my sister and I got in a rip roaring fight over this crap.
she is one year older than me, we eat about the same same size .
they give her drugs she has side effects.
i have normal levels.
I think the fear they put in people makes them stressed and they get high blood pressure thinking they are gonna die over this invisable chemical in their body that is evil and the dr. has a freaking hey day!
i know this isnt gonna be popular. but i truly believe stress has alot to do with the chemicals in your body and how they function and once you allow them to be messed with all hell can break lose . i think a change in life is demanded for good health and so many want a quick fix of the pill, easier than losing weight and exercise etc.
I love it when the antidepressant warn that an increase in suicidal thoughts can happen while on this drug.
Thanks for that A LOT! I just dumped my latest batch of pills 2 days ago because the side effects were just too much. But the reading from my blood test were through the roof. At this point, I don't know what to do. Cheese and food in general in France is loaded with the stuff.
I'm going to have new blood work done and go back for another consultation this week.
I currently take 10mg of Lipitor daily. My numbers have gone down significantly. I don't feel any different than I ever did. But...
am I really doing myself any good by taking them? Ya got me...
The thing I DO find a little troubling in your links is the preponderance of "Phds." and "concerned activist" and such like after contributors names and a dearth of "MDs". That, and the general tone (almost universally found in "alternative" literature) that the basic mindset of the AMA crowd is to milk as much money as possible out of their patients, and to hell with their REAL health needs. I just don't think that that is an honest reflection of what mainstream medicine is really about.
I know that when one HAS a problem with their health, obviously they would like a solution. When mainstream medicine doesn't seem to have a real good - and hopefully painless and simple - cure, I think it's tempting to want to villify the "medical establishment" and seek out comparatively painless and inexpensive alternatives - thus the popularity of the whole "alternative" industry.
I see WAAAAY too often, pseudo-science rules the day with the alternative crowd. Selective studies, poorly designed studies, "cherry-picked" data, and - most of all - anecdotal evidence are the bread and butter of lots of the "trapped-toxins-in-our-bodies-are-the-source-of-all-illness" and "natural-is-automatically-better" crowd.
But, is there solid "truth" behind the articles you've posted? I just don't know. I just don't have the training to really be able to analyze any of the data responsibly. And, isn't that what the whole medical field - mainstream and alternative - depends on? Us just not being educated enough to really know what quality of care we're getting?
Well, I'm not going to go toss my medications down the drain just yet. I have seen first hand via both my mother and my sister what untreated cholesterol problems can do. There are many componants to all of this and it would be in the best interest of the individual to educate themself about THEIR specific situation. This would include understanding what aspects of their cholesterol are "abnormal". There are more factors than just good cholesterol and bad cholesterol. For instance, there are tryglicerides, which can effect you liver, pancreas, and kidneys if left out of control for too long.
Diet and exercise or very important and many people could stay off medications if they would just take care of those two aspects of their lives. There are other componants as well, like thyroid levels. If your thyroid isn't functioning properly, it can throw much of your body chemistry out of whack including cholesterol. An insufficiency in certain nutrients can also do this.
Diet doesn't mean drastic and outrage self denial - it means choosing your food wisely and having a lot of variety. I eat a lot of fish, I also eat chicken and red meat - variety. I eat a lot of veggies. I eat a very small amount of grains because in my specific situation it is the processed carbs that are the worst for me (that is MY situation, not everyone's).
Excercise is extremely important in this day and time when we spend hour upon hour sitting in an office chair, sitting in front of a computer, sitting in front of a t.v. It doesn't have to be intense, it doesn't have to consume your day. Use the stairs instead of the elevator. Walk or ride a bike instead of driving a car when time and weather permit. Get a small $30 "step walker" and use it for 20 - 30 minutes WHILE you are watching t.v.
Goey, I have a lot of respect for you and I know a little, but enough to know you have been through the gamut on this topic and have put in your research. Your research may very well have led you to what is best for YOU, that does not mean it is what is best for everyone.
I chose to educate myself, continue to work with my doctor, eat a healthy diet, exercise, AND take my medications as prescribed. I have no desire to spend weeks in the hospital because out of control cholesterol led to secondary problems.
I had my cholesterol checked years ago and it was a stunning 330. After reading "The Cholesterol Myth" I decided to not be overly concerned and definitely not take drugs for it. Things I have done are eliminate pork from my diet, decrease beef and, to a lesser extent, chicken and increase fish. My wife makes baked salmon twice a week and I try to eat sushi at least once a week with two servings of salmon. We also try to workout for an hour at least 3 times a week.
Healthwise, I have very few problems with my bp about normal for my age. My machine says my average is 117/77. I do watch the bp but ignore all the dire cholesterol warnings. My family has no significant heart disease history, despite living on a diet of lard, pig and fried chicken.
Note that this is my own personal opinion and should not be confused with health advice. Do your own research and decide what's right for you.
I'm going to throw my two cents in here, I've read a book by Kevin Trudeau called "Natural Cures The Don't want You to Know About" and he gets into alot on what I call "bandaid drugs" like what you're talking about and how they supposedly take care (cover-up) one ailment but in the end , they cause major damage to other parts of your body in the long run, which in turn causes you to take more drugs to correct the damage the first drug caused. The drugs never deal with the underlying cause, just the symptons He nails the FDA and the major pharmacutial companies and what their whole intent is. Some people call him a little extreme but I think there's alot of truth to what he says. He does push his own cures but that's towards the end of the book, I don't agree or disagree with that but, the part I found so eye-opening was what he shared about the drug companies and the FDA. And if I'm correct he does cover those two drugs that are mentioned in previous posts. It's definitely worth a read, you can get it at your library!
I think Trudeau is one of those that goes beyond simple delusion and steps over into the realm of con artist - that is, one who knows they're promoting B.S., but sees a way to make a buck at it, so... Sorta like a certain midwest preacher I once knew.
I think Trudeau is one of those that goes beyond simple delusion and steps over into the realm of con artist - that is, one who knows they're promoting B.S., but sees a way to make a buck at it, so... Sorta like a certain midwest preacher I once knew.
Here's a couple of links (lots more if you do a Google search, of course) showing 1: That cholesterol components are predictors of mortality HERE! and 2: That statin drugs (for whatever reason) lower mortality HERE!
Likewise I didnn't read the whole book that claimed cancer could be cured by drinking lemon juice and distilled water. Or the book that touted the benefits of laetrile (remember Vitamin B-17?), or the ones that claimed that copper bracelets could cure rheumatoid arthritis. There's just so much of the crap around, there simply isn't time enought in the day to read all the pseudo-scientific claptrap.
But there are "keys" class! Like, if the purveyor of said "cure" has no medical training whatsoever, has no history of real research in the field, and has in fact, been involved in something entirely different from what he is now touting, AND has a history of being prosecuted for fraud and tax evasion, just MAYBE you should view his earth-shattering claims with a bit of a more jaundiced eye?
1. Propound the idea that mainstream medicine is simply out to ripoff their patients and control their lives by keeping them sick and incapacitated with harmful drugs and surgeries.
2. Play up the conspiratorial aspect of it all. The doctors, hospitals, and drug companies are all colluding to maintain their control over your life and money.
3. Insinuate that there is a SECRET cure that only special people know about, that, for a price, YOU TOO can find out, and cure all your ailments. Generally only a few specifics are given out, and the "REAL" stuff is kept sorta vague, so you can keep coming around for further developments.
You want some examples? Just go to any "healthfood" or "supplement" store and glance at their book offerings.
Or, better yet, look up what books they were selling 10 or 20 years ago with the secret cures that nobody's buying anymore...
I made the connection (somewhat obliquely) in my last post.
Geeze, pay attention!
Goey,
Here's a couple of links (lots more if you do a Google search, of course) showing 1: That cholesterol components are predictors of mortality HERE! and 2: That statin drugs (for whatever reason) lower mortality HERE!
sudo
How about that Doc, you've come back to where we (you and I) can agree... even though you didn't express an opinion, per se.
Yeah and you sound like the critics that support mainstream medicine, in the end George, we are responsible for whatever we put into out bodies and I know for myself I sure I sure wouldn't be jumping so fast to pop a pill into my mouth just because a doctor prescribed it, I would definitely be doing my homework. I believe and I'm going to quote what TWI said that (God designed the body to heal itself) and when we go the way of traditional medicine pill popping for every ailment, it interferes with the way God set it up and reaps major problems throughout the body. I also believe that the major reason for 99% percent of sicknesses and dieases are a weakened immune system, via stress, lack of healthy foods, lack of exercise, smoking and those are things we can control right in our own backyard without any Dr's perscription.
Waysider, I read the article on the iron overload and cancer article, and found that other research from Harvard Medical School and the European Molecular Laboratory have substanciated it.
Wow, I recently switched from cooking in Teflon pans to steel and cast iron pans because of the cancer link to Teflon. Â Now I may have to reconsider the cast iron pans....That article says if you have the missing gene, then iron overload can cause cancer.
Regarding the anti-statins, they are touted as an aide to reduce the occurance of stroke, they're not just a heart attack fighter, both scarry stuff.
Re:"I also believe that the major reason for 99% percent of sicknesses and dieases are a weakened immune system...."
I think you just pointed out the real difference between medical science and alternative medicine. The belief system. See, you believe what you just stated and work from that belief.. you strengthen your immune system in ways that you believe will do that.
Medical science however accepts something only after its been proved. Its the empirical method. That's not to say that a scientist won't get a bright idea like, say, that bacteria causes diphtheria. But the way the system works is that the scientist has to prove the hypothesis before he comes out and claims such a thing. George gave several examples (the laetrile one was a classic) where the alternative medical folks will jump on something based on gut feel or something.
That's not to say there aren't problems in medical science but I see no other way to prove something.
I would say that mainstream medicine is good in general. However, I think that in the case of fats, cholesterol and statins that we, as well as mainstream medicine, have been mislead. Look at how they screwed up with trans fats, how for years they were telling us how good and healthy they were.
Butter Bad. Margerine Good. Do you know how margarine is made and what is really in it ? If you did I bet you would not eat it any more. Rancid oils, acid baths, nickel catalysts, bleach, artifical color and artifical flavor ...... and somehow this is better for us than nature's butter, or so the doctor that you trust so much has told us for the last 50 years.
Statin drugs are treating a statistic, not a human being or a disease. Statistics can be very misleading and they can be distorted.
For example if we take 2 groups of 1000 people. 1 group has "high" cholesterol and one has normal cholesterol. Let's say that over 5 years, 4 in the high cholseterol group have heart attacks and 2 in the normal group have heart attacks. We can say that your chances are "twice as high" of having a heart attack if you have high cholesterol. Instead of .2 percent they are .4 percent. So what do we do?
We treat ALL people with high cholesterol to get to the 2 in 1000 that might actually be helped. We treat 1000 to statistically save 2. But in doing so we have unnecessarily treated 998 people. This is exactly what traditional medicine is doing with cholesterol and statins.
It wouldn't be so bad if the statin drugs were otherwise harmless and had no side effects. But such is not the case. The side effects are facts and not pseudosciece as you suggested.
It is not psudoscience and nut jobs that are questioning and dispelling the myths and misleading information concerning cholesterol , fats and statins. Check out the links I provided and do your own research. Or just blindly accept tradional medicine and traditional "science" in this matter .....you know the same ones that gave us margarine, trans fats and saccarin, and told us how good they were for us.
I think more than one HUGE problem has come about after a drug has been released by the FDA.
you read the head lines, you know darn well how the FDA has so many problems with lack of staffing, errors and just general inability to be certain, it was even on the debate with the democrats last night.
after a few hundred or thousand have the same type death or major problems only then do they sometimes even begin to form a link with a common drug they have.
many drugs are recalled after an the oh we didnt realize that could happen !
be honest science has more than a few problems and it is not exactly proven what the heck will happen when any of these drugs come out!!
but some cling to the hope my siblings are much older than I and they all have the typical problems of high blood pressure cholesteral. all of it.
i do think it has to do with the dr. some but I also think they need to do what they need to do and i would never dare say what iright for me is for them.
personly I really do not wanto live into well old age unless i can be absolutely healthy and do my own thing. and I smoke so there ya have it.
so i do not go for meds, or tests or check ups really all that much once every two years, never had an issue and i do take my blood pressure often cause everyone eles seems to have such issues in my family.
I have the sudden onset pressure which is linked to stress.. i believe my brother who died in a car accident did as well they think he had a mini stroke when he was in his forties and my sister had a stroke in her forties my family is one of those sick ones.
I will tell you a story and again i think God was in this for me, I had to have an exam for a job and I had to have a test I was nervous it was a very bad day a number of issues were getting to me and i didnt eat that day.
so when they took my blood pressure for the job the PA told the nurse to call an ambulance, my blood pressure was so high she thought i was going to ahve a stroke right then.
I said wait just wait let me get a grip I cant put it back down . she called the ambulance and by the time it arrived I was fine and my blood pressure was normal.
IKNOW I have never heard anyone doing this and IKNOW it isnt something I would tell anyone to do to do to be ok. i was young then in my 30's I assked the Dr. and he said I had that situational blood pressure when my emotions increase my body reacts with high blood pressure .
of course he wanted me to go on med. i said no. Now as I age i think I have learned how not to stress I really have, twi helped me practice a great deal when my body was able to adjust itself alot quicker . being a single parent two divorces my life has not been easy. i think now if I get so emotional i stroke out it had better be a big one and i die instead of messing me up to the point i cant talk or walk and need rehab forever.
I know this is radical but that is how i feel about how i want to manage my life.
Medical science however accepts something only after its been proved.
Idealy that should be true. However it is not true in all cases. And let's not confuse an unproven hypothesis with a proven one. And let's also not confuse
true medical science with that which is driven by outside influences such as Drug Manufacturers amd other commercial interests.
If a study was done on Lipitor for example, and 2 universities were asked to analyze the data. Which one would you trust to be more objective? The one that received a $500,000 grant from Pfizer or the one that did not?
The lipid hypothesis can be rather easily debunked with real science and unbiased analysis of the many studies that have been done. The largest of this kind ever done, the Framingham Study has clearly shown no corrleation between saturated fats/cholesterol and athlerosclerosis. Yet it's data is ignored in favor of data provided by Merk, Pfizer and the scientists they pay to do their studies and research .
Mary Enig, is not a "pseudoscientist". Neither are many of the others that have shown the lipid hypothesis to be flawed. These are not all "alternative medicine" people as some of you have presumed, but real scientists and doctors, many from respected universities and research centers.
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Danny
This week my total was 180
and was told it was way to high.
Thanks for the links
Lot of baby boomers here
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pond
thank you Goey
my sister and I got in a rip roaring fight over this crap.
she is one year older than me, we eat about the same same size .
they give her drugs she has side effects.
i have normal levels.
I think the fear they put in people makes them stressed and they get high blood pressure thinking they are gonna die over this invisable chemical in their body that is evil and the dr. has a freaking hey day!
i know this isnt gonna be popular. but i truly believe stress has alot to do with the chemicals in your body and how they function and once you allow them to be messed with all hell can break lose . i think a change in life is demanded for good health and so many want a quick fix of the pill, easier than losing weight and exercise etc.
I love it when the antidepressant warn that an increase in suicidal thoughts can happen while on this drug.
yeah sounds like a rememdy to me!not.
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Bumpy
Thanks for that A LOT! I just dumped my latest batch of pills 2 days ago because the side effects were just too much. But the reading from my blood test were through the roof. At this point, I don't know what to do. Cheese and food in general in France is loaded with the stuff.
I'm going to have new blood work done and go back for another consultation this week.
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George Aar
I don't know what to think Goey.
I currently take 10mg of Lipitor daily. My numbers have gone down significantly. I don't feel any different than I ever did. But...
am I really doing myself any good by taking them? Ya got me...
The thing I DO find a little troubling in your links is the preponderance of "Phds." and "concerned activist" and such like after contributors names and a dearth of "MDs". That, and the general tone (almost universally found in "alternative" literature) that the basic mindset of the AMA crowd is to milk as much money as possible out of their patients, and to hell with their REAL health needs. I just don't think that that is an honest reflection of what mainstream medicine is really about.
I know that when one HAS a problem with their health, obviously they would like a solution. When mainstream medicine doesn't seem to have a real good - and hopefully painless and simple - cure, I think it's tempting to want to villify the "medical establishment" and seek out comparatively painless and inexpensive alternatives - thus the popularity of the whole "alternative" industry.
I see WAAAAY too often, pseudo-science rules the day with the alternative crowd. Selective studies, poorly designed studies, "cherry-picked" data, and - most of all - anecdotal evidence are the bread and butter of lots of the "trapped-toxins-in-our-bodies-are-the-source-of-all-illness" and "natural-is-automatically-better" crowd.
But, is there solid "truth" behind the articles you've posted? I just don't know. I just don't have the training to really be able to analyze any of the data responsibly. And, isn't that what the whole medical field - mainstream and alternative - depends on? Us just not being educated enough to really know what quality of care we're getting?
Seems like it to me...
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Abigail
Well, I'm not going to go toss my medications down the drain just yet. I have seen first hand via both my mother and my sister what untreated cholesterol problems can do. There are many componants to all of this and it would be in the best interest of the individual to educate themself about THEIR specific situation. This would include understanding what aspects of their cholesterol are "abnormal". There are more factors than just good cholesterol and bad cholesterol. For instance, there are tryglicerides, which can effect you liver, pancreas, and kidneys if left out of control for too long.
Diet and exercise or very important and many people could stay off medications if they would just take care of those two aspects of their lives. There are other componants as well, like thyroid levels. If your thyroid isn't functioning properly, it can throw much of your body chemistry out of whack including cholesterol. An insufficiency in certain nutrients can also do this.
Diet doesn't mean drastic and outrage self denial - it means choosing your food wisely and having a lot of variety. I eat a lot of fish, I also eat chicken and red meat - variety. I eat a lot of veggies. I eat a very small amount of grains because in my specific situation it is the processed carbs that are the worst for me (that is MY situation, not everyone's).
Excercise is extremely important in this day and time when we spend hour upon hour sitting in an office chair, sitting in front of a computer, sitting in front of a t.v. It doesn't have to be intense, it doesn't have to consume your day. Use the stairs instead of the elevator. Walk or ride a bike instead of driving a car when time and weather permit. Get a small $30 "step walker" and use it for 20 - 30 minutes WHILE you are watching t.v.
Goey, I have a lot of respect for you and I know a little, but enough to know you have been through the gamut on this topic and have put in your research. Your research may very well have led you to what is best for YOU, that does not mean it is what is best for everyone.
I chose to educate myself, continue to work with my doctor, eat a healthy diet, exercise, AND take my medications as prescribed. I have no desire to spend weeks in the hospital because out of control cholesterol led to secondary problems.
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Jim
I had my cholesterol checked years ago and it was a stunning 330. After reading "The Cholesterol Myth" I decided to not be overly concerned and definitely not take drugs for it. Things I have done are eliminate pork from my diet, decrease beef and, to a lesser extent, chicken and increase fish. My wife makes baked salmon twice a week and I try to eat sushi at least once a week with two servings of salmon. We also try to workout for an hour at least 3 times a week.
Healthwise, I have very few problems with my bp about normal for my age. My machine says my average is 117/77. I do watch the bp but ignore all the dire cholesterol warnings. My family has no significant heart disease history, despite living on a diet of lard, pig and fried chicken.
Note that this is my own personal opinion and should not be confused with health advice. Do your own research and decide what's right for you.
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waysider
And then there is this.
http://www.nytimes.com/specials/women/warc...70305_1156.html
Reference to cholesterol/ iron relationship appears near end of article.
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Cowgirl
I'm going to throw my two cents in here, I've read a book by Kevin Trudeau called "Natural Cures The Don't want You to Know About" and he gets into alot on what I call "bandaid drugs" like what you're talking about and how they supposedly take care (cover-up) one ailment but in the end , they cause major damage to other parts of your body in the long run, which in turn causes you to take more drugs to correct the damage the first drug caused. The drugs never deal with the underlying cause, just the symptons He nails the FDA and the major pharmacutial companies and what their whole intent is. Some people call him a little extreme but I think there's alot of truth to what he says. He does push his own cures but that's towards the end of the book, I don't agree or disagree with that but, the part I found so eye-opening was what he shared about the drug companies and the FDA. And if I'm correct he does cover those two drugs that are mentioned in previous posts. It's definitely worth a read, you can get it at your library!
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George Aar
No, Cowgirl,
I think Trudeau is one of those that goes beyond simple delusion and steps over into the realm of con artist - that is, one who knows they're promoting B.S., but sees a way to make a buck at it, so... Sorta like a certain midwest preacher I once knew.
http://skepdic.com/trudeau.html
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Rocky
I'm just a little curious... on what this has to do with TWI (which is implied, as the thread is located in the About The Way forum).
Does anyone know?
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George Aar
Hey Rocky,
I made the connection (somewhat obliquely) in my last post.
Geeze, pay attention!
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Sudo
Goey,
Here's a couple of links (lots more if you do a Google search, of course) showing 1: That cholesterol components are predictors of mortality HERE! and 2: That statin drugs (for whatever reason) lower mortality HERE!
sudo
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Cowgirl
George.............Have you actually sat down and read the whole the book, or are you just mimicing the critics?
Cowgirl
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George Aar
Have I read the whole book? Nope.
Likewise I didnn't read the whole book that claimed cancer could be cured by drinking lemon juice and distilled water. Or the book that touted the benefits of laetrile (remember Vitamin B-17?), or the ones that claimed that copper bracelets could cure rheumatoid arthritis. There's just so much of the crap around, there simply isn't time enought in the day to read all the pseudo-scientific claptrap.
But there are "keys" class! Like, if the purveyor of said "cure" has no medical training whatsoever, has no history of real research in the field, and has in fact, been involved in something entirely different from what he is now touting, AND has a history of being prosecuted for fraud and tax evasion, just MAYBE you should view his earth-shattering claims with a bit of a more jaundiced eye?
Maybe...
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Cowgirl
Yeah and I think there's alot of crap in traditional medicine !!
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George Aar
Exactly!
That's the script that's being followed.
1. Propound the idea that mainstream medicine is simply out to ripoff their patients and control their lives by keeping them sick and incapacitated with harmful drugs and surgeries.
2. Play up the conspiratorial aspect of it all. The doctors, hospitals, and drug companies are all colluding to maintain their control over your life and money.
3. Insinuate that there is a SECRET cure that only special people know about, that, for a price, YOU TOO can find out, and cure all your ailments. Generally only a few specifics are given out, and the "REAL" stuff is kept sorta vague, so you can keep coming around for further developments.
You want some examples? Just go to any "healthfood" or "supplement" store and glance at their book offerings.
Or, better yet, look up what books they were selling 10 or 20 years ago with the secret cures that nobody's buying anymore...
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Rocky
How about that Doc, you've come back to where we (you and I) can agree... even though you didn't express an opinion, per se.
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Cowgirl
Yeah and you sound like the critics that support mainstream medicine, in the end George, we are responsible for whatever we put into out bodies and I know for myself I sure I sure wouldn't be jumping so fast to pop a pill into my mouth just because a doctor prescribed it, I would definitely be doing my homework. I believe and I'm going to quote what TWI said that (God designed the body to heal itself) and when we go the way of traditional medicine pill popping for every ailment, it interferes with the way God set it up and reaps major problems throughout the body. I also believe that the major reason for 99% percent of sicknesses and dieases are a weakened immune system, via stress, lack of healthy foods, lack of exercise, smoking and those are things we can control right in our own backyard without any Dr's perscription.
Cowgirl
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now I see
Waysider, I read the article on the iron overload and cancer article, and found that other research from Harvard Medical School and the European Molecular Laboratory have substanciated it.
Wow, I recently switched from cooking in Teflon pans to steel and cast iron pans because of the cancer link to Teflon. Â Now I may have to reconsider the cast iron pans....That article says if you have the missing gene, then iron overload can cause cancer.
Regarding the anti-statins, they are touted as an aide to reduce the occurance of stroke, they're not just a heart attack fighter, both scarry stuff.
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Sudo
Cowgirl,
Re:"I also believe that the major reason for 99% percent of sicknesses and dieases are a weakened immune system...."
I think you just pointed out the real difference between medical science and alternative medicine. The belief system. See, you believe what you just stated and work from that belief.. you strengthen your immune system in ways that you believe will do that.
Medical science however accepts something only after its been proved. Its the empirical method. That's not to say that a scientist won't get a bright idea like, say, that bacteria causes diphtheria. But the way the system works is that the scientist has to prove the hypothesis before he comes out and claims such a thing. George gave several examples (the laetrile one was a classic) where the alternative medical folks will jump on something based on gut feel or something.
That's not to say there aren't problems in medical science but I see no other way to prove something.
sudo
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Goey
George,
I would say that mainstream medicine is good in general. However, I think that in the case of fats, cholesterol and statins that we, as well as mainstream medicine, have been mislead. Look at how they screwed up with trans fats, how for years they were telling us how good and healthy they were.
Butter Bad. Margerine Good. Do you know how margarine is made and what is really in it ? If you did I bet you would not eat it any more. Rancid oils, acid baths, nickel catalysts, bleach, artifical color and artifical flavor ...... and somehow this is better for us than nature's butter, or so the doctor that you trust so much has told us for the last 50 years.
Statin drugs are treating a statistic, not a human being or a disease. Statistics can be very misleading and they can be distorted.
For example if we take 2 groups of 1000 people. 1 group has "high" cholesterol and one has normal cholesterol. Let's say that over 5 years, 4 in the high cholseterol group have heart attacks and 2 in the normal group have heart attacks. We can say that your chances are "twice as high" of having a heart attack if you have high cholesterol. Instead of .2 percent they are .4 percent. So what do we do?
We treat ALL people with high cholesterol to get to the 2 in 1000 that might actually be helped. We treat 1000 to statistically save 2. But in doing so we have unnecessarily treated 998 people. This is exactly what traditional medicine is doing with cholesterol and statins.
It wouldn't be so bad if the statin drugs were otherwise harmless and had no side effects. But such is not the case. The side effects are facts and not pseudosciece as you suggested.
It is not psudoscience and nut jobs that are questioning and dispelling the myths and misleading information concerning cholesterol , fats and statins. Check out the links I provided and do your own research. Or just blindly accept tradional medicine and traditional "science" in this matter .....you know the same ones that gave us margarine, trans fats and saccarin, and told us how good they were for us.
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excathedra
thanks for this thread
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pond
I think more than one HUGE problem has come about after a drug has been released by the FDA.
you read the head lines, you know darn well how the FDA has so many problems with lack of staffing, errors and just general inability to be certain, it was even on the debate with the democrats last night.
after a few hundred or thousand have the same type death or major problems only then do they sometimes even begin to form a link with a common drug they have.
many drugs are recalled after an the oh we didnt realize that could happen !
be honest science has more than a few problems and it is not exactly proven what the heck will happen when any of these drugs come out!!
but some cling to the hope my siblings are much older than I and they all have the typical problems of high blood pressure cholesteral. all of it.
i do think it has to do with the dr. some but I also think they need to do what they need to do and i would never dare say what iright for me is for them.
personly I really do not wanto live into well old age unless i can be absolutely healthy and do my own thing. and I smoke so there ya have it.
so i do not go for meds, or tests or check ups really all that much once every two years, never had an issue and i do take my blood pressure often cause everyone eles seems to have such issues in my family.
I have the sudden onset pressure which is linked to stress.. i believe my brother who died in a car accident did as well they think he had a mini stroke when he was in his forties and my sister had a stroke in her forties my family is one of those sick ones.
I will tell you a story and again i think God was in this for me, I had to have an exam for a job and I had to have a test I was nervous it was a very bad day a number of issues were getting to me and i didnt eat that day.
so when they took my blood pressure for the job the PA told the nurse to call an ambulance, my blood pressure was so high she thought i was going to ahve a stroke right then.
I said wait just wait let me get a grip I cant put it back down . she called the ambulance and by the time it arrived I was fine and my blood pressure was normal.
IKNOW I have never heard anyone doing this and IKNOW it isnt something I would tell anyone to do to do to be ok. i was young then in my 30's I assked the Dr. and he said I had that situational blood pressure when my emotions increase my body reacts with high blood pressure .
of course he wanted me to go on med. i said no. Now as I age i think I have learned how not to stress I really have, twi helped me practice a great deal when my body was able to adjust itself alot quicker . being a single parent two divorces my life has not been easy. i think now if I get so emotional i stroke out it had better be a big one and i die instead of messing me up to the point i cant talk or walk and need rehab forever.
I know this is radical but that is how i feel about how i want to manage my life.
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Goey
Idealy that should be true. However it is not true in all cases. And let's not confuse an unproven hypothesis with a proven one. And let's also not confuse
true medical science with that which is driven by outside influences such as Drug Manufacturers amd other commercial interests.
If a study was done on Lipitor for example, and 2 universities were asked to analyze the data. Which one would you trust to be more objective? The one that received a $500,000 grant from Pfizer or the one that did not?
The lipid hypothesis can be rather easily debunked with real science and unbiased analysis of the many studies that have been done. The largest of this kind ever done, the Framingham Study has clearly shown no corrleation between saturated fats/cholesterol and athlerosclerosis. Yet it's data is ignored in favor of data provided by Merk, Pfizer and the scientists they pay to do their studies and research .
Mary Enig, is not a "pseudoscientist". Neither are many of the others that have shown the lipid hypothesis to be flawed. These are not all "alternative medicine" people as some of you have presumed, but real scientists and doctors, many from respected universities and research centers.
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