That is what convinces me....the lack of Godly sorrow, the lack of repentance, the lack of restitution....
All of these things scream of a spiritual and moral bancruptcy.
These people think only of covering their arses ...of schemes of how to get people to return...Because they care about people??? Oh HEYAL no ...they need fresh blood, fresh money, numbers to justify their existence....to make them feel like they are accomplishing something....
Maybe we need new classes, new books, new this new that...I don`t think they will ever get it.
...How many times did I sit and listen to king okie scream and holler about his unshakable committment?...Condescending to the rest of us, whose spirituality and committment was nowhere near his?....His arrogant attitude, his vulgar and uncouth mouth...spitting and pontificating about the steadfastness of his godly stand?
...HA!!!!!!!!!!!...The wimp turned tail and ran as soon as the kitchen got too hot...his own disgusting behavior catching up to him. Called of God?...What a phoney, what a joke. Maybe the twi denomination booted him but if he was as committed to God as he claimed, why did he not continue with his "ministry"?...Lynn did, Schoenheit did, Finnigan did...many other did...but not king okie.
...and from all accounts, he's a broken man. Hiding away and running from his past....I say he's a punk and always was....all mouth.
...How many times did I sit and listen to king okie scream and holler about his unshakable committment?...Condescending to the rest of us, whose spirituality and committment was nowhere near his?....His arrogant attitude, his vulgar and uncouth mouth...spitting and pontificating about the steadfastness of his godly stand?
...HA!!!!!!!!!!!...The wimp turned tail and ran as soon as the kitchen got too hot...his own disgusting behavior catching up to him. Called of God?...What a phoney, what a joke. Maybe the twi denomination booted him but if he was as committed to God as he claimed, why did he not continue with his "ministry"?...Lynn did, Schoenheit did, Finnigan did...many other did...but not king okie.
...and from all accounts, he's a broken man. Hiding away and running from his past....I say he's a punk and always was....all mouth.
Yeah, the rants were unforgettable......one time, in his most-condescending manner he stated that "you corps are NOT WORTHY to carry my jockstrap."
My, oh my...........how the "mighty" have fallen..!!
Omygosh, Skyrider, I remember that soo well. We were FWC and on some stupid corps night hookup or something He says, with great venom and total, absolute, complete contempt: THERE'S NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU WHO IS WORTHY OF THE PRIVILEGE OF CARRYING MY JOCK STRAP!"
All I could think was "Well thank God for small favors! Who the he11'd WANT to?"
Wish I'd said it out loud; would've saved me a lot of grief in the long run.
Omygosh, Skyrider, I remember that soo well. We were FWC and on some stupid corps night hookup or something He says, with great venom and total, absolute, complete contempt: THERE'S NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU WHO IS WORTHY OF THE PRIVILEGE OF CARRYING MY JOCK STRAP!"
All I could think was "Well thank God for small favors! Who the he11'd WANT to?"
Wish I'd said it out loud; would've saved me a lot of grief in the long run.
WG
Yeah, WG.......the other trustees SHOULD have kicked his arse for an off-wall statement like that. Heck, if Don and Howard would have had any b@lls and integrity......they would have demanded for martindale to apologize to the corps. Just shows that mog-mentality ruled/rules at twi.
Wonder if martindale has found anyone in Toledo to carry his jock strap????
Ewwww! Truthfully he didn't need one....think about it.
I was just thinking today about him. How if he would have some humility he would be better off in the long run. He should be honest and make some public statements of apology, etc.
I was even thinking he could possibly make a big chunk of change writing a tell all book something like "My Life as a Christian Cult Leader, from the former President of The Way International"
God, the stories he could tell!
It would do him some good to let it all out and to express his feelings on the experience.
On the other hand........hell is not frozen over yet.
Ewwww! Truthfully he didn't need one....think about it.
I was just thinking today about him. How if he would have some humility he would be better off in the long run. He should be honest and make some public statements of apology, etc.
I was even thinking he could possibly make a big chunk of change writing a tell all book something like "My Life as a Christian Cult Leader, from the former President of The Way International"
God, the stories he could tell!
It would do him some good to let it all out and to express his feelings on the experience.
On the other hand........hell is not frozen over yet.
Re:Apology
I thought in his announcement to resign he offered an apology. Not that anyone accepted it.
Re: the stories he could tell.....
I think I could write a song: "Let my cult.....tell the story........."
It would be great for him to let it all out and express his feelings on the experience... But it would probably incite criminal behavior by many.
Some readers may find the following post distasteful. Failure to think so may cause your coffee to turn cold and your lungs to collapse. Bleeding of the right eye should be reported to your doctor immediately. If you lose sleep or have memory loss just remember "Dead Doctors Don't Lie".
I remember thinking about LCM screwing around when so many other ministers in other ministries were admitting to their congregation, "I have sinned! ! !"
I thought on it for a little bit and thought how deceived they would have allowed themselves to get in order for it to get that bad.
I realized that if anything like that ever happened it would be disgraceful and totally ruin TWI....
It appears many people considered that possibility back in the '80's and '90's.
Looking back now, I think of how I appreciated his same 'ol jokes year after year. And sometimes before POP, his teachings were really powerful. Now, I don't think too many would go across the street to slice his tomatoes. I can't and won't excuse his blunder, but today when I think of him, I try to remember the things I appreciated before POP.
I always loved his teaching on the 4-D's of Doulos Doings. I can't remember them right now, but when I do, I'll appreciate the cleverness of teaching it.
The above post is posted by a person infected with CRS and is liable for nothing said.
I always loved his teaching on the 4-D's of Doulos Doings. I can't remember them right now, but when I do, I'll appreciate the cleverness of teaching it.
YID, he did NOT apologize! He also made a point of saying that just because he was not going to be serving as pres anymore, he still had his ministry and was not the least bit diminished because of it. He called it an aggravating and trying time and insinuated more than anything he was sorry that the whole ministry was being "put out" because of those liars and egg sucking cop outs.
He has NEVER, NEVER, NEVER apologized for ANY of his behavior.
He went so far as to BRAG about his behavior in his deposition!
There's at least one person I know of who has actually talked with craiggers personally and she has said that he shows absolutely NO REMORSE for the death and destruction he has caused.
Current TWI leadership - ALL OF 'EM - are just as guilty as he is. Their silence speaks volumes, no?
Martindale never did "get it"...for him, it was always about him...
I really don't have a vindictive attitude towards him, but I am glad that his position in life is such, that he can't do the damage to people that he once did.
Today...he's probably hitting on bar maids and middle aged divorcees...maybe a few hookers thrown in. He probably hires the kinky ones that will allow him to wear his "Athletes of the Spirit" costume and scream out the names of demons while he's spanking her...
..and meanwhile, back at the ranch, Donna is still living high on the hog.
I know folks who were booted when their marriage fell apart...why was she an exception?
..and meanwhile, back at the ranch, Donna is still living high on the hog.
I know folks who were booted when their marriage fell apart...why was she an exception?
Because................................she had access to the *queen.*
Once king okie was booted, she wasn't about to follow that man anywhere. She knew where her bread was buttered..........and liked the "royal courts" where servants pampered her every move.
Besides.......... she knew that twi had DOUBLE STANDARDS, she'd been around vpw alot before she hooked up with craig. With Rosalie in power, Donna knew that Rosalie would silence the critics.
And, that's ANOTHER shrouded issue amongst this fiasco.
Seems as if you ignore it and intimidate your people into silence it will go away.... and, indeed, it does seem to have worked to some degree. That, or they've bored everyone to death and there's really nothing but zombies left. :unsure:
I was even thinking he could possibly make a big chunk of change writing a tell all book something like "My Life as a Christian Cult Leader, from the former President of The Way International"
....
I don't think he could make anything writing a book. He didn't make anything from the first one he wrote, which leads me to believe he's done with wrting books.
Seems as if you ignore it and intimidate your people into silence it will go away.... and, indeed, it does seem to have worked to some degree. That, or they've bored everyone to death and there's really nothing but zombies left. :unsure:
Belle.......yes, to some degree, it HAS silenced the twi-following.
But then, again......the Craig/Donna issue has sent out ANOTHER red flag. Twi has double standards. There is favortism and partiality within their ranks. Don't mess with the upper hierarchy of twi.
Sure, there is SILENCE a-happening. But.......there is also *silent* numbers of in-residence corps NOT present, *silent* numbers of people showing up at branch meetings, *silent* numbers are fading away into the fabric of life and escaping the *silent treatment* of twi.
No longer is twi dealing with teenagers or 20-somethings. Heck, what's the AVERAGE AGE of twi nowadays???
47 ??? Or higher???
Now, the staffers who collect the paycheck......they learned long ago to turn and look the other way. They keep silent.......TO KEEP THEIR JOB. But the field folk, that's a whole 'nother story. It's no wonder why twi continues to hemorrage at a slow pace.
Average age?? Gotta be 40s-60s, I imagine. Hard ...because Istill picture us all as still in our early 20s lol
That's what I suspect, too, Rascal. AND their kids are NOT staying around..... not most of 'em anyway and most of the ones who are still around aren't as sold out as their parents are/were. I also expect that once they start having kids and experiencing life in the "real world" there will be a number of them who leave as well.
Sure, there is SILENCE a-happening. But.......there is also *silent* numbers of in-residence corps NOT present, *silent* numbers of people showing up at branch meetings, *silent* numbers are fading away into the fabric of life and escaping the *silent treatment* of twi.
Now, the staffers who collect the paycheck......they learned long ago to turn and look the other way. They keep silent.......TO KEEP THEIR JOB. But the field folk, that's a whole 'nother story. It's no wonder why twi continues to hemorrage at a slow pace.
Imagine...............10 years from now..!!!!!!!
:blink:
Yeppers! Good point, Sky. :) There are more and more people giving TWI the *silent treatment* - I pray for those silently wondering why they continue to feel bad about being involved with TWI, not getting answers and if there really IS nothing better out there. Hopefully they'll decide to look around or at least realize that NOTHING has GOT to be better than where they are.
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rascal
That is what convinces me....the lack of Godly sorrow, the lack of repentance, the lack of restitution....
All of these things scream of a spiritual and moral bancruptcy.
These people think only of covering their arses ...of schemes of how to get people to return...Because they care about people??? Oh HEYAL no ...they need fresh blood, fresh money, numbers to justify their existence....to make them feel like they are accomplishing something....
Maybe we need new classes, new books, new this new that...I don`t think they will ever get it.
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Ham
I wonder if a funeral procession following a closed casket down w. road would be appropriate..
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skyrider
Yeah.......SCREAMING from the Way Woods treetops..!!!
18 years of martindale being wierwille's "annointed choice" as next prez................DEAD silence.
11 years after "signing on" with martindale's loyalty letter.....................................DEAD silence.
Years and years of supporting twi with hard-earned abs, and then.........................DEAD silence.
Asking questions at the local level, and intimidated NOT to ask these questions......????????
Wondering why Donna Lombardi Martindale didn't follow her husband out the door..???????
And, if they hide the MAJOR stuff, how can they be trusted anymore......................???????
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oldiesman
Go to now Skyrider, its FRIDAY.
Live and let live. :)
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skyrider
Yeah......and the life I now live is full-scale FREEDOM seven days a week.
But.........the twi cult obstructs and abuses those who would/could "live and let live."
Even on weekends.................others LURK here.
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skyrider
I don't know, Hamm..............seems that anyone who wanted to pay their respects, respectfully LEFT.
:)
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GrouchoMarxJr
...How many times did I sit and listen to king okie scream and holler about his unshakable committment?...Condescending to the rest of us, whose spirituality and committment was nowhere near his?....His arrogant attitude, his vulgar and uncouth mouth...spitting and pontificating about the steadfastness of his godly stand?
...HA!!!!!!!!!!!...The wimp turned tail and ran as soon as the kitchen got too hot...his own disgusting behavior catching up to him. Called of God?...What a phoney, what a joke. Maybe the twi denomination booted him but if he was as committed to God as he claimed, why did he not continue with his "ministry"?...Lynn did, Schoenheit did, Finnigan did...many other did...but not king okie.
...and from all accounts, he's a broken man. Hiding away and running from his past....I say he's a punk and always was....all mouth.
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skyrider
Yeah, the rants were unforgettable......one time, in his most-condescending manner he stated that "you corps are NOT WORTHY to carry my jockstrap."
My, oh my...........how the "mighty" have fallen..!!
<_<
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Watered Garden
Omygosh, Skyrider, I remember that soo well. We were FWC and on some stupid corps night hookup or something He says, with great venom and total, absolute, complete contempt: THERE'S NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU WHO IS WORTHY OF THE PRIVILEGE OF CARRYING MY JOCK STRAP!"
All I could think was "Well thank God for small favors! Who the he11'd WANT to?"
Wish I'd said it out loud; would've saved me a lot of grief in the long run.
WG
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skyrider
Yeah, WG.......the other trustees SHOULD have kicked his arse for an off-wall statement like that. Heck, if Don and Howard would have had any b@lls and integrity......they would have demanded for martindale to apologize to the corps. Just shows that mog-mentality ruled/rules at twi.
Wonder if martindale has found anyone in Toledo to carry his jock strap????
:blink:
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doojable
Maybe he realized what an "empty threat" that was...
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igotout
I was just thinking today about him. How if he would have some humility he would be better off in the long run. He should be honest and make some public statements of apology, etc.
I was even thinking he could possibly make a big chunk of change writing a tell all book something like "My Life as a Christian Cult Leader, from the former President of The Way International"
God, the stories he could tell!
It would do him some good to let it all out and to express his feelings on the experience.
On the other hand........hell is not frozen over yet.
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YID
Re:Apology
I thought in his announcement to resign he offered an apology. Not that anyone accepted it.
Re: the stories he could tell.....
I think I could write a song: "Let my cult.....tell the story........."
It would be great for him to let it all out and express his feelings on the experience... But it would probably incite criminal behavior by many.
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YID
Warning!
Some readers may find the following post distasteful. Failure to think so may cause your coffee to turn cold and your lungs to collapse. Bleeding of the right eye should be reported to your doctor immediately. If you lose sleep or have memory loss just remember "Dead Doctors Don't Lie".
I remember thinking about LCM screwing around when so many other ministers in other ministries were admitting to their congregation, "I have sinned! ! !"
I thought on it for a little bit and thought how deceived they would have allowed themselves to get in order for it to get that bad.
I realized that if anything like that ever happened it would be disgraceful and totally ruin TWI....
It appears many people considered that possibility back in the '80's and '90's.
Looking back now, I think of how I appreciated his same 'ol jokes year after year. And sometimes before POP, his teachings were really powerful. Now, I don't think too many would go across the street to slice his tomatoes. I can't and won't excuse his blunder, but today when I think of him, I try to remember the things I appreciated before POP.
I always loved his teaching on the 4-D's of Doulos Doings. I can't remember them right now, but when I do, I'll appreciate the cleverness of teaching it.
The above post is posted by a person infected with CRS and is liable for nothing said.
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skyrider
4-D's......
1) Decision
2) Desire
3) Details
4) Deliverance
Just to help you out there, YID.
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Belle
YID, he did NOT apologize! He also made a point of saying that just because he was not going to be serving as pres anymore, he still had his ministry and was not the least bit diminished because of it. He called it an aggravating and trying time and insinuated more than anything he was sorry that the whole ministry was being "put out" because of those liars and egg sucking cop outs.
He has NEVER, NEVER, NEVER apologized for ANY of his behavior.
He went so far as to BRAG about his behavior in his deposition!
There's at least one person I know of who has actually talked with craiggers personally and she has said that he shows absolutely NO REMORSE for the death and destruction he has caused.
Current TWI leadership - ALL OF 'EM - are just as guilty as he is. Their silence speaks volumes, no?
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WhiteDove
Then again Pigs do Fly........
So maybe there still is hope......
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GrouchoMarxJr
Martindale never did "get it"...for him, it was always about him...
I really don't have a vindictive attitude towards him, but I am glad that his position in life is such, that he can't do the damage to people that he once did.
Today...he's probably hitting on bar maids and middle aged divorcees...maybe a few hookers thrown in. He probably hires the kinky ones that will allow him to wear his "Athletes of the Spirit" costume and scream out the names of demons while he's spanking her...
..and meanwhile, back at the ranch, Donna is still living high on the hog.
I know folks who were booted when their marriage fell apart...why was she an exception?
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skyrider
Because................................she had access to the *queen.*
Once king okie was booted, she wasn't about to follow that man anywhere. She knew where her bread was buttered..........and liked the "royal courts" where servants pampered her every move.
Besides.......... she knew that twi had DOUBLE STANDARDS, she'd been around vpw alot before she hooked up with craig. With Rosalie in power, Donna knew that Rosalie would silence the critics.
And, that's ANOTHER shrouded issue amongst this fiasco.
<_<
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Belle
Seems as if you ignore it and intimidate your people into silence it will go away.... and, indeed, it does seem to have worked to some degree. That, or they've bored everyone to death and there's really nothing but zombies left. :unsure:
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What The Hey
I don't think he could make anything writing a book. He didn't make anything from the first one he wrote, which leads me to believe he's done with wrting books.
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skyrider
Belle.......yes, to some degree, it HAS silenced the twi-following.
But then, again......the Craig/Donna issue has sent out ANOTHER red flag. Twi has double standards. There is favortism and partiality within their ranks. Don't mess with the upper hierarchy of twi.
Sure, there is SILENCE a-happening. But.......there is also *silent* numbers of in-residence corps NOT present, *silent* numbers of people showing up at branch meetings, *silent* numbers are fading away into the fabric of life and escaping the *silent treatment* of twi.
No longer is twi dealing with teenagers or 20-somethings. Heck, what's the AVERAGE AGE of twi nowadays???
47 ??? Or higher???
Now, the staffers who collect the paycheck......they learned long ago to turn and look the other way. They keep silent.......TO KEEP THEIR JOB. But the field folk, that's a whole 'nother story. It's no wonder why twi continues to hemorrage at a slow pace.
Imagine...............10 years from now..!!!!!!!
:blink:
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rascal
Average age?? Gotta be 40s-60s, I imagine. Hard ...because Istill picture us all as still in our early 20s lol
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Belle
That's what I suspect, too, Rascal. AND their kids are NOT staying around..... not most of 'em anyway and most of the ones who are still around aren't as sold out as their parents are/were. I also expect that once they start having kids and experiencing life in the "real world" there will be a number of them who leave as well.
Yeppers! Good point, Sky. :) There are more and more people giving TWI the *silent treatment* - I pray for those silently wondering why they continue to feel bad about being involved with TWI, not getting answers and if there really IS nothing better out there. Hopefully they'll decide to look around or at least realize that NOTHING has GOT to be better than where they are.
I hope Brian Moneyhands has a Plan B.
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