much better writing Mike! it is nice to speak with a poster who can express their words without the confusion and twisting and guessing games you often play with.
yes posting is a difficult thing in the medium of writing.... yet you seem to play guessing games on purpose to intice or make us wonder what you know that we do not.
like a game of cat and mouse. you do it on purpose.
the result is NOT as you want you get ignored and dismissed more than arouse interest.
Im not trying to hurt you your above post is simple enough to be understood and expressed in a manner most would enjoy. I do think it would benefit you to write without the arrogant game you know your playing with posters.
It's bad weather here. So I have the time. I always feel this way, though.
***
pond,
I'm all for straight talk. I resort to handstands, smoke, and mirrors when posters come at me with torches and pitchforks. It's happened oodles of times here, but I've developed a thick skin and watching the early Spider Man DVDs several times every night really helps me learn moves to keep three steps ahead of my attackers. I've been told it's more like a Road Runner cartoon than a cat and mouse one.
Speaking of straight talk, doesn't anyone want to finish I Cor 3?
I think that's not quite an English text that's God-breathed, but the Greek one AT BEST.
Your suggestion is an English text version of a translation of modern (1550 and up) scholarly compilation of fragmentary copies of copies of God-breathed documents from Paul's time, in Greek at best.
(Talking about the NT part)
You don't mean to assert that your suggestion is what I was asking for, DO you?
If you do, they we'd have to invent a new way of describing documents that are God-breathed and in English, that is, the English part is God-breathed. THAT'S what I was asking for... it's like asking for a COMPLETELY AUTHORITATIVE translation, the last word on translations.
...I can't blame you for not seeing this. It's only possible to see it by opening the books up FRESH and A LOT....
Ya know…just when this thread starts to bore me – a post or two will remind me of specific vp drivel – and when I find it - I just enjoy a big ol' laugh over spotting another one of his tricks. Case in point - from PFAL, Chapter Eleven, The Translations of the Word of God, page 128:
"…Since we have no originals and the oldest manuscripts that we have date back to the fifth century A.D., how can we get back to the authentic prophecy which was given when holy men of God spoke? To get the Word of God out of any translation or out of any version, we have to compare one word with another word and one verse with another verse. We have to study the context of all the verses. If it is the Word of God, then it cannot have a contradiction for God cannot contradict Himself. Error has to be either in the translation or in one's own understanding. When we get back to that original, God-breathed Word – which I am confident we can – then once again we will be able to say with all the authority of the prophets of old, "Thus saith the Lord."…
[page 142 of the same chapter]
"…In this study on Power for Abundant Living in which we are interested in the accuracy and integrity of God's Word, we must get back to that original Word which was given when holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. We must strip off the translators' theologies which have come about with man-made devices and once more discover the perfect God-breathed Word."
End of excerpts
Uh huh …I don't believe I actually fell for this nonsense. I ought to start another thread on The Nonsense vp Used to Deceive & Mislead Others…If you're wondering where I got the idea for that title – I looked up the word "bu11$hi+" in Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary, Eleventh Edition.
Ok, I’ll turn off the sarcasm and work with you.
I’ll agree with you that IF the written part of PFAL is not God-breathed, then my thesis is idolatry, or something just as bad.
Now that I said that, can you agree with me that IF written PFAL is God-breathed then I'm not idolatrous at all?
I see what I am doing as helping grads get the good stuff from the good old days. It’s a right and proper presentation of something new that God has been trying to make available to grads for over 20 years now.
mike,
i think that your motivation to help people is a good thing...
i also am motivated to help people...
i am glad that you agree with me that IF the written part of pfal is not God-breathed, then your thesis is idolatry...
i'm assuming your thesis has something to do with studying and following the written pfal "materials"...
but would you please succintly state your thesis for me so that i will know exactly what it is (i do not want to make assumptions about it, and i have not been on this message board for 4 years so i really have not read too many of your posts)
and i would agree with you that IF (and i wish i could make that "if" 3 feet tall)... but IF written pfal is God-breathed, then you would not be idolatrous in following it...
so the big question is: IF
and i would also like to ask you: do you agree that IF there are errors in written pfal, then it cannot be God-breathed (since God does not make errors)
soooo...
before we start i need you to clarify a couple of things...
1.) please succintly state your thesis for me
and
2.) please state what the written pfal "materials" include (that you believe are "God-breathed")
"…Since we have no originals and the oldest manuscripts that we have date back to the fifth century A.D., how can we get back to the authentic prophecy which was given when holy men of God spoke? To get the Word of God out of any translation or out of any version, we have to compare one word with another word and one verse with another verse. We have to study the context of all the verses. If it is the Word of God, then it cannot have a contradiction for God cannot contradict Himself. Error has to be either in the translation or in one's own understanding. When we get back to that original, God-breathed Word – which I am confident we can – then once again we will be able to say with all the authority of the prophets of old, "Thus saith the Lord."…
[page 142 of the same chapter]
"…In this study on Power for Abundant Living in which we are interested in the accuracy and integrity of God's Word, we must get back to that original Word which was given when holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. We must strip off the translators' theologies which have come about with man-made devices and once more discover the perfect God-breathed Word."
End of excerpts
You know it's uncanny and just a bit...no, a lot...unnerving that even though it has been over 20 years and I am reading the words on a computer screen, his voice still resonates in my head when I read them. It doesn't matter which class it is or which SNS or whatever his voice and Loy's voice seem to haunt me. :blink: I guess you never really do get that spunge clean.
i think that your description of vpw borders on idolatry...
What exactly does this mean and exactly what is it supposed to prove Mr. Ham? Truthfully it doesn't prove a thing to me - other than the fact "half a dozen other posters" have come to the wrong conclusion. Let me explain why I believe this further.
In ninth grade I gave the conclusion and the correct answer to a math question when the rest of the class was completey wrong when applying the same formula. The correct answer to the quesion was "0". The rest of the class had said something else - they all (without distinction) said: "-1".
The teacher then asked, "How many of you say the answer is "0"? About half the class had their hands raised, mine included. Then she asked, "How many of you say -1?" There were a few more than half of the class whose hands were raised who said -1. She asked again, "How many of you still say 0? Now there were only 3 hands raised, instead of 8 like before. She asked again, How many of you think it is still -1? Nearly everyone's hands were raised now, except mine. Then she asked again, "How many of you still say 0? Now only my hand was raised.
Do you want to know why it was still raised? The reason was I had cheated. I looked in the back of the book to find the correct answer to that math question. That didn't mean I understood how to arrive at the correct conclusion to the math question, I just had the correct answer without having the understanding of how to come to the correct answer. That is exactly where I believe a lot of people are at with the PFAL class today and with the PFAL collateral materials. They cheated and "looked ahead". Of course, we got the correct answer in PFAL - but that doesn't mean we have got the understanding on how to arrive at the correct answer. Now everybody in the class has got their hand raised with some other answer that was already written in the book.
The next thing I knew the teacher had started questioning me on how I arrived at the answer. Since I was now the only one in the class left who had said "0" and also because I couldn't give her an appropriate answer (I didn't want to admit I cheated and that I already found the answer in the back of the book) I just said, "Well, I think it could be 0, but I might be wrong." The rest of the class was now looking at me to side with them. I then put down my hand. When she asked for the last time, "How many of you still think the answer should be -1?," then I raised my hand.
Of course I would have gotten an A+, that is, before the rest of the class "peer pressured and talked me out" of the correct answer, even when I knew the correct answer by cheating and looking ahead and not knowing how to arrive at the correct conclusion to the math question.
All (without exception) I learned from that experience in ninth grade taught me was I should not cave into "peer pressure" - that I should learn how to arrive at the correct answer without cheating and looking ahead. I should gain an understanding of the material that was presented by applying it and workng it for myself - especially if I want to keep an A+ grade I can be proud of.
I just needed to put my two cents in. This post is a beautifull example of why we need to do what Dr. told us we needed to do, and that is to, "MASTER THE MATERALS!!!"
I believe that we cannot just go from memory, but need to REALLY understand what we were REALLY given, and what God by way of Dr. REALLY gave us! And that was the silver mine that so many others had just walked over.
Again I want to say that I love ALL of you and only want Gods' BEST for you.
You know it's uncanny and just a bit...no, a lot...unnerving that even though it has been over 20 years and I am reading the words on a computer screen, his voice still resonates in my head when I read them. It doesn't matter which class it is or which SNS or whatever his voice and Loy's voice seem to haunt me. :blink: I guess you never really do get that spunge clean.
Oh well...
Hi,
You are up late. I just needed to say that I too, still hear their voice.
I believe that we cannot just go from memory, but need to REALLY understand what we were REALLY given, and what God by way of Dr. REALLY gave us! And that was the silver mine that so many others had just walked over.
If God has something to give you, you don't need "Dr." to give it to you.
What??? You have to have some one else between you and Jesus Christ?
Life and death are in the power of the tongue, not a book.
I think that if we REALLY just focused on being good decent people and REALLY treated people with love and respect and REALLY gave up on all this BS about who is REALLY right about the Bible or your preferred book of faith by burying our nose in it, that everyone would REALLY be much better off. Collectively we would all be in a state that would WAY outweigh anything the WAY or any other group could claim to offer. Period.
I think that if we REALLY just focused on being good decent people and REALLY treated people with love and respect and REALLY gave up on all this BS about who is REALLY right about the Bible or your preferred book of faith by burying our nose in it, that everyone would REALLY be much better off. Collectively we would all be in a state that would WAY outweigh anything the WAY or any other group could claim to offer. Period.
Wow! Amen to that, Lindy Hopper!...Man, if you wrote a book about stuff like that, the Library of Congress just might classify it in the God-breathed category.
before we start i need you to clarify a couple of things...
1.) please succintly state your thesis for me
and
2.) please state what the written pfal "materials" include (that you believe are "God-breathed")
thank you,
jen-o
What we study are the writings (book and magazine form) Dr put his name on starting around 1971, when most of the books originated. We accept Dr's claims that these materials are from God, and aside from a few printer typos and proofreader errors, these publications are inerrant. We're not satisfied with a sense knowledge understanding of these materials, although that was at one time the only proper and available understanding. The factual meanings are no longer what we seek, but to see the truths is paramount.
In addition to the Way Magazine articles this is what we were given and told to master:
PFAL – Power For Abundant Living
RHST – Receiving the Holy Spirit Today
CSBP – Christians Should Be Prosperous
ADAN – Are the Dead Alive Now?
BTMS – The Bible Tells Me So (Vol. 1)
TNDC – The New, Dynamic Church (Vol. 2)
WWAY – The Word’s Way (Vol. 3)
GMWD – God’s Magnified Word (Vol. 4)
OMSW – Order My Steps In Thy Word (Vol. 5)
JCNG – Jesus Christ Is NOT God
JCOP – Jesus Christ Our Passover
JCPS – Jesus Christ Our Promised Seed
***
and i would also like to ask you: do you agree that IF there are errors in written pfal, then it cannot be God-breathed (since God does not make errors)
I, myself, am past this hurdle. If you want to try your hand at finding errors for me you're not only too late, but I WILL find your methods in such searching wanting. I've seen almost nothing but arguments from secure ignorance posing as error finders in these matters. Spend a few months (then years) reading these materials and we can begin straightening out apparent contradictions, but if you can't adopt an attitude of meekness in reading the materials and only want to conjure up what you THINK are errors, then I turn a deaf ear. My mind is closed tight as a bank vault on this.
For those arriving late, I shall enable the Help files for this one.
waysider,
I don't believe you have accurately identified the culprit of that event some several decades ago.
There's no amount of emotion you can try to bring to the board that is going to force me to change. That's an LCM method of the lowest order.
Mike will consider ANY discussion to the errors in his doctrine to be attempts to "force"
him to change, or being like lcm.
Mike will refuse to even seriously consider the possibility his doctrine is wrong and nearly everyone else is right, period.
I offered help for your pain, and you have a right to refuse it, but you can't bully me into backing off on what I have dedicated my life to. You'll wear out your emotions trying.
Mike thinks that-since we don't embrace Mikean doctrine- that we all need his help, and that any discussion
of the flaws in the Mikean doctrine are "bullying".
Mike has indeed "DEDICATED HIS LIFE TO" the Mikean doctrine.
Mike will make ANY sacrifice for his Mikean doctrine.
Now, I'm going to end this conversation with you if you don't get a grip and drop this latest strategy to argue points. Let's see what's inside the books, not the details of all that went wrong.
When the insides of the books ARE the details of all that went wrong,
Mike will then desperately "dodge" and "distract" and "never admit an error is an error."
(Those are DIRECT QUOTES from Mike, BTW.
He's since regretted admitting that he uses these strategies. He hasn't regretted USING them, however.
There's PLENTY of that on this board. I like to discuss what went right IN MY OPINION. If you got a problem with that, then put me on "ignore."
And if someone else OPINION disagrees with Mike's OPINION, Mike has a problem with that.
If someone else introduces FACTS that disagree with Mike's OPINION, Mike has a BIG problem with that,
thus "dodge" and "distract".
For those who arrived late, Mike's not the usual poster.
On vpw, Mike's said he "had an overabundance of brains and brawn", was "OVERgifted" and
"when he walked, the earth shook."
On the Orange Book, Mike's said that "when Jesus returns, he will be holding a copy of the Orange Book
and be teaching you from it."
For those of you who, like myself, think he HAD to be joking and making a joke on himself, he said he was
"Quite serious. I've seen him this way more than once."
There's other quotes, but basically, he considers the modern Bibles to be devoid of any usefulness, and devoid
of Godly authority.
For nearly 2000 years, there was no book with any real Godly authority.
Then, in 1942 and the years following, God-who bypassed centuries of Godly men-selects vpw as THE man to send
forth His message to the people, writing the greatest Godly documents for nearly 2000 years.
Oh, and Mike, please remember that I could make a MUCH more emphatic "case", but I'm taking it easy on you in this post.
Mike
In all the time I have been posting here, I have never put anyone on "ignore".
(Though I have joked about it from time to time.)
I'm not trying to bully you into anything.
Believe whatever floats your boat.
I know what's inside the books, Mike, and it's a steady diet of arsenic.
But, like the two dear old ladies in Arsenic and Old Lace, the person who administered it laced it with something to make it more palatable.
Gee, Mike's misinterpreted something he's read.
Who would have guessed?
mike,
i think that your motivation to help people is a good thing...
i also am motivated to help people...
i am glad that you agree with me that IF the written part of pfal is not God-breathed, then your thesis is idolatry...
i'm assuming your thesis has something to do with studying and following the written pfal "materials"...
but would you please succintly state your thesis for me so that i will know exactly what it is (i do not want to make assumptions about it, and i have not been on this message board for 4 years so i really have not read too many of your posts)
and i would agree with you that IF (and i wish i could make that "if" 3 feet tall)... but IF written pfal is God-breathed, then you would not be idolatrous in following it...
so the big question is: IF
and i would also like to ask you: do you agree that IF there are errors in written pfal, then it cannot be God-breathed (since God does not make errors)
soooo...
before we start i need you to clarify a couple of things...
1.) please succintly state your thesis for me
and
2.) please state what the written pfal "materials" include (that you believe are "God-breathed")
thank you,
jen-o
Mike, if you agree to answer plainly the questions by-and communicate directly and clearly with this poster with whom
I have no communication and know nothing about,
I will cooperate by staying out of the discussion entirely for at least a week, longer if it seems profitable for the discussion
What we study are the writings (book and magazine form) Dr put his name on starting around 1971, when most of the books originated. We accept Dr's claims that these materials are from God, and aside from a few printer typos and proofreader errors, these publications are inerrant. We're not satisfied with a sense knowledge understanding of these materials, although that was at one time the only proper and available understanding. The factual meanings are no longer what we seek, but to see the truths is paramount....
In other words, in order to achieve the maximum absorption rate you’ll have to turn this thing off:
Mike, I was merely pointing out the fact that your post advocated a mindless process of absorbing vp's stuff. Sorry you took it so hard.
What we study are the writings (book and magazine form) Dr put his name on starting around 1971, when most of the books originated. We accept Dr's claims that these materials are from God,and aside from a few printer typos and proofreader errors, these publications are inerrant. We're not satisfied with a sense knowledge understanding of these materials, although that was at one time the only proper and available understanding. The factual meanings are no longer what we seek, but to see the truths is paramount.
It appears everyone (I do mean everyone - all without exception) in this class has got their hands raised as to what they believe the correct answer or the conclusion is. Some people have even taken it upon themselves to count all the hands that have been raised. You are all (without exception) wasting your time with counting all (without exception) the raised hands - regardless of how they have been raised - one way or the other - either yea or nay.
Maybe you all (without exception) should quit guessing about "the answer", and/or quit looking ahead in the book to locate "the answer" and just ...
put down your raised hand! ... for "the teacher" (life) is eventually going to start asking you how you arrived at your conclusion.
(Sometimes this place really reminds me of: "Welcome back Kotter". There's always an "Arnold Horshack" somewhere in the croud with their arm fully extended, wildly flinging up in the air (practically ready to .... their paints) saying, Ooh-ooh-ooooh! Pick me!, Pick me! Pick me, Mr. Kotter, Pick me!")
well, how are we going to have a conversation then??
or are you telling me that you really don't want to have a conversation with me?
peace,
jen-o
I had written "My mind is closed tight as a bank vault on this."
The key word is "this." I can converse as to why I have closed my mind on this one issue, and I can discuss other issues where I have not made such a final decision. Haven't you arrived at the end of your life's search on any issues yet?
Anyway, we have strayed too far from the topic here. Maybe you and I can discuss this in a Doctrinal thread or in PMs.
There is still a bunch of stuff on I Corinthians 3 and forgiveness I'd like to finish up here.
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waysider
Well, you see, Mike, as the old ladies realized, no one would willingly consume pure arsenic.
That's why they "laced" it.
Now, you tell me. Which parts were the "arsenic" and which parts were the "lace"?
edited for punctuation.
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T-Bone
getting a little bored with your convoluted jargon...cut to the chase...just talk normal.
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Mike
I found those words of Jesus very intriguing, the first time I ever heard them.
Did you? Did you look into them? Find anything?
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pond
much better writing Mike! it is nice to speak with a poster who can express their words without the confusion and twisting and guessing games you often play with.
yes posting is a difficult thing in the medium of writing.... yet you seem to play guessing games on purpose to intice or make us wonder what you know that we do not.
like a game of cat and mouse. you do it on purpose.
the result is NOT as you want you get ignored and dismissed more than arouse interest.
Im not trying to hurt you your above post is simple enough to be understood and expressed in a manner most would enjoy. I do think it would benefit you to write without the arrogant game you know your playing with posters.
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excathedra
now you're talking
WORTHLESS
anyway, mike, where did you get this new steam ?
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Mike
Exy,
It's bad weather here. So I have the time. I always feel this way, though.
***
pond,
I'm all for straight talk. I resort to handstands, smoke, and mirrors when posters come at me with torches and pitchforks. It's happened oodles of times here, but I've developed a thick skin and watching the early Spider Man DVDs several times every night really helps me learn moves to keep three steps ahead of my attackers. I've been told it's more like a Road Runner cartoon than a cat and mouse one.
Speaking of straight talk, doesn't anyone want to finish I Cor 3?
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jen-o
mike,
i am not trying to attack you...
and i am glad that you re not going to be sarcastic with me anymore...
i definitely like straight talk!
:~)
shalom,
jen-o
p.s. i will have to post more later because i am on webtv right now...
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T-Bone
"…Since we have no originals and the oldest manuscripts that we have date back to the fifth century A.D., how can we get back to the authentic prophecy which was given when holy men of God spoke? To get the Word of God out of any translation or out of any version, we have to compare one word with another word and one verse with another verse. We have to study the context of all the verses. If it is the Word of God, then it cannot have a contradiction for God cannot contradict Himself. Error has to be either in the translation or in one's own understanding. When we get back to that original, God-breathed Word – which I am confident we can – then once again we will be able to say with all the authority of the prophets of old, "Thus saith the Lord."…
[page 142 of the same chapter]
"…In this study on Power for Abundant Living in which we are interested in the accuracy and integrity of God's Word, we must get back to that original Word which was given when holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. We must strip off the translators' theologies which have come about with man-made devices and once more discover the perfect God-breathed Word."
End of excerpts
Uh huh
…I don't believe I actually fell for this nonsense. I ought to start another thread on The Nonsense vp Used to Deceive & Mislead Others…If you're wondering where I got the idea for that title – I looked up the word "bu11$hi+" in Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary, Eleventh Edition.
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sirguessalot
now there seems at least
a book
a Book
and a BOOK
STORIES
Stories
and stories
here is a fresh batch of what i have found to be worthy and relevent words
from the words of the word in the words from God about forgiveness and such...
The Four Things That Matter Most
The Common Heart
Quakers
Mustard Seed
typing from work...
i'll keep adding as they pop up
and as the edit meter will allow
or someone objects
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jen-o
mike,
i think that your motivation to help people is a good thing...
i also am motivated to help people...
i am glad that you agree with me that IF the written part of pfal is not God-breathed, then your thesis is idolatry...
i'm assuming your thesis has something to do with studying and following the written pfal "materials"...
but would you please succintly state your thesis for me so that i will know exactly what it is (i do not want to make assumptions about it, and i have not been on this message board for 4 years so i really have not read too many of your posts)
and i would agree with you that IF (and i wish i could make that "if" 3 feet tall)... but IF written pfal is God-breathed, then you would not be idolatrous in following it...
so the big question is: IF
and i would also like to ask you: do you agree that IF there are errors in written pfal, then it cannot be God-breathed (since God does not make errors)
soooo...
before we start i need you to clarify a couple of things...
1.) please succintly state your thesis for me
and
2.) please state what the written pfal "materials" include (that you believe are "God-breathed")
thank you,
jen-o
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Eyesopen
You know it's uncanny and just a bit...no, a lot...unnerving that even though it has been over 20 years and I am reading the words on a computer screen, his voice still resonates in my head when I read them. It doesn't matter which class it is or which SNS or whatever his voice and Loy's voice seem to haunt me. :blink: I guess you never really do get that spunge clean.
Oh well...
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Neo
I just needed to put my two cents in. This post is a beautifull example of why we need to do what Dr. told us we needed to do, and that is to, "MASTER THE MATERALS!!!"
I believe that we cannot just go from memory, but need to REALLY understand what we were REALLY given, and what God by way of Dr. REALLY gave us! And that was the silver mine that so many others had just walked over.
Again I want to say that I love ALL of you and only want Gods' BEST for you.
Much Love,
Neo
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Neo
Hi,
You are up late. I just needed to say that I too, still hear their voice.
Neo
ps I'll stay in the boat!
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cman
If God has something to give you, you don't need "Dr." to give it to you.
What??? You have to have some one else between you and Jesus Christ?
Life and death are in the power of the tongue, not a book.
A living tongue.
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lindyhopper
I think that if we REALLY just focused on being good decent people and REALLY treated people with love and respect and REALLY gave up on all this BS about who is REALLY right about the Bible or your preferred book of faith by burying our nose in it, that everyone would REALLY be much better off. Collectively we would all be in a state that would WAY outweigh anything the WAY or any other group could claim to offer. Period.
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T-Bone
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Mike
What we study are the writings (book and magazine form) Dr put his name on starting around 1971, when most of the books originated. We accept Dr's claims that these materials are from God, and aside from a few printer typos and proofreader errors, these publications are inerrant. We're not satisfied with a sense knowledge understanding of these materials, although that was at one time the only proper and available understanding. The factual meanings are no longer what we seek, but to see the truths is paramount.
In addition to the Way Magazine articles this is what we were given and told to master:
PFAL – Power For Abundant Living
RHST – Receiving the Holy Spirit Today
CSBP – Christians Should Be Prosperous
ADAN – Are the Dead Alive Now?
BTMS – The Bible Tells Me So (Vol. 1)
TNDC – The New, Dynamic Church (Vol. 2)
WWAY – The Word’s Way (Vol. 3)
GMWD – God’s Magnified Word (Vol. 4)
OMSW – Order My Steps In Thy Word (Vol. 5)
JCNG – Jesus Christ Is NOT God
JCOP – Jesus Christ Our Passover
JCPS – Jesus Christ Our Promised Seed
***
I, myself, am past this hurdle. If you want to try your hand at finding errors for me you're not only too late, but I WILL find your methods in such searching wanting. I've seen almost nothing but arguments from secure ignorance posing as error finders in these matters. Spend a few months (then years) reading these materials and we can begin straightening out apparent contradictions, but if you can't adopt an attitude of meekness in reading the materials and only want to conjure up what you THINK are errors, then I turn a deaf ear. My mind is closed tight as a bank vault on this.
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WordWolf
For those arriving late, I shall enable the Help files for this one.
Mike will consider ANY discussion to the errors in his doctrine to be attempts to "force"
him to change, or being like lcm.
Mike will refuse to even seriously consider the possibility his doctrine is wrong and nearly everyone else is right, period.
Mike thinks that-since we don't embrace Mikean doctrine- that we all need his help, and that any discussionof the flaws in the Mikean doctrine are "bullying".
Mike has indeed "DEDICATED HIS LIFE TO" the Mikean doctrine.
Mike will make ANY sacrifice for his Mikean doctrine.
When the insides of the books ARE the details of all that went wrong,
Mike will then desperately "dodge" and "distract" and "never admit an error is an error."
(Those are DIRECT QUOTES from Mike, BTW.
He's since regretted admitting that he uses these strategies. He hasn't regretted USING them, however.
And if someone else OPINION disagrees with Mike's OPINION, Mike has a problem with that.If someone else introduces FACTS that disagree with Mike's OPINION, Mike has a BIG problem with that,
thus "dodge" and "distract".
For those who arrived late, Mike's not the usual poster.
On vpw, Mike's said he "had an overabundance of brains and brawn", was "OVERgifted" and
"when he walked, the earth shook."
On the Orange Book, Mike's said that "when Jesus returns, he will be holding a copy of the Orange Book
and be teaching you from it."
For those of you who, like myself, think he HAD to be joking and making a joke on himself, he said he was
"Quite serious. I've seen him this way more than once."
There's other quotes, but basically, he considers the modern Bibles to be devoid of any usefulness, and devoid
of Godly authority.
For nearly 2000 years, there was no book with any real Godly authority.
Then, in 1942 and the years following, God-who bypassed centuries of Godly men-selects vpw as THE man to send
forth His message to the people, writing the greatest Godly documents for nearly 2000 years.
Oh, and Mike, please remember that I could make a MUCH more emphatic "case", but I'm taking it easy on you in this post.
Gee, Mike's misinterpreted something he's read.
Who would have guessed?
Mike, if you agree to answer plainly the questions by-and communicate directly and clearly with this poster with whom
I have no communication and know nothing about,
I will cooperate by staying out of the discussion entirely for at least a week, longer if it seems profitable for the discussion
for me to do so.
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T-Bone
In other words, in order to achieve the maximum absorption rate you’ll have to turn this thing off:
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Mike
OUCH! That hurt!
...but I forgive you.
***
I see the weather is clearing up.
A sparkling new penny for the poster who can steer this thread back to topic: A note on forgiveness... :)
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T-Bone
Mike, I was merely pointing out the fact that your post advocated a mindless process of absorbing vp's stuff. Sorry you took it so hard.
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What The Hey
It appears everyone (I do mean everyone - all without exception) in this class has got their hands raised as to what they believe the correct answer or the conclusion is. Some people have even taken it upon themselves to count all the hands that have been raised. You are all (without exception) wasting your time with counting all (without exception) the raised hands - regardless of how they have been raised - one way or the other - either yea or nay.
Maybe you all (without exception) should quit guessing about "the answer", and/or quit looking ahead in the book to locate "the answer" and just ...
put down your raised hand! ... for "the teacher" (life) is eventually going to start asking you how you arrived at your conclusion.
(Sometimes this place really reminds me of: "Welcome back Kotter". There's always an "Arnold Horshack" somewhere in the croud with their arm fully extended, wildly flinging up in the air (practically ready to .... their paints) saying, Ooh-ooh-ooooh! Pick me!, Pick me! Pick me, Mr. Kotter, Pick me!")
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jen-o
well, how are we going to have a conversation then??
or are you telling me that you really don't want to have a conversation with me?
peace,
jen-o
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Mike
I had written "My mind is closed tight as a bank vault on this."
The key word is "this." I can converse as to why I have closed my mind on this one issue, and I can discuss other issues where I have not made such a final decision. Haven't you arrived at the end of your life's search on any issues yet?
Anyway, we have strayed too far from the topic here. Maybe you and I can discuss this in a Doctrinal thread or in PMs.
There is still a bunch of stuff on I Corinthians 3 and forgiveness I'd like to finish up here.
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