Off topic in a way. The line Don't Worry posted about the pain meds VP was taking at the end got me thinking .. as most of you know, I'm a pain patient and have tried almost every painkiller on the market. Here I can speak from experience/knowledge.
Tylenol 3 is the one of the lowest forms of pain killer and are only about 40 bucks a bottle with no insurnace. They also don't do a thing for chronic pain.
Vicodin/Lortab 7.5 to 10 mg help a bit more and are still a schedule 3 drug, so they cost about 100 per month without insurance.
Does anyone know if any of the people discussed here had insurance? If VP didn't, our ABS was going quickly with every script he filled for painkillers once he was classified a chronic pain patient with intolerable pain.
Once the pain gets bad, you move up to the schedule 2 drugs, Ms Contin (morphine), Oxycontin, and the patch (Fentanyl) which all start at 400 to 500 a month, sometimes more, depending on the mgs you need to take as you build tolerance.
The only schedule 2 drug that isn't expensive is Methadone. A month's worth runs 30 to 60 bucks depending on the mgs you take. It's also the best painkiller on the market for those who won't ever have to stop taking it. (The detox is something you never want to go thru if possible, it's very very bad.) Of course, given the stigma that drug has, since it's known mostly for helping heroin and other opitate addicts detox off them, I can't see any of the high ranking TWI people 'lowering' themself or their familes to such a drug, even though it would help the best.
What they did to anyone sick to avoid having to help goes way beyond what words can say. I trust that God *will* have the correct words at their judgement. I can't wait to hear Him say it all to them. What a happy day that will be for me, another who ignored my pain for years due to their teachings, until I was about 2 weeks shy of dying from an incurable, but not deadly disease (unless it's ignored). Thanks go to God for making pain , as that is when I finally got scared enough when I was passing out from the pain it was so bad that I went and pressured doctors until I found one willing to help me find out what was wrong and he saved my life. I was out of TWI by then though, I'm fully aware that if I had still be in, I wouldn't be alive today to type this to y'all.
I hope you find your friend Liz and have a wonderful reunion. I would love to hear all about it and all she's doing in her life today. She sounds like such a strongwilled, wonderful woman. I will keep a reunion in my prayers. Having had one with my birth family after adoption records were opened, I know well how wonderful they are.
Remember the Samaritan. I wonder what "denomination" or class of men Jesus would have used in place of "Samaritan" in that parable if he'd have spoken it in the 20th Century.
AnotherDan, regarding the Samaritan of the 20th century, I bet it would really chap TWI's hide if it were a kindly gay guy!
WAW, I remember while being in the Corps accompanying the Corps Coordinator's wife to the drug store where she filled her personal Rx's. Too bad when I had one the worst sinus infection of my life that lasted 3 weeks, where all I could get was herb tea and a face massage from third aide, they couldn't scrounge up anything else for me either.
Very different standards of treatment in the TWI food chain, the hierarchy system of TWI was born of the debil. Â Â
THis is all so sad. It really breaks my heart that we were taught to be such unloving louses while being told we were loving. To bad we never could really see what the real definition of love was back then.
I don't remember Liz or anything about her but I do hope she has had a great life these past few years
Too bad when I had one the worst sinus infection of my life that lasted 3 weeks, where all I could get was herb tea and a face massage from third aide, they couldn't scrounge up anything else for me either.
third aide
Now there's a "way speak" term I haven't heard in a while.
If I remember correctly it was the way equivalent of first-aid, except you were supposed to go to prayer first, then to being prayed for, then to medical attention. Of course the "third-aid" at HQ or other TWI locations were staffed by whoever happened to have a bit of medical training.
That's close to the concept I think. If one was squirting out pints of blood, PRAY. Pray hard..
if that fails, even if it takes an hour, or two, find a "believer" or "leader" who will then pray for you. After sharply reproving you, they will agree to "minister" to the person, despite the inconvenience such a spiritual hitchiker can impose upon their greatness.
If THAT fails.. go back to the "leader", and explain that because of your unbelief and devilishness, that you are now only bleeding 1/4 pints of blood, only because you don't have a whole heck of a lot left..
They will then send you to the "third aid" office, to receive a band aid to fix your "boo boo".
"anything else I can do for you?" "naw.. I'm fine.."
But the bandaid doesn't stop the 1/8 th pints of blood the person is now losing. So back to the "leader."
They will then sharply reprove you, and if you happen to be on staff, will suggest a ministry mandated and highly recommended physician, who might be able to help..
they'll give you directions to the office..
but you'll have to get an "exception" for work, signed by your immediate supervisor, the supervisor's supervisor, and at least one bod's signature..
next week, at a staff lunch, detailed instructions are given, how to recognize if you are bleeding, and to always be aware of the nearest door, so as to get to the outside of the building so you don't bleed inside of the building.. costs too much of gawd's abs to clean it up..
but remember to get your signed exception paper, on the way out..
I know.. I know, but it isn't too far from reality, here..
We were TOLD that in order to be the *best* for God....that we had to put our lives into the hands of these leaders...that they would mold and shape us into God`s elite crack troops....
We were told that we must obey these people implicitly...or we were like peter who sank while walking on the water because he looked at the physicals or 5 senses.
Poor Liz did exactly as she was told, to imagine.....that the poor girl was washing their damned dishes with an intense headache ...it is absolutely inexcusable in the first place...I can only imagine the pain that she must have been in as she heroically scrubbed somebody elses plates......that she was simply dropped off at the brc when she told them that she was blind and forced to fend for herself....can one imagine the terror??? the pain?? the feeling of shame??? My God how completely heartless....words fail
OMG ...to find out that she was condemned for suffering from a brain tumor....to be deprived of something as absolutely precious as ones vision because of unpardonable cruel stupidity.....inexcusable heartlessness.....to then be condemned for her lack of believing????
Instead of sueing those son`s of bi tches for every damned dime they had in their coffers, she instead tries to complete the program with no assistance????
If that rat bas tard (whom by the way up untill this day my husband had tagged as one of the GOOD guys) ever comes to grips with what he cost this woman...I would hope that he would do whatever it took to search this woman out and beg her forgivness.
It doesn`t suprise me that that psycho craigenstien used this as an opportunity as a springboard into a rant....we all know that he was a lunatic...I sure don`t know how burton can live with himself.
They did these things to Liz in God`s name....Liz suffered because of her desire to serve God....
I received this information from someone here about Liz. It is very upsetting. I was going to wait until I heard for certain that she died, but I don't know how long that will take.
If anyone knows anything else, please let me know...
I read about your friend, Liz, who I got to know through a friend of mine. Sadly, I believe she eventually died of the return of the brain tumor, and ironically, so did her husband. I will check... and get back to you ... but I am almost positive this is what happened.
Like a lot of people here, I only tell "just so much" of what I know,
Partly because it's just too darn embarrassing to think about how stupid I must have been.
Does anyone remember Lester G.(HQ staff), who died in about 1980?
I was told he just "freaked out" and couldn't get it together to be healed.
Any clarification of what actually happened?
I have been in the dark on that one for 25+ years.
When I was quite new "in The Word", I had a childhood friend who was diagnosed as schizophrenic.
He was doing fairly well(but not great) with the clinical treatments he was receiving which included very heavy duty pharmaceuticals.
One of the "lovely" young ladies in our branch(who went on to much bigger and "better" things with TWI) was kind enough to tell him his problems probably stemmed from the fact that he was "born of the wrong seed".
Not long after that, I found myself being asked by his father to be a pall bearer at his funeral.
He left me a note saying that he had learned something about himself that he could not bear to live with.
It was me who insisted he come with me to twig because I thought it could help him.
It was me who had to find his lifeless body that cool Autumn night.
I'm sure we all have similar things lurking in our memories.
Yeah, there's probably somebody on WayGB thinking,"AHA! NOW I know who Waysider is!"
When I was quite new "in The Word", I had a childhood friend who was diagnosed as schizophrenic.
He was doing fairly well(but not great) with the clinical treatments he was receiving which included very heavy duty pharmaceuticals.
One of the "lovely" young ladies in our branch(who went on to much bigger and "better" things with TWI) was kind enough to tell him his problems probably stemmed from the fact that he was "born of the wrong seed".
Not long after that, I found myself being asked by his father to be a pall bearer at his funeral.
He left me a note saying that he had learned something about himself that he could not bear to live with.
It was me who insisted he come with me to twig because I thought it could help him.
It was me who had to find his lifeless body that cool Autumn night.
I'm sure we all have similar things lurking in our memories.
Sorry Waysider.
I think this is one of the benefits of GS Cafe. I think those stories should be told so those memories "lurking" in the shadows can be healed. It's not real pleasant to bring them up, but it is therapeutic.
David and Deborah Walker both died of brain tumors so I hope someone isn't mistaking them for your friend Liz and her husband. Its a sad enough story as it is.
how horribly sad, waysider. i can't even imagine poor lester's torment
--
a dear friend of mine in the way corps committed suicide some years after we graduated
he left a note and in it stated
"i wish i were the man i knew to be"
---
When I saw her at Emporia, she was almost starving to death, I mean that literally. You see, apparently the wonderful compassionate people of the Way Corps were determined to not help her in any way. So she would sit at the meal table and not be able to eat because she couldn’t see the food. No one offered to help her. I couldn’t believe it. I remember sitting with her and helping her by telling her what was on her plate and where it was and she was finally able to eat. She had no training in coping skills that a person who loses their sight normally gets by going to life-skill training classes, so she was completely on her own.
I am so happy to report that both Liz and her husband are alive and will and living in Medina, OH. He retired from his job as a judge advocate in juvenile court and they moved to Ohio and bought a house across the street from her friend Irma and her husband. They get together for barbecues all the time and attend the same church.
I have her phone number and was told she's out of town and will be back on Friday. I will call her then.
I can't tell you how relieved I am to hear about this. We managed to track down Irma and her husband through the internet white pages and they told us that Liz and her hubby are doing just fine.
So you guys that were praying for her can keep on praying. I'm thrilled to be able to talk to her. I really have been trying to find her for years.
All this reminded me of the old Mark Twain quote:
"The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated."
, which he said after a reporter incorrectly reported that he had died.
Sorry for prematurely reporting something that hadn't been verified.
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BikerBabe
Off topic in a way. The line Don't Worry posted about the pain meds VP was taking at the end got me thinking .. as most of you know, I'm a pain patient and have tried almost every painkiller on the market. Here I can speak from experience/knowledge.
Tylenol 3 is the one of the lowest forms of pain killer and are only about 40 bucks a bottle with no insurnace. They also don't do a thing for chronic pain.
Vicodin/Lortab 7.5 to 10 mg help a bit more and are still a schedule 3 drug, so they cost about 100 per month without insurance.
Does anyone know if any of the people discussed here had insurance? If VP didn't, our ABS was going quickly with every script he filled for painkillers once he was classified a chronic pain patient with intolerable pain.
Once the pain gets bad, you move up to the schedule 2 drugs, Ms Contin (morphine), Oxycontin, and the patch (Fentanyl) which all start at 400 to 500 a month, sometimes more, depending on the mgs you need to take as you build tolerance.
The only schedule 2 drug that isn't expensive is Methadone. A month's worth runs 30 to 60 bucks depending on the mgs you take. It's also the best painkiller on the market for those who won't ever have to stop taking it. (The detox is something you never want to go thru if possible, it's very very bad.) Of course, given the stigma that drug has, since it's known mostly for helping heroin and other opitate addicts detox off them, I can't see any of the high ranking TWI people 'lowering' themself or their familes to such a drug, even though it would help the best.
What they did to anyone sick to avoid having to help goes way beyond what words can say. I trust that God *will* have the correct words at their judgement. I can't wait to hear Him say it all to them. What a happy day that will be for me, another who ignored my pain for years due to their teachings, until I was about 2 weeks shy of dying from an incurable, but not deadly disease (unless it's ignored). Thanks go to God for making pain , as that is when I finally got scared enough when I was passing out from the pain it was so bad that I went and pressured doctors until I found one willing to help me find out what was wrong and he saved my life. I was out of TWI by then though, I'm fully aware that if I had still be in, I wouldn't be alive today to type this to y'all.
I hope you find your friend Liz and have a wonderful reunion. I would love to hear all about it and all she's doing in her life today. She sounds like such a strongwilled, wonderful woman. I will keep a reunion in my prayers. Having had one with my birth family after adoption records were opened, I know well how wonderful they are.
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doojable
They were a bunch of madmen running a looney bin...<_<
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anotherDan
Bikerbabe, you are awesome.
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wrdsandwrks
So glad you did get out and that you're here!
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now I see
AnotherDan, regarding the Samaritan of the 20th century, I bet it would really chap TWI's hide if it were a kindly gay guy!
WAW, I remember while being in the Corps accompanying the Corps Coordinator's wife to the drug store where she filled her personal Rx's. Too bad when I had one the worst sinus infection of my life that lasted 3 weeks, where all I could get was herb tea and a face massage from third aide, they couldn't scrounge up anything else for me either.
Very different standards of treatment in the TWI food chain, the hierarchy system of TWI was born of the debil. Â Â
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Out There
THis is all so sad. It really breaks my heart that we were taught to be such unloving louses while being told we were loving. To bad we never could really see what the real definition of love was back then.
I don't remember Liz or anything about her but I do hope she has had a great life these past few years
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wrdsandwrks
third aide
Now there's a "way speak" term I haven't heard in a while.
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Outfield
what's third aide?
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wrdsandwrks
If I remember correctly it was the way equivalent of first-aid, except you were supposed to go to prayer first, then to being prayed for, then to medical attention. Of course the "third-aid" at HQ or other TWI locations were staffed by whoever happened to have a bit of medical training.
But now I see, or others, am I correct?
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Ham
That's close to the concept I think. If one was squirting out pints of blood, PRAY. Pray hard..
if that fails, even if it takes an hour, or two, find a "believer" or "leader" who will then pray for you. After sharply reproving you, they will agree to "minister" to the person, despite the inconvenience such a spiritual hitchiker can impose upon their greatness.
If THAT fails.. go back to the "leader", and explain that because of your unbelief and devilishness, that you are now only bleeding 1/4 pints of blood, only because you don't have a whole heck of a lot left..
They will then send you to the "third aid" office, to receive a band aid to fix your "boo boo".
"anything else I can do for you?" "naw.. I'm fine.."
But the bandaid doesn't stop the 1/8 th pints of blood the person is now losing. So back to the "leader."
They will then sharply reprove you, and if you happen to be on staff, will suggest a ministry mandated and highly recommended physician, who might be able to help..
they'll give you directions to the office..
but you'll have to get an "exception" for work, signed by your immediate supervisor, the supervisor's supervisor, and at least one bod's signature..
next week, at a staff lunch, detailed instructions are given, how to recognize if you are bleeding, and to always be aware of the nearest door, so as to get to the outside of the building so you don't bleed inside of the building.. costs too much of gawd's abs to clean it up..
but remember to get your signed exception paper, on the way out..
I know.. I know, but it isn't too far from reality, here..
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TheHighWay
Mr. Ham,
That's pretty much the way I remember it, too...
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rascal
This is a travesty.
We were TOLD that in order to be the *best* for God....that we had to put our lives into the hands of these leaders...that they would mold and shape us into God`s elite crack troops....
We were told that we must obey these people implicitly...or we were like peter who sank while walking on the water because he looked at the physicals or 5 senses.
Poor Liz did exactly as she was told, to imagine.....that the poor girl was washing their damned dishes with an intense headache ...it is absolutely inexcusable in the first place...I can only imagine the pain that she must have been in as she heroically scrubbed somebody elses plates......that she was simply dropped off at the brc when she told them that she was blind and forced to fend for herself....can one imagine the terror??? the pain?? the feeling of shame??? My God how completely heartless....words fail
OMG ...to find out that she was condemned for suffering from a brain tumor....to be deprived of something as absolutely precious as ones vision because of unpardonable cruel stupidity.....inexcusable heartlessness.....to then be condemned for her lack of believing????
Instead of sueing those son`s of bi tches for every damned dime they had in their coffers, she instead tries to complete the program with no assistance????
If that rat bas tard (whom by the way up untill this day my husband had tagged as one of the GOOD guys) ever comes to grips with what he cost this woman...I would hope that he would do whatever it took to search this woman out and beg her forgivness.
It doesn`t suprise me that that psycho craigenstien used this as an opportunity as a springboard into a rant....we all know that he was a lunatic...I sure don`t know how burton can live with himself.
They did these things to Liz in God`s name....Liz suffered because of her desire to serve God....
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wrdsandwrks
I received this information from someone here about Liz. It is very upsetting. I was going to wait until I heard for certain that she died, but I don't know how long that will take.
If anyone knows anything else, please let me know...
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waysider
Ya know,
Like a lot of people here, I only tell "just so much" of what I know,
Partly because it's just too darn embarrassing to think about how stupid I must have been.
Does anyone remember Lester G.(HQ staff), who died in about 1980?
I was told he just "freaked out" and couldn't get it together to be healed.
Any clarification of what actually happened?
I have been in the dark on that one for 25+ years.
When I was quite new "in The Word", I had a childhood friend who was diagnosed as schizophrenic.
He was doing fairly well(but not great) with the clinical treatments he was receiving which included very heavy duty pharmaceuticals.
One of the "lovely" young ladies in our branch(who went on to much bigger and "better" things with TWI) was kind enough to tell him his problems probably stemmed from the fact that he was "born of the wrong seed".
Not long after that, I found myself being asked by his father to be a pall bearer at his funeral.
He left me a note saying that he had learned something about himself that he could not bear to live with.
It was me who insisted he come with me to twig because I thought it could help him.
It was me who had to find his lifeless body that cool Autumn night.
I'm sure we all have similar things lurking in our memories.
Yeah, there's probably somebody on WayGB thinking,"AHA! NOW I know who Waysider is!"
To which I say "Screw You!!"
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wrdsandwrks
Sorry Waysider.
I think this is one of the benefits of GS Cafe. I think those stories should be told so those memories "lurking" in the shadows can be healed. It's not real pleasant to bring them up, but it is therapeutic.
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waysider
Thanks, WAW
I really appreciate your response.
Sometimes I feel like I never really left TWI until I stumbled into this place.
Thanks again.
(Sorry for the rant.)
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Danny
This stuff makes me cry.
God forgive me if I harmed someone along the line.
And believing all that bull.
You are the God of light and love.
In you is no darkness.
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Suda
All of this is heartbreaking. Just no words to express the sadness and sympathy.
Suda
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Sudo
WAW,
David and Deborah Walker both died of brain tumors so I hope someone isn't mistaking them for your friend Liz and her husband. Its a sad enough story as it is.
sudo
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excathedra
how horribly sad, waysider. i can't even imagine poor lester's torment
--
a dear friend of mine in the way corps committed suicide some years after we graduated
he left a note and in it stated
"i wish i were the man i knew to be"
---
i still can't get over this
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Dot Matrix
Waysider - My heart bleeds for your friend and for you. I am very sorry.
W and W - From the way you speak of Liz, I love her. I have no words to speak. I am sick about this.
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wrdsandwrks
I am so happy to report that both Liz and her husband are alive and will and living in Medina, OH. He retired from his job as a judge advocate in juvenile court and they moved to Ohio and bought a house across the street from her friend Irma and her husband. They get together for barbecues all the time and attend the same church.
I have her phone number and was told she's out of town and will be back on Friday. I will call her then.
I can't tell you how relieved I am to hear about this. We managed to track down Irma and her husband through the internet white pages and they told us that Liz and her hubby are doing just fine.
So you guys that were praying for her can keep on praying. I'm thrilled to be able to talk to her. I really have been trying to find her for years.
All this reminded me of the old Mark Twain quote:
, which he said after a reporter incorrectly reported that he had died.Sorry for prematurely reporting something that hadn't been verified.
Did I say I'm relieved.
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Suda
What a splendid reunion you will have by telephone. So glad you found her!
Suda
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Dot Matrix
W and W
Let us know how she is....
This story and Waysider's has invaded me with sadness.
I look forward to hearing good things about Liz.
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