and warning - don't let anyone touch your handlebars.
I'm pretty new here, so I'm still figuring out what it is for me. I "got out" around 1983, and have changed alot, grown alot, and have a pretty nice (not perfect, but nice) life now. Yet stuff from twi still comes up for me. Often not for a long time, and I think I'm completely done with it, and then...
So, at least for now, it's reassuring to know that there's alot of folks who are processing some of the same stuff, even though many of them have been away from twi as long as I have. It's "fellowship" minus the control (for the most part, but nothing's perfect!).
Actually, the imperfection makes it all the more attractive. Some folks have been very kind, some rude, some very funny,some p#*sed off, and many just seem to want to have some genuine discourse. It's all good, because people seem to feel pretty free to say what's on their mind.
So, maybe for me it's going to about some healing and some humor and some dialog with people who know without alot of tiring explanations. We'll see how I feel down the road...
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Ham
Sometimes I think the place is more about the party. I'd rather just have fun.. but I hope I can help someone else in the process..
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lindyhopper
YOU CALL THIS A PARTY, HAM?
I'm BLEEDING over here!
BLEEDING!
oh
no
wait that is just my bloody mary. I must have spilled it.
BACK TO TOPIC
this thread is screwed now.
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Ham
Actually, I've "moved on". I've gotten involved in the community.. higher education, etc..
I think quite a few of us have. But there's one strange place in the world.. a language and vocabulary that practically no one else can understand..
why do I keep coming back..
sheesh.. I don't know..
I think this place sometimes warns those who may enter the "hallowed(?)" doors.. but I think it really is more than that. It's where the evaluations of old leadership gone by, and even perhaps for the "new" guard is being written. It's a luxury that many of us were not allowed in the old ministry.
I never got a form to fill out when the bestest and latest corpses local coordinators would move on.
Here, I can give them an HONEST evaluation. For me, I'm sure it's not entirely anonymous.
What's even more interesting.. I can read the evaluations given by others.
You'd think the old organization would give half a damn about something like this..
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cheranne
That is a great question.
I came here because i was hoping to find my old wow brothers,sisters,friends i hadn't heard
from in years because i was no longer in twi, and hoping i would find them safe, healed and
recovered .cause i always cared about them THE PEOPLE!
I have not found anyone i actually knew back then,but i am glad their is such a site here for
THE PEOPLE.
AND....i do not care what you believe in now or don't. and i am not here to preach and quote
scripture ,just here like a support ,a net to help cushion the blow for people that don't have any
support.
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rhino
I think one poll said most people here (80%?) got out of TWI at least 8 years ago, most more like 15-20 years.
The thing that keeps the place "alive" appears to be a community of folks that were in in the 70's up toward '86, then another group that endured some lcm whackiness and left in the 90's.
Anybody needing help getting out has a ton of stuff to read off the front page. They can drop into any disscussion and get a feel of real people having fun, and that are totally irreverent toward any TWI "mystique". (Can I be ordained as "The very IrReverand Rhino?)
I don't spend much time thinking of recovery, more about various life choices and beliefs. We use TWI as a comparison because it was so much of our early years, and a common knowledge base. For us it is a good case study that can be related to, though it is easy to devolve into minutia of just how that case study should be interpretted.
And there is something cool about this circle that were so commonly bound for so long, then to have this 20 year jump where we dicover how lives turned out. At that corpse site you see some real pictures and real names ... so it is different ... not much discussion though.
I rather think some still hold delusions bout TWI, that it was all well meaning folks that got a little twisted. I tend to believe that view for most, but at the root were some people that were too willing to use and abuse, and that became systematic and involved many people that some would prefer not to "think evil of".
So some don't come here or stay here ... I still like the crowd, and like them better with beer or wine in hand.
It is more of a bar for me from 5pm till midnight. 
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Bramble
I was one who was in during the nineties. Coming here did help alot. So many things were redefined for us, things were called love that were actually control and using us, not love at all.
We were told we were being helped so we could be strong--but in reality we were just getting weaker and more dependent.
It was confusing. Plus confidence became so shaken because we were always wrong/off the Word etc about so many things.
It was and is good to come here and be able to say--that wasn't love, that was cruel, that was control, we were being used, bullied etc.
It takes time to unravel all the stuff, even to recgonise why you feel/act /think a certain way.
I think the same threads could be a warning or recovery, depending on where the reader is in life.
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frank123lol
What would you do without us?(Twi)
You will be isolated(twi)
The adversarys fair game(Twi)
My reply?I left! Talk about abundance!
The 90s were fear plain and simple
do this or this will happen
Watch out we will turn your wife and family against you
Enough is enough,Either life is worth living or it is not
No one can live in the pressure cooker they call the way cult!!
WAKE UP INNIES THEY ARE SUCKING YOU DRY!!!!!!!!!!!
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TrustAndObey
I thoguht this place was where we could hang out and roast our hot dogs and marshmellows on the slowly dying embers of TWI?
Not that I was going to eat mine, I just wanted to see how shrivelled the hot dog could get.
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excathedra
uhhhhh duhhhhh what was the question ;)
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coolchef
Ham's right party and to chat with nice folks like you AND not to kick ourselves in the foot for when we were kids and got duped.hopefully others still in will be aware
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excathedra
and if not ? party on !!!!!
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GrouchoMarxJr
I think that oftentimes the "warning" IS part of the recovery...the things that are said here mean different things to different people. We are not trained psychologists and there is no professional recovery program here...we are more of a "blue collar" recovery program...people telling their stories, giving their opinions...newcomers can relate and feel at home because there are folks here who understand and went through the same things...that's the real value in the recovery process here. Those of us who have gone through this can say "it's ok, we understand, things will get better"...that means a lot.
and yes, part of the recovery is becoming aware of the "nasty" things that twi did...in other words, it wasn't your fault!
So...to me, this place may be more about warning for those who need to be warned and more about recovery for those who need to recover...it simply depends on where a person is at...and let's not forget that people can search a wide variety of different topics and focus on the ones that they feel are appropriate for them.
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RumRunner
Valid observation Groucho but also consider the good overall success rate of other abuse "programs" be they substance or other. Rarely are there trained psychs - in fact the most successful tend to be peer groups ( which I loosely interpret to mean your blue collar programs ). Perhaps the one distinction is that in a lot of abuse recovery programs there is indeed a program ( don't beat me up on this )...or at least a methodology. Here there is no real methodology - but there is a common thread (generally) - life sucked in TWI for whatever the myriad of reasons - and GSC provides a place for people to express/vent/explain. So I see GSC as a place with valid mechanisms for recovery albeit not codified.
Just a thought...
Somebody robbed the Glendale train this morning at half-past nine....NRPS
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T-Bone
The Penguin Dictionary of Psychology defines "recovery" as generally, the return to or reestablishment of the normal, original state of a person.
IMHO recovery for Ex-TWI folks is a return to being a normal person – with the freedom to THINK, EXPRESS EMOTIONS, and CHOOSE a RESPONSE.
This "silly" way of thinking you mentioned exemplifies the type of mindset prevalent in TWI – which accepts without question TWI's spin on an issue and what the follower's response should be.
This is a great thread - got me thinking about vp's story in PFAL of the pranksters who set the handlebars crooked on someone's bicycle. Ironically, that's just what happens to PFAL students who absorb vp's viewpoint – they acquire a mindset that has a skewed way of perceiving things…makes me think of Chris G33r saying something like we must not only look at the facts – but the truth behind the facts…Don't think the handlebars are straight with that fella.
Grease Spot…it's about recovery…and warning - don't let anyone touch your handlebars.
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Tamar
I'm pretty new here, so I'm still figuring out what it is for me. I "got out" around 1983, and have changed alot, grown alot, and have a pretty nice (not perfect, but nice) life now. Yet stuff from twi still comes up for me. Often not for a long time, and I think I'm completely done with it, and then...
So, at least for now, it's reassuring to know that there's alot of folks who are processing some of the same stuff, even though many of them have been away from twi as long as I have. It's "fellowship" minus the control (for the most part, but nothing's perfect!).
Actually, the imperfection makes it all the more attractive. Some folks have been very kind, some rude, some very funny,some p#*sed off, and many just seem to want to have some genuine discourse. It's all good, because people seem to feel pretty free to say what's on their mind.
So, maybe for me it's going to about some healing and some humor and some dialog with people who know without alot of tiring explanations. We'll see how I feel down the road...
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