My friend and I had a long talk about this. Are there any REALLY happy marriages out there where the people really love each other?
I hear from my friends the "failures"
Does anyone have the kind of love where you can look in each others eyes and cherish what you see?
Is that just Hollywood?
Does anyone look in your eyes and treasure you? Have you ever had that? Or given that kind of love?
Is it real or movie love?
It is human nature to focus on negatives. For a clear example, look at your electric service. Do you call up the electric company every day and say, "Thanks for keeping the power on!" or do you only call when there is a problem? In a relationship, can you remember the last time a person said "I love you" more easily than you can remember when someone says, "I hate you" instead?
Some of us do have happy relationships. Obviously, my wife and have only been married about four years now but we have seen friends and family divorce in that time or less, and we're still happy with each other. There is no perfect, blissful, happily ever after marriage. However, there should absolutely be love and respect.
You're coming out of a marriage that crashed and you are depressed. You can find love and be in a happy relationship in the future. However, right now the most important thing for you to do is to focus on yourself and making yourself happy. You need to work on doing the things you wanted to do and try to get to a place where you are comfortable as an individual first.
I've been reading along, thinking for a few days how to put into words my thoughts on this. dmiller's post on the Touch of the Master's Hand hit home.
I think a relationship where you're loved is filling. It's inspiring. It's like Red Bull. It gives me wings. :)
The love of my wife for me has made me a better person. Many years ago, I remember when we had our kids and they were toddlers, two years apart, it was a huge amount of work doing everything that needed to be done. Every parent knows how challenging it can be, yet we always appreciated them and wanted them. We had lost our first child, a horrible time. When we had our son about a year later, I knew beyond any doubt when I first held him what my calling was. I was The Dad. I've loved every minute of it.
Our daughter came and our joy multiplied. And I remember my wife one day, when I asked her as she was doing some stuff for them if she needed any help. She said, no, she was fine. "This is how we get close to them, by doing things for them". It was a funny thing to hear, but it was a view into her heart and intents, and I've never forgotten it. Her love is in doing, she loved doing for them and drawing them close to her as she did. She's The Mom.
I've learned that and so much more from her. It does fill me up. That love is playing me everyday, even still, after many years. Long ago I remember meeting her and feeling like I'd seen a light at the end of a long dark tunnel. It was the love we had that made me want to pull out of the mist and grab hold of it and never let go. Love saved me, of that - no doubt.
Most of the time it's simple things - trust, humor. A comfortable moment. A look, a glance. A smile. A frown. Happy, sad, angry, passionate. It's everything I want, nothing I don't.
what a great post, socks!....thanks!........sorry about the loss of your child........i never knew that!!........but the 2 of you together has always been my mind picture of you!!!!..........congratulations to you all!!!...........love you guys!...................................peace.
I"m waxing on, waxing off. Dunno. It's work but it's not. I'm just ridin' the wave. I know we all deserve good, and like love, good is where you find it and I did. Lighting struck and I've been talkin' funny ever since. :)
"This is how we get close to them, by doing things for them". It was a funny thing to hear, but it was a view into her heart and intents, and I've never forgotten it. Her love is in doing, she loved doing for them and drawing them close to her as she did. She's The Mom.
Well, I wasn't going to post a response here because the subject tends to get me ticked off big time, but maybe I will.
I do believe there is such a thing as true love, maybe not the Hollywood kind, but something pretty darn close. I also believe most of us don't ever find it. I know it's possible to be so much in love that you can hardly stand to be apart for any length of time, where you can look into each other's eyes and know that it's the real thing. That's the kind of love where you are so comfortable with each other that you can just be yourself and not have to try to impress. You know when you've found that special one, call it true love, call it soulmate, whatever. You know.
If you're lucky, you find that special person and get to spend the rest of your life with them.
If you're unlucky, you never quite find that special person and you may have something that's really good, but not quite there.
If you're really unlucky, you find that special person but she get's mixed up with a half-a$$ed cult run by a bunch of circus clowns from the middle of an Ohio cornfield that f***s up her mind to the point where she doesn't know if she's up, down or sideways.
It's hard to answer to a topic like this. I've only been married for 12 years; just a baby marriage compared to some of you. We had babies easily, even though I was old for that at the time. A wise woman said that everybody is a blue plate special; if you want the meatloaf, you have to also take the brocolli; there are no substitutions. People are like that; I know that I am. You have to find someone whose brocolli is okay with you. After that, you can spend the rest of your life enjoying the meatloaf. Is that too weird an analogy? You have to know them well enough to know what you're going to hate about them; if that's okay with you, then there's a good chance. It helps to be courteous, completely honest with one another, and I mean about everything. If you can't do that with THIS person, then it's the wrong person. It has to be someone that you'd enjoy flirting with, whether they're young and beautiful, or old and wrinkled, because hopefully, during the time that you're with them, they'll be a bit of both. It takes time, and work, and attention to the relationship, almost like a garden. We go on a date every week, even if things are crazy busy. Especially then. We just go and sit and have a pizza and a carafe of wine, and we talk. About anything. Every day, after work, we talk. We sit. We ban the children for a short time, and we concentrate solely on one another. Afterwards, we go back to the crazy day, the impossible deadlines, the sick relatives, the dirty dishes. But there is a time each day when for me, it's just him, and for him, it's just me.
I think that's important. You have to pick the right one, but not have unrealistic expectations. I'm not perfect; I didn't expect him to be. Thank heavens he doesn't expect me to be. After, like Indiana Jones, you "choose wisely," there is upkeep. You can't leave a marriage on autopilot. But it's one of those things that's fun to take care of, if you know what I mean.
I'm not as wise as Socks, but that's my perspective. That's all I have to say about that.
I do believe there is such a thing as true love, maybe not the Hollywood kind, but something pretty darn close. I also believe most of us don't ever find it. I know it's possible to be so much in love that you can hardly stand to be apart for any length of time, where you can look into each other's eyes and know that it's the real thing. That's the kind of love where you are so comfortable with each other that you can just be yourself and not have to try to impress. You know when you've found that special one, call it true love, call it soulmate, whatever. You know.
I've found that several times in my life... problem is, it only lasted a short while each time!
I'm gonna move to NoCal and be adopted by M/M Socks!
I really love your post Socks. I am crying to think that two people can be that much in love and still see each other in one another's eyes.
I love it.
Pirate, I smiled and was sad at your post, I am so sorry.
Priscilla
Your post is also vey sweet and heartfelt
I remember what it felt like to be in love... The warmth and excitment to see your "special" friend. But I have not been able to cultivate that in a marriage. I just do not think I have truly been loved by a husband. I have been liked, shown off, trophed but never explored. Never reached. Never really had anyone try.... Since snowflake Micheal. It makes me sad. I cannot make the magic happen, I cannot wish it into being so... I can only be kind and supportive and hope someday it will be seen as something that meant something... ya know?
Socks, I would love to look in someone's eyes and know they held my heart and I theirs.... Knowing what trust and value one has to have in the other to reach that kind of in-to-me-you-see is priceless.... I am glad you found it.
Upon reading the posts Steve! and I made, they seemed to come across at a bit simplistic.
LIfe and marriage are anything but simplistic.
I have prepared a post that kind of goes into more detail on our marriage, but it is rather long....so I decided to ask you if you want to see it.
No marriage should be held up as an example.
I would only post what I have written about our marriage to show that there is nothing like a "perfect marriage" or "perfect life"
It has to do with what you do together with that life. If you have a partner that will make little or no effort in making you happy it is not your fault. It may feel like it, though.
Every marriage is different just like every person in each marriage is different.
Likewise, the needs of each person in a marriage are valid.
One thing I do know is that it takes someone loving themself before they can love another. Our society is full of people who don't love themselves. It is sad, and I hope that most find a way to find the happiness and love they deserve. I've seen a lot of old people who have seemed to give up on life and just accept mediocrity.
After my first divorce, I decided I wouldn't accept mediocrity in a relationship. I had a few learning experiences to establish what mediocrity was to me. I value those experiences even though they caused my heart pain. I thank God I learned those lessions fairly early in my life.
The ones I know who have accepted mediocrity are those who have remained in a loveless marriage for YEARS and YEARS because they didn't want to step outside their comfort zone. My mother is one of those people. It's sad to realize that she has lost a lot of zeal for life.
Thanks, it was a long time ago. An unfortunate and sad way to learn a lot in a way no one would choose. But that's the way it was. If I could go back and talk to that younger man I'd tell him not to blame himself. I don't know if it would help, some things have to be learned in their own time and way maybe.
Dot, I think in retrospect that the key to a long relationship for us has been like what you're describing - we were close friends, had fun together and enjoyed each other's company in all the ways you would want to with someone. We were really young, but it was cultivated over time. It didn't take long for me to realize though "this was it" and there was a point where I knew it. After that, everything else was easy, for me.
Over 36 years there's going to be some ups and downs, some goods and bads. While I don't advise others to try and duplicate what we've had, I always recommend that people come together and let their mutual love form a bond of it's own for them. Let their concern, care, love for each other make something new, something they can both build and contribute to. Separately we support each other. I'm my Wife's #1 fan. If it's good for her, it's good. I want her to succeed, be happy.
Together we have something that's bigger than the two of us. That's the wild thing about a relationship that seems to grow over the years. With each other we can do things that we couldn't alone. Children are the perfect example of that, but it shows in countless other ways too. That love shared becomes a powerful force to be honored, respected, served.
We took the "vows", and at the time there's no way of knowing what's coming down the pike.
A small example - ice cream. We laugh about it now. But it's one of those little things that get learned, after you think you know. For years, I'd get ice cream and buy certain kinds, like Pistachio, or Butterscotch Swirl, or something, can't remember what they were but I usually got the same stuff. And we'd have ice cream. She'd get chocolate but I always got this other stuff for us.
It was several years later that my Wife told me, she likes chocolate ice cream. How about some chocolate ice cream here? In fact, she's a real lover of Chocolate, serious. I remember kind of getting a blank moment - chocolate. Right. Of course. Now I wouldn't think to buy her anything else, if I was buying for her. I was definitely brain damaged, not getting the message for so many years. It's the only explanation.
Why she never bopped me on the head and left me for an ice cream vendor? She's a patient woman. :)
I don`t know...I have spent many years deeply angry with my husband for marrying, and then deciding not to love me in a way where I feel cherished....for in doing so, he has not only denied me his love, but access to love from anybody else. All I can do is sadly shake my head at the loss and waste.
Lately, I see more effort. I see him reading and searching for ways to improve....who knows, maybe that is what love is...trying to change ones self even when they don`t think that they have a problem.
I look back over the last 21 years and see how far that we have come together, I rejoice in the wonderfull children that we have raised together, at our personal accompishments...and have to feel that in spite of the difficulties, it has been a pretty good life after all.
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Dot Matrix
In contrast here are the lyrics to a song I wrote:
I'm sitting here with my wife named Jane
It’s been 5 years since the ball and chain
She chuckled and said, "I'm 3 months"
I trembled and my face turned green...
The wedding vows were a scary thing...
OR this other one:
Oh, Martha where are we now?
We are caught up in this mess we can't escape somehow
I run with my secretary for a mere change of pace
While Martha does the laundry
With the years upon her face
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Mister P-Mosh
It is human nature to focus on negatives. For a clear example, look at your electric service. Do you call up the electric company every day and say, "Thanks for keeping the power on!" or do you only call when there is a problem? In a relationship, can you remember the last time a person said "I love you" more easily than you can remember when someone says, "I hate you" instead?
Some of us do have happy relationships. Obviously, my wife and have only been married about four years now but we have seen friends and family divorce in that time or less, and we're still happy with each other. There is no perfect, blissful, happily ever after marriage. However, there should absolutely be love and respect.
You're coming out of a marriage that crashed and you are depressed. You can find love and be in a happy relationship in the future. However, right now the most important thing for you to do is to focus on yourself and making yourself happy. You need to work on doing the things you wanted to do and try to get to a place where you are comfortable as an individual first.
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Dot Matrix
Thanks
That is no longer in the works. :)
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socks
I've been reading along, thinking for a few days how to put into words my thoughts on this. dmiller's post on the Touch of the Master's Hand hit home.
I think a relationship where you're loved is filling. It's inspiring. It's like Red Bull. It gives me wings. :)
The love of my wife for me has made me a better person. Many years ago, I remember when we had our kids and they were toddlers, two years apart, it was a huge amount of work doing everything that needed to be done. Every parent knows how challenging it can be, yet we always appreciated them and wanted them. We had lost our first child, a horrible time. When we had our son about a year later, I knew beyond any doubt when I first held him what my calling was. I was The Dad. I've loved every minute of it.
Our daughter came and our joy multiplied. And I remember my wife one day, when I asked her as she was doing some stuff for them if she needed any help. She said, no, she was fine. "This is how we get close to them, by doing things for them". It was a funny thing to hear, but it was a view into her heart and intents, and I've never forgotten it. Her love is in doing, she loved doing for them and drawing them close to her as she did. She's The Mom.
I've learned that and so much more from her. It does fill me up. That love is playing me everyday, even still, after many years. Long ago I remember meeting her and feeling like I'd seen a light at the end of a long dark tunnel. It was the love we had that made me want to pull out of the mist and grab hold of it and never let go. Love saved me, of that - no doubt.
Most of the time it's simple things - trust, humor. A comfortable moment. A look, a glance. A smile. A frown. Happy, sad, angry, passionate. It's everything I want, nothing I don't.
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DontWorryBeHappy
what a great post, socks!....thanks!........sorry about the loss of your child........i never knew that!!........but the 2 of you together has always been my mind picture of you!!!!..........congratulations to you all!!!...........love you guys!...................................peace.
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socks
Yikes! Thanks. That and this, back to you!
I"m waxing on, waxing off. Dunno. It's work but it's not. I'm just ridin' the wave. I know we all deserve good, and like love, good is where you find it and I did. Lighting struck and I've been talkin' funny ever since. :)
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doojable
How wonderful that you understand her.
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Pirate1974
Well, I wasn't going to post a response here because the subject tends to get me ticked off big time, but maybe I will.
I do believe there is such a thing as true love, maybe not the Hollywood kind, but something pretty darn close. I also believe most of us don't ever find it. I know it's possible to be so much in love that you can hardly stand to be apart for any length of time, where you can look into each other's eyes and know that it's the real thing. That's the kind of love where you are so comfortable with each other that you can just be yourself and not have to try to impress. You know when you've found that special one, call it true love, call it soulmate, whatever. You know.
If you're lucky, you find that special person and get to spend the rest of your life with them.
If you're unlucky, you never quite find that special person and you may have something that's really good, but not quite there.
If you're really unlucky, you find that special person but she get's mixed up with a half-a$$ed cult run by a bunch of circus clowns from the middle of an Ohio cornfield that f***s up her mind to the point where she doesn't know if she's up, down or sideways.
Have I mentioned lately how much I hate the way?
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notinKansasanymore
Pirate, George, I'm so sorry.
Socks, once again, thank you for those posts.
It's hard to answer to a topic like this. I've only been married for 12 years; just a baby marriage compared to some of you. We had babies easily, even though I was old for that at the time. A wise woman said that everybody is a blue plate special; if you want the meatloaf, you have to also take the brocolli; there are no substitutions. People are like that; I know that I am. You have to find someone whose brocolli is okay with you. After that, you can spend the rest of your life enjoying the meatloaf. Is that too weird an analogy? You have to know them well enough to know what you're going to hate about them; if that's okay with you, then there's a good chance. It helps to be courteous, completely honest with one another, and I mean about everything. If you can't do that with THIS person, then it's the wrong person. It has to be someone that you'd enjoy flirting with, whether they're young and beautiful, or old and wrinkled, because hopefully, during the time that you're with them, they'll be a bit of both. It takes time, and work, and attention to the relationship, almost like a garden. We go on a date every week, even if things are crazy busy. Especially then. We just go and sit and have a pizza and a carafe of wine, and we talk. About anything. Every day, after work, we talk. We sit. We ban the children for a short time, and we concentrate solely on one another. Afterwards, we go back to the crazy day, the impossible deadlines, the sick relatives, the dirty dishes. But there is a time each day when for me, it's just him, and for him, it's just me.
I think that's important. You have to pick the right one, but not have unrealistic expectations. I'm not perfect; I didn't expect him to be. Thank heavens he doesn't expect me to be. After, like Indiana Jones, you "choose wisely," there is upkeep. You can't leave a marriage on autopilot. But it's one of those things that's fun to take care of, if you know what I mean.
I'm not as wise as Socks, but that's my perspective. That's all I have to say about that.
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Tom Strange
I've found that several times in my life... problem is, it only lasted a short while each time!
I'm gonna move to NoCal and be adopted by M/M Socks!
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Priscilla
Well, I have waited a long time to respond to this post.
I have been in my marriage for 38 years. Notice I didn't say 38 wonderful years.
I do have a wonderful spouse, and I love him beyond reason, but wonderful is not always what can happen every day.
We have been through good times, bad times, and wonderful times.
We have been through life together!
He is 17 years older than I am, and at some point this will be a challenge to overcome.
But I am so willing to live through any thing that may come up because he is my love.
He makes me laugh, he makes me feel like the most important person in the world!
Also, we both have an abiding love, not only for each other, but also for our God.
We always look to the greatness of the promises of God to get us through all things, and He always does.
I am so blessed to be married to my "best friend", and trust that this will continue for another 38 years!
Yes, I do believe it is possible to be in a relationship where you are loved, and it is my prayer that everyone
can have what I have!
Work hard at what you have, and know that it is possible to have a great relationship!
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Dot Matrix
I really love your post Socks. I am crying to think that two people can be that much in love and still see each other in one another's eyes.
I love it.
Pirate, I smiled and was sad at your post, I am so sorry.
Priscilla
Your post is also vey sweet and heartfelt
I remember what it felt like to be in love... The warmth and excitment to see your "special" friend. But I have not been able to cultivate that in a marriage. I just do not think I have truly been loved by a husband. I have been liked, shown off, trophed but never explored. Never reached. Never really had anyone try.... Since snowflake Micheal. It makes me sad. I cannot make the magic happen, I cannot wish it into being so... I can only be kind and supportive and hope someday it will be seen as something that meant something... ya know?
Socks, I would love to look in someone's eyes and know they held my heart and I theirs.... Knowing what trust and value one has to have in the other to reach that kind of in-to-me-you-see is priceless.... I am glad you found it.
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Cindy!
Upon reading the posts Steve! and I made, they seemed to come across at a bit simplistic.
LIfe and marriage are anything but simplistic.
I have prepared a post that kind of goes into more detail on our marriage, but it is rather long....so I decided to ask you if you want to see it.
No marriage should be held up as an example.
I would only post what I have written about our marriage to show that there is nothing like a "perfect marriage" or "perfect life"
It has to do with what you do together with that life. If you have a partner that will make little or no effort in making you happy it is not your fault. It may feel like it, though.
Every marriage is different just like every person in each marriage is different.
Likewise, the needs of each person in a marriage are valid.
There is no "one size fits all"
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Nottawayfer
One thing I do know is that it takes someone loving themself before they can love another. Our society is full of people who don't love themselves. It is sad, and I hope that most find a way to find the happiness and love they deserve. I've seen a lot of old people who have seemed to give up on life and just accept mediocrity.
After my first divorce, I decided I wouldn't accept mediocrity in a relationship. I had a few learning experiences to establish what mediocrity was to me. I value those experiences even though they caused my heart pain. I thank God I learned those lessions fairly early in my life.
The ones I know who have accepted mediocrity are those who have remained in a loveless marriage for YEARS and YEARS because they didn't want to step outside their comfort zone. My mother is one of those people. It's sad to realize that she has lost a lot of zeal for life.
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excathedra
i appreciate all your posts. thank you so much
socks, i'm very very sorry about your first baby
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socks
Thanks, it was a long time ago. An unfortunate and sad way to learn a lot in a way no one would choose. But that's the way it was. If I could go back and talk to that younger man I'd tell him not to blame himself. I don't know if it would help, some things have to be learned in their own time and way maybe.
Dot, I think in retrospect that the key to a long relationship for us has been like what you're describing - we were close friends, had fun together and enjoyed each other's company in all the ways you would want to with someone. We were really young, but it was cultivated over time. It didn't take long for me to realize though "this was it" and there was a point where I knew it. After that, everything else was easy, for me.
Over 36 years there's going to be some ups and downs, some goods and bads. While I don't advise others to try and duplicate what we've had, I always recommend that people come together and let their mutual love form a bond of it's own for them. Let their concern, care, love for each other make something new, something they can both build and contribute to. Separately we support each other. I'm my Wife's #1 fan. If it's good for her, it's good. I want her to succeed, be happy.
Together we have something that's bigger than the two of us. That's the wild thing about a relationship that seems to grow over the years. With each other we can do things that we couldn't alone. Children are the perfect example of that, but it shows in countless other ways too. That love shared becomes a powerful force to be honored, respected, served.
We took the "vows", and at the time there's no way of knowing what's coming down the pike.
A small example - ice cream. We laugh about it now. But it's one of those little things that get learned, after you think you know. For years, I'd get ice cream and buy certain kinds, like Pistachio, or Butterscotch Swirl, or something, can't remember what they were but I usually got the same stuff. And we'd have ice cream. She'd get chocolate but I always got this other stuff for us.
It was several years later that my Wife told me, she likes chocolate ice cream. How about some chocolate ice cream here? In fact, she's a real lover of Chocolate, serious. I remember kind of getting a blank moment - chocolate. Right. Of course. Now I wouldn't think to buy her anything else, if I was buying for her. I was definitely brain damaged, not getting the message for so many years. It's the only explanation.
Why she never bopped me on the head and left me for an ice cream vendor? She's a patient woman. :)
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Cindy!
I think socks says it really well!
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rascal
I don`t know...I have spent many years deeply angry with my husband for marrying, and then deciding not to love me in a way where I feel cherished....for in doing so, he has not only denied me his love, but access to love from anybody else. All I can do is sadly shake my head at the loss and waste.
Lately, I see more effort. I see him reading and searching for ways to improve....who knows, maybe that is what love is...trying to change ones self even when they don`t think that they have a problem.
I look back over the last 21 years and see how far that we have come together, I rejoice in the wonderfull children that we have raised together, at our personal accompishments...and have to feel that in spite of the difficulties, it has been a pretty good life after all.
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