Who comes to the Cafe?

[Twinky]

Folks, it might be interesting to find out a bit about who comes to the Cafe so if you're willing, let's ask the questions. If I missed out a relevant category, apologies, tick other and tell us about it below.

Edited January 11, 2008 by Twinky

[Twinky]

In case anyone thinks I've not voted - I did, but made an amendment to the poll and it won't let me vote again.

[Belle]

Good poll, Twinky. It'll be interesting to watch. :)

I chose the HFC option even though we were only ever assistant household coordinators.

In the "why you left" section I chose "other" because, while I did not leave of my own accord, I was not exactly kicked out either. I was "allowed" to "take a break" for a while and I'm pretty sure that if I had declared an epiphany of the egregious nature of my thoughts and behavior, I would have been "allowed" to go back into the fold of TWI.

My leaving was not, at the time, all that cut and dried.

After I left I did many of the things mentioned in that section, but not necessarily in that order.

• Tried a different Christian religious organization
  
  
• Tried a different religion
  
  
• Didn't do anything for a long time
  
  
• Was seriously depressed
  
  
• Life became wonderful
  
  
• Counselling/psychotherapy/similar
  
  

[Eyesopen]

Great poll Twinky!

So I put that I had left of my own accord because I didn't like what I saw. This is true for the most part, but it followed being kicked out of the Corps. I never actually "declared" that I was leaving. I simply took a vote in my twig and we decided that although we loved each other very much, we no longer wanted to be involved with twi.

[Kevlar2000]

I was not happy with the secretive manner and double-speak of the limb leader. I had heard a lot of things from my branch leader of which the LC would neither confirm nor deny.

The breaking point was, after all the preceding crap, the LC demanded that, in addition to holding fellowship at least twice a week, the Twig coords. would now have to attend "mandatory" TC meetings on Saturday. I told the LC I didn't appreciate having a Way leader demand anything from me, and was told, "you might have to make a decision whether you want to continue being a TC."

After agonizing for a week, I "resigned" as a TC, and left the Way completely shortly after that.

I should have said something like, "you didn't hire me and you can't fire me", but I still harbored some respect for, if not the person, then the concept of "leadership". And I figured the LC would call the folks in my twig and tell them to attend twig somewhere else anyway.

Ah well, water under the dam.

[TheHighWay]

I love this poll. It should be interesting to see the results, if folks partake.

My only comment is that the last section was hard to answer because I went through many of those things but in stages:

1) Was depressed, tried other christian religious groups, took any old job I could get just to pay the bills

2) Spent much time thinking things through, talking to friends, relatives, counselors -- got over it

3) Life became wonderful, got a great job, VERY happy with things right now

But this stuff happened over the course of 6 years... is it too late for you to amend that part of the poll into 2 year segments? Now THAT would be interesting. Or, maybe another way would be "Before I found Greasepot" and "After I found Greasespot". Would that be revealing???

[templelady]

1) When your Husband and your twig Coordinator are sexually abusing your kids, ( and Others

2) When you are told by leadership that as a submissive wife it is your duty to plead guilty to abuse charges so your husband will go free and you refuse

3) When you are diagnosed with multiple sclerosis and leaderships response is "this is God's punishment for not being a submissive wife" ( see #2)

It's time to gather the tattered shreds of your life, abandon ship, and tread water until you find good planks to grab hold of to swim to safety

I made it to safety thanks to a Loving Heavenly Father who never gave up on me AFTER I left TWI, wasn't ABSing, and didn't believe in Way doctrine anymore

Edited January 11, 2008 by templelady

[Ham]

Why I left..

voluntarily, didn't like what they taught, didn't like what they did.. and "other".

I could have stayed if I grovelled sufficiently, to a uneducated madman.

something like the vicsters description of slain in the spirit.. "cmon fellow, cooperate and fall down won't ya.."

"You'd better tell us what's wrong with you.."

something like.. "give us the names of all your spurts, and their resume's in triplicate.."

Interesting.. the place only got much worse after I left.. I wonder if mr. bread and vegetables figured out I wasn't the organizations "problem"..

[polar bear]

Yep I left voluntarily allright.

More like a "run for the hills".

Couldn't stand the teaching anymore. SNS's read like they were from a script. (Opps) they were.

Way prod. need some prodding. The poor souls had to sing the same stuff over and over. Same uniforms, same movement.

Almost hypnotic or should I say robotic.

Felt guilty I couldn't raise my ABS to 15 or 20 percent like they wanted.

Best thing I did was leave.

[waysider]

My departure was somewhat like drifting out to sea.

I drifted away slowly because of personal and family obligations.

One thing that has always intrigued me is that, despite my drifting out to sea, there was never any sort of search party launched.

All those years of being told I was "the best" and listening to how much they "just loved me" and when I left it was as if no one noticed I was gone.

I did hang with another believer(for a while) who had left.

But, when he started a new fellowship and I told him I was not interested, he disappeared too.

I don't hold it against him.

He was/is a really great guy.

I saw him not too long ago and he seemed to be in denial about what happened.

(but not in a pushy, defensive kind of way.)

I did not push the issue because I will always consider him a friend no matter what he decides to do.

Kinda like a brother who lives in a distant city if that makes any sense.

[now I see]

Great thread Twinky!

I checked the box for seriously depressed after leaving, but should add that if there was a box for isolated and traumatized I would have checked that too.  I concurr with what Waysider said, the "your the best and love yous" were all just lip service, absolutely fake, a cheap imitiation, and no reflection of God's or Jesus' love.

I relocated and ended up in an offshoot for a while, then, I am happy to say, I left there too, a complete retread ministry, same foundation in error.  I am happy to be a free agent now, and am thankful my path has lead me here. <_<

[dmiller]

(snip) ---

I am happy to be a free agent now ...

That says it all, in a nutshell!! :)

[now I see]

My old offshoot friends that I've witnessed to about the goldmine that's here on Greasespot and the fullness of being a free agent, just don't get it, they are still under the spell and they simply can't see through the haze... reminds me of seeing, they see not, hearing, they hear not....well, at least they've heard.

Hey D Miller, I like your signatory statement and the clip with it,  I saw John Hartford

  perform twice before he died, once in Wisconsin at a big Bluegrass festival in the 70's, and once in Oklahoma when he was solo, a great old time performer and gifted musician and writer, so sad he's no longer with us.  :( Edited January 12, 2008 by but now I see

[Kit Sober]

Nice poll. Thanks for the work to put it together.

[T-Bone]

Great poll - thanks for putting that together Twinky. It was a toss up for me on why I left - a combination of seeing how inept upper leadership was in handling issues after Passing of a Patriarch and starting to question the things we were taught...I finally chose leaving over what I was taught...Ever since I left - life has been wonderful!

[Eyesopen]

My old offshoot friends that I've witnessed to about the goldmine that's here on Greasespot

Now that is an interesting statement or just an odd choice of words.

[Bramble]

We did wow, way homes, ran a fellowship, I did the state bookstore for a few years, and children's fellowship for nearly a decade.

Funny, though--when my own children were old enough to go to Children's fellowship they abandoned the program in favor of having the children in the main meetings and smacking them with wooden spoons.

We left voluntarily but it was probably just a matter of days before we were kicked out. I'd made the 'mistake' several years earlier of telling my spouse I wanted out, he'd gone for help to the HFC, and it was all down hill from there with leadership.

[TheHighWay]

I'd made the 'mistake' ... of telling my spouse I wanted out, he'd gone for help to the HFC, and it was all down hill from there with leadership.

Yup, been there, done that!!

[happyheart]

We left voluntarily but it was probably just a matter of days before we were kicked out. I'd made the 'mistake' several years earlier of telling my spouse I wanted out, he'd gone for help to the HFC, and it was all down hill from there with leadership.

I learned the hard way that going to leadership for help was a disaster. They just ended up using whatever it was against you. Some help that was. I remember Craig saying "Why would you pay someone $200. an hour to care about you?" (Referring to therapists)

I guess it's better to pay 18 % of your income to have people b--tch slap you when you admit your not happy. :huh:

[frank123lol]

I learned the hard way that going to leadership for help was a disaster. They just ended up using whatever it was against you. Some help that was. I remember Craig saying "Why would you pay someone $200. an hour to care about you?" (Referring to therapists)

I guess it's better to pay 18 % of your income to have people b--tch slap you when you admit your not happy. :huh:

I would laugh at the last staement except for me the scars aint quite healed all the way.

[Twinky]

Thanks, all, for your replies so far. I think if I were to start this again I would add another button, "Did you leave pre- or post-PoP?" but too late for that now. Perhaps that can be considered later.

Results so far on 66 votes are that 54% of us have had Corps involvement (though didn't necesarily graduate) and 64% of us have been out for over 15 years, which gives some idea of the insidious nature of TWI teachings.

The subtle way of inviting someone to "take a break" as a subterfuge for throwing them out has also been raised in several posts. Whether anyone was received back with open arms after such a break is debatable. (I myself was invited to "take a break" and when I returned after 6 months met even more vile treatment than before. I doubt there was ever any intention to do let me back - it was just someone on a jolly to administer more humiliation.) Well done those of you who "took a break" and made it permanent. I think I'd call that being thrown out, rather than leaving volutarily, but it's whatever you feel is appropriate.

Looking forward to more responses.

Twinky

(edited cos I can't type today, hurt my index finger)

Edited January 14, 2008 by Twinky

[excathedra]

very interesting but i screwed up in some of my voting

[Twinky]

Ah, Ex, sure you didn't screw up too badly.

Some of the sections allow more than one answer, including, "what you did for TWI" and "what you did after TWI."

Thanks for everyone's responses, let's see a few more, please! :) :) :)

[cheranne]

Folks, it might be interesting to find out a bit about who comes to the Cafe so if you're willing, let's ask the questions. If I missed out a relevant category, apologies, tick other and tell us about it below.

i was a military wow,it looks like a lot of people are not doing anything after leaving twi(AS FAR AS SPIRITUALLY)sorry didn't mean to yell, i went to so much therapy my therapist got a new mercedes!!!!! in the movie awakenings with robin williams the first opening line is what happens to fish when the water freezes...........the adapt,well in our case or so many like us we were under ice and someone had to rescue us,i personally felt in a hypothermic state spiritually and i wrote an in depth paper i call under ice about hyphothermic brainwashing in an american cult. iT IS DEEP.

[GT]

For the first question, forgot about the "spouse corpse". Marrying a corpse and being treated like you graduated the way corpse, at the same time being treated like you didn't graduate the way corpse.